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Noxville posted:JK Rowling shared a picture of a T-shirt she got which said ‘this witch doesn’t burn’ ( im beginning to think JK might be a terf but how can you explain that all the liberal newspapers support her? that would make them out of touch bigots and that can't be right
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Sep 23, 2020 13:00
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) and linked it and, yikes:
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Guavanaut posted:What if your poor ma worked for BAE Systems? Won't you think about the Brimstone®s? Even then what the gently caress is that leap? "People want to know how a Labour government will work for them, but the Trolls keep calling me a missile shagger regardless" Even worse that this dipshit stood for the CUKs. Edit: I know there's been some memo or group think about "Labour needs to stop talking about international stuff about Palestinian's being people and focus on the home front" but every time I see it it's from some oval office who won't stop talking about how we need to bomb a Muslim country and fight against trans women. Gonzo McFee fucked around with this message at 13:05 on Sep 23, 2020 |
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Sep 23, 2020 13:02
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Gonzo McFee posted:What the gently caress does my families prosperity have to do with bombing Syria? Look governing is hard work and sometimes our glorious leaders need to kick back and bomb something to relax. It's the price of having grown up sensible government that can make hard choices.
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Sep 23, 2020 13:02
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Stormgale posted:Sure, I just feel that any biological element to gender idendity might be useful in applying medical treatment (hormone interactions), wedding the cart to "Well theres this part of the brain that shows someons is trans". What happens if I don't have that particular element? Or it's borderline? Also I think it very much limits our discussion of gender identity to al ine between male/female (like identifying nonbinary as in the middle of the two). I've said this before but it's *incredibly similar* to the arguments about a genetic cause for homosexuality in the early 90s, which as a bisexual scientist I was watching with interest. Bear in mind the context of gay rights in the country at the time, there'd been some success but it was still ingrained that you shouldn't promote homosexuality in schools, it was a niche thing relevant to maybe 10% of the population, adoption was seen as iffy as gently caress by a huge amount of people, prejudice was still rife in wider culture even though you had the odd token character turn up in soap operas. Meanwhile, we were sequencing the genome and people were saying "hey, you know there might be a genetic basis for this". Which split people into two ideological camps: one, that it would be a great thing to find because you could say "look, this is something that's there from birth, it's part of someone's nature, it's immutable, so people ought to accept it once and for all". The other, "if we can find a cause of it we can test for it, we can do a eugenics, and that would be bad. Also, it's kind of skeevy to be medicalising something that *is loving normal*". You had people supporting one or the other side regardless of their sexuality, or taking a bit from both sides. But it was an argument, and it was happening. The outcome was that society just moved past that, by chilling the gently caress out about medicalising and dissecting people's romantic and sexual alignments. No, obviously homophobia didn't disappear, but a bunch of lovely legislation got cleared away, the fight continued for more acceptance and better legal protections and equality, and now we live in a world where the majority of people of some generations no longer consider themselves straight. It's a continuum you can find yourself in, and the more accepting the community the more honest people can be, the more they can be happy as they are. So as a trans person I get it, I get the need some people, even some trans people have to latch on to a medical... thing to say "look, here it is, now gently caress off forever and stop bothering us" but I'd much rather skip past that part to the bit where we don't treat it like a medical issue with doctors as gatekeepers, people can identify how they like and the world goes about its business without a bunch of chuds and well-moneyed authors throwing their weight behind chromosomes-for-dummies without realising that the world is more varied and beautiful than the narrow view they grew up in and they read about in GCSE biology. That's why I'm happy to see Judith Butler doing that hilarious interview. The medical stuff is a curio, the lived experience is the ground truth Edit: unintentional misgendering Isomermaid fucked around with this message at 00:13 on Sep 24, 2020 |
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Sep 23, 2020 13:03
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Communist Thoughts posted:im beginning to think JK might be a terf Helen Lewis.
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Sep 23, 2020 13:03
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Thanks for being more thoughtful than the entire print media of this country about trans stuff thread!
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Sep 23, 2020 13:04
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stev posted:That's hilarious. Who the gently caress would even subscribe to something called BritBox? The target gammons either don't know how streaming subscriptions work or get all of their entertainment from the various UKTV channels anyway. British people living in America (or Anglophile Americans). I might have considered it if it was around when I lived in Michigan, if I didn't just  all my telly anyway.
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Sep 23, 2020 13:06
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Lol at seeing a usual suspect doing an insanely long twitter thread about how actually Lisa Mandy saying Britain first is fine
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Sep 23, 2020 13:15
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Isomermaid posted:I've said this before but it's *incredibly similar* to the arguments about a genetic cause for homosexuality in the early 90s, which as a bisexual scientist I was watching with interest. Whereas most of the people searching for biological clues to gender identity in the 2010s/20s are firmly in the affirmation camp, along the lines of "how do we best use endocrinology to affirm people's identities" and "maybe we shouldn't be operating on newborns genitalia for socio-cosmetic reasons", which on balance is a good thing.
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Sep 23, 2020 13:17
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Jose posted:Lol at seeing a usual suspect doing an insanely long twitter thread about how actually Lisa Mandy saying Britain first is fine Oh Mandy..
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Sep 23, 2020 13:18
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Personally I think it's fine that Labour's new slogans are being drawn from whatever you shout when you stab a labour MP to death. Only good things can come of it.
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Sep 23, 2020 13:19
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radmonger posted:That was an obvious and entirely avoidable tactical blunder. Maybe consider acknowledging that, and commit to avoid doing anything similarly stupid in future , before giving up on the whole parliamentary socialism thing. I mean, the two alternatives were a) explicitly campaign for Remain (we lose those Midlands seats even harder) or b) explicitly campaign for Brexit, in which case everyone under the age of 40 goes to vote Lib Dem. There were no good choices here. What we got wasn't great, but that's because there was no great to be had.
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Sep 23, 2020 13:20
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feedmegin posted:I mean, the two alternatives were a) explicitly campaign for Remain (we lose those Midlands seats even harder) or b) explicitly campaign for Brexit, in which case everyone under the age of 40 goes to vote Lib Dem. There were no good choices here. What we got wasn't great, but that's because there was no great to be had. The only vaguely sane course was the slightly mealy-mouthed "We have to keep the Tories honest" stuff Corbyn was doing in 2016/17, which is notably what Starmer is doing now to the fawning adulation of the big-brains who insisted that Labour could win by a thousand seats if they only went full rabid Remain.
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Sep 23, 2020 13:23
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Stormgale posted:Thanks for being more thoughtful than the entire print media of this country about trans stuff thread! apparently the american guardian had to complain about how insane with transphobia the UK guardian was does anyone know what the inciting event for all these transphobes to go insane was? i'm wondering if there was something like how 9/11 made all the libs go fash or atheists become judeochristians or how obama winning 2012 made all the racists go super racist
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Sep 23, 2020 13:23
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Communist Thoughts posted:apparently the american guardian had to complain about how insane with transphobia the UK guardian was People were rude to them on Twitter. That's their 9/11.
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Sep 23, 2020 13:24
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feedmegin posted:I mean, the two alternatives were a) explicitly campaign for Remain (we lose those Midlands seats even harder) or b) explicitly campaign for Brexit, in which case everyone under the age of 40 goes to vote Lib Dem. There were no good choices here. What we got wasn't great, but that's because there was no great to be had. It's pure speculation but I think saying explicitly "Labour would bin Brexit if we got elected" wouldn't have been as bad as people think because there's a non trivial number of voters who "just want it over with either way" and found Boris message appealing in that regard. It was painfully obvious most of the pro-2nd Ref people were just FBPEs looking for a do-over even if there were logical arguments about "knowing more now" and suchlike. Labour were doing well before the meltdown in support around the EU elections; it's hard to know what could've worked (if anything) but we do know dithering on the fence really didn't work.
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Sep 23, 2020 13:29
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Communist Thoughts posted:apparently the american guardian had to complain about how insane with transphobia the UK guardian was Then Glinner got mild criticism of a bad joke he did.
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Sep 23, 2020 13:29
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Guavanaut posted:I see the comparison, but I think the big difference was that most of the scientists looking for a testable biologic cause for homosexuality were either literal Nazis in the 1940s or people coming out with comments like "of course, it would be a mother's choice to abort gay fetuses if we could develop a test" in the 90s. The Mail being on board with it should say everything. Oh sure, and yeah, it's flipped this time, I dunno if its a sign of more enlightened times or what. I knew way more gay people who didn't give a gently caress and were just living their lives. But I do remember the discourse, I *definitely* remember what the likes of the Mail were doing with it, and the more thoughtful people being "well, you know it's interesting...". It didn't seem to divide neatly down lines of sexuality or acceptance, just like now most trans people I know see the transmed stuff as either annoying or actively abhorrent, but you do get transmeds. And, allies who channel their acceptance through transmedicalism without meaning to.
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Sep 23, 2020 13:29
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Sanitary Naptime posted:Weetman has an article in the independent about Kieth’s speech that is so powerfully telling on herself that it’s off the scale even for her There is an interesting phenomenon of people who appear to have got everything they wanted, be it Boris winning, Brexit happening, or Corbyn leaving, but are still angry and upset. It's because what they really actually wanted was for people to stop telling that they are idiots on the internet. A day or two ago someone on here posted an article about what Tory MPs think in private about the culture war. An incredible quote in there: “What I don't quite get is why the left seems quite so keen to have a culture war, because certainly sat where I am in my constituency, it doesn't look to me like they're going to win it.” They really think they can turn this poo poo around. Brexit will happen, or a centrist becomes Labour leader, and now the Twitter rabble will finally show them some respect. Short of incredibly repressive crackdowns on freedom of speech (something to look forward to, accelerationism fans) the left's victory in the culture war is incredibly likely.
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Sep 23, 2020 13:35
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TheRat posted:Corbyn was extremely for accepting the referndum, because, you know, not accepting the referendum would be a complete disaster. Glad it didn't turn out that way though. Oh. Especially given that the brexit minister who came up with the policy that hosed him is now not only leading the party, but also placing all of the blame for it squarely on Corbyn's shoulders. kecske posted:idgi, so under the new guidance outdoor crowds at football are no bueno but indoor crowds at theatres are ok?
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Sep 23, 2020 13:35
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goddamnedtwisto posted:People were rude to them on Twitter. That's their 9/11. oh drat i think this is actually right at least somwhat i'd forgotten how insanely traumatising the corbyn era was for the blueticks because it roughly coincided with the era of getting slaughtered online for your terrible babybrained opeds i did think of it exactly as the chattering class' 9/11 now i guess they're hoping corbyn and bernie going away means its gone and since its not they're gonna get real mad at "populists polluting the discourse"
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Sep 23, 2020 13:36
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JK Rowling's new thriller takes No 1 spot amid transphobia row meanwhile, glinner sits at a darkened kitchen table in his empty house, cradling a cup of cold tea and penning his latest daily mail guest column
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Sep 23, 2020 13:37
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I completely forgot tweetman was in CUK, and not only in it, utterly hosed the LD candidate. https://twitter.com/coso9001/status/1308739832483639296
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Sep 23, 2020 13:38
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StarkingBarfish posted:I completely forgot tweetman was in CUK, and not only in it, utterly hosed the LD candidate. what the gently caress, how come i've had to read so many of her banal terrible tweets but i never heard of this?
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Sep 23, 2020 13:39
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It was a fight between a Change UK candidate and a Lib Dem, it's a wonder anyone with ears heard about it.
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Sep 23, 2020 13:45
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Isomermaid posted:Oh sure, and yeah, it's flipped this time, I dunno if its a sign of more enlightened times or what. I knew way more gay people who didn't give a gently caress and were just living their lives. But I do remember the discourse, I *definitely* remember what the likes of the Mail were doing with it, and the more thoughtful people being "well, you know it's interesting...". It didn't seem to divide neatly down lines of sexuality or acceptance, just like now most trans people I know see the transmed stuff as either annoying or actively abhorrent, but you do get transmeds. And, allies who channel their acceptance through transmedicalism without meaning to. Hopefully the public discourse will move past having to justify why affirmation therapies exist, and it'll mostly be for the benefit of people who can't yet express their identity, like the very young.
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Sep 23, 2020 13:45
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goddamnedtwisto posted:Funny you should say that... I've always been of the opinion that certain estates and buildings are specifically set up for that. In particular there's one design of late-60s tower block - here it is in Canning Town: There's one like this in Fulham right at the bottom of Wandsworth Bridge Road near the bridge that also has a concrete moat around it so the building is only accessible via walkways. The historic building height around it is all 2/3 story terraced so it always seemed a bit out of place, at least until they put a cement storage tower next to it on the river anyway. Also I think Wandsworth Bridge probably has a claim on being the worst maintained bridge in London*. It's a complete state, though I think it's finally getting some work done. *Hammersmith doesn't count as they physically couldn't maintain that one because of its construction which uses individually bolted components for the chains instead of cables or something so no matter how much the local gammons bang on about how "in my day the army would have a new one up in days" its going to take a long time to sort it out.
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Sep 23, 2020 13:47
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feedmegin posted:British people living in America (or Anglophile Americans). I might have considered it if it was around when I lived in Michigan, if I didn't just My American friend living in the US has subscribed to it (or is going to). She likes British TV (the older stuff). (She's 70 and very well travelled btw).
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Sep 23, 2020 13:47
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First trailer for Spitting Image is out. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n0JTta67aUE
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Sep 23, 2020 13:49
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Communist Thoughts posted:what the gently caress, how come i've had to read so many of her banal terrible tweets but i never heard of this? enjoy https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/North_East_England_(European_Parliament_constituency)#2019
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Sep 23, 2020 13:52
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Comrade Fakename posted:There is an interesting phenomenon of people who appear to have got everything they wanted, be it Boris winning, Brexit happening, or Corbyn leaving, but are still angry and upset. It's because what they really actually wanted was for people to stop telling that they are idiots on the internet. the left's victory in the culture war happened when david cameron beat david davis
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Sep 23, 2020 13:55
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josh04 posted:It was a fight between a Change UK candidate and a Lib Dem, it's a wonder anyone with ears heard about it. It was a fight between a lab candidate and a libdem, tweetman split the ld vote lol
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Sep 23, 2020 13:56
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Beefeater1980 posted:Separately, if it’s true that Labour is a captive opposition then maybe here’s a solution. Form a new centre-right party. Give it a name with historical resonance and broad appeal - the Commonwealth Party, perhaps. Have you forgotten the Lib Dems exist? I did too. Lungboy posted:First trailer for Spitting Image is out. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n0JTta67aUE Asking some 12 year olds from 2015 to write a comedy show looks pretty good. I didn't manage to finish the video unfortunately, but from what I saw I am excited at the prospect of one poster sitting through an entire episode and reporting back. Though they'd need Britbox, so I'm not sure who'd that be.
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Sep 23, 2020 13:57
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Jedit posted:A lot of Scottish flats are in blocks with two flats on each floor, but all sharing a single street number and external front door. So the flats get identifiers added. Your parcel is going to ground floor right. Guavanaut posted:Ground right, compare G/L, 2/R, etc, efb Ahh, thanks 
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Sep 23, 2020 13:57
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Gonzo McFee posted:What the gently caress does my families prosperity have to do with bombing Syria?
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Sep 23, 2020 14:01
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Guavanaut posted:
That's all I'm trying to say really. Now as back then I find the scientific discourse and the various ways it's digested and regurgitated by the popular consciousness impossible to ignore and it's exhausting, even as it supports me. The point I was trying to make was I remember this from last time, the good bit happens when we all get past this. Or, if I could disengage from it entirely! But it's a pandemic, and we're all Very Online Now.
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Sep 23, 2020 14:02
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feedmegin posted:British people living in America (or Anglophile Americans). I might have considered it if it was around when I lived in Michigan, if I didn't just I've just got a VPN for iPlayer for Pointless and Bob Mortimer fishing, then everything else is on Watchseries or Putlocker or posted on Reddit so gently caress it.
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Sep 23, 2020 14:02
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Powerful Two-Hander posted:There's one like this in Fulham right at the bottom of Wandsworth Bridge Road near the bridge that also has a concrete moat around it so the building is only accessible via walkways. The historic building height around it is all 2/3 story terraced so it always seemed a bit out of place, at least until they put a cement storage tower next to it on the river anyway. Hammersmith Bridge (another gift to the world from Bazalgette) uses chains because it's old enough that it was built before they could reliably make steel cable. Realistically of the pre-war London bridges should have been replaced by now - that they're standing at all is a testament to just how little the Victorians (and Edwardians) hosed around and just how tiny the horizons of modern Capitalism are, because Richard Rogers managed to make a bridge incapable of dealing with people walking on it, and after millions of pounds of remediation work it's still likely to need complete replacement before Hungerford Bridge, over a hundred years older.
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Sep 23, 2020 14:13
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Comrade Fakename posted:There is an interesting phenomenon of people who appear to have got everything they wanted, be it Boris winning, Brexit happening, or Corbyn leaving, but are still angry and upset. It's because what they really actually wanted was for people to stop telling that they are idiots on the internet. "the left" doesn't really go in for culture wars outside of weirdos on twitter. its the centrists who can't help themselves unless you're saying standing up for trans rights and minority rights is something the left should give up on
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Sep 23, 2020 14:16
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goddamnedtwisto posted:Hammersmith Bridge (another gift to the world from Bazalgette) uses chains because it's old enough that it was built before they could reliably make steel cable. Realistically of the pre-war London bridges should have been replaced by now - that they're standing at all is a testament to just how little the Victorians (and Edwardians) hosed around and just how tiny the horizons of modern Capitalism are, because Richard Rogers managed to make a bridge incapable of dealing with people walking on it, and after millions of pounds of remediation work it's still likely to need complete replacement before Hungerford Bridge, over a hundred years older. I've always wondered how much of it was "I am going to make the *strongest ever bridge* that all may marvel at its sturdiness" and how much was "I have no idea if this thing is gonna hold so might as well overspecify".
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Sep 23, 2020 14:16
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