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It should note that isn’t actually in the manga that was just apart of the anime because producing an episode a week was insanely hard That’s also why a lot of old shonen animation looks cheap
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Sep 26, 2020 19:31
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CharlestheHammer posted:It should note that isn’t actually in the manga that was just apart of the anime because producing an episode a week was insanely hard Also anime is generally produced faster than the manga it's adapted from, so unless there's a tremendous amount of manga to adapt already then they need to write up some filler while the manga catches up. Which gives rise to both the 'really dragging out a pre-existing fight scene' type of filler, and the 'now Goku has to learn to drive' type of filler. The latter of which, needless to say, is the best type of filler episode. The original Yu-Gi-Oh might be one of the more egregious I've seen. On top of filler episodes that usually go near the end of an arc just to get some buffer time, out of four seasons of the show (not including the pre-card game 'Season Zero') there's a good season and a half of straight, uninterrupted filler. Season three and the first half of season four are entirely filler while they wait for the final arc (and I think the first chunk of GX) to get written. Incidentally, you can tell a filler arc in the original Yu-Gi-Oh because they give female characters something to do that isn't 'lose'.
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Sep 27, 2020 07:37
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Dragon Ball Super feels like it has much better pacing (which isn't exactly a high bar, mind) probably because they know it's loving Dragon Ball, they don't have to worry about losing their timeslot. Though they do have a few episodes that make an effort to evoke the spirit of the old style entertaining filler. (Though the driving episode is a hard height to reach again) They do have the Dr Slump crossover and a meta-joke with the dub of the Copy-Vegeta episode. vvv: Yeah, pretty much. Ghost Leviathan has a new favorite as of 07:47 on Sep 27, 2020 |
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Sep 27, 2020 07:42
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Cleretic posted:Also anime is generally produced faster than the manga it's adapted from, so unless there's a tremendous amount of manga to adapt already then they need to write up some filler while the manga catches up. Which gives rise to both the 'really dragging out a pre-existing fight scene' type of filler, and the 'now Goku has to learn to drive' type of filler. The latter of which, needless to say, is the best type of filler episode. ah yes, Game Of Thrones
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Sep 27, 2020 07:42
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The setup of two or maybe a handful of characters battling, while the rest of the characters form a peanut gallery from a safe distance, is extremely good imo. Is it lazy storytelling? Yes. Is it cliche shounen? Yes. Is it super fun and and even more so if you are fifteen? Hell yes.
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Sep 27, 2020 07:52
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Game of Thrones would have been massively improved if they took the anime filler approach, honestly. Like, what Game of Thrones did is closer to, say, Trigun: taking an incomplete work and then attempting to backfill the ending as close as possible using the author's notes. Sometimes this works; people generally like the Trigun anime better than the manga. Sometimes, though, you get Game of Thrones. This type of "filler" is bonkers-rear end risky because it lives or dies on the skill of the writers, and if they don't utterly nail it the way that something like Trigun did, the whole series is basically ruined. If Game of Thrones had just stopped the plot dead when it ran out of book, and started doing adaptations of the Dunk and Egg stories like how One Piece does adaptations of the cover arcs for its filler, or done some dumb "Jon Snow has to get his driver's license" episodic nonsense, it would actually have been significantly better because once they got back to book material you could just ignore all the filler.
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Sep 27, 2020 07:55
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Edgar Allen Ho posted:The setup of two or maybe a handful of characters battling, while the rest of the characters form a peanut gallery from a safe distance, is extremely good imo. It makes a lot of sense when you realise it basically makes it a wrestling match. A lot of anime adaptations, especially Dragon Ball Super, basically use the manga as a rough draft for the story, and it can work really well especially when they have things like audience feedback to work from. Especially if you're basically using the same writers. That said, GoT was already doomed from the get go because JRRM has pretty clearly gotten completely sick of the series as well as having written himself into a corner.
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Sep 27, 2020 08:01
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WeedlordGoku69 posted:once they got back to book material you could just ignore all the filler. They couldn't stall for long enough for that to be an option.
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Sep 27, 2020 08:01
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Cleretic posted:Incidentally, you can tell a filler arc in the original Yu-Gi-Oh because they give female characters something to do that isn't 'lose'. You can also tell when it's a filler arc because yet another rear end in a top hat from Kaiba's past has come back to get their revenge on the Kaiba Corporation and his family.
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Sep 27, 2020 08:15
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Ghost Leviathan posted:A lot of anime adaptations, especially Dragon Ball Super, basically use the manga as a rough draft for the story not quite with DB Super, it's actually way more complicated than that basically Toriyama (the guy who created dragon ball) is writing the basic outline for Super, which then gets separately handed to Toyotaro (Super manga guy) and Toei (Super anime studio), who take it in somewhat different directions if you see a plot element in both, it's reasonably safe to say it was Toriyama's idea, but if you see something that's in one but not the other, it's from whoever respectively made that version
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Sep 27, 2020 08:16
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Scott Pilgrim vs. the World ran into this as well. The first 70% of the movie is the most faithfully I've ever seen anything adapted from one medium to another, but there's a clear point where Edgar Wright ran out of comic to pull from and started taking some guesses on his own.
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Sep 27, 2020 08:20
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Nameless Pete posted:Scott Pilgrim vs. the World ran into this as well. The first 70% of the movie is the most faithfully I've ever seen anything adapted from one medium to another, but there's a clear point where Edgar Wright ran out of comic to pull from and started taking some guesses on his own. I still like the movie but i do wish it had had more of the comeuppance scott got for being a lovely person in the comics, but even still I don't know if it'd have been enough to keep scott from being on the list of 'protagonists you wince when you see someone say they empathise with/look up to'
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Sep 27, 2020 08:24
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Vandar posted:You can also tell when it's a filler arc because yet another rear end in a top hat from Kaiba's past has come back to get their revenge on the Kaiba Corporation and his family. I do love how they can get away with that over and over because no one is going to be in the least bit surprised no matter how many times it happens Kaiba is basically the Tony Stark of children's card games and dragons and children's card games involving dragons
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Sep 27, 2020 08:38
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Ghost Leviathan posted:I do love how they can get away with that over and over because no one is going to be in the least bit surprised no matter how many times it happens but he's also the cute broody badass who specializes in "light" monsters and his signature dragon is the good guy dragon whereas our hero is a dweeb who turns into a creepy chess murderer. basically i'm saying there's a reason everyone crushes on Seto.
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Sep 27, 2020 08:45
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WeedlordGoku69 posted:Game of Thrones would have been massively improved if they took the anime filler approach, honestly. Maybe, but they would have been getting back to book material in Season 27.
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Sep 27, 2020 08:52
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Edgar Allen Ho posted:but he's also the cute broody badass who specializes in "light" monsters and his signature dragon is the good guy dragon Kaiba's also the only one of the main cast who's genuinely good at the game the entire show is based around. Yami Yugi canonically cheats to always pull the exact card he needs, and Joey relies on dumb luck so much that three of his most iconic cards are entirely based on coin flips and dice rolls. Non-Yami Yugi is a good player, but he only gets to show that right at the end of the show. And he staunchly refuses to believe in anything remotely mystical, which is a fantastic character trait that only gets more and more fantastic as the show gets more overt about using straight-up magic.
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Sep 27, 2020 09:01
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Ghost Leviathan posted:A lot of anime adaptations, especially Dragon Ball Super, basically use the manga as a rough draft for the story, and it can work really well especially when they have things like audience feedback to work from. Especially if you're basically using the same writers. The Boys is doing that right now. The producers took one thing early in the comics and diverged hard from the comics storyline. Amazingly, almost everyone who loved the comic books is totally down with the wildly divergent TV show. The edgy bullshit you loved at 13 doesn't make for good TV when you're pushing 30. I've only read the summary of the comics on Wikipedia, but I'm amazingly grateful that they didn't adapt that poo poo straight.
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Sep 27, 2020 09:33
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Edgar Allen Ho posted:a creepy chess murderer mods PLEASE
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Sep 27, 2020 10:24
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Cleretic posted:Also anime is generally produced faster than the manga it's adapted from, so unless there's a tremendous amount of manga to adapt already then they need to write up some filler while the manga catches up. Which gives rise to both the 'really dragging out a pre-existing fight scene' type of filler, and the 'now Goku has to learn to drive' type of filler. The latter of which, needless to say, is the best type of filler episode. Didn't this happen with the first Full Metal Alchemist anime leading to a movie about how World War 2 fueled their magic powers or something?
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Sep 27, 2020 10:40
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flatluigi posted:I still like the movie but i do wish it had had more of the comeuppance scott got for being a lovely person in the comics, but even still I don't know if it'd have been enough to keep scott from being on the list of 'protagonists you wince when you see someone say they empathise with/look up to' I wish the comic had more of the comeuppance scott got for being a lovely person in the comics. It starts off doing a pretty decent job, but kinda felt like it got cold feet in the final volume.
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Sep 27, 2020 10:42
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Desert Bus posted:Didn't this happen with the first Full Metal Alchemist anime leading to a movie about how World War 2 fueled their magic powers or something? That was a bit different, and closer to how Game of Thrones handled it: rather than just do filler stories until the original manga was finished, they did a whole new ending of their own. Which was so off-the-wall and unlike how the actual writer would go on to end it that there was a second anime adaptation solely so that the last word for most people wouldn't be THAT. Which is a weird echo for how I've heard the recent Dragon Ball revival happened: Toriyama was so disappointed by the live-action Dragonball Evolution that he came out of retirement essentially out of spite at the idea people would let that happen. Cleretic has a new favorite as of 12:52 on Sep 27, 2020 |
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Sep 27, 2020 12:44
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With the Buu saga, even if it was an arc that was kind of not in the initial plan, at least it was still a good one. You got the Incredible Fighting Candy, and Hercule nearly saving the world by being the villain's BFF.
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Sep 27, 2020 12:47
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Dragon Ball's always worked best when it keeps in touch with its comedic roots. Hence why the protagonist remains the clueless bumpkin martial arts savant himbo.
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Sep 27, 2020 12:55
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I always like when the smart character gets to have an episode though, like in Digimon Data Squad where it's just the two genius characters fighting, and the good guy genius is having trouble until he decides to try a new tactic, which is abandoning tactics all together and relying on luck like his friend does because he knows he can't outthink his opponent. There's a hilarious moment where the opponent's like "Yeah, you won, but it wasn't your power you used... you relied on his way instead on standing on your own." and the good guy's like "That's SO annoying that you're right. I hate that that was necessary..."
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Sep 27, 2020 12:59
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Desert Bus posted:Didn't this happen with the first Full Metal Alchemist anime leading to a movie about how World War 2 fueled their magic powers or something? Yeah they got maybe like halfway through the manga and ran out, so they just made up the rest wholesale. Then years later once the manga was done they adapted FMA again (Brotherhood) but the first season of Brotherhood is almost the same as the first season of the original because they had done a decent job originally. What's weird is Brotherhood cut out an episode (compared to the original series) about a side character that ends up being pretty important so they had to do a recap when he shows up near the end. The manga was done they knew the character was important but they still cut the episode because???
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Sep 27, 2020 13:16
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Out of all the ones I've watched, I think Naruto is the worst offender when it comes to filler. Bleach would be a close second.
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Sep 27, 2020 13:29
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the_steve posted:Out of all the ones I've watched, I think Naruto is the worst offender when it comes to filler. Bleach would be a close second. Though Naruto also has the problem in that you can tell it’s filler because female characters actually accomplish something
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Sep 27, 2020 13:36
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BioEnchanted posted:I always like when the smart character gets to have an episode though, like in Digimon Data Squad where it's just the two genius characters fighting, and the good guy genius is having trouble until he decides to try a new tactic, which is abandoning tactics all together and relying on luck like his friend does because he knows he can't outthink his opponent. There's a hilarious moment where the opponent's like "Yeah, you won, but it wasn't your power you used... you relied on his way instead on standing on your own." and the good guy's like "That's SO annoying that you're right. I hate that that was necessary..." That's honestly a very quick strength of Yu-Gi-Oh GX; they fill the supporting cast full of people who are actually smart, and use varied and interesting tactics. Which I think comes from the time the show was made; for basically the first time they were making the show not just based on what they knew the cards did, but how they knew people played. So you don't just get Jaden's reliance on very specific monsters, you've got Syrus' deck full of low-level cards with good combo potential (that he can't handle because he's got severe anxiety), Alexis repeatedly coming up with ways to bypass defenses, Bastion's multiple decks based on elaborate four+ card combos, and Chazz's deck constantly being underestimated because he literally got his signature cards from the garbage. Cleretic has a new favorite as of 13:43 on Sep 27, 2020 |
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Sep 27, 2020 13:39
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The world building of YuGiOh is delightfully insane. Seto Kaiba advanced technology up to the point of having made a space station shaped in his initials so that he can travel into the gates of the (canonical Egyptian) afterlife, so he can get a rematch on Yami.
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Sep 27, 2020 15:40
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His company also made elaborate freestanding holograms and he uses it for a card game. Although the funny thing is the holograms started out as kind of realistic in that they only showed up in strictly controlled situations and then later they were like gently caress it, holograms everywhere!
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Sep 27, 2020 16:03
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And it wasn't even his card game. Legally speaking, it was Pegasus's game, Kaiba just liked it so much he restructured a multibillion dollar company into making peripherals for it.
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Sep 27, 2020 16:13
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Apparently Kaiba made the hologram projectors because he kept losing badly to Pegasus, and figured Pegasus must have some kind of ability to spot tells, so he made peripherals that would have opponents standing a considerable distance away from each other just so he could foil it. (Which didn't even work, but to be fair 'Pegasus has a literal magical eye that lets him read minds' is a bit of a leap even without Kaiba's scepticism in play) Though it did still presumably make his company a shitload of money given how omnipresent they are (and that children's card games are serious business), and I bet Pegasus is his best customer. Funny thing is that without the mind reading, Pegasus is an absolutely lousy duelist even with his own personal deck of custom printed overpowered Toon cards. (Which are presumably only tournament legal because he literally owns the game and makes the rules)
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Sep 27, 2020 16:37
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Well I think the idea was he thought the tec he was using allowed him to cheat so Kaiba wanted to use his own tech to make sure he wasn’t. Though P got him to use his tech by threatening to make him duel his kid brother so Kaiba gave in. In the end he wasn’t using his tech in any way to cheat so I don’t know the point of that subplot
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Sep 27, 2020 16:40
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Humerus posted:Then years later once the manga was done they adapted FMA again (Brotherhood) The manga was actually still going when Brotherhood started. This led to them managing to have the manga and Brotherhood end almost simultaneously (Brotherhood ended one month after the manga).
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Sep 27, 2020 16:53
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Then again, Pegasus needing to cheat to be a threat to Yugi and Kaiba makes sense; both of them (well, all three counting Yami) are full-time card game fanatics, while Pegasus may have invented the game but he's an artist and businessman, and it's not exactly typical for the developers of a popular game to be the best at it.
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Sep 27, 2020 16:58
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Ghost Leviathan posted:Then again, Pegasus needing to cheat to be a threat to Yugi and Kaiba makes sense; both of them (well, all three counting Yami) are full-time card game fanatics, while Pegasus may have invented the game but he's an artist and businessman, and it's not exactly typical for the developers of a popular game to be the best at it. World of Warcraft is rather famous/infamous for using it's top competitive guilds as unpaid playtesters for their raids because the one time they tried to test it internally, they weren't good enough to even get through the easy parts. In an example of a piece of media aging strangely, C'thun is generally remembered positively as a difficult and iconic raid boss in spite of its initial release being mathematically impossible to kill before it wiped the party.
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Sep 27, 2020 18:33
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any videogame that is ongoing for long enough will have a playerbase who insists that what is happening now is bad but it was really great years back (when they started playing and either didn't know enough to be able to criticize it or have had enough time pass to smooth over their biggest complaints) world of warcraft's in a funny spot where it's been going so long that you have people talking fondly about basically any point in the game's history & you also finally have an officially-released "classic" server where people can actually go and get disillusioned about how good it actually was
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Sep 27, 2020 18:57
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Yeah, a lot of love older WoW is definitely just chasing the dragon. Definitely a lot of my fondness from the old days came from the mystery and unexplained weirdness out in the world, but now every rock and tree has a published novel about how it got there and you can't put that genie back in the bottle. Also regarding Classic, I think the official release reminded a lot of people why the pirate servers had like 3x exp and gold rewards or other stuff like that.
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Sep 27, 2020 19:37
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Apparently Cataclysm got a lot of complaints but MAN were most of the original zones vastly improved in the revision.
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Sep 27, 2020 19:48
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buddhist nudist posted:Yeah, a lot of love older WoW is definitely just chasing the dragon. Definitely a lot of my fondness from the old days came from the mystery and unexplained weirdness out in the world, but now every rock and tree has a published novel about how it got there and you can't put that genie back in the bottle. For me, I recognize having a lot of nostalgia for "had the free time to play video games 8 hours per day and no real responsibilities", more than the specific game itself.
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Sep 27, 2020 20:02
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