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Azathoth posted:At the inquest, they quickly figured out that if the captain of HMS Camperdown, the ship that collided with HMS Victoria, had refused to obey the order that resulted in the collision, he would have been court-martialed for disobeying and, at a minimum, kicked out of the Navy, because no one would have understood that he averted disaster. It's the same with the Titanic disaster. Lots of people bang on about the bulkheads not going high enough as if this was a stupid design flaw, when in fact the ship had watertight subdivision that allowed it to absorb damage far beyond what was reasonably foreseeable for its role (and is superior to most modern cruise ships). It's just that on its maiden voyage the ship took damage that was - only slightly - in excess of its design limits and so it sank. In circumstances which had never knowingly happened before in maritime history and haven't happened since. Similarly, it has been calculated that had the ship hit the iceberg head on, it would have killed people in the forward part of the ship but limited the damage to an extent that the ship would have survived - badly flooded, but she would have floated until assistance arrived. So there is an undercurrent in some quarters of blaming the officer of the watch for not doing that. But, leaving aside the fact that he had been trained all his career to avoid obstacles rather than hit them, what was he going to say in the inevitable fallout? "I had a weird feeling that if I tried to avoid the berg the ship wouldn't turn in time and would ground out on the surrounding underwater ice shelf and cause just enough damage to exceed the limits of the watertight bulkheads causing it to sink"? Of course not, because he didn't know that. He would have been pilloried as the fool who drove the world's largest ship straight into an iceberg on a clear, calm night and killed 50 people.
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Sep 28, 2020 18:14
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Making some big assumptions that restarting the industrial revolution with coal is a good thing here or that our current society is a desired goal.
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Sep 28, 2020 18:15
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This is a good video, but the guy pauses just a bit too much between each sentence and it's getting on my nerves
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Sep 28, 2020 18:17
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BalloonFish posted:It's the same with the Titanic disaster. Lots of people bang on about the bulkheads not going high enough as if this was a stupid design flaw, when in fact the ship had watertight subdivision that allowed it to absorb damage far beyond what was reasonably foreseeable for its role (and is superior to most modern cruise ships). It's just that on its maiden voyage the ship took damage that was - only slightly - in excess of its design limits and so it sank. In circumstances which had never knowingly happened before in maritime history and haven't happened since. Its important to remember that the metal may have also been weakened by a coal fire that had happened prior to and during the beginning of the trip from Belfast as well, likely weakened multiple bulkheads. As the ship left Belfast, there was an ongoing coal fire below decks. CommieGIR fucked around with this message at 18:26 on Sep 28, 2020 |
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Sep 28, 2020 18:19
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Uthor posted:Ryan North wrote a book about how to build anything starting from nothing except for the information in the book. I read this post, and thought "the guy who wrote squirrel girl?" Yeah, the same dude! Thanks for the rec. I've really enjoyed his comic writing. It tends to be really quite funny in a nerdy kind of way (my favourite way). Edit: dang BMan, I slept on those. Going to have to give them a go. Midas Flesh was good too. B33rChiller fucked around with this message at 18:48 on Sep 28, 2020 |
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Sep 28, 2020 18:25
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Ryan North edited Machine of Death, which upset Glenn Beck by placing above his own book on the bestsellers list, and I will always remember that.
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Sep 28, 2020 18:28
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B33rChiller posted:I read this post, and thought "the guy who wrote dinosaur comics?"
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Sep 28, 2020 18:38
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CommieGIR posted:Its important to remember that the metal may have also been weakened by a coal fire that had happened prior to and during the beginning of the trip from Belfast as well, likely weakened multiple bulkheads. There was also an interesting documentary which was on Netflix/Amazon a while back but I can't be hosed to find it again, which posited that one thing that contributed heavily (well, the documentary was sensationalist hype so it was sold as " the actual reason the Titanic sank that no one has figured out until now ") was basically the mirage effect, caused by cold instead of heat. That is, the iceberg was hidden by the mirage effect caused by the intensely cold water, well below freezing, and that's why the lookouts didn't see it in time to turn, since after all it's described as taller than the ship and their entire job is to be on the lookout for bergs. I mean few disasters are caused by only one thing, so the weak metal combined with the glancing blow (opening up too many compartments for the ship to survive) are definitely the other two major causes, but I'd never seen anyone mention the mirage issue before and I'd always wondered why the hell the event was described as "oh poo poo where'd that iceberg come from".
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Sep 28, 2020 18:49
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https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qq6zulyXO5Q 7:50 of heavy equipment oopsies, including one at 3:30 that is probably some kind of record. No obvious visible injuries.
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Sep 28, 2020 18:52
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I thought I also remembered people having concerns that galvanic corrosion wasn't understood at the time and that it weakened the rivets, increasing the damage. On the other hand I would think they would have figured out the rough principles of galvanic corrosion since they had been copper bottoming ships since the early 1800s and the titanic wasn't the first metal hulled ship
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Sep 28, 2020 19:10
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B33rChiller posted:I read this post, and thought "the guy who wrote squirrel girl?" Yeah, the same dude! Thanks for the rec. I've really enjoyed his comic writing. It tends to be really quite funny in a nerdy kind of way (my favourite way). Platystemon posted:Ryan North edited Machine of Death, which upset Glenn Beck by placing above his own book on the bestsellers list, and I will always remember that. BMan posted:the guy who wrote dinosaur comics The guy who did the very OSHA thing of getting stuck in a hole. https://www.polygon.com/2015/8/18/9173621/ryan-north-stuck-hole-twitter His comic adaptation of Slaughterhouse-Five just came out and by all indications, seems excellent.
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Sep 28, 2020 19:16
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One of the craziest things about the whole Challenger story to me is that the O-Rings were sort of expected to fail, just not in the way that they ultimately did. Apparently the original design was poo poo, and the O-Rings failed to form a proper seal as intended. But because they failed to do that, the casing deformed during ignition which caused the O-Ring to shift out of it's groove to a position where it did form a seal. Once this was determined rather than go back and fix the O-Ring design, the company just changed the design spec to include this process and relied on it happening in future launches.
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Sep 28, 2020 19:16
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EvenWorseOpinions posted:I thought I also remembered people having concerns that galvanic corrosion wasn't understood at the time and that it weakened the rivets, increasing the damage. On the other hand I would think they would have figured out the rough principles of galvanic corrosion since they had been copper bottoming ships since the early 1800s and the titanic wasn't the first metal hulled ship the ship hit an iceberg and was damaged and sank there wasn't anything mysterious or impossible about it, there were no major flaws in the ship's design*, it was just bad luck all the "what really sank the titanic???" conspiracy theories are no different from 9/11 truthing *other than there not being enough lifeboats for everyone on board, that one was definitively proven to be stupid
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Sep 28, 2020 19:33
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Sagebrush posted:the ship hit an iceberg and was damaged and sank Oh, it was likely going to sink no matter what, but having a bulkhead warped by fire likely made it happen a lot faster. Its like Chernobyl: Whatever happened was going to be bad due to mismanagement of the reactor, but the design flaw just amplified it.
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Sep 28, 2020 19:35
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Azathoth posted:We'd probably get back to a 20th century standard of living quicker than you'd think, but getting into the information age would be significantly harder. imo the actual response is, we would ramp up recycling of existing materials until trade networks were reestablished. even if all the electronics in the world were bricked, that doesnt mean you can't harvest their rare earth metals to make new ones
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Sep 28, 2020 19:48
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The White Dragon posted:imo the actual response is, we would ramp up recycling of existing materials until trade networks were reestablished Imagine this then, we get teleported to Earf 2. We have the good brains and memories, but totally empty handed.
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Sep 28, 2020 19:49
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haveblue posted:The most OSHA thing about the shuttle is the label on the attachment point on the back of the 747
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Sep 28, 2020 19:51
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CommieGIR posted:Its important to remember that the metal may have also been weakened by a coal fire that had happened prior to and during the beginning of the trip from Belfast as well, likely weakened multiple bulkheads. I mean, it's incredibly OSHA, and indicitive of the rather reckless way that trans-Atlantic liners were run in the early 20th century, but coal 'fires' (more of a smouldering in the middle of the coal bunker, due to the restricted air supply) were, if not routine, certainly 'no big deal'. The Titanic's junior officers, and many of the suriving firemen, didn't even know about it since it didn't affect them. It was entirely unremarkable for coal-fired ships to sail with bunker fires - the Board of Trade inspector who signed off Titanic's paperwork knew about it - and it was SOP to just prioritise emptying that bunker to get to and remove the smouldering coal. In fact the bunker fire may have in a small way helped prolong the ship during the sinking - because it was emptied first the ship had a slight list to port when she hit the iceberg. Since the flooding was from the starboard side, she began listing over the starboard - a tendency which would, in the normal course of things, lead to a progressively steeper angle of heel and an eventual capsize. But all the initial stages of flooding did was correct the port list. Then the ship did begin leaning to starboard, but by then the sinking had progressed to the extent that the longitudinal working passage which ran the length of the ship on the port side of E-Deck began to flood, pulling the ship back onto a more even keel. Although the Titanic is a 'classic' sinking, it was actually highly unusual in that the ship sank slowly by the head on an even keel over multiple hours. The 'bunker fire weakened the steel' theory is...controversial, to say the least. Especially that TV documentary a few years back which 'proved it' with photographic evidence of the 'damage' to the hull - none of which actually corresponded with the location of the smouldering bunker, or any of the coal bunkers at all. Super Soaker Party! posted:There was also an interesting documentary which was on Netflix/Amazon a while back but I can't be hosed to find it again, which posited that one thing that contributed heavily (well, the documentary was sensationalist hype so it was sold as " the actual reason the Titanic sank that no one has figured out until now ") was basically the mirage effect, caused by cold instead of heat. That is, the iceberg was hidden by the mirage effect caused by the intensely cold water, well below freezing, and that's why the lookouts didn't see it in time to turn, since after all it's described as taller than the ship and their entire job is to be on the lookout for bergs. For the bit in bold, there is a theory which I find fascinating and strangely compelling, that the Titanic was accidentally conned into the iceberg which had previously been spotted some minutes before, due to a loss of situational awareness on the part of the officer of the watch and a design flaw with the ship's navigating arrangements where the standard compass (by which all courses were set and maintained) was positioned on a compass platform 230ft away from the bridge, and from which forward view was blocked by the funnels. The theory goes that, as per White Star Line regulations, the ship's course was to be checked on the standard compass every hour. On the evening of the disaster, the ship's clocks were put back 46 minutes to account for her westward progress, and the difference was split between the two duty watches, so each watch would serve an extra 23 minutes. The watch on the 8pm-midnight duty reached '1st midnight' and then the clocks were put back 23 minutes (returning them to 11:37pm). Since an hour had passed since the last compass check, it still had to be carried out. A course adjustment was required, which was done by the officer on the compass platform sending coded instructions via an electric bell to the helmsmen in the wheelhouse. This meant that just before 11:40pm (the time of collision by the ship's clock, but the 'second' 11:40pm of the working day), the ship was being conned not by the officer on the bridge, but by his colleague 200+ft away with no clear view ahead. And he accidentally nudged the ship into collision with an iceberg that it was previously going to clear. This explains several points: 1) We know that Quartermaster Olliver was walking back to the bridge from the compass platform at the time of the collision, having just adjusted the oil lamps illuminating the compass. Why was he there, why did the lamps need trimming? 2) We know that Fourth Officer Boxhall was on duty but not on the bridge at the time of the collision. In 1912 he said he was walking towards the bridge from an unspecified location - was it the compass platform? 3) That neither of the lookouts would be drawn on specifically how much time passed between them ringing their bell and the ship striking the iceberg. Frederick Fleet blanked the question, saying he was unable to say whether it was even a minute or an hour. None of the lookouts' testimony puts a timeframe on their actions, only a sequence - they spotted the berg -> they rang the bell -> they telephoned the bridge -> the ship struck the berg. 4) Why did the lookouts ring the warning bell and then telephone the bridge? That wasn't normal procedure. 5) Why did AB Scarott testify that between five and eight minutes passed between him hearing the lookout's bell and the collision? 6) QM Hichens at the wheel said the ship made a two-point turn to port before the collision. That's a curiously specific recollection, given that it was an emergency and he was in a wheelhouse with shutters closed and no view out. But what if that had been the order given to him via the bell codes from the compass platform a few minutes before? Again, his testimony only gives the sequence of events, not the time intervals or the context. 7) Why - according to the testimony of Major A.G. Peuchen - did Hichens and Fleet have a shouted conversation between their two lifeboats after the sinking, trying to clear up exactly which officer was on the bridge at the time of the collision? 8) How - if you believe the standard depiction of the collision, as in the movies - an experienced and qualified crew on a clear (if dark) night with unlimited visibility, didn't see an iceberg until they were right on top of it. 9) Why, in the years after the sinking, the Titanic's sisterships were modified with the standard compass moved to a binnacle on top of the wheelhouse, visible to the helmsman via a periscope. There are questions against this theory, but nothing which conclusively proves (or disproves) it.
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Sep 28, 2020 20:02
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LifeSunDeath posted:Imagine this then, we get teleported to Earf 2. We have the good brains and memories, but totally empty handed. The sci-fi novel The Long Earth and its sequels delve into this some. A gadget is invented that allows anyone to freely and easily transfer to uninhabited parallel Earths, but you can only take what you're holding and iron doesn't transfer, so no heavy machinery. It's not exactly starting from nothing since people can still take, like, bronze screwdrivers and stuff, but it's a really interesting exploration of that bootstrap process. Most places can get up to a ~19th century tech level pretty quickly, but only a few major Earths develop past that since it requires such a massive increase in the local industrial base.
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Sep 28, 2020 20:06
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Wingnut Ninja posted:The sci-fi novel The Long Earth and its sequels delve into this some. A gadget is invented that allows anyone to freely and easily transfer to uninhabited parallel Earths, but you can only take what you're holding and iron doesn't transfer, so no heavy machinery. It's not exactly starting from nothing since people can still take, like, bronze screwdrivers and stuff, but it's a really interesting exploration of that bootstrap process. Most places can get up to a ~19th century tech level pretty quickly, but only a few major Earths develop past that since it requires such a massive increase in the local industrial base. I'll check it out, sounds like my jam. I have an anthropology degree, and the chain of tool evolution fascinates me to no end.
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Sep 28, 2020 20:13
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LifeSunDeath posted:Imagine this then, we get teleported to Earf 2. We have the good brains and memories, but totally empty handed. Mass starvation (/cannibalism) - we cannot support our current population without artificial fertiliser made using the Haber process, which needs high pressures and temperatures that you need good pressure vessels for. https://www.nature.com/articles/22672.pdf?origin=ppub
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Sep 28, 2020 20:23
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Xaintrailles posted:Mass starvation (/cannibalism) - we cannot support our current population without artificial fertiliser made using the Haber process, which needs high pressures and temperatures that you need good pressure vessels for. They had a behind the bastards about that guy, he also made phosgene and bunch of other nasty chemicals.
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Sep 28, 2020 20:26
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Wingnut Ninja posted:The sci-fi novel The Long Earth and its sequels delve into this some. A gadget is invented that allows anyone to freely and easily transfer to uninhabited parallel Earths, but you can only take what you're holding and iron doesn't transfer, so no heavy machinery. It's not exactly starting from nothing since people can still take, like, bronze screwdrivers and stuff, but it's a really interesting exploration of that bootstrap process. Most places can get up to a ~19th century tech level pretty quickly, but only a few major Earths develop past that since it requires such a massive increase in the local industrial base. SM Stirling has a pair of series kind of about this too. There's Island in the Sea of Time and sequels where modern Nantucket is teleported back to the Bronze Age. Then there's Dies the Fire and sequels whatever teleports Nantucket away also fucks with physics to the point not even steam engines work for the rest of the modern world.
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Sep 28, 2020 20:33
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Flash Gordon Ramsay posted:Having a ramp where drivers might miss the corner seems like a bad idea, in hindsight. idk, seems like a great spot to watch the race. The only question is why was no one standing there to record the crash
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Sep 28, 2020 20:33
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Cthulu Carl posted:SM Stirling has a pair of series kind of about this too. There's Island in the Sea of Time and sequels where modern Nantucket is teleported back to the Bronze Age. Then there's Dies the Fire and sequels whatever teleports Nantucket away also fucks with physics to the point not even steam engines work for the rest of the modern world. The Long Earth series is really fun (and co-written by Terry Pratchett!). Dies the Fire has interesting parts but SM Stirling is an absolutely insufferable writer, so it's a real slog to get through all the ridiculous LARPing Wiccan supermen and women and their terrible monologues. Just painfully badly written main characters who are the best at everything.  https://va.media.tumblr.com/tumblr_qgwruiYiu31yebpxd.mp4 https://va.media.tumblr.com/tumblr_qh8ipgOudl1s1ddrj.mp4
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Sep 28, 2020 21:10
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GotLag posted:No we won't. Jabor posted:No. Coal got made during the carboniferous because there was literally nothing that could eat trees. Dead wood just kept piling up, most of it burned, but a lot of it also got buried in landslides, which is what eventually turned into coal. This is an interesting way to explain climate change to dumb people/deniers: The earth used to be much hotter. For tens of millions of years, trees pulled carbon out of the atmosphere and since nothing could break them down the carbon was permanently removed and the earth cooled. Now we are digging all of those trees up and burning them increasing atmospheric carbon back to where it was when the earth was much hotter. For people who say we can't change the climate, it's too big, or just can't wrap their mind around the concept this explanation sometimes gets through to them.
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Sep 28, 2020 21:11
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Are the hospitals in Europe filled with 19 year olds with shattered ankles?
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Sep 28, 2020 22:48
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Weembles posted:Are the morgues in Europe filled with shattered 19 year olds?
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Sep 28, 2020 23:05
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I'll bed people love it when he's stomping around on the roof.
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Sep 28, 2020 23:23
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Cojawfee posted:I'll bed people love it when he's stomping around on the roof. The trust in roofers these people have is, well, very stupid.
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Sep 28, 2020 23:24
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LifeSunDeath posted:The trust in roofers these people have is, well, very stupid. I was gonna say, he's putting a lot of faith in the sturdiness of those dormer windows. I doubt those are designed expecting people to be jumping on them.
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Sep 29, 2020 00:08
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Wingnut Ninja posted:I was gonna say, he's putting a lot of faith in the sturdiness of those dormer windows. I doubt those are designed expecting people to be jumping on them. He's one unlucky patch of slippery bird poop away from a face to face appointment with the pavement.
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Sep 29, 2020 00:16
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Luv 2 be crushed to death by falling roof hopping imbeciles when I step out for a croissant
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Sep 29, 2020 00:51
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Jabor posted:if it happens too late then there wouldn't be enough coal left to restart an industrialized society There's still several hundred years worth of non-metallurgical coal in the Victorian coal measures in the LaTrobe valley. We're a fair way away from that particular tipping point, but essentially all of the easily-discovered base metal deposits have been found and exploited already. The Broken Hill deposit and Mt Isa are mostly or completely gone, Red Dog and Rampura Agucha only have around a decade left at current production, etc etc. If you don't have lead for batteries and zinc for alloys, catalysts and coatings, bootstrapping up another industrial civilisation is going to look very different. Super Soaker Party! posted:There was also an interesting documentary which was on Netflix/Amazon a while back but I can't be hosed to find it again, which posited that one thing that contributed heavily (well, the documentary was sensationalist hype so it was sold as " the actual reason the Titanic sank that no one has figured out until now ") was basically the mirage effect, caused by cold instead of heat. That is, the iceberg was hidden by the mirage effect caused by the intensely cold water, well below freezing, and that's why the lookouts didn't see it in time to turn, since after all it's described as taller than the ship and their entire job is to be on the lookout for bergs. Maybe if they had a key to the binoculars locker they might have seen it  D-Pad posted:This is an interesting way to explain climate change to dumb people/deniers: Also that we're burning tens of millions of years worth of tree growth in a couple of hundred years. Memento fucked around with this message at 01:30 on Sep 29, 2020 |
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Sep 29, 2020 01:26
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D-Pad posted:This is an interesting way to explain climate change to dumb people/deniers: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=m-AXBbuDxRY
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Sep 29, 2020 01:45
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climate change deniers think that rain comes from stars, they're not going to understand any of these facts.
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Sep 29, 2020 02:08
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Rain is like sixteen parts in eighteen star-stuff.
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Sep 29, 2020 02:17
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priznat posted:Luv 2 be crushed to death by falling roof hopping imbeciles when I step out for a croissant  https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xBp76WemoNw
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Sep 29, 2020 02:27
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aphid_licker posted:https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qq6zulyXO5Q I wonder what percentage of crane jobs end up with people standing around with their hands on their hips saying "well, now we need an even bigger crane"
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Sep 29, 2020 02:42
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starkebn posted:I wonder what percentage of crane jobs end up with people standing around with their hands on their hips saying "well, now we need an even bigger crane" Job security!
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Sep 29, 2020 03:00
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