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Barudak posted:I may be a humble country lawyer but I assume its that on Xbox they're considered the same game by the system and your hardware determines what you get but on playstation they are distinct skus and thus non transferable. That may at least be how it's presented to the end user. There's definitely a difference on the backend but that can all be obfuscated. A bit like how iTunes digital movies technically have several copies of the movie in question on their backend server and it just feeds you whatever works on your setup (e.g. if you have 4K but only SDR it feeds you a 4K SDR version, if you have Dolby Vision it feeds you a Dolby Vision version etc.) I'm a bit curious how the disc versions of cross-gen Xbox games are going to work, specifically how much you'll be expected to download using that disc in a Series X.
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Sep 29, 2020 13:08
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Crafty posted:I hope that more pre-orders happen, because I don't have one yet If you aren’t already, follow Jelly Deals on Twitter. They are good at finding when new UK preorders open
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Sep 29, 2020 13:20
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univbee posted:My understanding from stirrings online, and Akuma feel free to confirm or deny (or not), is that the PS5 is easier to develop for, but does so in such a way that it's not really factoring in cross-gen elements, while Xbox is more of a pain to develop for but its SDK has built-in integration for cross-gen and cross-platform stuff (i.e. it's more work but you wind up pretty close to a cross-platform Win10/XB1/XB Series build just doing the baseline stuff if you're not specifically excluding XB1, while with PS5 the "baseline" work doesn't facilitate a PS4 version necessarily).
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Sep 29, 2020 13:23
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univbee posted:I'm a bit curious how the disc versions of cross-gen Xbox games are going to work, specifically how much you'll be expected to download using that disc in a Series X. Basic assets and such from disc, rest in the form of a patch. No different than a modern XBone/PS4 game with day one patches. EDIT: In regard to the games being "the same application", the OS on XSX is an update of the one found on Xbone. Since it's based on the Windows 10 core, the games would work no different than running a game on PC with different hardware. PS5 might have a completely new OS on the backend which requires a full refactor of games to use all the backend stuff (trophies, saves etc.) Asteroid Alert fucked around with this message at 13:33 on Sep 29, 2020 |
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Sep 29, 2020 13:25
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univbee posted:My understanding from stirrings online, and Akuma feel free to confirm or deny (or not), is that the PS5 is easier to develop for, but does so in such a way that it's not really factoring in cross-gen elements, while Xbox is more of a pain to develop for but its SDK has built-in integration for cross-gen and cross-platform stuff (i.e. it's more work but you wind up pretty close to a cross-platform Win10/XB1/XB Series build just doing the baseline stuff if you're not specifically excluding XB1, while with PS5 the "baseline" work doesn't facilitate a PS4 version necessarily). I also wonder how much the save situation has to do with how Sony has designed their save system. I know there are a very small handful of games like Assassin's Creed Unity where the disc and digital versions don't use the same save file on the PS4. This post, allegedly from a developer on another forum, has been posted a few times on Resetera and it makes sense to me: quote:Sony's backend is really not made for this, it's an absolute mess to work with compared to Microsoft and there's absolute zero sign of them changing it anytime soon, sadly. Every version of a game, (physical, digital, special editions, re-releases, GOTY editions etc) is a different Title ID and not only that it's also different for Europe, America and Asia and each submission is handled separately. So if you're lucky and you're "only" doing a digital release for your title in those three regions, that's still 3 submissions you have to go through. Add a physical release, now you're doing six submissions! Updates planned for your game? Yep, six submissions every time. Any one of these can be failed too, whilst you'll pass without issue in the other regions. Their system is bonkers. Saves is a mine field. When submitting you CAN include the feature to read saves from other Title IDs but you're limited to linking a single Title ID. So you can't say, release a physical GOTY edition down the line and have ALL saves work. You can link one existing Title ID. I dunno. Zerot fucked around with this message at 13:43 on Sep 29, 2020 |
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Sep 29, 2020 13:34
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Zerot posted:I do think people are expecting way too much from PS4 BC on PS5. I don't think it's going to be as fully featured as Microsoft's implementation. theyre both doing it the same exact way. this is truly nonsensical at this point. the most you could say is that one or the other of the two companies will be more or less committed to chasing down and patching any outlying titles which have issues, but theres no "fully featured" when both are doing native hardware compatibility and both are saying any games which are able to use the extra power available will be doing so. this is like people claiming ps5 was dropping backwards compatibility because sony said there was backwards compatibility once or twice but not every single week.
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Sep 29, 2020 13:48
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Stux posted:theyre both doing it the same exact way. this is truly nonsensical at this point. the most you could say is that one or the other of the two companies will be more or less committed to chasing down and patching any outlying titles which have issues, but theres no "fully featured" when both are doing native hardware compatibility and both are saying any games which are able to use the extra power available will be doing so. this is like people claiming ps5 was dropping backwards compatibility because sony said there was backwards compatibility once or twice but not every single week. Let's not forget that Cerny said they will have 100 of the most popular PS4 games* running on launch AND also the report that all games released from july onwards to have PS5 compatibility from day 1. So if anything, you'll just need a patch for the game to run. (* Marketing speak)
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Sep 29, 2020 13:51
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Iacen posted:If you aren’t already, follow Jelly Deals on Twitter. They are good at finding when new UK preorders open Thanks I will check it out. Kind of hoping I can get one launch day, even though there's nothing I'm interested in playing from the launch lineup. Think I'll buy Sekiro and try that out, and also MUST get new thing.... NOW.
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Sep 29, 2020 13:55
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Adaptabullshit posted:Let's not forget that Cerny said they will have 100 of the most popular PS4 games* running on launch AND also the report that all games released from july onwards to have PS5 compatibility from day 1.
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Sep 29, 2020 13:57
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They have come out more then once since that press conference and said 99% of games will work so those people can’t read.
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Sep 29, 2020 13:58
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Adaptabullshit posted:Let's not forget that Cerny said they will have 100 of the most popular PS4 games* running on launch AND also the report that all games released from july onwards to have PS5 compatibility from day 1. they said this month that they have now tested thousands of games and 99% are currently working lol even before they said pretty clearly that they were going to be testing and ensuring near every ps4 game works on ps5 for launch, this was in march after cerny said they had worked with amd to put full ps4 and ps4 pro compatibility modes into the new apu, much like amd did with microsoft and the series x chip. its like some bizarre game of telephone going on.
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Sep 29, 2020 14:00
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EA Play joins Xbox Game Pass Ultimate at launch. https://twitter.com/XboxWire/status/1310927394186772481 Stux posted:theyre both doing it the same exact way. this is truly nonsensical at this point. the most you could say is that one or the other of the two companies will be more or less committed to chasing down and patching any outlying titles which have issues, but theres no "fully featured" when both are doing native hardware compatibility and both are saying any games which are able to use the extra power available will be doing so. this is like people claiming ps5 was dropping backwards compatibility because sony said there was backwards compatibility once or twice but not every single week. We had a discussion earlier in this thread about the differences in the approaches by Microsoft and Sony with BC, and it didn't go anywhere and likely won't this time, either. We disagree about what limited info we have. It's fine. I predict that, when comparing a bunch of Xbox One games on Series X versus PlayStation 4 games on PS5, that there will be a ton of notable differences in performance and user experience. I'm not even talking about stuff like AutoHDR and framerate/resolution doubling. I'd love to be wrong, sincerely, but this is my expectation. Most games will probably run about the same that they did on PS4 or PS4 Pro. Hopefully Sony shows more soon.
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Sep 29, 2020 14:01
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Stux posted:they said this month that they have now tested thousands of games and 99% are currently working lol even before they said pretty clearly that they were going to be testing and ensuring near every ps4 game works on ps5 for launch, this was in march after cerny said they had worked with amd to put full ps4 and ps4 pro compatibility modes into the new apu, much like amd did with microsoft and the series x chip. its like some bizarre game of telephone going on. Sony's marketing has been absolutely atrocious in the last few months, I don't blame anyone for getting their messages confused
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Sep 29, 2020 14:02
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Stux posted:its like some bizarre game of telephone going on. This all stems from awful communication from their PR/Marketing teams. All of this could have been easily avoided with a couple of tweets (from Sony, not from a random journalist), or in one of their conferences.
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Sep 29, 2020 14:03
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Crafty posted:Keeping your PS4 solves the backwards compatible issue, I don't think Sony have any interest in extending that compatability to ps3/ps2. Are you able to play all PSN store bought games online if your account has expired? I think at least PS+ games are not available then. If I do decide (after being boring  ) to switch to the MS camp, I am definitely not going to keep paying my PS+ account. It will most likely be either one, or the other due to financial reasons.
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Sep 29, 2020 14:05
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Zerot posted:EA Play joins Xbox Game Pass Ultimate at launch. So I get to play Madden once to see next gen graphics and don't have to pay 60 bucks for it? Nice Also, hopefully Sony has enhancements for their BC too. If they need to test the games, the 1% might just be ones that have issues with the increased horsepower. Kinda like PS4 Pro boost mode caused issues for a small handful of games.
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Sep 29, 2020 14:06
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Sioux posted:Are you able to play all PSN store bought games online if your account has expired? I think at least PS+ games are not available then. If I do decide (after being boring PSN games you purchase will remain playable, except online play. You can't play your PS+ games if your subscription lapses. If you buy, say, a month, then all the games you have redeemed would be playable again, I believe.
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Sep 29, 2020 14:09
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Zerot posted:You can't play your PS+ games if your subscription lapses. If you buy, say, a month, then all the games you have redeemed would be playable again, I believe. This is it
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Sep 29, 2020 14:09
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Ah thanks, so yes I will be going to be betting on one horse, pretty much. Of course I can always change my mind later and try to exchange/sell one for the other. vvv good point!
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Sep 29, 2020 14:13
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Are those PS+ Games on Gamepass though? I bet a decent proportion of them probably are
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Sep 29, 2020 14:13
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Adaptabullshit posted:So I get to play Madden once to see next gen graphics and don't have to pay 60 bucks for it? Nice You'll have to wait about 6 months from whenever Madden came out, EA Play is just their vaulted games not all their new releases.
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Sep 29, 2020 14:13
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Barudak posted:You'll have to wait about 6 months from whenever Madden came out, EA Play is just their vaulted games not all their new releases. I am not sure if it's going to be a part of the Game Pass Ultimate version, but EA Play does include 10-hour trials of most of EA's new releases. You can get every Madden 21 achievement in that ten hours, so I hear.
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Sep 29, 2020 14:14
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Zerot posted:I am not sure if it's going to be a part of the Game Pass Ultimate version, but EA Play does include 10-hour trials of most of EA's new releases. Oh haha, yeah, no you're right. I was forgetting the trials. I can't imagine playing 10 hours much less 10 minutes of the new madden when 99% of its value is locked behind the competitive gambling mode.
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Sep 29, 2020 14:20
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Zerot posted:I predict that, when comparing a bunch of Xbox One games on Series X versus PlayStation 4 games on PS5, that there will be a ton of notable differences in performance and user experience. I'm not even talking about stuff like AutoHDR and framerate/resolution doubling. I'd love to be wrong, sincerely, but this is my expectation. Most games will probably run about the same that they did on PS4 or PS4 Pro. Hopefully Sony shows more soon. based on what though. a prediction should at least be based in some form of reason. sony have also said ps5 games will benefit from boosted performance, dependant on titles, just like the series x where we have already seen variations in how much better certain games run simply due to each games coding. both platforms are using the exact same approach. they are using the exact same technical backing in fact, both are using amds solution for running their rdna2 chips in compatibility mode for the gcn chips in the old consoles, a solution they will have made only for these two consoles and which has zero plausible reason to be two seperate, different implementations. the only possible difference is in patching for games with issues or to specifically beef up certain key titles, and the series x having more power available for the bc games that are able to use it without any issues. Crafty posted:This all stems from awful communication from their PR/Marketing teams. All of this could have been easily avoided with a couple of tweets (from Sony, not from a random journalist), or in one of their conferences. at no point have sony said anything other than full hardware compatibility. anything else is completely pulled from thin air. even the mark cerny "top 100" quote is him directly stating the new chip is fully compatible and it is simply the games they have tested currently, and it was immediately followed up with an official blog post stating in no uncertain terms that it is full compatibility that was also tweeted out on the official playstation account. this was back in march. the 99% quote from this month is the the SIE CEO saying it in an interview to the washington post lol sony have been extremely unclear with many things but backwards compatibility has been one thing where theyve been really really clear.
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Sep 29, 2020 14:20
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Stux posted:based on what though. a prediction should at least be based in some form of reason. sony have also said ps5 games will benefit from boosted performance, dependant on titles, just like the series x where we have already seen variations in how much better certain games run simply due to each games coding. both platforms are using the exact same approach. they are using the exact same technical backing in fact, both are using amds solution for running their rdna2 chips in compatibility mode for the gcn chips in the old consoles, a solution they will have made only for these two consoles and which has zero plausible reason to be two seperate, different implementations. the only possible difference is in patching for games with issues or to specifically beef up certain key titles, and the series x having more power available for the bc games that are able to use it without any issues My reasoning is that Sony is being weird about BC, and the GDC presentation specifically saying that games had PS5 Boosted, PS4 Pro, and PS4 compatibility modes. I suspect most games are going to fall in the latter two modes.
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Sep 29, 2020 14:23
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Zerot posted:My reasoning is that Sony is being weird about BC, and the GDC presentation specifically saying that games had PS5 Boosted, PS4 Pro, and PS4 compatibility modes. I suspect most games are going to fall in the latter two modes. They aren't really being all that weird about it though. They just aren't mentioning it literally every week.
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Sep 29, 2020 14:27
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Zerot posted:My reasoning is that Sony is being weird about BC, and the GDC presentation specifically saying that games had PS5 Boosted, PS4 Pro, and PS4 compatibility modes. I suspect most games are going to fall in the latter two modes. how are they being weird by saying the exact same thing as microsoft. the series x also has those same modes! how else do you think it works? why do you think there are two different amd developed methods for these consoles to do backwards compatibility when it is specifically a hardware solution they are both using? what do you think the series x does if a game doesnt play along with the new boosted mode? what do you think it does if that game also didnt play along with the one x enhanced mode? just think it through for 1 second.
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Sep 29, 2020 14:29
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EA Play bringing you that Anthem content you crave. EA's non sports game lineup is dire, innit?
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Sep 29, 2020 14:30
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buttchugging adderall posted:They aren't really being all that weird about it though. They just aren't mentioning it literally every week. Also most consumers don’t give a poo poo about BC. A high percentage of goons think it does but to the average person it really doesn’t.
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Sep 29, 2020 14:31
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Sioux posted:Are you able to play all PSN store bought games online if your account has expired? I think at least PS+ games are not available then. If I do decide (after being boring PS4 games cannot be played online without PS+ generally, although the following exceptions exist: - Free-to-play games (Gold is required on Xbox for these), although I think Destiny 2 is an exception since it didn't start off as one. Not sure about Rocket League either, for the same reason. - Some timed betas of games. Some are only offered to PS+ members, others are free for everyone and don't require PS+ to play even though the final game build will. - Games with a mandatory paid subscription (e.g. Final Fantasy XIV). Games with optional monthly subscriptions like TESO and Fallout 76 still require it. - A few special circumstances like No Man's Sky. - If you have PS Now, any game you play through the service, whether streamed or downloaded, is counted as having PS+, and will be playable online. Games you claimed for free with PS+ require an active PS+ membership to be playable, however if you paid money for it (i.e. it wasn't free but severely discounted due to having PS+) you don't need PS+ to play the game, you effectively own it forever. Also some free stuff was legit-free, like at the start of the pandemic when Sony offered the Uncharted Collection and Journey for free, if you claimed those they're yours to keep and don't require an active PS+ membership. Adaptabullshit posted:If they need to test the games, the 1% might just be ones that have issues with the increased horsepower. Kinda like PS4 Pro boost mode caused issues for a small handful of games. I think only one game was affected by it (SOMA, which crashed on boot), and that got fixed pretty quickly. I think some people have a problem with what happens to Bloodborne with Boost Mode on but I don't know the specifics behind that, and it definitely prevented some significant framerate drops in certain areas. Given what we're seeing with the Series X BC is basically the same as what we saw with regular PS4 and XB1 games on their mid-gen boosted consoles (games will perform better but still within the imposed boundaries of the build) it'll probably be the same thing on PS5 for PS4 games. It wouldn't surprise me if special attention were paid to those "PS+ collection" games, too. For that matter, have any BC games done anything truly new? I know games are hitting higher frame rates than before if they didn't have a 30fps lock, and faster load times, but is that it? Zerot posted:Sony's backend is really not made for this, it's an absolute mess to work with compared to Microsoft and there's absolute zero sign of them changing it anytime soon, sadly. Every version of a game, (physical, digital, special editions, re-releases, GOTY editions etc) is a different Title ID and not only that it's also different for Europe, America and Asia and each submission is handled separately. So if you're lucky and you're "only" doing a digital release for your title in those three regions, that's still 3 submissions you have to go through. Add a physical release, now you're doing six submissions! Updates planned for your game? Yep, six submissions every time. Any one of these can be failed too, whilst you'll pass without issue in the other regions. Their system is bonkers. Saves is a mine field. When submitting you CAN include the feature to read saves from other Title IDs but you're limited to linking a single Title ID. So you can't say, release a physical GOTY edition down the line and have ALL saves work. You can link one existing Title ID. While there's definitely some greater ease on the Microsoft side that I've noticed, there have been some oddities and exceptions to this I've come across. Witcher 3 base game and GOTY still have incompatible saves on Xbox One, and I think the same is true for Shadow of Mordor and SoM GOTY. Unless it reads your region settings and applies things weirdly, at least PES 2020 seems to be a North America-specific build based on the language options, and I suspect the EU version is a separate SKU. Earlier games in the franchise appeared to have the full set of European language options at least, the Japanese version might have been its own SKU for those. Some Xbox 360 games are language-specific. Like in Canada they released special discs for most of the Halo games where the audio tracks are swapped out for French. This is a different SKU that isn't available digitally at all, and you can have both the English audio version and French audio version installed separately. I suspect this can get pretty wild in Europe. I think this tends to be more of a thing with games that tend to be PlayStation-exclusive or at least not on Xbox, but different distributors complicates things for this, and I think Asian releases have a tendency to want to stay within that region for various legal reasons. Asian versions of games (e.g. ones with Korean, Chinese and/or Japanese language options) tend to be PlayStation-exclusive, too. I don't know if this is still the case but Square Enix handled translation and distribution of Japanese versions of their games in Japan on PlayStation exclusively. This gets super-weird, too, like I have a Japanese version of Diablo 3 on PS4 which has full-blown UI changes because circle is considered the main action button there and cross the secondary action button and the UI is changed to account for this...but it transparently recognizes saves from the North American version of the game. I wonder if the Xbox versions of the Yakuza games have full support for text in Japanese, Korean and Chinese. I think what happened at least in part in Witcher 3's case was sort-of the Xbox 360 problem, especially with the GOTY version. The GOTY version pretty much perfectly fits on a 50-gig disc, but only if two audio languages are included. Usually this is the original English and one other language, and then a further two (or more) languages are available as DLC. So in North America the disc/digital version includes English and Spanish options by default, but has 4 gig DLC packs for French and Polish. But across Europe there are a shitton of different SKUs, so in France their version has English/French, in Germany I think it's English/German etc. and this creates an absolute clusterfuck in terms of DLC packs on different stores and all that fun stuff.
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Sep 29, 2020 14:36
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actually even better why do you think the series s specifically runs games in one s mode with some fps bumps and stabilizing dynamic resolutions if you think the xbox is doing something different lol
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Sep 29, 2020 14:36
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Barudak posted:EA Play bringing you that Anthem content you crave. I look forward to playing Fallen Order in a few months.
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Sep 29, 2020 14:36
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Game Pass updates: https://twitter.com/Wario64/status/1310935187526619136 https://twitter.com/Wario64/status/1310935306783268864
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Sep 29, 2020 14:36
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Stux posted:how are they being weird by saying the exact same thing as microsoft. Microsoft came out and said "here is what we are doing with BC, here are the upgrades, they work on every non-Kinect game. We have extra upgrades on top of those." Digital Foundry also went to Microsoft and saw games running. Sony hasn't done that. They gave a GDC talk that confused people, they had to fix their press release the next day, and then Jim Ryan says 99% of games will work and didn't talk specifics. I don't even think he talked about boost mode in that interview. quote:the series x also has those same modes! This is not my understanding. Do you have a source? I tried to find something and came up with nothing. In fact, unless I've missed something tested by the press so far, every game that wasn't performance capped already and has been tested on Series X has ran better than on Xbox One. While there does seem to be some kind of compat layer going on for the entirety of the BC, there don't seem to be different modes applied on a game-by-game basis that the PS5 seems to have. Stux posted:actually even better why do you think the series s specifically runs games in one s mode with some fps bumps and stabilizing dynamic resolutions if you think the xbox is doing something different lol I think it runs the One S version and lets the better processor and GPU brute force it to whatever the max is. Which is what the Series X does, too, with the One X version where applicable.
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Sep 29, 2020 14:41
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Red Warrior posted:Game Pass updates: Given every single game on PS Now supports streaming, I wonder what the issue with Game Pass is.
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Sep 29, 2020 14:42
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univbee posted:Given every single game on PS Now supports streaming, I wonder what the issue with Game Pass is. Game streaming is literal dog poo poo, why would anyone want to do that?
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Sep 29, 2020 14:49
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One of these days I'm gonna actually remove the unplugged kinect from my living room setup.
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Sep 29, 2020 14:49
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univbee posted:Given every single game on PS Now supports streaming, I wonder what the issue with Game Pass is. PS Now was a streaming first service so I guess they've always only gone after stuff they could get license to do that. Probably some hitches there for Microsoft, like why stuff started getting pulled from Nvidia's service etc.
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Sep 29, 2020 14:50
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TheScott2K posted:One of these days I'm gonna actually remove the unplugged kinect from my living room setup. You can trade it in for a sweet £14 voucher for CEX if you're in the UK. I just bought this game from their site (£3.40 delivered) - Original xbox classic FREEDOM FIGHTERS https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Freedom_Fighters_(video_game) Hoping it works, wikipedia seems to suggest it will
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Sep 29, 2020 14:53
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Crafty posted:You can trade it in for a sweet £14 voucher for CEX if you're in the UK. I don't think Freedom Fighters is BC on Xbox One. EDIT: It is compatible on Xbox 360, though.
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Sep 29, 2020 14:54
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