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FilthyImp posted:Ooh I missed that. Where was it? Criminal Joker says he used to run the city before Batman. His plan involves Joe Chill, and the last panel is the Jokers getting chill to admit WHY he killed he Waynes. Theory from here on: He ran the city cause he was mobster Jack Napier Chill was ordered by him to kill the Wayne family. If the stuff about Thomas pulling a bullet out of Falcone that one time are still in canon, that's why. Jack Napier, the joker, is going to be revealed as the one who killed Batman's parents. Chill was the triggerman, but Jack gave the order.
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Oct 3, 2020 20:03
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So why is he asking a question he knows the answer to already?
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Oct 4, 2020 00:11
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Does Napier actually exist in any canon aside from the 89’ Batman movie?
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Oct 4, 2020 00:35
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chaosapiant posted:Does Napier actually exist in any canon aside from the 89’ Batman movie? The DCAU, kinda? If I remember right, there are a few episodes where you can see the name on Joker's cell or paperwork or something, though I don't think they ever actually said the name.
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Oct 4, 2020 00:45
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catlord posted:The DCAU, kinda? If I remember right, there are a few episodes where you can see the name on Joker's cell or paperwork or something, though I don't think they ever actually said the name. At one point someone in Arkham says something like “Oswald Cobblepot, Harvey Dent, Jack Napier. Here they’re known as the Penguin, Two-Face, and the Joker.” It may have even been Harley
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Oct 4, 2020 01:13
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It was in a Scarecrow episode. Batman talks to a Doctor there who says they have all the villains locked up right now calling them Oswald Copplepot, Harvey Dent and Jack Napier "Who you call Penguin, Two-Face, and the Joker." Before Batman accuses Scarecrow of being the guilty party, and the doctor says that Professor Crane is still locked up.
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Oct 4, 2020 01:36
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Ah, thanks. It's been a while.
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Oct 4, 2020 01:47
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Mask of the Phantasm also has pre-Joker and I'm pretty sure he's called Jack there.
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Oct 4, 2020 01:55
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Vince MechMahon posted:Criminal Joker says he used to run the city before Batman. His plan involves Joe Chill, and the last panel is the Jokers getting chill to admit WHY he killed he Waynes. This is the dumbest possible way for things to turn out and i refuse to believe even Geoff Johns is that much of a hack
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Oct 4, 2020 07:32
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Thranguy posted:So why is he asking a question he knows the answer to already? He's recording it. He's asking because he already knows the answer, and is going to expose it for some ham handed plot Johns came up with. I'm not sure enough to toxx over this, but I will be very surprised if some variant of what I proposed isn't exactly what he's doing. Also I'm not saying any of this is a good idea, I'm saying it's really stupid because of course it is.
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Oct 4, 2020 09:49
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Batman 100 Spoilers Sometimes I wonder what comics would be like if interesting things were allowed to happen. Ultimately I did like Joker War overall but boy is anything cool that happens deflated by turning to one of the many epilogues.A solid Joker take nobody will remember in a year.
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Oct 4, 2020 18:42
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I always had respect for Greg Rucka when he originally came onboard one of the Bat-books and they said something like "Okay, now you can't use Joker" and Greg shrugged and said he'd rather use Two-Face all day anyway.
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Oct 4, 2020 19:22
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Lord_Hambrose posted:Batman 100 Spoilers Where are the spoilers?
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Oct 4, 2020 19:23
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They are cowards for the not calling him Joseph Kerr (which actually did happen in Batman:Going Sane though that was a name an amnesiac Joker gave himself)
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Oct 4, 2020 20:14
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Codependent Poster posted:Where are the spoilers? The saddest part of all
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Oct 5, 2020 01:39
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BrianWilly posted:In good news Cass Cain has Batgirl ears and cape again! Stephanie Brown also sporting a bat symbol. I was a little sad that Cass had to basically steal her Batgirl costume instead of Bruce/Babs going "Here sweetie, you deserve this."
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Oct 5, 2020 05:21
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but hey baby steps got us this far.
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Darth Nat posted:I was a little sad that Cass had to basically steal her Batgirl costume instead of Bruce/Babs going "Here sweetie, you deserve this." Yyyyeah, it's kind of weird, but I guess this is the 'payoff' to all these little meta winks and nods they've been sprinkling across issues, but I've honestly hated all of those. "Hey, remember before the New 52 happened and you were Batgirl and cool? You're not anymore. Isn't that hosed up?" Like, yes DC Comics comic book, that is pretty hosed up because you did it.
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Oct 5, 2020 09:05
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Darth Nat posted:I was a little sad that Cass had to basically steal her Batgirl costume instead of Bruce/Babs going "Here sweetie, you deserve this." I guess stealing it makes sense because the last time she had it she just randomly gave it away to Stephanie.
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Oct 5, 2020 13:34
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Abroham Lincoln posted:Yyyyeah, it's kind of weird, but I guess this is the 'payoff' to all these little meta winks and nods they've been sprinkling across issues, but I've honestly hated all of those. One of these days I'm gonna just post every single splash page of random DC characters going "It's all missing?" while a bunch of iconic panels are in the background. The slow, "Hey, remember the things you liked? It's coming we swear" is so obnoxious.
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Oct 5, 2020 22:17
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Roth posted:One of these days I'm gonna just post every single splash page of random DC characters going "It's all missing?" while a bunch of iconic panels are in the background. It’s beyond parody at this point, it’s a genuinely bizarre obsession they seem to have.
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Oct 6, 2020 01:50
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Having read today's two DCeased books it continues to be kind of depressing the best DC books do not actually take place inside the DC universe proper. Seriously, if you want an architect for your universe forget Johns and go with Tom Taylor.
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Oct 6, 2020 14:37
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Dawgstar posted:I guess stealing it makes sense because the last time she had it she just randomly gave it away to Stephanie. I liked Stef as Batgirl, but you’re right, the transition made no sense.
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Oct 6, 2020 17:20
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Mandibular Fiasco posted:I liked Stef as Batgirl, but you’re right, the transition made no sense. Oh, I liked her as Batgirl as well, it's just as I can remember Stephanie recounts it as they were essentially on a rooftop in mid-patrol or something and Cass suddenly goes 'here don't want it anymore.' I think this was the first sign of Cassandra acting very out of character for at least a few good years.
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Oct 6, 2020 17:42
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Batman 100 was dumb. Every Joker story is the same now. It's dumb.
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Oct 6, 2020 18:33
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Dawgstar posted:Having read today's two DCeased books it continues to be kind of depressing the best DC books do not actually take place inside the DC universe proper. I think it's largely because he writes alt-universes where poo poo is allowed to happen. A lot of recent posts here* have been about how frustrated people are with the static nature of big 2 comics, and Taylor is free to kill off as many big names as he wants and it's very liberating. *especially about Batman, which i haven't read yet but I somehow have a sneaking suspicion ends with Joker's pale rear end back in the loving asylum again
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Oct 6, 2020 19:06
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Mandibular Fiasco posted:I liked Stef as Batgirl, but you’re right, the transition made no sense. Dawgstar posted:Oh, I liked her as Batgirl as well, it's just as I can remember Stephanie recounts it as they were essentially on a rooftop in mid-patrol or something and Cass suddenly goes 'here don't want it anymore.' I think this was the first sign of Cassandra acting very out of character for at least a few good years. They initially wanted Misfit to be the all-new, all-
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Oct 6, 2020 19:08
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They're gonna make a Punchline book. wtf? I guess someone's jealous that Dini got a Joker legacy that's popular and no one else did? Gimme a Clownhunter book. Now that'd be something. Force him to cross paths with Signal who seems like someone who should've been more prominent in a Joker based event given his origin being a previous one.
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Oct 6, 2020 19:41
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I think Signal (and David Fox for that matter) are characters who are kind of in desperate need for a big breakout moment so that they can be more than just the XXth addition to the bat family. As it stands they kind of feel like where Kate was before Rucka and Williamson came along. The problem is that they've been in that spot for longer than she was, at the time. also signal's costume is bad and i think it's unfair that he's still stuck with a bad one when everyone else seems to have an at least passable look as of Batman 100 if those group shots are any indicator
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Oct 6, 2020 20:14
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OnimaruXLR posted:I think Signal (and David Fox for that matter) are characters who are kind of in desperate need for a big breakout moment so that they can be more than just the XXth addition to the bat family. As it stands they kind of feel like where Kate was before Rucka and Williamson came along. The problem is that they've been in that spot for longer than she was, at the time. It reminds me a bit of Harper Row/Bluebird who's introduced by Snyder, gets some big moments and then is shuffled into the background because no one else really wants to use them. Also Simone's Misfit way back when. Hopefully after The Outsiders and his new powerset (very much seems like no one knew what to do with him as he was), he gets set up with a different costume, but that'll involve someone taking an interest in them
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Oct 6, 2020 20:27
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Dawgstar posted:Oh, I liked her as Batgirl as well, it's just as I can remember Stephanie recounts it as they were essentially on a rooftop in mid-patrol or something and Cass suddenly goes 'here don't want it anymore.' I think this was the first sign of Cassandra acting very out of character for at least a few good years. The writer of her book was part of a Batgirls panel at the virtual comic con, and he said he was told that Cass was going to disappear. He asked why, and they said something like "We don't know, make something up." Also, the first sign of Cass acting out of character was the whole Robin debacle where she was evil and learned Navajo in her spare time. That started the many dark years of Cassandra Cain.
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Oct 6, 2020 21:11
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Darth Nat posted:The writer of her book was part of a Batgirls panel at the virtual comic con, and he said he was told that Cass was going to disappear. He asked why, and they said something like "We don't know, make something up." I also want to say the writer of her miniseries in the aughts was told not to read her ongoing or past appearances.
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Oct 6, 2020 21:56
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I though Batman 100 was OK; I actually liked Harley and I wish she had killed Joker, if only to spare us from another "Batman should kill the Joker" moment, though the epilogues were kind of meh; Clownhunter being around but outside of Batman's family is kind of dissapointing and so far I don't know why I should care about Punchline and the more DC tries to make me care, the less I'm willing to. Also, once I remembered Harper and Duke, I realized Tynion is just doing the same stuff Snyder did; introduce a new character to the batfamily, but with such a tenous connection to them that no other writer makes anything worthwhile with them. I still think that Duke should have been made officially a Robin if only to force writers and readers to pay attention to him; I like Clownhunter a bit more and I was hoping they would actually make him Robin...but I guess he'll be another forgotten Batman tertiary character in a couple of years.
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Oct 6, 2020 22:28
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Batman knowing the Joker has lockpicks and can easily escape really just means that Batman doesn't have to make a hard choice at all. What a waste.
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Oct 6, 2020 23:01
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Joker: I know your secret and I am going to destroy your family and kill hundreds and you'll have to make the toughest decision of your life to stop me Batman: No I am stronger and will prove it and you will never win but you'll get away anyway I've just written the last Joker stories for the past 10 years and also every Joker story going forward At least 3 Jokers had the decency to kill Joker, even if it ultimately means nothing because the whole thing is just going to be an excuse to say why there's always a Joker and that killing him is meaningless
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Oct 6, 2020 23:12
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I'd just love to see more stories where Joker is just a clown-themed villain who pulls joke-themed crimes and manages to get the best of Batman more often than most of the rogue's gallery. But nope, every Joker story has to be capital-I Important, an operatic meditation on Batman's dark shadow and his eternal enemy yadda yadda. Every time the Joker appears, it means you know that you're in for some metatextual bullshit. Enough already. Every writer keeps trying to write the ultimate definitive iconic story, and they all blur together . One of the best things about Grant Morrison's run was that Joker was just a supporting character (and used very well in that role).
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Oct 6, 2020 23:27
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Got home just now andTwoPair posted:*especially about Batman, which i haven't read yet but I somehow have a sneaking suspicion ends with Joker's pale rear end back in the loving asylum again wow it was worse than I thought. Actually, the thought occurs, for as much as superhero comics are known for having a revolving door of death, when is the last time a major villain bit the dust? And I mean big, not like when a C-lister gets offed in an event or gets killed by an A-list villain like a Joker to show how eeevilll they are. Outside of baddies created for stuff like big crises and events, I am having a hard time.
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Oct 7, 2020 00:12
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I haven't read Batman 100 yet but will tomorrow. I can take a wild guess how it ends. Batman and Joker sort of died in Snyder's run (only to get better thanks to a proto-Lazarus pit that gave them amnesia) but at least Batman wasn't doing everything in his power to save Joker's life.
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Oct 7, 2020 01:06
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TwoPair posted:Got home just now and Doc Ock after the end of Superior Spider-Man maybe?
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Oct 7, 2020 01:56
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Is the Joker the only villain that gets that is used to tirelessly drill the point that the hero should kill? Lex Luthor is around and Norman Osborn has been coming and going for a while, but I don't recall the same arguments about Superman or Spider-Man, even though they are also heroes that don't kill their villains.
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Oct 7, 2020 02:16
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radlum posted:Is the Joker the only villain that gets that is used to tirelessly drill the point that the hero should kill? If Norman caused mass murder on the level of Joker, I bet Pete would pull the trigger if he had to. And if he didn't someone else almost certainly would. It's ridiculous in a world where people who are okay with sometimes killing, like Wonder woman, that the joker is allowed to live in this state. It's long past due for that character to go away for a while and not come back till someone has a new idea.
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Oct 7, 2020 02:21
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