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Trilobite
Aug 15, 2001

Sarsapariller posted:

Chris waved his hands and said "Development is hard" and they did an hour-long video of devs muttering about what they'd like to do with AI "Resuming conversations" when the player steps away and then returns to them. To my knowledge they didn't explain anything or promise anything except more of these shows in the future, whenever they feel like it.

That should be enough, right?

I swear that they were saying the exact same "development is hard, we're working out how we're going to handle conversations where the player can walk around freely and even walk away from the NPC they're talking to" stuff at least three years ago. And probably even before that.

2020, and they're still trying to figure that poo poo out. Amazing. Worth every Idris.

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Jack-Off Lantern
Mar 2, 2012

Gravity_Storm posted:

If base building becomes a thing and is so superbly complicated I might just have to back this game and buy a bomber that punches above its weight.

Anything can be a bomb if moving fast enough, even the free starter ship

https://youtu.be/rTAx8r_090o

tuo
Jun 17, 2016

Theaters of War has now been in development for 20 months.

Bronze Fonz
Feb 14, 2019




tuo posted:

Theaters of War has now been in development for 20 months.

Crysis 3 came out 92 months ago.

MedicineHut
Feb 25, 2016

tuo posted:

Theaters of War has now been in development for 20 months.

Hype!

G0RF
Mar 19, 2015

Some galactic defender you are, Space Cadet.

tuo posted:

Theaters of War has now been in development for 20 months.

And the rent-a-shill they made it for has been gone for half of those.

No point in finishing it, really. It’ll just join Star Marine and Arena Commander in the abandonware-as-a-service junkyard down the road. We need no further proof that CIG can’t produce; even low-stakes microgames are beyond their reach.

Forget Theaters of War, guys. It might’ve made a better Rexzilla LARP enhancement sim than Star Citizen, but the dude took his buttrock swagger to a higher bidder. Time to write it off like he wrote you off and finish the Magnum Opus.

DigitalPenny
Sep 3, 2018

The Titanic posted:

Chris would have a difficult time just getting his game to run and would look virtually clueless while thumbing an Xbox controller and hoping for the best, while not being able to show code and also blame computer science and the internet as a whole for why his game doesn't run but can't really go into details about why that is.

He'd also spend the better part of a year planning for the event of him "playing'' the game.

commando in tophat
Sep 5, 2019

G0RF posted:

And the rent-a-shill they made it for has been gone for half of those.

No point in finishing it, really. It’ll just join Star Marine and Arena Commander in the abandonware-as-a-service junkyard down the road. We need no further proof that CIG can’t produce; even low-stakes microgames are beyond their reach.

Forget Theaters of War, guys. It might’ve made a better Rexzilla LARP enhancement sim than Star Citizen, but the dude took his buttrock swagger to a higher bidder. Time to write it off like he wrote you off and finish the Magnum Opus.

:thunk: Star Citizer: abandonware-as-a-service

Dwesa
Jul 19, 2016

Maybe I'll go where I can see stars
Example of an excellent gameplay

:reddit: Words cannot express my anger...
https://v.redd.it/7ivsjjyol1u51/DASH_1080.mp4

Paladinus
Jan 11, 2014

heyHEYYYY!!!

Trilobite posted:

I swear that they were saying the exact same "development is hard, we're working out how we're going to handle conversations where the player can walk around freely and even walk away from the NPC they're talking to" stuff at least three years ago. And probably even before that.

2020, and they're still trying to figure that poo poo out. Amazing. Worth every Idris.

Just want to point out that this stuff was in Uncharted 2 or 3. If you get too far from the character, they just say, like, okay, I'll tell you later, and when you return, like, alright, so I was saying. You don't need a complicated AI for it.

Gort
Aug 18, 2003

Good day what ho cup of tea

Paladinus posted:

Just want to point out that this stuff was in Uncharted 2 or 3. If you get too far from the character, they just say, like, okay, I'll tell you later, and when you return, like, alright, so I was saying. You don't need a complicated AI for it.

Yeah, it's pretty much what you'd expect from a big-budget game these days. GTA 5 has it too, I think.

NumptyScrub
Aug 22, 2004

damn it I think the mirrors broken >˙.(

Jack-Off Lantern posted:

Anything can be a bomb if moving fast enough, even the free starter ship

https://youtu.be/rTAx8r_090o

Except they already removed ramming damage *because griefers*, so that gameplay loop is really going to require the bomber (and bombs that currently don't work iirc) :v:

commando in tophat
Sep 5, 2019
I still think that it was way better to have cutscenes take away control from the player and basically pause the whole world and gently caress the immersion. I mean someone is dumping exposition on me and what do I gain by walking away or it being interrupted by something random. My examples are from super janky games without the revolutionary interrupt tech, but whatever:
Oblivion - when talking to NPC, whole world freezes. You take your time to talk about stuff with some monk while in background demon is frozen mid strike aiming at that monk. It looks stupid but whatever, I got what I needed from NPC
Skyrim - you're talking to some NPC while suddenly!, wild mudcrab attacks and you lost 50% of dialog
I don't really see how the system in skyrim is better, even if you could return and continue the dialog where you left off. I wanted to talk to NPC and not be interrupted by random bullshit. Maybe I'm just too old for AAAA gaming

tuo
Jun 17, 2016

G0RF posted:

And the rent-a-shill they made it for has been gone for half of those.

No point in finishing it, really. It’ll just join Star Marine and Arena Commander in the abandonware-as-a-service junkyard down the road. We need no further proof that CIG can’t produce; even low-stakes microgames are beyond their reach.

Forget Theaters of War, guys. It might’ve made a better Rexzilla LARP enhancement sim than Star Citizen, but the dude took his buttrock swagger to a higher bidder. Time to write it off like he wrote you off and finish the Magnum Opus.

But then they'd have to acknowledge that it's shitcanned...which might not go well with the backers.

In the recent AMA-but-when-questions, the answer to "what's up with Theaters of War" IIRC was "how should I know, ask the other studio that's developing it", not "uhm...you see...it's actually in the game already".

This is such a brilliant shitshow ;) Most open development ever, where a game mode no one asked for gets developed for eight months in secrecy, to then become the centerpiece of CitCon while still beeing terribly broken, then announced for "early 2020", still not appearing on any roadmap, only to be shrugged away at an AMA.

Money well spent!

Inspector Gesicht
Oct 26, 2012

500 Zeus a body.


What can we add to the list of good space-themed games that have been released in the meantime? (2012-) Stuff that isn't a janky Crysis mod?

Prey: It's System Shock 3. First-person immersive-sim that will make forget Deus Ex died so the Avengers game could be made. Gets kind of long near the end, but you can transform into a coffe mug so there's that.
Prey: Mooncrash: Deserves it's own spot. Has a terrific Roguelike Time-Loop bent and a non-linear structure.
The Outer Worlds: Solid RPG and unlike Bethesda games you can climb ladders. Got derided both for being too easy and for not being Disco Elysium. Hope the Microsoft move doesn't affect a sequel's existence.
No Man's Sky: Grindy space-sim that I occasionally slip into. The makers have grafted so much stuff onto it so I guess it's good?
Outer Wilds: Utterly fantastic exploration game, even better cosmic-horror story. Has an astronaut playing the banjo.

Stuff I haven't played:

Elite Dangerous, Star Wars: Squadrons, Call of Duty: Infinite Warfare

Inspector Gesicht fucked around with this message at 11:35 on Oct 20, 2020

tuo
Jun 17, 2016

House of the Dying Sun
EVE: Valkyrie
X4

Rabelais D
Dec 11, 2012

ts'u nnu k'u k'o t'khye:
A demon doth defecate at thy door

The Titanic posted:

Honestly though, Derek's projects are 1000 times better because they are games he likes, actually does play and code and design, and hasn't scammed people to support him while delivering nothing to them for a decade.

Any genuine indie developer out there who is getting rich or scraping by to keep going from the money from the fruits of their hard work get my kudos and appreciation. Making games really isn't easy. Delivering a game is just as hard.

I'm also willing to bet if push came to shove, Derek would not only be able to actively play his game, show off different areas of code successfully, and also blame German drivers when it crashes whereas Chris would have a difficult time just getting his game to run and would look virtually clueless while thumbing an Xbox controller and hoping for the best, while not being able to show code and also blame computer science and the internet as a whole for why his game doesn't run but can't really go into details about why that is.

Also Derek's games are genuine games, while Star Citizen is just a Crysis mod. :black101:

Yeah, this all the way - I absolutely will never play a Derek Smart game again (I played Battlecruiser back when it first released for about ten minutes) - but godspeed to the man. His games aren't for me but some people do actually like them, and he made a career in the video games industry actually making and shipping games.

Chris Roberts couldn't even log in to the computer when he had to play his game live (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZWq8ynUq7wM). He didn't know the password, and he couldn't type it in, and when the game crashed he had to get Dennis to help. "Is...Is Dennis around here??"

When it crashed he said "What is wrong with this computer nowadays?" nervously, which is appropriate for a man who no longer touches computers and instead spends his time on yachts snorting lines and possibly shaggin nines.

When he was trying to troubleshoot the error (network connection timed out) he said "Are you sure noone's run over a line or something??"

Yeah Chris someone ran over a line and now your game doesn't work.

DENNIS!

commando in tophat
Sep 5, 2019
:lol: I checked the Line of Defense page and they're doing an engine switch, their image viewer's arrow to the left does the same thing as arrow to the right, but at least they're not selling ships for $27000 or blood of the glorious leader

Flayer
Sep 13, 2003

by Fluffdaddy
Buglord

commando in tophat posted:

:lol: I checked the Line of Defense page and they're doing an engine switch, their image viewer's arrow to the left does the same thing as arrow to the right, but at least they're not selling ships for $27000 or blood of the glorious leader
Damned with the faintest of praise.

Pixelate
Jan 6, 2018

"You win by having fun"
Fast travel

https://i.imgur.com/6t0ukkt.mp4

Pixelate
Jan 6, 2018

"You win by having fun"
Missiles now even more fiendish

https://i.imgur.com/bdiklst.mp4

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VqwE8_S0Lok&t=2m

Mailer
Nov 4, 2009

Have you accepted The Void as your lord and savior?

Inspector Gesicht posted:

Elite Dangerous, Star Wars: Squadrons, Call of Duty: Infinite Warfare

X4 got released. Rebel Galaxy Outlaw pretty much just lifted Privateer and made it a 2019 game, warts and all. E:D announced spacelegs, making it very close to the thing citizens want and therefore must be rejected even harder. None of these allow you to die in an animation where you grab your rear end so they're inferior.

If you expand outside "it's a space game" then poo poo has been wild. Eight years of advances and awesome games. Meanwhile the BDSSE can't figure out stairs.

Thom12255
Feb 23, 2013
WHERE THE FUCK IS MY MONEY

Mailer posted:

X4 got released. Rebel Galaxy Outlaw pretty much just lifted Privateer and made it a 2019 game, warts and all. E:D announced spacelegs, making it very close to the thing citizens want and therefore must be rejected even harder. None of these allow you to die in an animation where you grab your rear end so they're inferior.

If you expand outside "it's a space game" then poo poo has been wild. Eight years of advances and awesome games. Meanwhile the BDSSE can't figure out stairs.

X4 has such an impressive game engine, it's amazing that a small team working out of their boss's house in Germany made that. Back when SC started, Wingmans Austin crew were basically just working in a rented house that they made an office, and it was back then that it seemed the game was actually making progress and viable. After they went and got those massive luxurious beachside office spaces in LA is when all progress seemed to stop.

Kikas
Oct 30, 2012
Intel is out of the SSD business, looks like that Optane was a solid investment :v:
https://www.pcgamer.com/intel-ssd-business-sk-hynix-sale/

Beet Wagon
Oct 19, 2015





Inspector Gesicht posted:

What can we add to the list of good space-themed games that have been released in the meantime? (2012-) Stuff that isn't a janky Crysis mod?

Prey: It's System Shock 3. First-person immersive-sim that will make forget Deus Ex died so the Avengers game could be made. Gets kind of long near the end, but you can transform into a coffe mug so there's that.
Prey: Mooncrash: Deserves it's own spot. Has a terrific Roguelike Time-Loop bent and a non-linear structure.
The Outer Worlds: Solid RPG and unlike Bethesda games you can climb ladders. Got derided both for being too easy and for not being Disco Elysium. Hope the Microsoft move doesn't affect a sequel's existence.
No Man's Sky: Grindy space-sim that I occasionally slip into. The makers have grafted so much stuff onto it so I guess it's good?
Outer Wilds: Utterly fantastic exploration game, even better cosmic-horror story. Has an astronaut playing the banjo.

Stuff I haven't played:

Elite Dangerous, Star Wars: Squadrons, Call of Duty: Infinite Warfare

Hellion had enough time to get made, launch, fail to succeed, and get any further development canceled, and it did Star Citizen better than Star Citizen did.

Pulsar: Lost Colony, which also does Star Citizen better than Star Citizen, launched entered early access in 2014 and is still getting updated.

e: I stand corrected, Pulsar is currently in beta.

Beet Wagon fucked around with this message at 14:27 on Oct 20, 2020

Inspector Gesicht
Oct 26, 2012

500 Zeus a body.


Can someone please archive the "death-by-rear end-grabbing" gif? I feel it may see further use in the future.

How do you pitch X4 to a newcomer, and what does it do better than the critcially mauled X: Rebirth?

The Titanic
Sep 15, 2016

Unsinkable

Fashionable Jorts posted:

I've been out of the star citizen loop for a while now; so what features did Roberts force into the game because they are in star wars: squadron?

The Code Whisperer doesn't play games. That's beneath him. He just envisions future realities and they happen thanks to his tremendous skills as a producer from the 1990's.

Thom12255
Feb 23, 2013
WHERE THE FUCK IS MY MONEY

Inspector Gesicht posted:

Can someone please archive the "death-by-rear end-grabbing" gif? I feel it may see further use in the future.

How do you pitch X4 to a newcomer, and what does it do better than the critcially mauled X: Rebirth?

X-Rebirth's main problem was taking away your freedom (by limiting you to one ship the whole game) and bolting on these terrible new systems such as station walking which were entirely pointless and badly done (hey it's SC).

X4 lets you pilot every ship again and while it does still have walking sections on stations and ships, it is much better done and actually adds to the immersion as it is epic standing on the bridge of your new Destroyer as it shoots 20 plasma turrets at the enemy and it's fun watching ships come and go from the stations and watching your huge complex around you do its thing. The game engine itself is simulating the entire galaxy in real-time and you can teleport from one side of it to the other without a single loading screen, its crazy how they managed that.

It's not perfect, it's got some German jank like making you wait a long time to level up crewmember skills (but there are tons of mods to change this that are easy to install) and it's not a game you buy for the storyline. But it is well worth a purchase and you'll get a few hundred hours out of it. I have no interest in ever going back to the X3 games even if they do some things better, X4 is just more fun.

Dwesa
Jul 19, 2016

Maybe I'll go where I can see stars

The Titanic posted:

The Code Whisperer doesn't play games. That's beneath him. He just envisions future realities and they happen thanks to his tremendous skills as a producer from the 1990's.
CR generates dreams.txt, citizens mainly enjoy their game in dreams.txt. The only purpose of game is having an excuse for transfer of finances in exchange for dreams.txt. It works same for writers, readers and their medium - books. Except books are much cheaper.

Dwesa fucked around with this message at 14:48 on Oct 20, 2020

Pixelate
Jan 6, 2018

"You win by having fun"

Inspector Gesicht posted:

Can someone please archive the "death-by-rear end-grabbing" gif? I feel it may see further use in the future.


Thoatse posted:

jpegging

Kikas
Oct 30, 2012

Thom12255 posted:

X-Rebirth's main problem was taking away your freedom (by limiting you to one ship the whole game) and bolting on these terrible new systems such as station walking which were entirely pointless and badly done (hey it's SC).

X4 lets you pilot every ship again and while it does still have walking sections on stations and ships, it is much better done and actually adds to the immersion as it is epic standing on the bridge of your new Destroyer as it shoots 20 plasma turrets at the enemy and it's fun watching ships come and go from the stations and watching your huge complex around you do its thing. The game engine itself is simulating the entire galaxy in real-time and you can teleport from one side of it to the other without a single loading screen, its crazy how they managed that.

It's not perfect, it's got some German jank like making you wait a long time to level up crewmember skills (but there are tons of mods to change this that are easy to install) and it's not a game you buy for the storyline. But it is well worth a purchase and you'll get a few hundred hours out of it. I have no interest in ever going back to the X3 games even if they do some things better, X4 is just more fun.

Didn't they also go "yeah gently caress it, space legs are optional, if you're in a hurry you can just teleport to your ship and do all that stuff from the menu" ? That seems like a good balance.

The Titanic
Sep 15, 2016

Unsinkable

Rabelais D posted:

Yeah, this all the way - I absolutely will never play a Derek Smart game again (I played Battlecruiser back when it first released for about ten minutes) - but godspeed to the man. His games aren't for me but some people do actually like them, and he made a career in the video games industry actually making and shipping games.

Chris Roberts couldn't even log in to the computer when he had to play his game live (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZWq8ynUq7wM). He didn't know the password, and he couldn't type it in, and when the game crashed he had to get Dennis to help. "Is...Is Dennis around here??"

When it crashed he said "What is wrong with this computer nowadays?" nervously, which is appropriate for a man who no longer touches computers and instead spends his time on yachts snorting lines and possibly shaggin nines.

When he was trying to troubleshoot the error (network connection timed out) he said "Are you sure noone's run over a line or something??"

Yeah Chris someone ran over a line and now your game doesn't work.

DENNIS!

I imagine this particular incident was a turning point for some people.

And anybody who still believes CR is some kind of coding wunderkind who strolled in from the 90's with groundbreaking technical knowledge... just watch the video. Chances are the backers who play games are more familiar with how a computer runs and operates than CR is.

Also realize that since this day, CR has never played his game under any circumstances ever again since then for any kind of video or live event. This was literally the only time we saw him attempt to play his game. And even when it was working, it's like some of the features he'd never even seen before, and he was actively bashing them and saying how it'll totally be fixed because it sucks.

Now take that knowledge and apply it to the 8-9 year long development time with a $300M spend rate and ask yourself if they are just "making the game really good" or if CR actually genuinely is way, way out of his depth.

The talk is about highly advanced AI and events, the reality is your guy is randomly killed, ejected into space, everything is suffering from some kind of horrible engine-level physics issues they cannot seem to resolve, and the AI is standing on tables or walking around some set path.

The talk does not match the reality in any case anywhere.

The Titanic
Sep 15, 2016

Unsinkable

Mailer posted:

X4 got released. Rebel Galaxy Outlaw pretty much just lifted Privateer and made it a 2019 game, warts and all. E:D announced spacelegs, making it very close to the thing citizens want and therefore must be rejected even harder. None of these allow you to die in an animation where you grab your rear end so they're inferior.

If you expand outside "it's a space game" then poo poo has been wild. Eight years of advances and awesome games. Meanwhile the BDSSE can't figure out stairs.

Don't forget people marveling over how good a loving rock looks. :)

Meanwhile in unreal, average people/indie devs are able to use Quixel mega scans to make scenes that are virtually indistinguishable from actual reality sometimes... using of course Unreal and not something dumb like CryEngine.

monkeytek
Jun 8, 2010

It wasn't an ELE that wiped out the backer funds. It was Tristan Timothy Taylor.

IAbsolveMyself posted:

The BIG Reason Why I'm Excited For Base Building and The Homestead Revamp

One of the things I've always felt was missing in SC was a link, or connection, something that players of different career paths can be doing, that lead up to related or similar goals.

Base building is one of those things that creates unifying gameplay that can both introduce entirely new gameplay loops, but most importantly, expand existing gameplay for multiple existing career paths at the same time.

For example, Chris Roberts recently revealed:
as long as you have a supply of raw materials you don’t need a Pioneer to build a homestead

This is actually huge, if you consider the implications. Let me put it in the most simple form.
Raw Resources > Refined Materials > Blueprints > Manufacturing Parts > Transportation > Assembly > Homestead


1. Mining: Providing Miners with more flexible jobs and contracts. To make a product, you need more than simply Hadanite, and Dolivine. This would provide players a real reason to mine Titanium, Aluminium, Copper, Diamond, Tungsten, Beryl, Quartz, Gold etc. The previously ignored deposits will suddenly become required raw materials as resources for Refineries.

2. Refining: Refineries will provide a place to refine and create mixed materials for alloys, and more advanced second stage resources required to build fabricated parts and components for an outpost or homestead. So now you've brought even more value to refining than simply providing a extra layer of profit on rare materials.

3. Blueprints (Optional): Just a consideration for potentially providing players with varying designs for specific parts and components which they'd assemble to form the structure of their outpost or homestead using processed and refined materials. For example, a Blueprint for high temperature resistance provides the mixing formula to create a wall that is suitable for high temperature moons or planets with hot biomes.

4. Manufacturing Parts: This is the step after choosing blueprints, which would be just a way to create the end product by submitting the blueprint with a number of needed parts to a job contract or manufacturing facility which would create the parts and ship them to a Cargo Deck for future transportation.

5. Transportation: Those parts don't move themselves. Not only do they have to be shipped from the manufacturing plant to the Cargo Deck, but they must also be moved form the Cargo Deck to your designated claim which you wish to build on. Perhaps if someone knows what is being shipped, they might find interest in preventing it from reaching it's destination.

6. Assembly: Assembling these parts could be done by the person who owns the claim themselves. Alternatively though, it could even be faster to assemble these parts is for example they could hire someone with a larger tractor beam to help move the parts where they're needed. This would be a situation where specialized ships like the 325C or Argo SRV would be of use other than distress calls for disabled ships stranded in space.

7. Homestead: The end result, your new beautiful homestead. Now you can head to Arccorp and purchase some interior furniture from Abernathy Interiors to help spice up or make your homestead feel a little more like home.

The end result is a system that would

·Fill the universe with dynamic locations created by players
·Provide more interesting and flexible jobs for miners
·Provide more new and interesting jobs for refining
·Provide more interesting jobs for cargo haulers
·Create more dynamic and spread of out exploration and travel across planets and moons
·Create a reason for Pirates to pirate, and obtain raw materials or pre-fabricated resources
·Create a reason for Cargo Haulers to hire protection from Pirates
·Create a reason for Bounty Hunters, Security and Mercenaries to provide active protection to Cargo Haulers, Refiners, Civil Surveyors, and conduct frequent patrols

Providing new depth to existing careers, while providing new gameplay to get involved in, Base building connects Mining, Refining, Cargo Hauling, Security and Bounty Hunting, Piracy, and Exploration together in an all encompassing larger systemic picture. This is what excites me the most about this. Let me know what you think about the newly revamped base building, and how it will in your view add to, or affect your experience in Star Citizen.

Yup, can hardly wait for thousands of Sex-O-Dromes popping up all over the place consisting of trillions of polygons that won't bring the game to its knees or anything.

Pixelate
Jan 6, 2018

"You win by having fun"
This is the game

(Now with audio)

https://i.imgur.com/qb1nCjJ.mp4

https://i.imgur.com/mpHnh7X.mp4

https://i.imgur.com/vSb2eza.mp4

The Titanic
Sep 15, 2016

Unsinkable
Did a quick YouTube search, sorted by date for unreal and quixel and here's the first hit from some totally random person somewhere in the world:

https://youtu.be/0t21ffuUMYk

As far as I'm concerned, it looks better than anything I've seen CIG put out so far. And it's just some random dude and not an 8-9 year long development program for funding people's lives in Hollywood. :shrug:

Dragonrah
Aug 22, 2003

J.C. Bearington, III

Rabelais D posted:

shaggin nines.

Also Sandi

Pixelate
Jan 6, 2018

"You win by having fun"
Star Citizen: Captain Richard's disappointing train set

Pixelate fucked around with this message at 16:15 on Oct 20, 2020

commando in tophat
Sep 5, 2019

Are these the famed "force reactions" or whatever they call it? I really hope the last sound after the laugh comes from star citierz

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Colostomy Bag
Jan 11, 2016

:lesnick: C-Bangin' it :lesnick:

Kikas posted:

Intel is out of the SSD business, looks like that Optane was a solid investment :v:
https://www.pcgamer.com/intel-ssd-business-sk-hynix-sale/

Did Lethality support Optane?

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