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I've always hated the fact the F91 has a separate beam rifle, on top of the two VSBRs. A beam bazooka makes some sense, since it can presumably produce a bigger and/or more destructive beam than the VSBRs are capable of, but the beam rifle is just a worse VSBR.
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Oct 20, 2020 02:36
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Stairmaster posted:its incredibly cool wehn a gundam has integral weaponry but also is carrying a gun too For Mikazuki, everything is integrated weaponry.
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Oct 20, 2020 02:41
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tsob posted:I've always hated the fact the F91 has a separate beam rifle, on top of the two VSBRs. A beam bazooka makes some sense, since it can presumably produce a bigger and/or more destructive beam than the VSBRs are capable of, but the beam rifle is just a worse VSBR. Beam rifles have a few advantages over VSBR's. Since they aren't suit-mounted they have more aiming flexibility. It's a lot harder to aim the VSBRs specifically than it is a beam rifle. The VSBRs also are powered directly by the suit's reactor while beam rifles have replaceable ECAPS and considering one of F91's gimmicks is "gets so fuckin' hot at full power that it literally sheds layers of metal to try to improve its ability to cool itself down having a distance weapon that isn't going to add more stress to the suit is probably a good thing.
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Oct 20, 2020 02:42
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Gundam Katana is pretty wild, silly, stupid, etc. because it's fielding all sorts of MSVs and designs that are explicitly design-stage only or alternate configurations that were never used or from more obscure works like the King of Dragon mothership.
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Oct 20, 2020 02:51
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I've been playing Cross Rays lately and I dunno what's dumber, the trio of custom Leos from Dual Story G-Unit or the massive katana that is like five times the size of the Astray Red.
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Oct 20, 2020 04:09
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Argas posted:Gundam Katana is pretty wild, silly, stupid, etc. because it's fielding all sorts of MSVs and designs that are explicitly design-stage only or alternate configurations that were never used or from more obscure works like the King of Dragon mothership. Katana is like... a worse Federation Hooligans, and honestly, Federation Hooligans isn't that good.
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Oct 20, 2020 05:55
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Endorph posted:Honestly I think that's a big thematic thing. A big part of IBO is expectations people have based on their pre-conceived notions being dashed, in both a plot way and a meta way. Everything up to Carta's introduction is fairly standard Gundam, but a massive point is made of Carta expecting things to go one way and then them not happening at all. There's even a bit of this that works on the audience - when she announces her 3v3 and it cuts to Akihiro and Shino gearing up for it, you expect it to actually happen, not Mika to brutally murder all of them. And everything after Carta's death is incredibly skewed. The char clone kills his Garma, but Gali survives and becomes the actual Char, while the protagonists start working for McGillis. Characters you expect to die don't, characters who feel too important to die are killed pretty casually. You don't expect season 2 to open with a casual line about how S1 made child soldiers more common. That sort of thing. Carta's running gag is basically very obvious signposting of that - Carta has her own concept of how things should go, because she's the protagonist and hero of her own story, and that foreshadows the mistakes every other character makes because of that same assumption. Yeah I have to admit on my first watch that I was inwardly groaning a little bit when Carta proposed the 3v3 duel because I wanted to see what happened next in the story and not more Carta and then was pretty shocked when it went the way it did. poo poo, I was even pretty shocked on the rewatch because while Mika is pretty brutal in hi efficiency the only times he goes in harder are against super machines after overclocking himself. Also wasn’t expecting S2 to start with “yeah Tekkaden became a fairly successful company but it made the world a worse place for kids like them” On the other hand I ALSO wasn’t expecting Akihiro to get the perfect opportunity for revenge before going out pretty contented in a series where every onscreen death is either too quick for the character to even notice or fighting to live until their last breath. Pretty glad that happened, kinda expected Iok McWarcrimes to get a redemption or something post-credits.
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Oct 20, 2020 06:22
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Onmi posted:Katana is like... a worse Federation Hooligans, and honestly, Federation Hooligans isn't that good. Hooligans had a measure of restraint. Katana didn't have seatbelts installed.
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Oct 20, 2020 08:12
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Argas posted:Hooligans had a measure of restraint. Katana didn't have seatbelts installed. Hooligans was odd in that the first half was pretty much a straight-up military comedy, and then the back half wanted to do a serious conspiracy story, losing what made the first half distinct to be just another Gundam story where the higher ups can't be trusted.
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Oct 20, 2020 08:35
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chiasaur11 posted:For Mikazuki, everything is integrated weaponry. I liked it when his right manipulator got broken off using it to break the MA's tail blade, then used his remaining manipulator to tear off a piece of armour and then smash through the exposed area with the busted wrist section
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Oct 20, 2020 09:13
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There's a quick cut during the final battle of S1 where Akihiro clubs a guy to death with his Graze's own leg.
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Oct 20, 2020 11:34
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Endorph posted:There's a quick cut during the final battle of S1 where Akihiro clubs a guy to death with his Graze's own leg. There's also the still after the same battle where we see the Gusion Rebake and the wreckage of half a dozen enemy mobile suits. Akihiro shoved his shield straight through the waist of a downed Graze and buried it in the ground.
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Oct 20, 2020 11:37
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Apprentice Dick posted:IBO also has Mika just absolutely pasting Carta's guards where he just fuckin stomps the second one.  Be sure to crush your cans flat before recycling!
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Oct 20, 2020 11:43
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jackhunter64 posted:Be sure to crush your cans flat before recycling! Note: please don't do that. It actually makes it harder for recycling centers to sort them, not easier. tsob fucked around with this message at 11:59 on Oct 20, 2020 |
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Oct 20, 2020 11:56
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 My favourite Mikazuki face.
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Oct 20, 2020 12:11
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The other reason I like Carta is that she's the reason both sides in IBO are culpable. Season 1 spoilers: Merribit has her texual moment where she grabs Orga and says "What are you, stupid? You did your job and now you're about to throw everything you've built away and kill a bunch of these kids because of your pride?" right before Alberta, and Orga goes "Yes, I am that stupid, why do you ask?" Carta poses that exact question for McGillis. Instead of his idiotic twelve dimensional chess plan, all he had to do was maintain normal human relationships with his two friends/lovers, the other scions of the most powerful Gjallarhorn families, and he'd end up on top of the heap with a lot fewer dead people to his name. Instead, he specifically pushes her into the whirling chipper-shredder that is Mika. Yes, McGillis does think a wig and a mask will protect him from the consequences of his actions, why do you ask? Every tragic event in IBO happens that doesn't stem from the sociopolitical conditions of the setting, which the show goes out of its way to criticize, is a result of the characters acting like egotistical morons and shounen cliches. The production team actually created a narrative, instead of whatever the hell Trigger's up to these days. It's really good! Also her visual design is really cool and she has the best Graze in the show, so like, top-tier character.
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Oct 20, 2020 14:05
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Heck even if McGillis wanted all out civil war he could have made it three families versus two. Him, Gaelio, and Carta versus Rustal and Iok, with the two other guys staying out of it. It's like he says after the fight with Vidar, he wouldn't have been able to go through with it if they were around. He'd be too satisfied with the status quo. Which, like Rustal points out, is a pretty childish worldview. Macky is basically a giant manchild - his motivations haven't evolved since he was a kid. It's understandable that he's pretty stunted, given his childhood, but it's still a huge character flaw.
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Oct 20, 2020 14:40
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The hot mess that is McGillis is one of my favorite Gundam villains/antagonists/rivals/whatever the hell you want to call his role.
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Oct 20, 2020 14:53
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Kanos posted:The hot mess that is McGillis is one of my favorite Gundam villains/antagonists/rivals/whatever the hell you want to call his role. To me it is appropriate that when his plan didn't go the way he envisioned he threw a tantrum and then took his Bael to go home (and get merked by Gaelio). It's a little signature on how you're supposed to read his arc.
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Oct 20, 2020 15:11
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The little scene Gaelio and McGillis have in the Bael's chamber is really revealing. McGillis goes for a ton of Confident Schemer Who Knows What's Going on type lines, Gaelio cuts him off, clearly goes in different directions than he expects, and most importantly, calls his bluff. McGillis asks if he's here to stop him from getting in the Bael, and Gaelio tells him to go ahead and get in it so they can fight. Mika interrupts the scene but it's the first hint McGillis should have gotten that the Bael wasn't actually an instant I Win button, if Gaelio didn't care at all about him managing to get in it.
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Oct 20, 2020 15:15
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Yeah S2 made McGilles actions in S1 make a lot more sense, he is just a very hosed up idiot.
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Oct 20, 2020 15:16
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Part of me wonders whether Mikazuki and Orga are based off of Simon and Kamina but more grounded, or at least slightly inspired by it. Specifically the whole dynamic where Mika’s mere presence makes Orga believe he can do anything and Mikazuki basically being the backbone of Tekkaden, but instead of giving each other genuine strength they’re just sort of toxic to each other since Orga’s expectations and ambitions would have been curbed if Mika wasn’t ultimately just as childish and naive as the junior squad in his own way. It would be pretty fitting with how IBO sort of takes these cliches and asks “but how would this REALLY work out”, but I’m probably just seeing things.
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Oct 20, 2020 16:04
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Kamina didn't so much think he could do anything so long as Simon was around, as he wanted to do anything to inspire when Simon was around because he wanted to be a good big brother and not fail Simon the way he felt he'd failed himself when he was younger. He knew Simon could be more than him, and wanted to foster that potential regardless of the personal risk. Which is a pretty minor difference, and perhaps more a point of view than anything. You could probably also say the same about Orga's view of his relationship with Mika, I suppose.
tsob fucked around with this message at 23:35 on Oct 20, 2020 |
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Oct 20, 2020 17:00
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I thought it was funny how McGillis went for a cockpit stab kill and missed twice
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Oct 20, 2020 22:20
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Last Celebration posted:Part of me wonders whether Mikazuki and Orga are based off of Simon and Kamina but more grounded, or at least slightly inspired by it. Specifically the whole dynamic where Mika’s mere presence makes Orga believe he can do anything and Mikazuki basically being the backbone of Tekkaden, but instead of giving each other genuine strength they’re just sort of toxic to each other since Orga’s expectations and ambitions would have been curbed if Mika wasn’t ultimately just as childish and naive as the junior squad in his own way. It would be pretty fitting with how IBO sort of takes these cliches and asks “but how would this REALLY work out”, but I’m probably just seeing things. I don't think that's quite the correct read. Apparently, the first concept was "A group leader named Orga and a genius Mobile Suit pilot named Mikazuki", but they didn't have anything beyond that. (Mikazuki was apparently a pretty difficult problem, since "genius pilot" is a pretty well worn archetype.) If "Evil Kamina and Simon" was a reference rather than a happy coincidence, then you'd think they'd have a better idea of the direction at the start. I'd also say that Mika and Orga's dynamic is a very mixed bag, not just good or bad. Without Mika, Orga wouldn't be driven forward to do the impossible... but he also would have better brakes on his bad ideas. And without Orga.. well, Mikazuki calls the day he first killed someone for Orga the day he was born. So there's that.
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Oct 20, 2020 22:35
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I really like what they wound up with for Mika. It'd be easy to make him, say, 'sullen except for Orga' but he's more like a weird dog. He's one of the funniest Gundam protags, frankly.
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Oct 20, 2020 23:48
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Endorph posted:I really like what they wound up with for Mika. It'd be easy to make him, say, 'sullen except for Orga' but he's more like a weird dog. He's one of the funniest Gundam protags, frankly. All of the moments where he does things that make perfect sense by his own (hosed up) internal logic but are strange or shocking to "normal" people are great. I'm especially fond of the moments where someone accidentally endangers or insults someone on his internal "protect at all costs" list, he snaps instantaneously into BRUTAL MURDER VIOLENCE mode, then someone he listens to goes "hey cut it out" and he turns off BRUTAL MURDER VIOLENCE mode like a light switch.
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Oct 20, 2020 23:58
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chiasaur11 posted:I'd also say that Mika and Orga's dynamic is a very mixed bag, not just good or bad. Without Mika, Orga wouldn't be driven forward to do the impossible... but he also would have better brakes on his bad ideas. And without Orga.. well, Mikazuki calls the day he first killed someone for Orga the day he was born. So there's that. Their relationship is explicitly one that's just horribly, incredibly toxic for everyone involved.
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Oct 20, 2020 23:59
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I don't think Mika and Orga's relationship would be terribly toxic if they weren't trained child soldiers leading an organization of trained child soldiers. It's extremely codependent and that's not great, but at the very least it's mutual. The thing that pushes it over the top into yikes territory is that Orga effectively has a whole bunch of kids' lives in his hands in a profession that is basically kill or be killed so his game of chicken with Mika inevitably leads to terrible consequences.
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Oct 21, 2020 00:04
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Endorph posted:I really like what they wound up with for Mika. It'd be easy to make him, say, 'sullen except for Orga' but he's more like a weird dog. He's one of the funniest Gundam protags, frankly. Remembering the time he kissed a cute girl cause of an offhand comment from Naze and that her response when she freaks out over being kissed out of nowhere is “I thought you looked cute. You didn’t like it?” and not giving it very much thought beyond that while she spends the next episode contemplating it.
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Oct 21, 2020 02:10
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Kanos posted:I don't think Mika and Orga's relationship would be terribly toxic if they weren't trained child soldiers leading an organization of trained child soldiers. It's extremely codependent and that's not great, but at the very least it's mutual. The thing that pushes it over the top into yikes territory is that Orga effectively has a whole bunch of kids' lives in his hands in a profession that is basically kill or be killed so his game of chicken with Mika inevitably leads to terrible consequences. Mutual codependence and one-sided dependence don't have any daylight between them in terms of toxicity, independent of anything else.
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Oct 21, 2020 02:13
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Warmachine posted:Mutual codependence and one-sided dependence don't have any daylight between them in terms of toxicity, independent of anything else. It's not healthy for either of them but if they weren't in the positions they were in it probably wouldn't have led to a ridiculous death toll.
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Oct 21, 2020 03:39
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Last Celebration posted:Remembering the time he kissed a cute girl cause of an offhand comment from Naze and that her response when she freaks out over being kissed out of nowhere is “I thought you looked cute. You didn’t like it?” and not giving it very much thought beyond that while she spends the next episode contemplating it. There's also the time he was told that Mobile Armors killed a quarter of the human race, so he held up four fingers, then lowered one to process the idea. (The look of surprise on his face rally sold the moment.) Mikazuki stands out even more as comic relief because even the protagonists of the more comedic shows, like early ZZ or Turn A, tend to spend most of their time playing tsukkomi, letting the supporting cast and villains be the ones to make the wacky situations they respond to. Mikazuki, by contrast, is the one who makes people react.
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Oct 21, 2020 03:45
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Kanos posted:It's not healthy for either of them but if they weren't in the positions they were in it probably wouldn't have led to a ridiculous death toll. When they were having to survive on the streets as poor orphans their relationship was probably the main thing that actually kept them alive, it just didn't scale up very well outside of that situation.
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Oct 21, 2020 04:02
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https://twitter.com/OOCGundam/status/1318656337107181581
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Oct 21, 2020 19:10
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drat sleeves
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Oct 21, 2020 19:27
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Does the GP02 have anything that protects the pilot from the radiation from the nuke? It would've been funny if Gato survived the heat from the blast because of the coolant system, but died anyway from the massive radiation leaking in.
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Oct 21, 2020 21:36
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amigolupus posted:Does the GP02 have anything that protects the pilot from the radiation from the nuke? It would've been funny if Gato survived the heat from the blast because of the coolant system, but died anyway from the massive radiation leaking in. Given the volumes of radiation in open space I think MS are generally shielded from that kind of stuff. Obviously they probably need to crank it up on the GP02, but I doubt they'd just like not think about that.
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Oct 21, 2020 21:51
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amigolupus posted:Does the GP02 have anything that protects the pilot from the radiation from the nuke? It would've been funny if Gato survived the heat from the blast because of the coolant system, but died anyway from the massive radiation leaking in. I’m going to say yes for no reason other than the blast shield is pointless otherwise, just give the nuclear weapon to a GM Quel and call it a day. I always ascribed much of the GPO2’s chonk to enhanced cooling and radiation shielding around the pilot and critical systems.
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Oct 21, 2020 22:46
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Its Anaheim so they probably offer a special pilot suit add-on that makes you not die.
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Oct 21, 2020 23:03
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