uncop posted:

I don’t understand what’s going on here anymore, what does blowing up a Stalin statue have in common with equating USSR and Nazi Germany as genocidaires and those responsible for WW2? People can build and blow up as many Stalin statues as they want. That’s making GBS threads on just one dude who people had legitimate grivances with, rather than the memory of countless heroic people who did literally nothing wrong.

steinrokkan posted:

Who ever attacked the people of the USSR?

steinrokkan posted:

Any sort of remembrance, no matter how framed, no matter how humble, will be portrayed as Holocaust apologia by the professional goalpost moving crew. After all the people who would mourn the victims of Stalinism don't even deserve to be alive, as we all know.

V. Illych L. posted:

the people trying to categorise them with the nazis?

OhFunny posted:

Any thoughts on the recent talks between Serbia and Kosovo on potential land swaps?

The plan is to swap the majority Serb area of northern Kosovo and the majority Albanian southwestern area of Serbia for each other. The US is for this plan and some EU officials are too, but there seems to be a lot of concern that it'll let loose another round of ethic separatism in the Balkans.

Doctor Jeep posted:

https://twitter.com/DanBoeckner/status/1297761296256053248

Lawman 0 posted:

Do you have a link?

steinrokkan posted:

Sayig that the government killed people isn't a attack on the citizens, unless you are an ultranationalist nutjob.

uncop posted:

Lol the period under intense focus here is WW2, the Black Ribbon day is literally designated after the Molotov-Ribbentrop pact. How in the world do you propose the government and the people can be separated, huh? The millions of Red Army conscripts and millions more civilians that eagerly supported the military operations worked as part of or hand in hand with the government! If you designate the government as criminal, the only debate to be had about its intense supporters is whether they were criminals, fools or forced. You know, approximately the discussion we have been having about Wehrmacht conscripts and the civilian supporters of the Nazi war machine for decades.

Even outside the war, guess where people most interested in serving and improving society tended to go in the USSR? How about... government posts? So now, we are forced to debate whether some medical scientist was a servant of humanity or an aide to the worst criminal acts of the century because they directly helped the government keep its legitimacy and support.

If anyone had wanted to spare those millions of regular people from being discussed in that fashion, the day of remembrance could easily have been framed differently. The framing was a conscious decision: it's anybody's guess how shamelessly and consciously propagandistic it was, but what's for certain is that the people making it didn't have an ounce of respect for the millions of people who fought for humanity in complete honesty and good will.

gradenko_2000 posted:

the Victims of Communism people are ardent anti-communists, and it is a form of anti-communist rhetoric, and a form of Holocaust denialism, to conflate or compare Nazi crimes against humanity to what happened under the Soviet Union.

steinrokkan posted:

I guess you are right, so an American mailman is responsible for MKULTRA.

Prtty much the only thing that is remembered at least in the Czech Republic are the post-war show trials (that mostly killed socialist politicians) and political prisoners of the 1950s (who again were largely socialists), I guess in countries like in the Baltics it's been coopted by fascists, but that's something they have to reckon with, if people there are stupid enough to go "Stalin killed my grandpa, time to go full Nazi apologist" I'm not responsible for cleaning up their poo poo.

uncop posted:

Come on, rather than being so incredibly willfully dense, you could have made an attempt to construct a honest analogy instead of this pitifully lazy strawman. It would have taken you a miniscule amount of time and brainpower to make the step to talking about e.g. if Russia and China hypothetically established a holiday commemorating the victims of the Nazi Germans and Americans at the same time.

Then we might have had something worth talking about : who is to be held responsible for MKULTRA, genocidal projects, colonial projects etc, and would it have been fair to give the American people the same treatment as we have (IMO justly) given to the German people. Would you have interpreted such a holiday as a honest and neutral commemmoration that we should respect or a crude and blatant propaganda effort?

PERPETUAL IDIOT posted:

The goalpost moving crew is back to invent a very ostentatious, not at all humble remembrance. And the terrible framing... I can barely believe it. Your hypothetical remembrance can not fairly be compared to Black Ribbon Day.

Byolante posted:

The reason vaccines must be mandatory is that a small number of people can't be vaccinated for medical reasons and without herd immunity they will die. Italy is a shithole.

Carthag Tuek posted:

true, except the world is a shithole so the antivax idiocy is everywhere

italy's just in the front seat for the apocalypse

Grape posted:

That is a very crowded chair right now.

Honest Thief posted:

why's denmark having a populist rise, isnt the socdem state holding on still?

Honest Thief posted:

why's denmark having a populist rise, isnt the socdem state holding on still?

Maximo Roboto posted:

V. Illych L. posted:

for the rest of scandiland i'd say that racial anxieties and resentments play a significant but much less pronounced role in our politics compared to the actual big empires, especially the anglo countries

denmark, bizarrely, has gone totally overboard and not being actively chauvinist is a sign that you're not serious about seeking power. it's hosed up

SplitSoul posted:

They were getting crushed in the polls until they started trying to out-racist the Danish People's Party. It's been a roaring success.

28% of the population wants Muslims ethnically cleansed from the country while 26.7% are unsure.

A Buttery Pastry posted:

I feel like The New Right doesn't entirely get across the name/brand? It's literally New Bourgeoisie, like their brand is specifically respectable/intellectual fascists as opposed to the populist/street thug kind.

A Buttery Pastry posted:

Yeah, when it comes to Muslims, our "center-left" is lovely-for-a-Tory/Republican-level poo poo.

V. Illych L. posted:

i think it actually is irreconcilable with social democracy, the issue is that social democracy as an ideology was fatally wounded in the early eighties and has been bleeding out ever since - the embrace of ethnic chauvinism is a defensive response to the collapse of the grander project. no longer are the social democrats representing a broad working class, they've collapsed into trying to be the general party of the common man which leads to a loss of ideological cohesion and some frankly pathetic displays.

we free traded our way out of having a real mass base for our societal projects. loving stupid of us.

SplitSoul posted:

Reminder that Rasmus Paludan was literally a candidate for the party until they were forced to acknowledge his "blood flowing into the sewers" speech. Numerous people have been excluded for condoning or inciting violence, including an attempt to burn a 16-year-old alive. Plus, as I mentioned, local chairmen on record for allowing neo-nazis entry.

SplitSoul posted:

That's too generous.

V. Illych L. posted:

also the translation 'new right' is fine imo, the anglosphere doesn't operate with the formal bourgeois/socialist party divide and it'd probably just be more confusing than good

V. Illych L. posted:

i think it actually is irreconcilable with social democracy, the issue is that social democracy as an ideology was fatally wounded in the early eighties and has been bleeding out ever since - the embrace of ethnic chauvinism is a defensive response to the collapse of the grander project. no longer are the social democrats representing a broad working class, they've collapsed into trying to be the general party of the common man which leads to a loss of ideological cohesion and some frankly pathetic displays.

we free traded our way out of having a real mass base for our societal projects. loving stupid of us.