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christmas boots posted:Honestly I'm not sure if it's more meaningful if the phasmid is actually saying that to Harry, or whether it's just Harry using Inland Empire to tell himself that via the phasmid
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Oct 28, 2020 19:35
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necrobobsledder posted:You mean Dolores Dei? I got the impression that was all a fabrication by everyone and greatly exaggerated and twisted around given the state of the world and more an internalization of shame, regret, or whatever HDB could muster up separate from his psyche. In effect, a religious epiphany kind of experience at best, a sign of going literally crazy at worst. ...No. I mean the Phasmid. The Phasmid is the miracle you're promised from the start, the miracle everyone wanted to see. The Phasmid is the embodiment of hope and innocence and wonder in the world. You didn't actually get to talk to it, did you?
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Oct 28, 2020 19:36
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necrobobsledder posted:Wasn't looking for a "kind" creature for fun cute fodder or whatever but something that can be nurtured, neglected, etc. Why does this need to be externalised? Harry has long been neglecting himself, both physically and emotionally, and a big part of the game is about grappling with whether Harry can get better, and if he himself believes he's worth it.
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Oct 28, 2020 19:39
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necrobobsledder posted:Wasn't looking for a "kind" creature for fun cute fodder or whatever but something that can be nurtured, neglected, etc. Perhaps a simple plant could have sufficed for the same dimension given how good the writing is. 
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Oct 28, 2020 19:53
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necrobobsledder posted:This is a good question but I suspect it's a deus ex machina meant as a wildcard specifically to screw with people trying to derive traditional meaning from the story rather than something material to the narrative. One telling part is Kim didn't communicate with it like HDB. Perhaps Cuno would?. Maybe I'd need to try a low-Psy run and get no dialogue? What happens if we don't go through the cryptozoologist quests?. If these kinds of factors change the interaction dramatically, that to me would answer the question. Cuno does not
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Oct 28, 2020 19:54
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Pro-Object Task Force
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Oct 28, 2020 19:54
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Kaysette posted:Disco Dancer DLC when???
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Oct 28, 2020 20:03
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JustaDamnFool posted:Why does this need to be externalised? Harry has long been neglecting himself, both physically and emotionally, and a big part of the game is about grappling with whether Harry can get better, and if he himself believes he's worth it.
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Oct 28, 2020 21:44
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Oxxidation posted:she's hanging around on the roof because part of her wants the sniper to take another shot and finish the job. for all her duplicity, klassje's not totally cold - she genuinely did like lely and she probably attributes his death to being in proximity to a fugitive like herself. the entire frame job around lely's death was definitely masterminded by her, with evrart just adapting to circumstances as they arose, but if she was a total ice queen then she wouldn't have left you the final hint to catch the sniper, whether out of guilt or gratitude, and it's almost certain she didn't anticipate or want the subsequent shootout (though of course she still takes advantage of it as it comes) This was my take as well. In fact, I'm pretty sure she says something to that effect that she's half expecting to be shot, or maybe Harry's mind circus intuits it or something. It could all be a sociopathic act, but its more compelling that she's feels insanely guilty about hanging her lover to avoid the chance of getting sniffed out by the RCM and handed over to the Moralintern. Its obvious from her interrogation she really connected with the merc. Both of them are hosed up and monstrous tools of capital. Transient People posted:Obviously, yes. Multiple outside and internal sources point that way...and the fundamental fact is Klaasje lies with truth. A good liar doesn't just 100% make up bullshit, and she's an excellent one. It's facile to assume everything she says is untrustworthy, and reductionist. You're a better detective than that. Part of being a good detective is knowing how to spot truth in a pack of lies. Yeah, I think you actually learn many true things about her over the course of your investigation. In fact she's truthful with you when the rest of the conspiracy isn't (she categorically debunks the rape cover story, and brings you MUCH closer to the truth). christmas boots posted:Honestly I'm not sure if it's more meaningful if the phasmid is actually saying that to Harry, or whether it's just Harry using Inland Empire to tell himself that via the phasmid Does it matter 
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Oct 28, 2020 21:45
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The latter would imply a greater sense of hope for Harry, I think. But perhaps it doesn't matter.
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Oct 28, 2020 22:07
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it is kim, kindly speaking through the phasmid, to enable the main character to accept his words
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Oct 28, 2020 22:11
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necrobobsledder posted:Wasn't looking for a "kind" creature for fun cute fodder or whatever but something that can be nurtured, neglected, etc. Perhaps a simple plant could have sufficed for the same dimension given how good the writing is. https://twitter.com/CanYouPetTheDog/status/1220721560870359041 you can also hit the mailbox, if you're some kind of heartless monster
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Oct 28, 2020 22:14
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Do dogs even exist in Elysium?
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Oct 28, 2020 22:20
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There are a bunch of lines that call things or people dogs.
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Oct 28, 2020 22:23
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OK good. DE is bleak but I can't imagine it being that bleak.
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Oct 28, 2020 22:45
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there are explicit mentions too, eg. fifteenth indotribe describes child harry and his friends "running from wild dogs in the Valley"
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Oct 28, 2020 22:51
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Brandon Proust posted:https://twitter.com/CanYouPetTheDog/status/1220721560870359041 I feel unreasonably emotional watching that animation
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Oct 28, 2020 22:56
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Lasting Damage posted:This was my take as well. In fact, I'm pretty sure she says something to that effect that she's half expecting to be shot, or maybe Harry's mind circus intuits it or something. It could all be a sociopathic act, but its more compelling that she's feels insanely guilty about hanging her lover to avoid the chance of getting sniffed out by the RCM and handed over to the Moralintern. Its obvious from her interrogation she really connected with the merc. Both of them are hosed up and monstrous tools of capital. This is a solid analysis. Klaasje is deeply, deeply damaged. It's easy to read her as a lying sociopath — she probably believes that about herself, to some degree, that she is irredeemable and evil. When you first interview her, she says she's running from room-to-room to escape "military grade Sad" that comes from the past "white and filled with doom" — notice here a direct allusion the Pale, which represents the detritus of all of humanity's past mistakes and pains. She's a foil for Harry in that they're both deeply compromised creatures suffering under the crushing weight of their pasts, both of whom end up at the Whirling-in-Rags (an allusion to the Whirling Dervishes, an order of Sufi worshippers who strip themselves of ego — like Harry was stripped of ego — through dance) on drug-fueled benders seeking freedom from the animals they both believe themselves to be: Harry at the end of his necktie, and Klaasje at the end of a sniper's scope. When you bring up rape to Klaasje, she considers for a brief moment —likely weighing whether duplicity would serve her in this moment — and can't bring herself to lie. "I don't wanna say that poo poo about him," she responds, because she truly cared for Ellis, likely seeing in him another poor, damaged soul caught up in the meat grinder of global capitalism. Harry is unique in that, at the start of the game, he is the only one stripped entirely of his past. The hole in the Church that scoured away his memories freed him from the Pale of his own past and made something entirely new, just as the Insulindan Archipelago itself was made new, assembled by the belief and hope of its first explorers from the Pale itself. Revachol itself reached out and gave Harry a second chance, as we see in the "Cleaning Out the Rooms" memory: "What if you didn’t lose your memory? What if something in Martinaise came and stored it all away. For you to slowly open one box at a time. So you can *choose* which parts to keep." Klaasje didn't believe she could change. Like the parable of the scorpion and the frog, she believed she was a creature that could not help but kill whatever was around her. Ellis didn't think he could change. The sniper didn't think he could change. The mercenaries of the tribunal, offered peace and a way out, chose instead to fall back upon the violence of their pasts. None of them are evil, they're just humans stuck in a repeating cycle of violence and pain. No one changed but Harry — and Harry changed the world.
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Oct 28, 2020 23:14
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That is a beautiful analysis, Poltroon.
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Oct 29, 2020 02:16
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one other neat bit about klassje is how rattled she gets if you repeat the hanged man's confession that "love did [him] in." she fixates on so much that she even repeats it later unprompted ("i'm the love that does people in, remember?") which is an uncharacteristic slip in the terse, detached persona she'd affected up to that point. at first it just comes off as her being taken off-guard because this detective is repeating words he heard from a corpse, but it also probably affirmed her belief that she's "irredeemable and evil" - how can she move on from her sordid past if everything she gets close to dies?
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Oct 29, 2020 04:04
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So, I just got past the tribunal shoot-out, by shooting the 'scab leader' guy in the face after failing to convince him to calm down...despite rolling TWO double-sixes for the persuasion attempts! Anyway, I also saved Kim from being shot, and apparently he was able to kill the other two mercs. A few of the non-Titus Hardie boys were killed, too. So I'm just wondering, is that the optimal/least-bad outcome for the situation? Or is there a better outcome, like being able to bring one of the mercs in for questioning? Also, I was wearing the cuirass at the time. I was shot twice in the shootout - once in the leg and once in the chest, which rebounded. Out of curiosity, what happens if you don't wear the armour? Do you die, or is it basically just fluff, and you walk away from your wounds two days later regardless?
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Oct 29, 2020 05:23
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You change a few things but the shootout will always happen, and Titus's crew will always have a few casualties. The tragedy of the tribunal is that by the time you come to at the start of the game things are already on an inevitable crash course and the one merc that had enough sway over the rest and enough of a level head that he could have been talked down is the one that got killed.
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Oct 29, 2020 05:30
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Major Isoor posted:Also, I was wearing the cuirass at the time. I was shot twice in the shootout - once in the leg and once in the chest, which rebounded. Out of curiosity, what happens if you don't wear the armour? Do you die, or is it basically just fluff, and you walk away from your wounds two days later regardless? You can't die in the shootout, no matter how badly you gently caress up, other than the normal game over conditions. The cuirass prevents you from taking health damage from being shot in the chest, but as long as you have healing items or enough health, you'll still survive without it.
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Oct 29, 2020 05:44
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Imma be honest, when somebody referenced a constantly encouraging miracle of life, I thought it was Kim. I get that he's not actually a dog, but there's an element of nurture in how you treat him explicitly. He's stuck with you whether you're an rear end in a top hat or not. He's the Tango to your Cash, the Buddy to your Cop. The Hooch to your Turner.
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Oct 29, 2020 16:14
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Poltroon posted:This is a solid analysis.  bobtheconqueror posted:Imma be honest, when somebody referenced a constantly encouraging miracle of life, I thought it was Kim. Absolutely, this was my feeling as well. It's a more realistic take on the constant supporting force. He isn't there to be the reason you pull yourself out of poo poo, but when you make positive changes he lets you know.
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Oct 29, 2020 17:51
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I’m about 10 hours in to this game, playing as the Psyche build or whatever it’s called, empathy and inland empire and all those. How different is a play through where I’m all physical violence, or one where I’m just an even drunker Sherlock Holmes? Do all of those skill things come up just as often as they do now? Cause I feel like Inland Empire comes up like 5 times per conversation.
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Oct 29, 2020 19:49
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Yorkshire Pudding posted:I’m about 10 hours in to this game, playing as the Psyche build or whatever it’s called, empathy and inland empire and all those. More or less. Some skills are chattier than other skills.
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Oct 29, 2020 19:51
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Yorkshire Pudding posted:I’m about 10 hours in to this game, playing as the Psyche build or whatever it’s called, empathy and inland empire and all those. High Encyclopedia is a fun time. Not always a useful one, but fun.
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Oct 29, 2020 20:08
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I wish Interfacing had more lines. I strongly relate with that skill.
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Oct 29, 2020 20:12
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Yeah the frequency of the skills chiming in is based on passive checks, so more skill means more interaction. That said, some skills get a ton more air time than others. Motorics skills get the worst of it imo. Except reaction speed. Encyclopedia is definitely one of my favorites.
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Oct 29, 2020 20:36
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Yorkshire Pudding posted:I’m about 10 hours in to this game, playing as the Psyche build or whatever it’s called, empathy and inland empire and all those. the way it works under the hood is “passive checks.” when the Continue button has a color besides solid dull red, the game is about to compare your_relevant_skill + 6 to a check. you can mouse over the label after the fact if it displays to see what the numerical value of the check was. if you’re equal or better (eg. inland empire 4 means you pass checks of difficulty 10 or below) something happens when the skill chimes in. sometimes failures have their own scenes and consequences as well, just like active checks. the net effect is that the skills you’re best at chime in the most often. eg. low Electrochemistry means that its reaction to looking into the peephole is “golly I bet you could see salacious stuff,” but increasing it extends the vignette to “I bet bottles were involved” and the artful climax “did you know that you can put speed straight up your rear end in a top hat?”
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Oct 29, 2020 21:14
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Motorics gets a number awesome active checks, and Reaction Speed and Composure do help steer your talks. Perhaps it's main failing is it makes you competent. And that Interfacing stops being spooky after like day 1, which is a shame.
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Oct 29, 2020 21:14
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Visual Calculus is getting a surprising amount of work - analyzing the crime scene was a hoot - and the rest of the skills on that path too. (6/2/2/2 for me) But I only just realized that I am never told about all the passive checks I'm failing - and kinda wondering just how much I'm missing  (especially considering my personal goal to avoid Doing A Drug during the playthrough - no, game, I'm ignoring the failed Volition check, I'm not getting speed  )
Ciaphas fucked around with this message at 21:32 on Oct 29, 2020 |
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Oct 29, 2020 21:30
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Ciaphas posted:Visual Calculus is getting a surprising amount of work - analyzing the crime scene was a hoot - and the rest of the skills on that path too. (6/2/2/2 for me) There are a small handful of passive checks you are informed that you're failing, but that's mostly for effect. You're right in that you can miss out, not only on skills but on environmental objects (with low Perception). Hope you're enjoying everything Encyclopedia has to say!
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Oct 29, 2020 23:00
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World War Mammories posted:eg. low Electrochemistry means that its reaction to looking into the peephole is “golly I bet you could see salacious stuff,” but increasing it extends the vignette to “I bet bottles were involved” and the artful climax “did you know that you can put speed straight up your rear end in a top hat?” It's not drugs, I'm just honouring myself, lieutenant
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Oct 29, 2020 23:03
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So should I just lean all into my psyche skills? I can get those real high, but my logic and visual calculus skills are like 0-1. Also, how much should I be doing thought cabinets? I have like 6 already, mostly cause I like reading the vignettes. Also I guess I need to make communism happen.
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Oct 29, 2020 23:54
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Ciaphas posted:Visual Calculus is getting a surprising amount of work - analyzing the crime scene was a hoot - and the rest of the skills on that path too. (6/2/2/2 for me) Check out mr big brain cop over here, knowing what the gently caress a book is Not shown is when you say "I know what these things are" is your skill saying "No you don't" and you then exiting by saying "Don't you sass me."
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Oct 30, 2020 00:13
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Glazius posted:There are a small handful of passive checks you are informed that you're failing, but that's mostly for effect. You're right in that you can miss out, not only on skills but on environmental objects (with low Perception). Hope you're enjoying everything Encyclopedia has to say! Been reading some, passing by others. So far so good  though I'm at day 2 and at a bit of a crossroads because, to be vague, all my current options seem either very self-defeating or, er, physical. I'll come back to it when I decide how I want to gently caress it up
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Oct 30, 2020 03:12
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Yorkshire Pudding posted:So should I just lean all into my psyche skills? I can get those real high, but my logic and visual calculus skills are like 0-1. the game will reward you if you lean into your psyche skills, just like it will reward you if you spread out your points, just in a different way. personally I recommend leaning into it, *bratan*, but do what you like, what strikes you as appropriate and/or fun, get silly. same with thoughts
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Oct 30, 2020 03:31
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Disco elysium is a game that you should absolutely play by feel. Do what you want, and then do a playthrough with a different setup.
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Oct 30, 2020 03:41
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