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Honestly, I'm of two minds. One: yes, more democracy, of course. The other: closed primaries got us Trump, whereas the old smoke-filled room full of GOP fat cats wouldn't have selected him in a million years.
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Oct 30, 2020 16:08
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TheDeadlyShoe posted:Jungle primaries make a certain amount of sense in states where one party is politically dominant, giving the general run of voter more power as compared to everything being locked up by the party base long before the election. They are just asinine in even remotely competitive states tho. they're asinine in general, just do ranked choice
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Oct 30, 2020 20:02
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VitalSigns posted:they're asinine in general, just do ranked choice Pretty much. This solves a huge number of electoral problems and afaict for federal congressional elections should be A) legislateable at a federal level and B) constitutionally valid without an amendment, quote:Article I
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Oct 30, 2020 20:50
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Sarcastro posted:Honestly, I'm of two minds. One: yes, more democracy, of course. The other: closed primaries got us Trump, whereas the old smoke-filled room full of GOP fat cats wouldn't have selected him in a million years.
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Oct 30, 2020 21:05
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ShadowHawk posted:Trump was also the product of this bizarre idea that the "winner" of a state primary with 10 candidates is the guy who got 20% of the vote. Being the most noticed in the crowd after the first pass is not the same thing as majority support! Yeah, exactly. Producing a result so lousy that the smoke-filled room looks reasonable is really something.
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Oct 30, 2020 21:06
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There is actually a Ranked Choice Voting Act bill (H.R. 4464) in Congress for ranked choice elections for members of Congress. It was introduced just last year. There is another version called the Fair Representation Act that at the same time establishes multiple-member districts, which comes with the drawback of the districts being larger, which means they'll be harder for candidates without large amounts of money to win. The third bill out there establishes a $40 million grant fund for states and localities transitioning to ranked choice voting. Writing to your member of Congress or any prospective challenger might help increase the chance of passage.
galenanorth fucked around with this message at 21:17 on Oct 30, 2020 |
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Oct 30, 2020 21:07
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Mr. Nice! posted:Florida has jungle primaries on the ballot and will probably pass because people are idiots and vote yes on every dumb thing. In 2018 the gubernatorial race would have been between two republicans because there was a three way split of dem votes vs a two way split in the rep primary. DeSantis and Putnam both had more votes than Gillum and would have been the only options on the general ballot under the proposed new scheme. Well, under an open primary system, the parties and the voters are also aware of what is going on. Maybe the first election will be a fuckup (CA had some high-profile mistakes for a couple election cycles) and you could have poo poo like Maine where a strong stubborn field elects a horrid candidate with a plurality, but in states that have a history of open primaries, the candidates who are doing badly are pressured to drop out, and the voters also read stories, see what is going on, and move on to their next-best choice to prevent a sweep by the other party.
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Oct 30, 2020 21:20
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galenanorth posted:There is another version called the Fair Representation Act that at the same time establishes multiple-member districts, which comes with the drawback of the districts being larger, which means they'll be harder for candidates without large amounts of money to win.
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Oct 30, 2020 21:29
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Rigel posted:Well, under an open primary system, the parties and the voters are also aware of what is going on. Maybe the first election will be a fuckup (CA had some high-profile mistakes for a couple election cycles) and you could have poo poo like Maine where a strong stubborn field elects a horrid candidate with a plurality, but in states that have a history of open primaries, the candidates who are doing badly are pressured to drop out, and the voters also read stories, see what is going on, and move on to their next-best choice to prevent a sweep by the other party.
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Oct 30, 2020 21:30
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ShadowHawk posted:This sounds a lot like having a shadow primary based on polling and a dropout-honors system before the official primary. yeah, pretty much. To be clear, open primaries are stupid and should not be done because these idiotic possibilities where you have two Democrats or two Republicans in the general election are not acceptable. (Two Democrats are bad because now both are outright campaigning to conservative assholes for votes) But, in the unfortunate case where your state implements this system, it still usually sort of works out.
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Oct 30, 2020 21:34
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Mr. Nice! posted:Florida has jungle primaries on the ballot and will probably pass because people are idiots and vote yes on every dumb thing. In 2018 the gubernatorial race would have been between two republicans because there was a three way split of dem votes vs a two way split in the rep primary. DeSantis and Putnam both had more votes than Gillum and would have been the only options on the general ballot under the proposed new scheme.
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Nov 3, 2020 13:56
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https://twitter.com/propublica/status/1323610831494537218
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Nov 3, 2020 15:23
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Zero_Grade posted:It doesn't help that Amendment 3 was worded so it sounded like it made primaries 'more fair' to everyone (yes I'm aware this was on purpose). I've had to explain to a number of my friends who were going to vote yes what it actually would do. Same thing is happening in VA with the gerrymandering amendment. It's just going to let the heavily GOP Supreme Court do redistricting itself with no oversight from voters but it is written on the ballot in a way to make it look like it'll be more bi-partisan than before.
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Nov 3, 2020 15:45
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So who do we think Biden nominates to the newly created court spots?
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Nov 4, 2020 05:16
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Biden has to win first. Then the Dems have to win the senate. Without both things done, nothing will happen.
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Nov 4, 2020 05:24
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Dameius posted:Biden has to win first. Then the Dems have to win the senate. Without both things done, nothing will happen. Don't forget the third necessary thing: getting rid of the filibuster.
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Nov 4, 2020 05:32
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Sarcastro posted:Don't forget the third necessary thing: getting rid of the filibuster. A minor speedbump if all the other conditions hold, they already did it for non-SCOTUS judges
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Nov 4, 2020 05:33
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haveblue posted:A minor speedbump if all the other conditions hold, they already did it for non-SCOTUS judges I don't mean for nominations (and the GOP did it for those already as well, hence Trump's three), I mean for the legislation needed to expand the court in the first place.
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Nov 4, 2020 05:35
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ilkhan fucked around with this message at 15:39 on Nov 4, 2020 |
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Nov 4, 2020 06:18
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I am confident that Biden is winning but the Senate isn't looking good. If they can only get to a tie or +1 then the odds of getting enough support to expand the courts are looking slim.
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Nov 4, 2020 11:56
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It was already slim even with a D+3 or D+4.
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Nov 4, 2020 14:57
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Dems could have D+10 and they wouldn't pack the courts.
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Nov 4, 2020 15:48
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Senate is a gonner dudes. We still gotta deal with Turtleface for another 4 years.
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Nov 4, 2020 16:33
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If I'm reading the constitution correctly, the Senate could be solicited for "advice," then you seat Breyer's replacement anyway.
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Nov 4, 2020 17:54
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Potato Salad posted:If I'm reading the constitution correctly, the Senate could be solicited for "advice," then you seat Breyer's replacement anyway. advice and consent.
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Nov 4, 2020 17:59
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Hieronymous Alloy posted:advice and consent. It's 2020, consent doesn't appear to matter to either party.
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Nov 4, 2020 18:32
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Hieronymous Alloy posted:advice and consent.
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Nov 4, 2020 18:37
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ShadowHawk posted:the senate cannot legally consent if they're mentally incapacitated president granted conservatorship over the senate, US now a monarchy
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Nov 4, 2020 19:04
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Hieronymous Alloy posted:advice and consent. oh, so the Senate has a constitutional duty to consent the appointment sorry, it doesn't say anywhere that they are allowed to say no, pack it in boys
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Nov 4, 2020 22:43
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My friend used to be an intern for Justice Thomas. They said the loving funniest thing to me: "If Biden wins he'll just wait another 4 years until he retires to spend more time with his family, ie: the portraits of white people that came with the frames he bought. That or he is discovered to have died like years ago and no one noticed." Thomas is like what, younger than almost all three of the current liberal judges? gently caress man.
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Nov 4, 2020 23:09
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jeeves posted:My friend used to be an intern for Justice Thomas. They said the loving funniest thing to me: Clarence Thomas was 43 years old when he was appointed to the Supreme Court. If he lives to be RBG's age he could conceivably spend more than half his life on the Supreme Court.
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Nov 4, 2020 23:13
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Sits down, pours glass of booze. OK FReep thread, hit me with the salt.
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Nov 5, 2020 00:28
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vyelkin posted:Clarence Thomas was 43 years old when he was appointed to the Supreme Court. yeah but the sooner he retires the sooner they can appoint a 22 year old Legal Studies major with a C- GPA to replace him!
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Nov 5, 2020 00:48
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Thomas will die on the bench while reading his 10,000th dissent or concurrence about how due process integration is faulty and everything should be based upon privileges and immunities instead.
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Nov 5, 2020 00:51
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Thomas will die on the bench during oral arguments and no one will notice for hours.
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Nov 5, 2020 01:03
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Stickman posted:Thomas will die on the bench during oral arguments and no one will notice for hours. Only if and when there is a smell.
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Nov 5, 2020 02:34
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I'm from the future and I just came back to tell you all to appreciate the time you have while there's still 3 liberal justices on the court....
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Nov 5, 2020 02:40
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 I hope you toxxed for him too.
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Nov 5, 2020 02:40
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jeeves posted:Senate is a gonner dudes. We still gotta deal with Turtleface for another 4 years. It's looking more and more possible, actually.
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Nov 5, 2020 10:54
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Fuschia tude posted:It's looking more and more possible, actually. It's still a bit of a long shot, presumably both georgia senate races will enter into a runoff election which without Trump as President could affect Republican turnout and could affect Democratic turnout which might bring Dems to 50. Then there's North Carolina which has 5% of the vote remaining presumably from Democratic leaning mail-in and provisional ballots but will take until the 12th or so. For conclusive control of the chamber Dem's need all 3. It's not a complete goner yet but its also a large uphill climb and hopefully every effort is made to win it.
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Nov 5, 2020 11:00
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