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Gun Jam posted:Cognitive dissonance is the discomfort experienced by an individual who holds two or more contradictory beliefs at the same time. I think one of my favorite arguments you can make against him is... honestly, I probably shouldn't talk about it until Kanfy shows off all the ways the conversation can go.
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Nov 7, 2020 23:52
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Kanfy posted:As as a related bit of trivia, talking down Vauclair was actually only added in Director's Cut. There are 3 possible outcomes in DC but while much of the dialogue remains largely the same or similar, the only possible result in the original Dragonfall was failing to convince him. Huh, guess I’m glad I waited for the Director’s Cut to come out. And yeah, the dialogue for this game is amazing.
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Nov 8, 2020 01:42
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The ending of Dragonfall was already very good, then Director's Cut made it amazing. Harebrained Schemes outdid themselves with this one. And the best part was that they gave it away for free to anyone who already owned a copy of the Dragonfall expansion. Cool people, that bunch.
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Nov 8, 2020 02:29
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Wait the talk option was added in Director's Cut? I could have sworn I got that result my first playthrough, but maybe I just never actually beat the game until DC came out.
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Nov 8, 2020 02:41
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you wanna play the bonus campaign to sr hong kong. bonus campaign is the one you want, w/o spoiling anything
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Nov 8, 2020 03:10
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Yeah, speaking as somebody who was a molecular biologist in a former career, I'm impressed how well they did the biology here, both Vauclair's logic and the party's. Sums up the primary downsides of biological warfare for actual warfare; if it's effective enough for the enemy to not neutralize it with a treatment it's too easy for it to get beyond your control thanks to mutation/spread issues. Though I gotta say I can sure see Vauclair's point; it's fitting the PC arguments against it boil down to "won't work/has unforseen consequences" rather than trying to defend dragonkind, because my oh my at best they're manipulative SOBs even when they're on the "right side", and while genocide is way too far if you could pop certain of the more brutal ones like Lofwyr and Sirrug it would pretty much be a net positive, unforseen consequences or not. I would definitely say with our current choices releasing Feuerschwinge strikes me as a BAD idea, there's a reason one of the most important Shadowrun rules alongside "geek the mage first" is "never deal with a dragon". Hope it's not compulsory to do so in order to stop this at least.
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Nov 8, 2020 03:34
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One of the big arguments for not trying to xenocide dragons is that unless it works perfectly, you have now really pissed them off.
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Nov 8, 2020 03:48
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The Lone Badger posted:One of the big arguments for not trying to xenocide dragons is that unless it works perfectly, you have now really pissed them off. Come at the dragon you best not miss.
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Nov 8, 2020 03:53
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People have made the "don't deal with dragons" argument a lot, but wouldn't it be fun to gently caress with tabletop or video game players by having the opportunity to deal with a dragon and it goes perfectly well? The DM could totally gently caress with them by making them constantly fear that the other shoe was about to drop, possibly by having the dragon torment them just for giggles even though he's satisfied and has bigger problems. Is there any truth to the implication in this update that the dragons might be holding back something even worse?
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Nov 8, 2020 04:09
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i did that in a game i gmed and then mitsuhama hosed them instead. it was fun re: second question: absolutely
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Nov 8, 2020 04:11
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JustJeff88 posted:Is there any truth to the implication in this update that the dragons might be holding back something even worse? You may have noticed that in Shadowrun, people in the magical know call this the Sixth World. You ever wonder what happened to worlds 1-5?
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Nov 8, 2020 04:14
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well, you wanna wonder about all the even worlds, cuz the odd ones were just no magic left the even worlds, bit of a doozy. you can actually see something if kanfy wants to show something
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Nov 8, 2020 04:16
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One of the reasons talking down Vauclair works is that, unlike a lot of similar convo-bosses in RPG's, you're bringing new infomation to the table. It's a lot easier to believe Dr. Vauclair's moment of doubt after you reveal that his scheme has killed the person he loves most in the world; Herman's death by collateral damage is a clearly hits a lot closer to home than the expected slaughter that will inevitably follow unleashing a dragon on Berlin.
Vagabong fucked around with this message at 05:05 on Nov 8, 2020 |
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Nov 8, 2020 05:03
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Cythereal posted:You may have noticed that in Shadowrun, people in the magical know call this the Sixth World. Yes, though I know gently caress all about Shadowrun lore outside of these threads, but the planet wasn't blown to bits and (meta)humanity survived? Not sure what to say. I was somewhat wondering if there is any estimate how long this world will last and what finally made "magic run out" on previous worlds. For the current, 6th world, I suppose that it's plot fiat.
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Nov 8, 2020 05:09
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JustJeff88 posted:Yes, though I know gently caress all about Shadowrun lore outside of these threads, but the planet wasn't blown to bits and (meta)humanity survived? Not sure what to say. The short form is that if you bend reality too much (see: magic) then things that should not exist start finding their ways in. It's never elaborated (at least in Shadowrun) what's out there, but Earthdawn's experience with The Horrors basically portrayed the Fourth World as a dark ages Call Of Cthulhu. As far as "how long", in past cycles a World has lasted about ~5000 years, but the way metahumanity keeps loving with power beyond its ken (lookin at you, aztechnology blood mages) the Sixth World might be speeding things along at an accelerated pace. As for what ended the Fourth World (aka Earthdawn) and made it transition into the Fifth World (aka Just Real Life Earth), I don't think FASA ever elaborated. Some immortal elves and most dragons probably know, but won't tell anyone.
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Nov 8, 2020 05:34
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KataraniSword posted:The short form is that if you bend reality too much (see: magic) then things that should not exist start finding their ways in. I just read on this a bit and, yes, about 5000 years per "world". I will say, however, that I cannot imagine humanity squandering a precious resource like mana and speeding up global decline in a quest for wealth and power and you should be ashamed for even mentioning it.
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Nov 8, 2020 05:45
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Mana kind of goes away both on a cycle and when there's not enough Life around. So as far as is known, there's no real way to keep a magical civilization around during the dead periods of the cycle on any kind of large scale. Even if you could get more than enough knowledgeable people to be ageless, just sheer loss from time and being unable to actually teach and train even a first circle magical trick would doom the society to collapse into small pockets at best.
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Nov 8, 2020 05:57
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MadDogMike posted:...there's a reason one of the most important Shadowrun rules alongside "geek the mage first" is "never deal with a dragon". Which is why the DM will make sure you have to. 
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Nov 8, 2020 06:06
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On the other hand, gently caress all the dragons.
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Nov 8, 2020 06:11
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Polaron posted:On the other hand, gently caress all the dragons. Isn't that how you end up with even more dragons?
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Nov 8, 2020 06:19
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Polaron posted:On the other hand, gently caress all the dragons. Point of order, Dunkelzahn was both Cool and Good.
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Nov 8, 2020 06:30
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hestaby and masaru less good but still not that bad
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Nov 8, 2020 06:32
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Tehan posted:Point of order, Dunkelzahn was both Cool and Good. So you're saying that the only good dragon is a dead dragon?
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Nov 8, 2020 06:35
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Polaron posted:On the other hand, gently caress all the dragons. I said slay the dragon, not lay the dragon!
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Nov 8, 2020 07:29
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During the 4th world, the mana cycle started swinging down from "the extra-dimensional monsters can manifest at will to make art of our suffering" towards "the only elves that are going to make it are the ones smart enough to have spare magic stored away", but got stuck slightly below the apocalypse level for unknown reasons for a long time before it finally declined to 5th world levels. There are certain extremely rare and complicated artifacts known as mana mills that can maintain a small manasphere around themselves almost indefinitely, but they're all one-offs. Exotic sites like gardens constructed to geomantic principles and filled with rare plants can also maintain power in the ebb periods, and of course, there's always a little blood sacrifice.
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Nov 8, 2020 08:28
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JustJeff88 posted:Is there any truth to the implication in this update that the dragons might be holding back something even worse? Who's to say we aren't going to find out? This LP isn't over yet, let's not get too far ahead of ourselves.
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Nov 8, 2020 09:34
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The thread title now takes on a new meaning.
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Nov 8, 2020 12:42
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Anticheese posted:I said slay the dragon, not lay the dragon! I'm a bard, it's what I do.
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Nov 8, 2020 19:50
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bob dobbs is dead posted:hestaby and masaru less good but still not that bad Periwanyr just wants to find good music and run his clubs.
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Nov 8, 2020 20:31
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GhostStalker posted:Periwanyr just wants to find good music and run his clubs. oh yeah, perianwyr is by far the best in terms of not plotting for poo poo
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Nov 8, 2020 20:39
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Urubia just wants everyone in Redmond to get along.
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Nov 8, 2020 21:32
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Kanfy posted:
To elaborate (in an abridged form), at the time of DF:
Omitted:
After DF: -2057: Dunkelzahn assassinated (or self-sacrificed, depending on how deep you go with this whole Horrors thing) 10 hours, 23 minutes and 8 seconds after being sworn in as UCAS president, with his will being used to influence current events posthumously. -2061: Alamais fights Lofwyr in 2061 (written off as 'special effects'), and is presumed dead -2062: Nachtmeister is killed in a duel with Lofwyr above Frankfurt. -2064: Ghostwalker emerges at the site of Big D's assasination and makes his way toward Denver -2074: Sirrug is taken out by Aztlan after destroying Cali, Coloumbia but is saved/put in Dragon jail before he can actually die -2075: Alamais is actually killed when his Italian compound is raided by a very wide array of forces (1,000 shadowrunners, Lung, Arleesh, 20 dragons, and other heavy equipment- the things that can happen during a Dragon Civil War are so strange). -2076: Celedyr eventually gets in bed with some sketchy players (Eliohann, Deus-follower Pax) post Crash 2.0 and gets stuck in the Boston Quarantine Zone for his CFD-related troubles. Negative_Earth fucked around with this message at 05:40 on Nov 9, 2020 |
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Nov 9, 2020 03:23
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There are seventeen great dragons in the world today. Seventeen ancient wyrms, millennia old, slowly dividing the planet into seventeen piles of gold to nest upon. In front of our eyes. Once upon a time, they burned castles to steal the treasure we collected. Laid waste to entire armies. But here, here in the Sixth World, it is no longer about tooth and claw and fiery breath.
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dunkelzahn is 'assassinated' and that happens right after he gets elected president which you neglected to mention lol
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Nov 9, 2020 03:29
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Was Dzbaltchen not a Great Feathered Serpent when he was killed (and then dissected live on the Matrix) by Atzlan for bombing a Yucatán peace summit? I know Pobre doesn’t count yet. Also, Hestaby’s lair and hoard at Mt Shasta were confiscated by Lofwyr and the Great Dragon Council at the end of the 4th Ed metaplot because of her going to the UN to get Sirrugg declared a war criminal just before the end of the Great Dragon Civil War that got Alamais killed by Lofwyr, Lung, and Arleesh at his lair in GeMiTo (Genoa, Milan, Torino) that he turned into his personal feeding ground, IIRC (oh, and where the Black Lodge tried to put a major magical whammy on Lofwyr and failed, leading to massive retaliation). Her magically wrecking SK’s MENA HQ in Dubai probably also had something to do with it (but not before she magically evacc’d every single metahuman In the building, a lot of Great Dragons consider Hestaby to be too soft when it comes to metahumanity and this is an example why) too. Though apparently losing her power base lets Hestaby act more freely in the shadows? Also, Ryumo waking up on Mt Fuji is considered the first major sighting of a Great Dragon in the Sixth World, though I guess Aden wrecked Tehran not soon after (after a mullah declared Jihad on all Awakened beings) showed that they were definitely here to stay. Lung waking up on one of the sacred mountains of China apparently buried most of the PRC’s nuclear stockpile in the resultant earthquake as well, which led to the collapse of China into a motley collection of microstates as well.
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Nov 9, 2020 03:51
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bob dobbs is dead posted:dunkelzahn is 'assassinated' and that happens right after he gets elected president which you neglected to mention lol Added. And it also spawns a great Dragon Corp, the Draco Foundation, notable for having bounties on blood mages and Drakes (at least as of SR3). Not sure what they got up to in 4/5/6.
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Nov 9, 2020 05:41
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schwarzkopft ends up being a professor
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Nov 9, 2020 05:43
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bob dobbs is dead posted:schwarzkopft ends up being a professor oh wait
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Nov 9, 2020 06:26
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Negative_Earth posted:Added. What did drakes do?
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Nov 9, 2020 07:04
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Drake's didn't do anything, they're servants created by true dragons. Their children are also drakes, which means dragons can get really possessive about their servants' families.
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Nov 9, 2020 07:50
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if you are a drake you get snapped up by a dragon for a life of slavery or you escape to the draco foundation and have adventures
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Nov 9, 2020 07:55
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