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The Question IRL posted:I can remember when Spider-Man fought a villain called Fusion who did the same thing. Broke his neck at the end of the issue. Technically Fusion only made Spider-Man think his neck was broken. Since the twist was that Fusion didn't actually have the combined powers of every Marvel character, he just had the power to make people react as if he did. Which is actually something you'd think would get used more in comics. Which can get almost as bad as Shonen Manga in how villains explain what their powers do, and thus how to beat them, instead of lying to the hero about what they do.
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Nov 11, 2020 23:21
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Skwirl posted:I'll second that Taskmaster is good. Yeah, they were set to go on sale on April 1, which turned out to be the first No New Comic Books Day.
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Nov 11, 2020 23:27
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Lord_Hambrose posted:Remember, when Hulk died in Civil War 2 (?) it was at a point where nobody gave a poo poo about him at all and his book had just ended anyway. He was brought back as a zombie by the Hand in the very next storyline! Bruce Banner got shot and 'died' in Civil War II #3, the same month Totally Awesome Hulk had its eighth issue come out. Totally Awesome Hulk ran for another fifteen issues under that title, before getting switched over to "Incredible Hulk" for Marvel Legacy and ran under that name for another ten issues. By that point, Immortal Hulk had already been around for six months. It's not like there was a lack of interest in publishing Hulk-related comics, Jennifer Walters had her own Hulk/She-Hulk book for that whole span too. Also I might be completely mistaken here, but given that everyone was up in arms about how Doc Samson was "back for the dead with zero explanation" in Civil War II and the same event killed/nearly killed both Bruce Banner and Jennifer Walters, and Al Ewing was involved with the Civil War II storyline, part of the Avengers writing team that brought back Hulk as a hand assassin and then more or less inexplicably in Avengers: No Surrender, there might have actually been some forethought involved with this outside of "nobody gave a poo poo about Hulk and his book had just ended*"
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Nov 11, 2020 23:37
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Vulpes Vulpes posted:Yeah, they were set to go on sale on April 1, which turned out to be the first No New Comic Books Day. Sucks about the delay, but you've got two books a month coming out now with the new Black Cat, that's pretty cool. I mentioned to my comic book store guy that we're on the same forum and he likes you.
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Nov 11, 2020 23:39
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Nilbop posted:So I just wanted to ask; do people actual like this "Kindred" story? I decided to hop on the last handful of issues of Amazing Spider-Man to get a feel for it and ... this is bad. This is like embarassingly bad. This is the kind of wrote, cliche-filled, retrodden forgotteable story that pushes me away from comics. Except with this story it's been presented as this significant moment, given it's lead-up and placement? I mean you are jumping in at the end of a story that's been building for like 2 years now. And it's clearly going to end in something being done in relation to the most hated Spider-Man story ever, most likely undoing it, and people are also excited for that possibility.
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Nov 11, 2020 23:49
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So that's a yes on liking it then? Or are people just putting up with whatever it takes to undo OMD? For what it's worth my problem isn't that I'm looking at a story and going "Wow, there's so many references here I don't understand!" It's that what I'm reading feels both really uninventive and lazy, and the prose has me cringing. I really don't feel that reading more of the writing is going to somehow improve the quality of it.
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Nov 12, 2020 00:03
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I'll start buying Spider-Man in floppies again when he's married again.
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Nov 12, 2020 00:05
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Nilbop posted:So I just wanted to ask; do people actual like this "Kindred" story? I decided to hop on the last handful of issues of Amazing Spider-Man to get a feel for it and ... this is bad. This is like embarassingly bad. This is the kind of wrote, cliche-filled, retrodden forgotteable story that pushes me away from comics. Except with this story it's been presented as this significant moment, given it's lead-up and placement? It's been so long since Kindred was first teased that I just want to see were this is going; I'm just tired of the whole thing and just want to see the result.
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Nov 12, 2020 00:38
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radlum posted:It's been so long since Kindred was first teased that I just want to see were this is going; I'm just tired of the whole thing and just want to see the result. Aside from a few brief moments during the J. Michael Straczynski years this has been Spider-Man since the Clone Saga.
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Nov 12, 2020 00:43
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god I just don't loving care about the marriage at all and even if I did I'd still find this long elaborate thing just to undo a retcon instead of...having them just get married again to be baffling nonsense.
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Nov 12, 2020 01:09
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Edge & Christian posted:There might have actually been some forethought involved with this outside of "nobody gave a poo poo about Hulk and his book had just ended*" Maybe, but I don't think so. Hulk books don't typically do great, and Immortal Hulk being a huge outlier is pretty interesting. Al Ewing is a great writer but I think much like Fractions Hawkeye it is a surprise smash hit the higher ups can't meddle with into oblivion like most books. Nilbop posted:Kindred bad.  Nick Spencer is a guy who produces like 75 percent great books, 25 percent trash. I like this Spider-Man run for the most part, but 50 issues of build up for Kindred is just a huge whiff. A Spooky Centipede-Man could be fine but the big reveal of being the most obvious established character is kinda whatever. Definitely not worth the build up in any way. I think Absolute Carnage is where this run really lost me, but I stick around for the bits that remind me of Superior Foes.
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Nov 12, 2020 01:57
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Lord_Hambrose posted:
I think you have your ratio way the gently caress out of wack. Superior Foes was good, but almost everything else he's written before Spider-Man has been trash. And "What if Captain America was a Nazi" was him which loses whatever loving good will he might have had for Superior foes.
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Nov 12, 2020 02:05
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Spencer’s ASM has been really good overall (a lot better than his Cap/Secret Empire stuff, yeesh), but I completely agree that these last few issues have been pretty boring. It’s odd that the centerpiece that the run has been building to is a big whiff so far, while I just want more Lizard as Peter’s prof, Boomerang, etc.
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Nov 12, 2020 02:45
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Lord_Hambrose posted:Maybe, but I don't think so. Hulk books don't typically do great, and Immortal Hulk being a huge outlier is pretty interesting. Al Ewing is a great writer but I think much like Fractions Hawkeye it is a surprise smash hit the higher ups can't meddle with into oblivion like most books. Looking through interviews it's unlikely the Doc Samson thing was explicitly laying down the seeds for Immortal Hulk, but here's a quote from Ewing from March 2018, about No Surrender: quote:This is something that's been brewing for a while - the last time I was in the Marvel "writer's room," way back at the start of last year, we were talking about the Hulk. and I pitched the idea that he was resurrecting so often because that's just what he does. Like, we don't need a MacGuffin or magic or Hydra science every time - he just comes back. That's what he does. That's what he is. The start of 'last year' would have been January 2017, which to take him at his word is after Hulk died in Civil War II but probably where they were mapping out how to return him, a year and a half before Immortal Hulk #1. I'm not saying that Immortal Hulk isn't an outlier in terms of sales or quality, but I don't think it's some sort of secret thing that Al Ewing had to sneak past editorial, for them to publish a Hulk book, something they've consistently done every single month for over fifty years. It's not an obscure character you have to fight or cajole them into getting a series out.
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Nov 12, 2020 03:16
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Skwirl posted:I think you have your ratio way the gently caress out of wack. Superior Foes was good, but almost everything else he's written before Spider-Man has been trash. And "What if Captain America was a Nazi" was him which loses whatever loving good will he might have had for Superior foes. I liked Nazi Cap when it was in his solo series, but Secret Empire was the worst poo poo I have ever read. Spencers misses are always huge. Edge & Christian posted:Marvel was publishing *two* Hulk books in the time period that you were saying they weren't publishing any, and Al Ewing was very explicitly planting seeds for the Immortal Hulk in Avengers: No Surrender six months before Immortal Hulk launched. Publishing a title from sheer momentum is like the cornerstone of comics for sure. Absolutely, I suppose you can consider the widely unpopular Totally Awesome Hulk book as a Hulk book. My favorite Hulk run stars Hercules so that is fair. Hulk in this era can't be described as memorable however. Bruce Banners death was the first one I remember at my store with no reaction either positive or negative. Just... Nothing... I definitely agree that Avengers:No Surrender set up Immortal Hulk but I really don't think anything before that point is meaningful. I am glad Al Ewing was giving the chance to do all this, easily cementing him in my top two current writers along with Tom Taylor. drat, I actually want to reread No Surrender. It is pretty much what I wish the Avengers was like all the time.
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Nov 12, 2020 03:29
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I think editorial knew Immortal Hulk was going to be a hit. They’re not going to spend Alex Ross money on middling books.
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Nov 12, 2020 03:36
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Lord_Hambrose posted:Publishing a title from sheer momentum is like the cornerstone of comics for sure. Absolutely, I suppose you can consider the widely unpopular Totally Awesome Hulk book as a Hulk book. My favorite Hulk run stars Hercules so that is fair. Hulk in this era can't be described as memorable however. Bruce Banners death was the first one I remember at my store with no reaction either positive or negative. Just... Nothing... Lord_Hambrose posted:Oh definitely could see him dying at any moment. The important bit of event writing is trying to find a character people recognize to kill off who is popular enough to make people feel something but not so popular that they can support their own title. Again, I am not denying that Immortal Hulk is a great, breakout book. I am not saying that Totally Awesome Hulk set the world on fire saleswise but calling it a "widely unpopular" book based on... I guess what folks say when they pick up their pull list at a single comic shop? ... is not exactly market analysis. Saying "they ended the Hulk book because Hulk couldn't support his own book" is just factually wrong short of a deep state conspiracy to deliberately put out lovely Amadeus Cho and Jen Walters books designed to lose money and be widely unpopular in order to... ? Or is it that they publish Hulk books out of inertia even though they're bad and unsuccessful, but certain runs don't count because of unspecified reasons, possibly down to shop talk? I suppose you could use the "well they replaced Bruce Banner as the Hulk because no one cared", but given how many legacy heroes get replaced periodically (and given that it was also the same 'era' that they were in the midst of replacing Captain America, Thor, Iron Man, Wolverine, etc with 'new heroes' that premise is awfully thin. It's wonderful when creative and financial success overlap, but they are two separate things and it feels like we're conflating the two. Technically speaking, based on sales nobody gave a poo poo about Superior Foes of Spider-Man; the most generic X-Men books that came out in the past decade, just truly awful ones, empirically sold more copies and had more people reading them than dozens of books that I have loved. Totally Awesome Hulk didn't do big numbers but it also did roughly the same sales (by some metrics better) than any of the post-WWH Incredible Herc stuff by the exact same author. I agree one was more enjoyable than the other, but that's my opinion and your opinion, not some sort of barometer for how it sold. Edge & Christian fucked around with this message at 04:07 on Nov 12, 2020 |
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Nov 12, 2020 04:02
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Taskmaster 1 really was rad. Are we back to his skull mask being his actual face again?
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Nov 12, 2020 15:36
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Edge & Christian posted:It's wonderful when creative and financial success overlap, but they are two separate things and it feels like we're conflating the two. Technically speaking, based on sales nobody gave a poo poo about Superior Foes of Spider-Man; the most generic X-Men books that came out in the past decade, just truly awful ones, empirically sold more copies and had more people reading them than dozens of books that I have loved. Totally Awesome Hulk didn't do big numbers but it also did roughly the same sales (by some metrics better) than any of the post-WWH Incredible Herc stuff by the exact same author. I agree one was more enjoyable than the other, but that's my opinion and your opinion, not some sort of barometer for how it sold. Oh you are definitely right. All my opinions and criticisms are pretty strongly rooted in how my customers react to things, and really more tied to how many copies I managed to personally sell than perhaps the overall market. Conflating quality and sales is the easiest thing to do in this industry. Based on sales, one of the best books our right now is Death Metal at my store. Based on people's reactions they mostly think it is either kinda fun and cute or they just buy it without even liking it because it is the big DC thing at the moment. I think that is is just two creators I like continuing their Justice League run that way overstayed it's welcome. People are also super into the current Venom and Thor runs, so they are my two best selling Marvel titles at the moment. Are they good? I like them fine but Venom has teetered on the brink of losing me since Absolute Carnage, and Thor is great if you have never read the original Galactus story I guess. Loved the two following issues though. Does King in Black being pushed so hard with so many minis and one shots make sense creatively? Oh God no. Squirrel Girl, Unstoppable Wasp, and Ms Marvel are all books that I have loved and pushed to customers but ultimately sold like absolute dogshit (Ms Marvel sells a bit better, so just badly). Luckily they were actually good so they sell decently in the 12 dollar GN format so ultimately I guess I was right all along? Way more staying power than nearly any other Marvel or DC title from the same time period.
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Nov 12, 2020 15:44
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BrianWilly posted:I think most readers wish that Knull was just, in fact, A Big Venom. This reminds me of the Marvel Heroic Roleplaying Exiles game I ran in TradGames, where the players had to take on a Frightful Four that had Giant-Venom as a member (the symbiote had taken over Hank Pym's dying body and used Pym Particles to stay alive forever and also be a skyscraper-sized slimy blob). The other members were Scarlet Spider (a crazed adult Normie Osborn), Wolverine (corrupted by Loki to just be mustache-twirling evil), and led by USAgent with a Celestial Death Seed in him. Never hire me, Marvel.
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Nov 12, 2020 20:43
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Tensokuu posted:Taskmaster 1 really was rad. He says it's a costume in the book.
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Nov 12, 2020 20:47
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If I'm planning to read Infinity Gauntlet for the first time, what are the recommended tie-in issues? It looks like the omnibus includes 12-13 Silver Surfer issues, 6 Doctor Strange, a few Hulk, and some other assorted series. The reading order on Comic Book Herald is 50-60 issues long and seems to include more issues mainly from the lead in and follow up to the main limited series. With modern events I can usually get a feel for what tie-ins are worthwhile based on who wrote them, but I'm not sure what was going on back in the early 90s and I dunno if most of these have important story points or if they're ancillary.
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Nov 12, 2020 21:07
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Dunbar posted:If I'm planning to read Infinity Gauntlet for the first time, what are the recommended tie-in issues? It looks like the omnibus includes 12-13 Silver Surfer issues, 6 Doctor Strange, a few Hulk, and some other assorted series. The reading order on Comic Book Herald is 50-60 issues long and seems to include more issues mainly from the lead in and follow up to the main limited series. With modern events I can usually get a feel for what tie-ins are worthwhile based on who wrote them, but I'm not sure what was going on back in the early 90s and I dunno if most of these have important story points or if they're ancillary. The Silver Surfer issues help flesh out a lot, especially the relationship between Warlock, Thanos, and the Surfer. I can't remember much of the Dr. Strange stuff, but the Hulk issues were fun and deal with him being Tiny Hulk. They're not really important to the overall story, though. You also want to read Thanos Quest before Infinity Gauntlet.
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Nov 12, 2020 21:17
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Dunbar posted:If I'm planning to read Infinity Gauntlet for the first time, what are the recommended tie-in issues? It looks like the omnibus includes 12-13 Silver Surfer issues, 6 Doctor Strange, a few Hulk, and some other assorted series. The reading order on Comic Book Herald is 50-60 issues long and seems to include more issues mainly from the lead in and follow up to the main limited series. With modern events I can usually get a feel for what tie-ins are worthwhile based on who wrote them, but I'm not sure what was going on back in the early 90s and I dunno if most of these have important story points or if they're ancillary. It's honestly pretty self contained if I'm remembering right. The Surfer tie ins are probably the most meaningful but are ultimately about his emotional state, Dr Strange has a fight with the Silver Dagger while Adam Warlock exists nearby, the Hulk is him getting teleported to a fight with Thanos and then getting teleported back to earth but tiny. There's a ton of like Crisis On Infinite Earth style "tie ins" that are just like Spider-Man going "what's going on??" with an asterisk leading to an editor's note that says "see Infinity Gauntlet #4, natch!"
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Nov 12, 2020 21:20
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When I read it I think I just read Thanos Quest and then Infinity Gauntlet without any tie-ins and I never felt lost.
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Nov 12, 2020 21:24
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Dunbar posted:If I'm planning to read Infinity Gauntlet for the first time, what are the recommended tie-in issues? It looks like the omnibus includes 12-13 Silver Surfer issues, 6 Doctor Strange, a few Hulk, and some other assorted series. The reading order on Comic Book Herald is 50-60 issues long and seems to include more issues mainly from the lead in and follow up to the main limited series. With modern events I can usually get a feel for what tie-ins are worthwhile based on who wrote them, but I'm not sure what was going on back in the early 90s and I dunno if most of these have important story points or if they're ancillary.
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Nov 12, 2020 21:26
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the pre thanos quest silver surfer issues are the actual intro issues to the plot to the whole story and you should read them but iirc after thanos quest a bunch of the "tie in" issues are him bumbling around while thanos laughs from his throne for a couple panels. Unfortunately I cannot tell you off the top of my head which ones those are lol fwiw, this is the list of comic in the arc that i kept, presumably i culled the ones i thought were unnecessary 
site fucked around with this message at 22:17 on Nov 12, 2020 |
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Nov 12, 2020 22:11
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I guess if you ever wanted an hc of something now might be the time to check with your lcs https://twitter.com/chrisarrant/status/1327016568027566080?s=19
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Nov 12, 2020 23:35
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Tensokuu posted:Taskmaster 1 really was rad. I...don't think it's ever been his face?
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Nov 13, 2020 00:31
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site posted:I guess if you ever wanted an hc of something now might be the time to check with your lcs These sales happen a lot and all the good stuff gets cleaned out on day 1. Once retailers pick it over it gets pallet sold to overstock stores like Ollie's and Big Lots.
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Nov 13, 2020 05:49
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Nilbop posted:So I just wanted to ask; do people actual like this "Kindred" story? I decided to hop on the last handful of issues of Amazing Spider-Man to get a feel for it and ... this is bad. This is like embarassingly bad. This is the kind of wrote, cliche-filled, retrodden forgotteable story that pushes me away from comics. Except with this story it's been presented as this significant moment, given it's lead-up and placement? Everything Ottley and Spencer have done together with Spider-Man has been gold to me, and I love it all unconditionally. They're everything I want Spidey to be, which is why I'm pissed Ottley's done.
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Nov 13, 2020 06:13
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Blockhouse posted:I...don't think it's ever been his face? In one of Taskmasters early appearances where he is fighting Dardevil, he makes a comment about how he thinks that he's wearing a mask. Then when he checks with his radar sense he's like "he's had plastic surgery multiple times." Also I remember reading somewhere that his creators (I think that was David Micheline ) intended for him to have a skull face because of his photographic reflexes. Like "I remember things real good. And now all my skin has fallen off."
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Nov 13, 2020 12:55
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Red posted:Everything Ottley and Spencer have done together with Spider-Man has been gold to me, and I love it all unconditionally. They're everything I want Spidey to be, which is why I'm pissed Ottley's done. Agreed, but Gleason is absolutely rising to the occasion.
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Nov 13, 2020 13:02
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Man, I wish I had used "Knull Kill Krew" for something (though it does make an unfortunate acronym).
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Nov 13, 2020 14:01
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Vulpes Vulpes posted:Man, I wish I had used "Knull Kill Krew" for something (though it does make an unfortunate acronym). At least you have what is quite possibly the best caption of 2020.  Allessandro Vitti draws great skull face. [Speech bubble erased to preserve reveal.]
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Nov 13, 2020 14:50
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The Question IRL posted:In one of Taskmasters early appearances where he is fighting Dardevil, he makes a comment about how he thinks that he's wearing a mask. Then when he checks with his radar sense he's like "he's had plastic surgery multiple times." What if this really happened in real life? For everything you remember you lose some skin. What a weird idea for an explanation for it.
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Nov 13, 2020 15:32
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Metalshark posted:At least you have what is quite possibly the best caption of 2020. This was my panel of the year, easy
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Nov 13, 2020 15:40
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Alessandro's "only in comics would this work" expressive skulls are the best in the biz. Edit: here's some examples https://twitter.com/jedmackay/status/1316015266669588488?s=19 Vulpes Vulpes fucked around with this message at 15:57 on Nov 13, 2020 |
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Nov 13, 2020 15:48
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The Question IRL posted:
I get it if it's supposed to be like a trade-off thing but that's a weird cause and effect.
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Nov 13, 2020 15:49
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The Question IRL posted:In one of Taskmasters early appearances where he is fighting Dardevil, he makes a comment about how he thinks that he's wearing a mask. Then when he checks with his radar sense he's like "he's had plastic surgery multiple times."  Also Taskmaster very clearly was drawn to be wearing a skeleton-themed mask (not even like a mask shaped like a skull, like a Spider-Man style cloth mask with skull painting on it) for most of his early appearances, so I'm not sure how that lines up with his creators wanting him to have an actual skull face, unless it was meant to be a long-term reveal, that under his skull mask is an actual skull face? Looking it up, I think the aforementioned Daredevil arc (292-293) was the first time he's drawn to have it even hypothetically be "an actual skull face", every other artist prior to that may have slightly tweaked the style of the cloth mask (to be more stylized or realistic in his skeleton print design) but it's clearly not a man with no flesh/muscles on his face.
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Nov 13, 2020 16:48
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