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ronya posted:I am a little skeptical - the usual suspects in the press have been angling for "blame Europe for the deal" for a while now but I don't know that this will actually stick Really, Starmer should go hard in on "They've had literally years to get a deal sorted out, but they're too lazy to do any of the work" the moment there's the faintest hint of trouble. I doubt he will, though. Or he'll find some more left-wing Jews to boot out of the party [edit] 34 is the number of members of the party who'll be left if Steith Kramer remains Labour leader until the next scheduled General Election kingturnip fucked around with this message at 17:33 on Dec 6, 2020 |
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Dec 6, 2020 17:30
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ronya posted:I am a little skeptical - the usual suspects in the press have been angling for "blame Europe for the deal" for a while now but I don't know that this will actually stick Oh doubtlessly they'll blame the EU, but it's unavoidable that the problems will be because of Brexit not going like the platonic form they had envisioned and some will change their minds because of it.
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Dec 6, 2020 17:30
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Comrade Fakename posted:I love that the government are running TV ads compelling businesses to prepare for the transition at the end of the month, but with no deal signed we have no idea what we’re transitioning into, and it’s impossible to prepare. in practice this becomes 'move as much of your poo poo out of the UK as humanly possible while you still can' (or at least that's how my company has taken it) this is good for Britain because
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Dec 6, 2020 17:38
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kingturnip posted:Really, Starmer should go hard in on "They've had literally years to get a deal sorted out, but they're too lazy to do any of the work" the moment there's the faintest hint of trouble. the tories could point to covid though and im sure the eu-wide covid-related recession will provide some cover next year
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Dec 6, 2020 17:38
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namesake posted:Leavers keep not changing their mind because everything that has happened has happened on tv. The various international connections that impact their lives will only become apparent once severed, even if it's lovely bourgie concerns like they can't get European labour for cheap any more. I think the tweet guy is right about two things: - Remainers did keep saying "ok but this time they'll surely realise their folly" at every key event along the way - Whatever happens in January and thereafter, I don't think most leavers will "turn against Brexit", i.e. get angry about Brexit itself, and regret their choice But I think he's wrong to characterise the upcoming end of the transition period as just another key event along the way. It is the culmination of the whole project, the effective implementation of the UK leaving the EU. It is different in nature and in scale from any milestone we've seen so far. This is the one where it's reasonable to say "it's different". But as I say, I don't think it'll make much difference to people's views. Nothing short of a line item on people's payslips called "Economic cost of Brexit deduction" would do that, and even then they'd blame the EU.
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Dec 6, 2020 17:43
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i always suspected corbyn was a secret millwall fan
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Dec 6, 2020 17:46
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Ms Adequate posted:It is an interesting constitutional question about what happens if a part of an existing country wants to join the US and how that would work. I uh, I don't think Scotland would be super eager for that path though. That's happened at least twice already. The first time, a bunch of Americans immigrated to Texas, which was part of Mexico at the time. They then rebelled, declared a republic, and joined the US. This also led to us stealing about half of Mexico's land. The other time I can think of is when we couped the government of Hawaii on behalf of the fruit companies, and then just annexed it. Anyways, if Scotland wants to join a country, it should join Canada, so that Nova Scotia and Scotia can be united at last.
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Dec 6, 2020 17:52
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ronya posted:I am a little skeptical - the usual suspects in the press have been angling for "blame Europe for the deal" for a while now but I don't know that this will actually stick See the thing is that when it is clear its a loving poo poo show the press can try that but there is a much easier target for them. They can blame boris for not extending teh transition period and claiming he had an "oven ready deal".
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Dec 6, 2020 17:55
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namesake posted:Leavers keep not changing their mind because everything that has happened has happened on tv. The various international connections that impact their lives will only become apparent once severed, even if it's lovely bourgie concerns like they can't get European labour for cheap any more. maybe but if I'm not particularly confident that the general public will suddenly start correctly identifying the causes of poo poo that's going wrong on the 1st of January look at what's happened with covid and bojo is still polling 40+%
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Dec 6, 2020 18:02
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Even if people connect the dots between the economic effects of Brexit and Brexit itself, we're in an age of near-total political impunity so absolutely poo poo-all will happen about it
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Dec 6, 2020 18:12
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Jedit posted:Let's also not forget that in the movie the actress who played her spying on Harry in the bath was 35 years old at the time. gross although the least problematic issue, considering. i ended up following the dude who played oliver wood on twitter somehow, probably because he made funny political posts for a while, and he was (rightfully) always going off on middle-aged women who would write overtly sexual posts about the character he played and he'd be like THAT IS A SEVENTEEN YEAR OLD BOY JFC Vigil for Virgil posted:Totalitarian vegetables? "Jeremy Corbyn found growing carrots in his allotment, a favourite vegetable of Hitler." mediaphage fucked around with this message at 18:15 on Dec 6, 2020 |
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Dec 6, 2020 18:12
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Jeff the Mediocre posted:That's happened at least twice already. The first time, a bunch of Americans immigrated to Texas, which was part of Mexico at the time. They then rebelled, declared a republic, and joined the US. This also led to us stealing about half of Mexico's land. Didn't Scotland and Canada used to be joined up geologically on the continent of Laurentia while the rest of Britain was on Gondwanaland? Brexit chat: The story absorbed by the public is that it is the EU's fault because they are 'playing hardball' with us. I've even had friends who voted remain say that. Why UK should be able to play hardball but the EU shouldn't is never explained.
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Dec 6, 2020 18:22
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I don’t think many Leavers will turn against Brexit. They are so wedded to the idea that to admit they were wrong is much harder than blaming many of the semi-plausible alternatives, most of which are being shovelled their way in large quantities by the RW press.
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Dec 6, 2020 18:36
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mediaphage posted:i ended up following the dude who played oliver wood on twitter somehow, probably because he made funny political posts for a while, and he was (rightfully) always going off on middle-aged women who would write overtly sexual posts about the character he played and he'd be like THAT IS A SEVENTEEN YEAR OLD BOY JFC Dude's name is "biggerstaff" iirc though so what do you expect?
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Dec 6, 2020 18:37
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sebzilla posted:Dude's name is "biggerstaff" iirc though so what do you expect? honestly? not to sexualize children
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Dec 6, 2020 18:39
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therattle posted:I don’t think many Leavers will turn against Brexit. They are so wedded to the idea that to admit they were wrong is much harder than blaming many of the semi-plausible alternatives, most of which are being shovelled their way in large quantities by the RW press. i agree which is again why i think people will turn on boris. He's already not popular even if the tories are and if we have food shortages while the pandemic is still happening because he didn't extend the transition its easy to blame him and is a really easy talking point. "There was a pandemic going on which was causing chaos and he could've slowed brexit down until the pandemic was under control" except he clearly assumed it wouldn't be an issue so didn't despite when that decision was made. It was his decision and his decision alone. The press don't want to take responsibility for something that is largely their creation
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Dec 6, 2020 18:42
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That still requires them to get over the hurdle of acknowledging a problem instead of jumping straight to "if it's my time to starve to death for the country then it's my time" which is more than I expect of the loving mouthbreather contingent in this hell country.
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Dec 6, 2020 18:44
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The disparity between domestic and overseas BBC reporting is pretty funny sometimes. An MSP gets caught breaking lockdown: "MSP loses party whip following public furore". An eastern european MEP gets caught going to a sex party breaking lockdown rules and gets kicked out of the party for it? quote:But that icy dismissal of Mr Szajer has an echo about it of how politically troublesome or embarrassing figures in the Soviet era could suddenly become "non-persons". And indeed that may now be Mr Szajer's fate. SOVIET PURGE
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Dec 6, 2020 19:09
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OwlFancier posted:That still requires them to get over the hurdle of acknowledging a problem instead of jumping straight to "if it's my time to starve to death for the country then it's my time" which is more than I expect of the loving mouthbreather contingent in this hell country. Bobstar posted:Remainers did keep saying "ok but this time they'll surely realise their folly" at every key event along the way The amount of times Leave broke the law or lied, they knew that by the time any court judgements came round, their message would already be out there and it'd be too late for the slap on the wrist to mean anything. Just look at how long it took the electoral commission to say Leave.eu broke funding law, and what happened? gently caress all. Since then it's been a free for all on neocon maniacs operating on the principle that it's easier to ask for forgiveness than to ask for permission. Except they don't ask for forgiveness, they take five years off politics and then some oval office gives them a book deal and a seat in the lords.
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Dec 6, 2020 19:11
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But the converse is that if remain had made those same choices... what could they have argued? How could they have lied to peple to make them change 40 years of embedded propaganda about how the EU is to blame for everything?
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Dec 6, 2020 19:27
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thespaceinvader posted:But the converse is that if remain had made those same choices... what could they have argued? How could they have lied to peple to make them change 40 years of embedded propaganda about how the EU is to blame for everything? They shouldn’t have lied (and didn’t need to) but led a signally bad campaign based on fear and negativity to people who didn’t t think they had much to lose anyway. The positive case for the EU (flawed as it is) was never forcefully advanced
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Dec 6, 2020 19:42
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There isn't a positive case for the EU though. The EU wasn't offering anything new, it was entirely about losing access to things that at the time the UK had access to. I suppose the government, if it wanted to, could have said they would spend more money if remain won, but the question then becomes why not spend it anyway? Also lol @ cameron spending money. OwlFancier fucked around with this message at 19:47 on Dec 6, 2020 |
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Dec 6, 2020 19:44
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Update on my electrics situation. Three sockets had a loose neutral and one which was downstairs behind the heaviest cabinets and our entire covid/brexit food store had fused and burnt out as live /neutral had come loose and touched. Fun.
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Dec 6, 2020 20:02
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At least it didn't burn your house down?
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Dec 6, 2020 20:03
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Regarde Aduck posted:Depends how 'turning on brexit' it defined. I don't think people are going to be happy with how Brexit turns out. But I have no idea if anyone even remotely to blame is going to take the brunt of the ire. Brexit the idea isn't the same thing as Brexit, the thing that's about to happen. Brexit cannot fail, Brexit can only be failed. Any economic damage we suffer will be painted as a consequence of not Brexiting hard enough
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Dec 6, 2020 20:09
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I think they'll just blame whoever the papers tell them to blame tbh. So immigrants, the EU and the Left most likely.
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Dec 6, 2020 20:17
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thespaceinvader posted:But the converse is that if remain had made those same choices... what could they have argued? How could they have lied to peple to make them change 40 years of embedded propaganda about how the EU is to blame for everything? My point is that remain were very much taking a smug moral superiority and assuming that remain was so obviously right that they didn't need to try hard to argue for it. Somewhere between Michelle Obama's 'when they go low we go high' and a political cinderella complex, where they believed they'd win just by sitting there and being virtuous against an overwhelmingly funded political and media machine.
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Dec 6, 2020 20:33
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Bobby Deluxe posted:Somewhere between Michelle Obama's 'when they go low we go high' and a political cinderella complex, where they believed they'd win just by sitting there and being virtuous against an overwhelmingly funded political and media machine. Ah, this is where Keith Stairmaster got his political philosophy from.
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Dec 6, 2020 20:38
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OwlFancier posted:There isn't a positive case for the EU though. The EU wasn't offering anything new, it was entirely about losing access to things that at the time the UK had access to. I guess this is why, generally, governments don't call referenda on changing the status quo when they support the status quo. Like, it's normally to show "public support" for something they want to change. Then again, PF Cameron called/allowed 3 on subjects where he supported the status quo, so I guess he thought he was on a roll.
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Dec 6, 2020 20:39
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Gonzo McFee posted:I think they'll just blame whoever the papers tell them to blame tbh. So immigrants, the EU and the Left most likely. This. Papers have been stirring up immigrant hatred for yonks, they don't need to keep to the same story to continue, they just adapt. So far its Gammon 'too many bloomin foreigners over here' groupthink. But once the food supply is threatened, and farms are falling all over the place as no one will work for them, the newspapers will blame the EU in a vague way like how the EU is preventing workers from coming over to punish the UK for reclaiming back freedom and sovereignty. Then the Gammons will be 'bloomin foreigners think they are too good not wanting to work for us'.
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Dec 6, 2020 20:41
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any consequences of Brexit will be blamed on the EU punishing us for daring to leave
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Dec 6, 2020 20:43
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Private Speech posted:The disparity between domestic and overseas BBC reporting is pretty funny sometimes. the MP is a fascist who's being expelled and ignored for having sex with men, not breaking lockdown yeah it's pretty bog-standard balkanism to pretend that any criticism of any individual is a totalitarian attack on democracy, but it is a totalitarian dictatorship and the guy is a fascist so this is a stopped clock moment imo
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Dec 6, 2020 20:44
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Julio Cruz posted:any consequences of Brexit will be blamed on the EU punishing us for daring to leave Yep, this will be the common right-wing media theme throughout 2021.
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Dec 6, 2020 20:59
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OwlFancier posted:At least it didn't burn your house down? Yeah really. The rcd did its job. It's going to be really interesting seeing any physical effects of brexit and how the public and press react to it. The games industry is not going to get any knock on effects for a while as we're almost entirely moving to remote work. We've got people working on our team from Canada to India now and have new hires coming in from everywhere. Core hours are being removed entirely, overtime is gone and we're basically moving to a "we don't care when you work or how you work as long as you do your tasks and are available if someone needs you" Some people in the thread are saying their businesses are moving everything out of the UK. What does that entail? Physical offices? Assets? Manufacturing? Just where the business is registered? Most of our contracts are in USD so there's not much to move. I'm just hoping medical doesn't take a big a hit as we fear. I can always put my partner on a plane to the Netherlands or Germany if we run out of insulin but I don't think many have that option.
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Dec 6, 2020 21:26
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Mebh posted:"we don't care when you work or how you work as long as you do your tasks and are available if someone needs you" This is, IMO, the best way to work, and I hope it sees adoption elsewhere.
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Dec 6, 2020 21:31
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OwlFancier posted:This is, IMO, the best way to work, and I hope it sees adoption elsewhere. Yeah morale is super high and everyone is getting more work done. They dismantled the back end for the the clock in clock out system and made it optional/local if you want a way to track your own hours. More companies need to do this. They're also looking at entirely dismantling the work week structure. Should be an interesting year next year.
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Dec 6, 2020 21:36
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OwlFancier posted:This is, IMO, the best way to work, and I hope it sees adoption elsewhere. Which he generally does after finishing whatever he's doing on Destiny 2.
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Dec 6, 2020 21:54
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I used to have a boss that was like that, he would say to me: "You know what has to be done and you know the deadlines, I don't care if you go and sit on a beach in the Bahamas as long as you get it done." It was good. The department really buzzed, people would do loads of unpaid overtime, come in on weekends off their own bat, but then if they were 'between projects' or wanted to get off early for some reason, they could without asking. (NB this was BEFORE internet, emails, smart phones. Ah the days of the pager.... )
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Dec 6, 2020 21:54
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Sounds like fishing has been sorted in the Brexit deal, just the tiny issue of who has power over legal disputes to go.
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Dec 6, 2020 21:55
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Mebh posted:we're basically moving to a "we don't care when you work or how you work as long as you do your tasks and are available if someone needs you" This is ok if you have a good home space to work in. This year has been a small first world version of hell for myself and a few others workwise. Started working from home in March, and it was great at first. Something different and exciting. But cabin fever definitely sets in. Am finding it hard to concentrate with the annoyances around me and from our connection to work. There is a garage opposite so car repair noises, the apartment upstairs has a kid jumping what seems like 10 hours a day (and always 9 jumps in a row at a time, still don't know why maybe its the width of the room), and kids in the near estate shouting at all hours of the day. Then for the last two hours of my shift, and every day of the week, the bloke opposite plays the same 10-15 songs at 'just about can hear' levels. 1960s crooner and folk songs, wouldn't mind if they were good ones. And then there is 3 second out of sync delay in everything with the connection to work from home. And work says the same as what you said 'we don't care as long as you do the minimum we expect'. Personally I would love to go back to the office atm.
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Dec 6, 2020 21:57
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