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Nodosaur posted:New Andorians are basically Andalites with mouths and no horse body Nice to see that circle has finally completed itself then  I wonder if Kathrine Applegate and Michael Grant watch Discovery?
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Dec 17, 2020 06:12
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Arc Light posted:It pretty much was canon in Enterprise. There was an episode where scientists find wreckage from First Contact's Borg sphere, and a drone reactivates and assimilates the scientists to kick off the rest of the plot. But that was always the prime timeline as well, presumably. At the end of the episode, the Borg give off a homing signal to the Delta Quadrant, with the implication that reinforcements wouldn’t arrive until the 24th Century. Wink wink.
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Dec 17, 2020 06:14
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HD DAD posted:But that was always the prime timeline as well, presumably. At the end of the episode, the Borg give off a homing signal to the Delta Quadrant, with the implication that reinforcements wouldn’t arrive until the 24th Century. Wink wink. Yeah they wrote it as a predestination paradox despite the show explicitly showing that they basically consider string theory settled science.
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Dec 17, 2020 06:20
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HD DAD posted:But that was always the prime timeline as well, presumably. At the end of the episode, the Borg give off a homing signal to the Delta Quadrant, with the implication that reinforcements wouldn’t arrive until the 24th Century. Wink wink. Yeah, Regeneration makes explicit what Q Who merely implied. The Borg were in fact headed directly to Earth, they knew about the Federation all along, and Q dropping the Enterprise off right in front of the cube's path ultimately saved humanity.
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Dec 17, 2020 06:20
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nine-gear crow posted:Yeah, Regeneration makes explicit what Q Who merely implied. The Borg were in fact headed directly to Earth, they knew about the Federation all along, and Q dropping the Enterprise off right in front of the cube's path ultimately saved humanity. Also, weren't the Hansons already studying the Borg by that point? Or was that after Q Who?
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Dec 17, 2020 06:37
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Cross-Section posted:Also, weren't the Hansons already studying the Borg by that point? Or was that after Q Who? The Raven departed for the Delta Quadrant in 2354, and Q Who takes place in 2365, so 11 years before the Enterprise-D encounters the Borg officially. The Borg were already probing the fringes of Romulan space in the Beta Quadrant at that point and Magnus Hansen was like "gently caress yeah, I'm gonna check that poo poo out", probably based on correlation between the rumors of biomechanical beings the Romulans were reporting and the data from the NX-01. The Raven snuck into the Neutral Zone under falsified registry data, found a cube in Romulan space, and then followed it back to the Delta Quadrant through the transwarp aperture it opened--probably even the same one seen in Romulan space in Picard.
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Dec 17, 2020 06:50
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Quick poll: who is the best Star Trek cat? Grudge or Spot? If there were any other cats in Star Trek I can't remember them. Also, don't say Porthos. Dogs don't belong on a spaceship. 
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Dec 17, 2020 08:15
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According to Brent Spiner, the cat(s) who played Spot were super difficult to work with.
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Dec 17, 2020 08:20
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DS9 needed more Chester
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Dec 17, 2020 08:36
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Carbon dioxide posted:Quick poll: who is the best Star Trek cat? Spot, because the cats playing Spot actually could play to type and come off as a standoffish cat that you gave the impression as to why it was a cat everybody except Data loathed. The cat playing Grudge is just too much of a sweetheart and every time someone's hamming up for a "oh god, this cat's a nightmare and I hate it" scene, the cat's just been contently relaxed wanting to be held and petted.
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Dec 17, 2020 08:41
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 - You have got to be kidding me with this upside-down negative intro, that's not what a loving mirror does! - Hooray for Space Hitler, she proved she was worth redemption by... torturing and breaking her daughter into murdering others and doing the bare minimum for a literal slave  - Oh hey, Discovery has an actual 1701-D-ish neck now apparently - Incredibly stupid Mirror bullshit aside, I didn't really have a problem with them using the Guardian in this manner. So gently caress the angry internet twitter crowd and Harlan Ellison's grumpy old corpse. - Oh man why the gently caress would any of these characters except for Burnham give a single poo poo about having some teary memorial drink for a giant fascist piece of poo poo who spent every encounter belittling and threatening them? These people should be celebrating the fact that she's off the ship for good. - Really glad we put the entire season arc on the backburner for a two-parter that only serves to set up a completely different show that no one actually wants to watch. Really glad, fine work there. For the love of god please get back to the interesting setting you specifically moved the entire show to this season.
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Dec 17, 2020 09:18
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The Golden Gael posted:If you think about it, it's almost like we're living on one of those Earth-like TOS planets where the society is completely hosed up because of technology gone awry. Only instead of Landru, we have Facebook.  Ah, alas if it were only this easy...
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Dec 17, 2020 09:46
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A.o.D. posted:I didn't have Cumberbatch's character's identity spoiled for me, but I also recall not being the list bit surprised when they made the big reveal during the movie. It was more heavily telegraphed than a documentary on Samuel Morse. Ironically also totally falling flat because the film itself doesn't provide you any context before (and barely any after) for why the name 'Khan' should mean anything to you.
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Dec 17, 2020 10:48
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Spoiler for this episode: Woof. They get 2 takes Frakes on this?
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Dec 17, 2020 12:05
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New episode spoiler "Let's all raise a toast to space Hitler! She may have slaughtered millions of innocents in an alternative universe, but she ended up the Empress of our Hearts!"
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Dec 17, 2020 12:35
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And then she became the new security chief on the Cerritos
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Dec 17, 2020 12:55
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Alchenar posted:Ironically also totally falling flat because the film itself doesn't provide you any context before (and barely any after) for why the name 'Khan' should mean anything to you. That's what pissed me off the most with that movie. It earned none of its story beats and as a result it made a mockery of the most emotional moments of WoK.
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Dec 17, 2020 13:08
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Azhais posted:And then she became the new security chief on the Cerritos LDS was good enough that I sincerely believe they could make this work
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Dec 17, 2020 14:49
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I enjoyed the two-parter and it was a nice close to the Mirror Universe which we will never ever see again. EDIT: Can't wait to see her walk out onto the Promenade and Quark will be there to greet her and then Sisko will fly out of the wormhole. Thom12255 fucked around with this message at 16:16 on Dec 17, 2020 |
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Dec 17, 2020 16:11
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Georgiou returns to the mirror universe in the new series, finds out the empire has fallen to rampaging Battle Kelpiens Kelpiens also caused the Burn apparently it's Kelpiens, all the way down
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Dec 17, 2020 16:38
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The Golden Gael posted:If you think about it, it's almost like we're living on one of those Earth-like TOS planets where the society is completely hosed up because of technology gone awry. Only instead of Landru, we have Facebook. ...gently caress
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Dec 17, 2020 16:43
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Big Mean Jerk posted:
You're going to flip your poo poo when you realize the mirror universe isn't literally a mirror either!  Let's be pedantic weirdos and complain about nothing!
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Dec 17, 2020 17:18
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sticklefifer posted:You're going to flip your poo poo when you realize the mirror universe isn't literally a mirror either! Nah, it was REALLY weak - literally just color-shifting/flipping the regular intro so everything was upside down. Epitome of  Whereas when Enterprise did the same thing, they created an intro that was about 8000 times cooler than the "Faaaaaaaaaith of the Heart" intro, and also made thematic sense (Enterprise's normal intro was about the peaceful progression of man into space, whereas this was about the warlike conquest with the same historical beats). Plus they actually created some original footage (such as the Mirror ships going into battle). https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sfbsZRbwbJ4 Lum_ fucked around with this message at 17:37 on Dec 17, 2020 |
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Dec 17, 2020 17:33
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I mean, screaming "Space Hitler" every thread is an easy way to dismiss the Emperor Georgiou thread in Disco, but really it's a nature versus nurture issue aka Grant Morrison Earth 2 issue. The base Terran nature of the Mirror universe is to give-in to the basest instincts every time. So, what happens when you take a Terran and put them in the exact opposite environment and let them live there? Is there anything more Star Trek than a lost soul being taught another way by the actions of Starfleet officers and crew? Kira and the Maquis crew in Voyager were literal terrorists and we had no problem watching them integrate to work with Starfleet moral standards. poo poo, TNG started the rehab of Klingons that continued for decades afterwards. I guess it all comes down to the viewer and how they view nature versus nurture. If someone truly wants to be rehabilitated, can they? We saw this in this exact episode with Georgiou selectively breaking Terran rules to attempt to rehabilitate Mirror Burnham. She changed what she could, but absent a concrete example of the positive effects of the change, Mirror Burnham simply fell back to nature and led to the expected result. I mean, you want a black-and-white moral story, I'm not sure that Star Trek will ever satisfy you. I'm actually surprised some completely wash over what came before to morally pontificate on the new stuff. The YouTube DS9 retrospective "What Came Before" has a perfect example of this type of attitude as they read fan letters sent to the DS9 staff. "Morally compromised" and "Not Trek!!!" were common phrases in those letters, and they were painful to hear knowing where DS9 went and where it sits in the fan's eyes today. Not saying that someone shouldn't be critical, more saying that some criticism is about as useful as blended gagh at a Klingon wedding. Ed. gently caress me, that was a rant. tl;dr: Georgiou redemption good, stop it with the purile Space Hitler criticism already. It's boring.
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Dec 17, 2020 17:39
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Brown Moses posted:New episode spoiler "Let's all raise a toast to space Hitler! She may have slaughtered millions of innocents in an alternative universe, but she ended up the Empress of our Hearts!" didn't georgiou literally eat a mirror version of a member of the bridge crew lol
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Dec 17, 2020 17:42
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Crimes don't count if they take place in a mirror universe, people  It's like being mad at a partner for cheating in a dream!!
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Dec 17, 2020 17:46
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Doctor Nutt posted:Yeah they wrote it as a predestination paradox despite the show explicitly showing that they basically consider string theory settled science. Can you elaborate on this? Only thing pulling up are a series of voyager novels, which seem to use cosmic strings like any magic space crystal or whatever, and in a roundabout way these novels serve as a justification for Janeway's "mood swings."
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Dec 17, 2020 17:53
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Khanstant posted:Can you elaborate on this? Only thing pulling up are a series of voyager novels, which seem to use cosmic strings like any magic space crystal or whatever, and in a roundabout way these novels serve as a justification for Janeway's "mood swings." In the TNG episode parallels, we are shown that in the Star Trek universe, every choice made creates an alternate parallel universe where another choice was made instead. Or at least, that's the impression I got. I fear based on context of your post I may have misunderstood the term string theory based on usage in popular culture. Regardless, predestination paradoxes don't really work for me in the same universe that has Parallels.
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Dec 17, 2020 18:05
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Lum_ posted:Nah, it was REALLY weak - literally just color-shifting/flipping the regular intro so everything was upside down. Epitome of Yeah I really liked the Enterprise mirror universe ep, it really knew what it was there for. Especially how the Terran Empire is badly run and nearing collapse from non-humans rising up, constant backstabbing is a bad way to run a group, and the awesome scene of a Constitution class ship mopping the floor with older models. Even the gorn was fun.
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Dec 17, 2020 18:12
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For all it's problems I flipped my poo poo when it was revealed that the dude was the loving Guardian of Forever! 
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Dec 17, 2020 18:52
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Michael needs to be louder, angrier and have access to a time machine. Whenever Michael's not on screen, all the other characters should be asking, "Where's Michael?" Then we should have a nice memorial for Hitler.
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Dec 17, 2020 18:52
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Doctor Nutt posted:In the TNG episode parallels, we are shown that in the Star Trek universe, every choice made creates an alternate parallel universe where another choice was made instead. Or at least, that's the impression I got. I fear based on context of your post I may have misunderstood the term string theory based on usage in popular culture. Regardless, predestination paradoxes don't really work for me in the same universe that has Parallels. That...has nothing to do with String Theory. String Theory is an attempt to put quantum field theory and general relativity in a unified geometrical framework. ashpanash fucked around with this message at 18:58 on Dec 17, 2020 |
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Dec 17, 2020 18:55
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Lum_ posted:Nah, it was REALLY weak - literally just color-shifting/flipping the regular intro so everything was upside down. Epitome of It's a title sequence. It doesn't need to be a whole new thing that they completely remade from scratch. Fringe did the same thing for its parallel universe episodes and it was fun, so at worst it's not a particularly original concept. But it's silly to list it as a standout complaint because it's "not what a mirror does". The show has flaws, but I swear people intentionally scour for ways to find more.
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Dec 17, 2020 19:43
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I’ve been one of the few defending this dumb show since it premiered, but I guess pointing out bad lazy title design lumps me in with all the people searching for things to complain about every episode 
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Dec 17, 2020 19:51
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sticklefifer posted:It's a title sequence. It doesn't need to be a whole new thing that they completely remade from scratch. Fringe did the same thing for its parallel universe episodes and it was fun, so at worst it's not a particularly original concept. But it's silly to list it as a standout complaint because it's "not what a mirror does". The show has flaws, but I swear people intentionally scour for ways to find more. I’m not defending it, but Hatewatch The Newest Trek has been a tradition since at least 1987. e: not calling out specific posters here, just generally observing
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Dec 17, 2020 19:51
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drat Star Trek fans, they ruined Star Trek!
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Dec 17, 2020 20:17
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Kelpian backup  I'm glad they remembered that kelpians are super strong too. So long Georgiou. The whole crew toasting her was a bit much lmao. Lum_ posted:Georgiou returns to the mirror universe in the new series, finds out the empire has fallen to rampaging Battle Kelpiens  piratepilates posted:didn't georgiou literally eat a mirror version of a member of the bridge crew lol No. That was a random kelpian.
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Dec 17, 2020 20:29
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SpeakSlow posted:I mean, screaming "Space Hitler" every thread is an easy way to dismiss the Emperor Georgiou thread in Disco, but really it's a nature versus nurture issue aka Grant Morrison Earth 2 issue. All of this is true but its execution sucks. Nodosaur posted:drat Star Trek fans, they ruined Star Trek! As soon as someone loves something they corrupt it.
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Dec 17, 2020 20:34
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Big Mean Jerk posted:I’ve been one of the few defending this dumb show since it premiered, but I guess pointing out bad lazy title design lumps me in with all the people searching for things to complain about every episode Please don't demean to suggest someone has to search.
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Dec 17, 2020 21:11
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ashpanash posted:That...has nothing to do with String Theory. String Theory is an attempt to put quantum field theory and general relativity in a unified geometrical framework. Ah, yep, I am indeed a dumbass who didn't understand the reference they were trying to drop. I was just saying that I think parallel universes tend to rule out predestination paradoxes, because the original timeline continues on without interference.
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Dec 17, 2020 21:27
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