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Threadkiller Dog posted:Also im pretty sure a simple parliamentary majority would not suffice for openly passing unconstitutional laws. Like if all the important parties agreed across the blocks im sure it could be paved for in the commities and constitutional court. Precisely, you'd need a broad and stable coalition all the way until the next election. The last thing to ever happen with party politics as they are presently. We almost had a government crisis last month for those that don't remember. A Buttery Pastry posted:I can see why the government has low trust, it sucks rear end. (Perhaps not that much more than most of its European counterparts though) Could be worse, could be the UK.
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Dec 18, 2020 19:30
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MiddleOne posted:Could be worse, could be the UK.
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Dec 18, 2020 19:37
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teen witch posted:Recommending masks on public transit and no bars after kl 20! And tryyyying to enforce non essential people to work from home which lol, loving lol I can’t wait to see my office do this. My office has said to please work at home whenever possible, but some of my IT coworkers just can't loving stay away from the office because it's boring to just sit at home. I miss the social interaction too (been 100% home since March) but god drat, sacrifice at least a _little_ here.
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Dec 18, 2020 19:42
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My office can work at home but the company does everything in their power to keep us in the office because the entire management culture is built around "if you don't watch the staff they will betray you" Like twice I found out that people I had spent time with had corona and our HR boss just responded that if I feel sick I should stay home but otherwise I can come to the office. This despite the fact that some staff members have immunocompromised family members. My work can be 100% done at home. It will be very interesting to see what mental gymnastics they use to dodge the next batch of suggestions.
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Dec 18, 2020 19:52
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Katt posted:
The Swedish Elite: The King is a respected and honored representative of our society. The King: Its bad people are dying. The Swedish Elite: loving commie activist.
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Dec 18, 2020 20:16
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Katt posted:Just ban fish from the thread already. They're not remotely good faith at this point. This is more sarcasm right? Fish is nailing it.
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Dec 18, 2020 20:44
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A Buttery Pastry posted:The people voted for pain. No, I'm not even a little bit ashamed of that pun.
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Dec 18, 2020 20:46
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MiddleOne posted:Only if you're an idiot. What I've told you over and over again (and this will be my last reply to you on this topic) is that government can't act against what is codified in law without support of the lawmaker. They need consent from parliament past (the law) or parliament present (political majority). It really isn't that complicated. loving christ  Much like the swedish parliament, let's just call it an impasse.
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Dec 18, 2020 22:31
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I can’t believe I cared enough to read the Swedish constitution just now. The Instrument of Government does seem to say it takes a specific law to enforce a quarantine *inside* Sweden. You can quarantine people coming in at a port or airport, yeah. But that’s different. The War stuff does go on at length, doesn’t it. So you could pass a law under section 20-something as a restriction on free movement, but if several riksdag members object you need a 5/6 majority to avoid a one yeardelay in passing it, or something, and I gather the idea of getting 5/6 the riksdag to approve *lunch* is ridiculous? Was I close?
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Dec 18, 2020 23:07
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Leaving it all in the hands of parlament does seem like a bad system ihmo. Some things should not be a matter of partisan politics, at least not exclusivly. Are there any swedish parties that have singeled themselves as being particularly sensible about covid? Or do they all more or less follow the goverment? .lf there is no real difference then citizens have no recourse to punish parlamentary politicians who failed in the duty to property delimit the goverments constitution powers. Any system that fails to provide a non-theoretical chance of punishment for those with the power to steer it will always fail.
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Dec 19, 2020 00:09
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Katt posted:My office can work at home but the company does everything in their power to keep us in the office because the entire management culture is built around "if you don't watch the staff they will betray you" Pretty much same here. WFH March to June, back in the office until mid Nov when 3-4 people got Covid and many people were exposed to Covid and kept coming in. ...and then back in the office for the past five days, and off for Jul now. Why we had to come in for those five days is loving beyond me. My work is also 100% doable from home and I frankly prefer WFH but nope. I take WFH whenever possible but even when we have WFH allowed people still come the gently caress in. I brought my laptop with me home for the break as when that break is over I’d be loving stunned if we didn’t have WFH but lol any excuse to drag us in.
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Dec 19, 2020 03:23
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Rust Martialis posted:So you could pass a law under section 20-something as a restriction on free movement, but if several riksdag members object you need a 5/6 majority to avoid a one yeardelay in passing it, or something, and I gather the idea of getting 5/6 the riksdag to approve *lunch* is ridiculous? Pretty much. The last time regeringsformen was rewritten was mid cold-war so it has a tons of provisions for war-time governments. Paragraphs about disease more feel like afterthoughts, even the wording is old. Baudolino posted:Leaving it all in the hands of parlament does seem like a bad system ihmo. Some things should not be a matter of partisan politics, at least not exclusivly. Another relic of our consitutional norms being old and our democracy being young. For most of Swedish democratic history, it has been less un-easy coalitions and more the SocDems bossing everyone around. The last 30 years are an aberration in that perspective. Baudolino posted:Are there any swedish parties that have singeled themselves as being particularly sensible about covid? Or do they all more or less follow the goverment? .lf there is no real difference then citizens have no recourse to punish parlamentary politicians who failed in the duty to property delimit the goverments constitution powers. Any system that fails to provide a non-theoretical chance of punishment for those with the power to steer it will always fail. If we're talking virus-stopping strategies, everyone is following the government and if they have critique it's opaque enough that it's impossible to nail them down on what they actually would change. Like this heavily derided example: https://twitter.com/moderaterna/status/1328754303394254848 Notice the actual text. Not actually demanding facial masks at all. Public opinion isn't exactly helping either. https://twitter.com/grodaeu/status/1340162704976306177 MiddleOne fucked around with this message at 07:28 on Dec 19, 2020 |
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Dec 19, 2020 07:06
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teen witch posted:Pretty much same here. WFH March to June, back in the office until mid Nov when 3-4 people got Covid and many people were exposed to Covid and kept coming in. 
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Dec 19, 2020 10:52
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lol, UNICEF giving aid to number 4 on the UN Human Development Index
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Dec 19, 2020 14:15
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To an outside observer it is sort of difficult to get a read on how the relationship between Löfven's government and parliament has impacted the crisis. But what is clear is that FHM's attitude to the whole situation has made it really difficult to get anything done politically. That Tegnell still has a job is pretty bizarre.
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Dec 19, 2020 17:08
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military cervix posted:To an outside observer it is sort of difficult to get a read on how the relationship between Löfven's government and parliament has impacted the crisis. But what is clear is that FHM's attitude to the whole situation has made it really difficult to get anything done politically. That Tegnell still has a job is pretty bizarre. Firing Tegnell would be admitting having made a mistake initially.
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Dec 19, 2020 21:36
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Yeah, if he's ever getting fired it's going to be quietly after the crisis is over.
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Dec 19, 2020 21:40
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This article is making the rounds: COVID-19 and the Failure of Swedish Exceptionalism
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Dec 19, 2020 21:55
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The liberal media loves the saying "never attribute to malice that which is adequately explained by stupidity". It's extremely convenient.
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Dec 19, 2020 23:24
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Well poo poo, they actually put aktivering on pause for a month. Wonder how many infections they were responsible for in the meantime.
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Dec 19, 2020 23:37
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david_a posted:This article is making the rounds: The Pol.sec for SD Örebro can suck my whole rear end.
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Dec 20, 2020 00:21
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david_a posted:This article is making the rounds: quote:John Gustavsson is a conservative writer Cool, this is coming from some SD dirtbag. This is a great tactic by SD, point out that the government is mishandling the crisis, without being explicit about what exactly SD would do differently (murder all the browns, presumably). It's not like it's easy to disagree when the article points out that Tegnell is a fuckup. I doubt many people will find the argument that the government has to allow the disease to spread due to the constitution very sympathetic. There is some truth to the idea that Scandinavian countries have a tendency to assume that disasters only happen in other countries. I recall many smug dismissals of the coronavirus in the early days as something that couldn't possibly spread here due to our cultural superiority to The Asians (they don't understand hygiene, our medical science is better than their medical science). I doubt the SD member is complaining that there's too much racism though. Esran fucked around with this message at 01:11 on Dec 20, 2020 |
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Dec 20, 2020 01:09
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Esran posted:There is some truth to the idea that Scandinavian countries have a tendency to assume that disasters only happen in other countries.
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Dec 20, 2020 06:09
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A Buttery Pastry posted:The article is specifically about Sweden assuming that, due to it just continuously sitting out history. Something I think I pointed out like half a year ago as an explanation for the different approach. Clearly this dude read my post and spent half a year writing the article. In a sense this whole situation is kinda like 2015 when it comes to the government’s response.
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Dec 20, 2020 06:12
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The author is bang on with Sweden being insulated (whether by dumb luck or intention) from the some of the world’s gravest horrors. It’s a mentality that in one hand seems absolutely idyllic and many countries would bend over backwards to have, but also kind of stunts this nation a bit. There is little to no fight here, if that makes sense. And anyone that causes conflict against the peacefulness here is smacked the gently caress down. Rabblerousing is a sin. You either go with the flow or you are drowned. I think maybe NOW, months later than the rest of the world, Sweden is waking up to the fact that Covid doesn’t loving care that this is Sweden. This microscopic motherfucker has found holes in society and government here that existed pre Covid and torn it wide open. We went with the flow and it seems the flow has led us to thousands of needless deaths and incalculable suffering. This isn’t to say that other countries didn’t make mistakes, aren’t suffering as well, and so forth, but we can’t keep doing this whataboutist game to downplay the utterly batshit situation we’re in. Perhaps FHM is wrong about things!!Perhaps the government had power to do more!! hosed up but true, maybe Sweden stuck its dick in a beehive on this one! I hate that the fashy rear end in a top hat was right on some things. His solution would likely end up with more avoidable misery but he isn’t wrong about the problem at hand and some of the causes. 
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Dec 20, 2020 08:08
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teen witch posted:I hate that the fashy rear end in a top hat was right on some things. His solution would likely end up with more avoidable misery but he isn’t wrong about the problem at hand and some of the causes.  At some point politicos are going to want to realize that fashy assholes make gains because they expose issues the politicos refuse to deal with. The problem being that naturally the fashy assholes want to implement fashy rear end in a top hat "solutions" and we all know where that's headed.
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Dec 20, 2020 12:51
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evil_bunnY posted:
It is difficult to get a man to understand something when his salary depends upon his not understanding it.
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Dec 20, 2020 13:53
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evil_bunnY posted:
Exactly. You can’t keep passing the buck because eventually someone’s going to pass it to someone who should clearly be far, far away from said buck, and they ain’t gonna let it go. This is an opportunity for some real hosed up garbage and I fear someone may finally take it up.
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Dec 20, 2020 13:58
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evil_bunnY posted:
So you are saying that SD could have been avoided?
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Dec 20, 2020 16:59
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Cardiac posted:So you are saying that SD could have been avoided? Next election the Alliance will probably secure a sole majority just by making GBS threads on Löfven for the pandemic so SDs next kingmaker gambit will be.... 2026? Assuming the momentum of Löfvens fuckery doesn't carry the Alliance through two elections.
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Dec 20, 2020 17:12
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Cardiac posted:So you are saying that SD could have been avoided? actually, probably norway hasn't got an SD or a DF imo, as Frp is much more libertarian except for the racism. not sure why this is - might be luck - but i suspect it's because norway's regional representation is much stronger, so a lot of the rural discontent that might otherwise go to a more traditionally populist party goes to Sp. the New Left has been a disaster for the left as a mass project imo
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Dec 20, 2020 19:05
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teen witch posted:Exactly. You can’t keep passing the buck because eventually someone’s going to pass it to someone who should clearly be far, far away from said buck, and they ain’t gonna let it go. This is an opportunity for some real hosed up garbage and I fear someone may finally take it up. Well, Corona has hit immigrant communities harder == immigrants have more Corona == immigrants are the problem. Who do you think might pick that one up? (seeing as Ebba is busy stealing houses from geriatrics lately) 
Clayton Bigsby fucked around with this message at 19:54 on Dec 20, 2020 |
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Dec 20, 2020 19:52
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Cardiac posted:So you are saying that SD could have been avoided?
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Dec 20, 2020 20:21
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Clayton Bigsby posted:(seeing as Ebba is busy stealing houses from geriatrics lately) Even with all the Federley stuff, Ebba trying to sue her way to an old mans housed is definitely the years most ridiculous political story.
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Dec 20, 2020 20:27
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Someone summarize Federlays last 10 years worth of discourse. I'm out of that loop.
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Dec 20, 2020 20:52
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V. Illych L. posted:actually, probably At least Denmark has "DF but libertarian (and somehow more racist)" covered with Nye Borgerlige now.
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Dec 20, 2020 21:35
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Katt posted:Someone summarize Federlays last 10 years worth of discourse. I'm out of that loop. Federlay was the golden child of C, a 100% purebred chairman of a ungdomsförbund product showing the way to a new, glorious libertarian C ("look he's gay, we're not your dad's old farmers' party!". He rose incredibly fast in the party, being voted into the Parliament for Stockholm, so at the centre of the new Stockholms-C, that were going to make a new libertarian option in Swedish politics. I think people really believed he had principles and stuff, until the highly publicised event where he was crying in the pew at Parliament over how voting for the new surveillance law was the worst thing anyone could do, and then he went and voted for it anyway. After that he lost a lot of the spotlight, and did the EU parliament semi-exile thing. He ran for leadership of ALDE and lost. He ran for leadership for the Renew Europe group and lost. He gradually became less and less relevant at home, especially as C toned down their libertarian streak. So basically he had an incredibly steep career directly out of the youth association, and then fizzled out. So he kind of reminds me of Gustav Fridolin, if that makes sense? E: Googled and found this peak 2008 C sacrificing their values for Allianses: https://www.aftonbladet.se/nyheter/samhalle/a/VRgkeW/svikare
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Dec 21, 2020 09:00
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Just read on SVT that Mink farms are going to be illegal in Denmark by next year because of Corona, hope we'll do the same here in Sweden. While I think Mink Farms should've been made illegal for other reasons I'm not going to look a gift horse in the mouth.
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Dec 21, 2020 13:43
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I wish the Swedish government would stop beating around the bush when it comes to covid restrictions. The new recommendations are useless and just add inconvenience without doing anything to actually stop the spread. "FHM recommends that masks be worn during certain times on public transport." 
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Dec 21, 2020 14:35
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Kamrat posted:Just read on SVT that Mink farms are going to be illegal in Denmark by next year because of Corona, hope we'll do the same here in Sweden. And only for a year, so we can start this whole thing over next pandemic.
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Dec 21, 2020 15:08
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