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Mr. Nice!
Oct 13, 2005

c-spam cannot afford



I'm pretty sure 2020 is record setting for active duty suicides and attempts. poo poo sucks for everyone right now. Everyone is going on 8-10 month deployments with zero liberty ports and the massive optempo has driven people past their breaking points.

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Crab Dad
Dec 28, 2002

behold i have tempered and refined thee, but not as silver; as CRAB


McNally posted:

I think the fact that we're actually talking in the thread right now should suggest that I was joking about burning down the thread.

Carry on.

stevobob
Nov 16, 2008

Alchemy - the study of how to turn LS1's into a 20B. :science:


LingcodKilla posted:

It’s an emotional response that does nothing to further the discourse we had going on but go ahead do what you want.

I mean there are emotional responses to jokes about suicide that push people out of the discussion too, but ignoring that in favour of defending your ability to make unfunny jokes is also your right

US Berder Patrol
Jul 11, 2006

oorah

krispykremessuck posted:

turns out Grover had a better understanding of this subforum / the navy / the mil.

(USER WAS PUT ON PROBATION FOR THIS POST)

post your last three evals or fitreps you fuckin poser

if you are a <3.0 sailor i want you out of my division!!!!!!!!

lightpole
Jun 4, 2004
I think that MBAs are useful, in case you are looking for an answer to the question of "Is lightpole a total fucking idiot".

piL posted:

A bibliography

2010: Navy, you made a bunch of changes and have failed to analyze them. You lack performance measures for your training and data on qualificatiom timeliness. You don't know what your workweek looks like, but you changed it from 67 hours/week to 70 hours/week.

2015: when you create too much tasking without analysis, relief or priority in large organizations, you incentivise mutual disinformation throughout the chain of command and, effectively, give up your command over subordinate forces who are thus forced to make uninformed risk "decisions" implicitly


May 2017: hey, its been 7 years, do you know what your Sailors are doing?

Sept 2017: Navy, you don't know what kinds of hours your people are working. Some sailors are working in excess of 100 hours per week.

the Navy workweek and manning

October 2017: The Comprehensive Review

2019: "during group discussions in November 2018 with ship crews and interviews with Navy officials in Japan, we learned that the Navy’s methods for tracking fit and fill do not account for sailor experience and may be inaccurately capturing the actual presence of sailors onboard and available for duty on its ships. Moreover, sailors consistently told us that ship workload has not decreased, and it is still extremely challenging to complete all required workload while getting enough sleep."

A 2019 all hands call inspires satire.

2020: Manning Still Matters: A Fleet Perspective By Master Chief Paul Kingsbury, U.S. Navy (Retired)

Northrop had the longest list of red flags combining a lot of this poo poo I've seen in a long time. It was clear I would have spent an easy 18 months implementing poo poo and then move right into management since there was no actual leadership ability or pipeline to produce it. I left my poo poo on my desk, sent two emails and walked the second it was clear management was toxic and incompetent. I wish I had something other than get mental help to people stuck in this because the only real solution is to not be in it.

McNally posted:

Message received, time to burn down this thread.

You Navy guys ought to be used to that this year, right?

Hey buddy, I'm glad you're here and with us. The previous posts highlighted environments in which people make bad decisions in an effort to escape.

Crab Dad
Dec 28, 2002

behold i have tempered and refined thee, but not as silver; as CRAB


stevobob posted:

I mean there are emotional responses to jokes about suicide that push people out of the discussion too, but ignoring that in favour of defending your ability to make unfunny jokes is also your right

It wasn’t the jokes I just didn’t want to see the thread shut down. He said he was joking about and I moved on.

PookBear
Nov 1, 2008

the british navy mutinied for two whole days and it caused their stock market to crash.

Grip it and rip it
Apr 28, 2020
Seems like everyone is feeling on edge. Let's all take some time to pick our favorite line in the sailors creed and bring them back so we can all discuss what we LIKE about naval service in 2020?

Laranzu
Jan 18, 2002

Grip it and rip it posted:

Seems like everyone is feeling on edge. Let's all take some time to pick our favorite line in the sailors creed and bring them back so we can all discuss what we LIKE about naval service in 2020?

The phrase "Navy combat team" always made me cringe. It just doesn't fit it in right.

Nick Soapdish
Apr 27, 2008


Laranzu posted:

The phrase "Navy combat team" always made me cringe. It just doesn't fit it in right.

At least it does not include warrior, sea warrior, or some other permutation as I hated that. We're professionals doing the work of our profession.

orange juche
Mar 14, 2012



Can't remember any of the sailor's creed, glad for it tbh.

Elendil004
Mar 22, 2003

The prognosis
is not good.


Grip it and rip it posted:

Seems like everyone is feeling on edge. Let's all take some time to pick our favorite line in the sailors creed and bring them back so we can all discuss what we LIKE about naval service in 2020?

I like the part about fighting the Templars.

US Berder Patrol
Jul 11, 2006

oorah
I am committed to excellence, and the fair treatment of all.

AlternateNu
May 5, 2005

ドーナツダメ!
The Sailor's Creed has got nothing on the Marine's NCO and SNCO creeds.

Hekk
Oct 12, 2012

'smeper fi

AlternateNu posted:

The Sailor's Creed has got nothing on the Marine's NCO and SNCO creeds.

Yeah but no one except try hard 1stSgts and SgtMajs have any clue what either of those are. On the other hand, I got to enjoy listening to zombie sailors recite the sailors creed every morning and at every all hands while I was on a ship.

shame on an IGA
Apr 8, 2005

Nick Soapdish
Apr 27, 2008


https://twitter.com/dave_brown24/status/1341382246083801088?s=20

What are they supposed to do if Venezuela did break the guy out, lobs some TLAMS in? Shoot down a VEN plane?

Jimmy4400nav
Apr 1, 2011

Ambassador to Moonlandia

Laranzu posted:

The phrase "Navy combat team" always made me cringe. It just doesn't fit it in right.

Nick Soapdish posted:

At least it does not include warrior, sea warrior, or some other permutation as I hated that. We're professionals doing the work of our profession.

In P-8 land I heard a few higher ups work really hard to unironically call our little group "airwarriors".

Also on the subject of weird names, I still standby that the Coast Guard has a more legitimate claim to be called Guardians than the freaking Space Force. :colbert:

Dorstein
Dec 8, 2000
GIP VSO
The Sailor's Creed is one of the few things I agree with CDR Salamander about.

Nick Soapdish
Apr 27, 2008


Dorstein posted:

The Sailor's Creed is one of the few things I agree with CDR Salamander about.

I don't know what he said about the Sailor's Creed but that guy's tweeter is like one good tweet for every 10 terrible tweets

Godholio
Aug 28, 2002

Does a bear split in the woods near Zheleznogorsk?

Nick Soapdish posted:

I don't know what he said about the Sailor's Creed but that guy's tweeter is like one good tweet for every 10 terrible tweets

That's pretty loving solid.

McNally
Sep 13, 2007

Ask me about Proposition 305


Do you like muskets?
The only good creed is Apollo Creed.

ZekeNY
Jun 13, 2013

Probably AFK

Jimmy4400nav posted:

I still standby that the Coast Guard has a more legitimate claim to be called Guardians than the freaking Space Force. :colbert:

Didn't they semi-officially adopt that name after that Kevin Costner movie?

piL
Sep 20, 2007
(__|\\\\)
Taco Defender

ZekeNY posted:

Didn't they semi-officially adopt that name after that Kevin Costner movie?

You're thinking of the USPS.

piL
Sep 20, 2007
(__|\\\\)
Taco Defender
Quote is not edit the shaaaaaame

ZekeNY
Jun 13, 2013

Probably AFK

piL posted:

You're thinking of the USPS.

I was worried for a moment you'd linked to that Costner movie

Jimmy4400nav
Apr 1, 2011

Ambassador to Moonlandia

ZekeNY posted:

Didn't they semi-officially adopt that name after that Kevin Costner movie?


ZekeNY posted:

I was worried for a moment you'd linked to that Costner movie

It'll unironically standby the former as a Coast Guard Top Gun and the later as a fun and enjoyable Mad Max pastiche.

Butter Activities
May 4, 2018

I haven’t spent a thanksgiving with my family for 5 years since I joined the Navy and I’ve only had one Christmas with them. This is the last loving holiday time alone thank god.

Crab Dad
Dec 28, 2002

behold i have tempered and refined thee, but not as silver; as CRAB


SpaceSDoorGunner posted:

I haven’t spent a thanksgiving with my family for 5 years since I joined the Navy and I’ve only had one Christmas with them. This is the last loving holiday time alone thank god.

Sorry bro. I got duty tomorrow but this only the 2nd Christmas I’ve missed 6 years. I miss my kids pretty bad but this too shall pass.

Was kinda rough resetting the Getting Home clock for them but it was the right call for the family overall.

Nick Soapdish
Apr 27, 2008


Early in my career I told my family and friends that I prefer quality of our time together over quantity or specific date to get around holiday issues.

This had worked perfect for my family but I married into a family that really loves Christmas :| (at least we both agreed not to travel for holidays because I think it is just irresponsible)

Butter Activities
May 4, 2018

LingcodKilla posted:

Sorry bro. I got duty tomorrow but this only the 2nd Christmas I’ve missed 6 years. I miss my kids pretty bad but this too shall pass.

Was kinda rough resetting the Getting Home clock for them but it was the right call for the family overall.

Still two Christmases too much. Sorry to hear.

The big frustrating part isn’t missing holidays, it’s more because of how unnecessary it is. We’re supposedly overmanned but we’re literally at the max capacity of nurses to patients so taking leave here is a huge PITA.

Butter Activities fucked around with this message at 23:32 on Dec 24, 2020

Arsenic Lupin
Apr 12, 2012

This particularly rapid💨 unintelligible 😖patter💁 isn't generally heard🧏‍♂️, and if it is🤔, it doesn't matter💁.


The Washington Post has an article on one of the dipshits who wrote an affidavit for Sidney Powell.

quote:

Maras-Lindeman, who is of Greek heritage, joined the Navy in December 1996 and spent eight months training in Illinois and Florida as an airman recruit before departing the service in August 1997, according to a Navy record.

In their civil case, North Dakota state attorneys said that Maras-Lindeman created a profile on Together We Served, an online veteran community, that incorrectly depicted an extensive military career.

The profile, which is no longer online, said that Maras-Lindeman reached the rank of lieutenant, served in the combat zones of Kosovo, Afghanistan and Iraq, and in the Office of Naval Intelligence, and was awarded multiple medals including a Purple Heart.

In the interview, Maras-Lindeman denied creating the profile and said whoever did had misstated the details of her career. She previously posted to Twitter a purported copy of her Navy separation paperwork, which said that she specialized in communications and intelligence.

Neither the record provided to The Post nor the paperwork Maras-Lindeman posted online stated a reason for her departure, but the papers she posted said that the character of her discharge was “general (under honorable conditions).”

In response to questions about the nature of the discharge, a Navy spokesman referred to the Navy Military Personnel Manual. The manual said it means, “The quality of the member’s service has been honest and faithful; however, significant negative aspects of the member’s conduct or performance of duty outweighed positive aspects of the member’s service record.”

Wound I be right in thinking "general under honorable" translates into "This person was a total fuckup, but we didn't feel like going through the bother of a dishonorable discharge"?

Hekk
Oct 12, 2012

'smeper fi

Arsenic Lupin posted:

The Washington Post has an article on one of the dipshits who wrote an affidavit for Sidney Powell.


Wound I be right in thinking "general under honorable" translates into "This person was a total fuckup, but we didn't feel like going through the bother of a dishonorable discharge"?

It’s generally a separation where there was no criminal conduct but a big enough issue that the Navy wanted to cut their losses.

For example, I recently had someone fight against an admin discharge of general under honorable conditions because of self harm and mental health issues.

edit- I am not trying to speculate what the discharge was for. Just providing an example.

orange juche
Mar 14, 2012



Arsenic Lupin posted:

quote:


In the interview, Maras-Lindeman denied creating the profile and said whoever did had misstated the details of her career. She previously posted to Twitter a purported copy of her Navy separation paperwork, which said that she specialized in communications and intelligence.


Nobody's going to go out and create a fake TWS profile 8 years before now for a random person who was in the military. Why would you even pretend that "Oh I didn't make that, someone else did"

Vincent Van Goatse
Nov 8, 2006

Enjoy every sandwich.

Smellrose

orange juche posted:

Nobody's going to go out and create a fake TWS profile 8 years before now for a random person who was in the military. Why would you even pretend that "Oh I didn't make that, someone else did"

Same reason people think they can get away with pretending to be the most specialist of special ops motherfuckers when they're 5'8" and 300 pounds: pure undiluted head-in-rear end stupidity.

Anita Dickinme
Jan 24, 2013


Grimey Drawer

Arsenic Lupin posted:

The Washington Post has an article on one of the dipshits who wrote an affidavit for Sidney Powell.


Wound I be right in thinking "general under honorable" translates into "This person was a total fuckup, but we didn't feel like going through the bother of a dishonorable discharge"?

I got a general under honorable. Went to court martial for something I didn’t do, was found not guilty, got back to the command and was told they were still kicking me out so it’s essentially a “we hate you but we can’t ruin your life so we’ll just kick you out :smug:” thing.

I had a month left on my contract. :v:

Arsenic Lupin
Apr 12, 2012

This particularly rapid💨 unintelligible 😖patter💁 isn't generally heard🧏‍♂️, and if it is🤔, it doesn't matter💁.


Anita Dickinme posted:

I got a general under honorable. Went to court martial for something I didn’t do, was found not guilty, got back to the command and was told they were still kicking me out so it’s essentially a “we hate you but we can’t ruin your life so we’ll just kick you out :smug:” thing.

I had a month left on my contract. :v:

I'm so sorry.

Butter Activities
May 4, 2018

Anita Dickinme posted:

I got a general under honorable. Went to court martial for something I didn’t do, was found not guilty, got back to the command and was told they were still kicking me out so it’s essentially a “we hate you but we can’t ruin your life so we’ll just kick you out :smug:” thing.

I had a month left on my contract. :v:

I’ve heard from a guy who frequently does military defense council that this is basically standard procedure whenever a court martial doesn’t go the CO’s way in his experience which is pretty hosed.

Sorry to hear that.

Sorry about being a bummer while working on Christmas too I’m just so ready to be done. I haven’t had a normal Christmas or thanksgiving holiday in so long and it’s bumming me out but I know a lot of folks have it worse.

Cerekk
Sep 24, 2004

Oh my god, JC!
Why would a CO keep a sailor that he referred to court-martial?

That would be like a business owner calling the cops on his employee but not firing the employee.

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warsow
Jun 28, 2009

Cerekk posted:

Why would a CO keep a sailor that he referred to court-martial?

That would be like a business owner calling the cops on his employee but not firing the employee.

Well you weren’t found guilty of the crime, but I’m going to ruin your career to feel vindicated.

It’s wild that it is institutionally easier to do this than to modify their PRD and force them to go up for orders sooner.

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