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Vinylshadow posted:Ben Solo's last word in the Palpatine Saga is "Ow." Thanks JJ. Thanks Chris Terrio.
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Dec 28, 2020 04:11
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The Cameo posted:The destruction of a planet is presented so indifferently, like “oh look they made a planet destroying laser that sits on the underbelly of a Star Destroyer. Ooo.” It’s shoved between Kylo talking to Han and Poe and Lando showing up and being like “FRIENDSHIP IS THE ANSWER!”; it also coming after we saw them blow up like five planets at once is, uh, a choice. It's very telling how differently the destruction of a planet is in TFA and RoS compared to the use of the Death Star Rogue One, which is arguably the best of the Disney films: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JWENGFKQaL0 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Mtw-QWB7FGA https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QePwbyNv2bc (I think this video cuts some bits of the sequence out but it's the best I can find) https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sXxbnEqhEhI And, of course, the original from A New Hope: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5p0IP-FVG2I I can't remember if I read it here or elsewhere, but I once saw it argued that the reason why the original scene of the Death Star firing is so effective because even if we don't care about Alderaan, we do care about Leia, and when her planet is threatened she has a clear and immediate emotional response. (And, this being the first film, it also serves as an effective showcase for the Empire's cruelty and disregard for human life as so clearly embodied by Tarkin). Rogue One is clearly a flawed film, but one of the things it does really well is establish the Death Star as a terrifying, omnipotent threat that justifies the protagonists' willingness to sacrifice their lives. When it fires, it has an impact both because of the tremendous visuals and because it puts the protagonists directly in danger, to the point of outright killing them the second time. We still don't really care about Jeddah or Scarif, but there are few moments in the franchise as powerful as Jyn and Cassian dying on the beach only moments after completing their mission. (And as an aside, I really have to applaud the decision to have the Death Star only fire on 'low power' both times—we already know it can blow up a planet, but seeing the sheer devastation it can cause when they're holding back just emphasizes its power as a weapon of terror, and the visual of a massive chunk of the planet being blown out is straight-up more impactful than any of the full-sized planetary explosions). By comparison, the degree to which both TFA and RoS fall flat is incredible. There's very little setup for either scene, the emotional impact is negligible, and the consequences on the plot and characters is practically nil. All these scenes serve to do is tell the audience "empire bad," which we already knew, and that they have planet-destroying superweapons, which gets a little stale when it's the third and then fourth one of the franchise.
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Dec 28, 2020 04:23
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FunkyAl posted:Threepio should have been interrogated by one of the bad guys at some point, and produced no useful information. Imagine Hux or Kylo or any of the suits doing this. Threepio is just a head on a table and he's trying to be helpful and informative but he just isn't. They try jedi mind tricks but it doesn't work. It almost writes itself. This really is a missed opportunity, given the whole joke is he's meant to be a translator but is terrible at it. I suppose it wouldn't have been an OT thing given the Empire isn't shown to have much if any comic relief. Bonus points if he's rescued by R2, who as a droid is obviously beneath notice.
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Dec 28, 2020 04:42
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Gareth Edwards was such an inspired choice for Rogue One. There's no one better at making big things look big. That part where the destroyer jumps in and just shrugs things off collisions 
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Dec 28, 2020 05:09
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well why not posted:Gareth Edwards was such an inspired choice for Rogue One. There's no one better at making big things look big. That part where the destroyer jumps in and just shrugs things off collisions I love that the Death Star is just there in that shot and they don't even try to put more than a fifth of it in the frame. There's some great cinematography in that movie.
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Dec 28, 2020 05:20
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I've only seen Rogue One once and don't remember much about it, to the point I couldn't tell you anything about the male lead, but what I do remember well were the visuals of the Death Star as this colossal diseased eye in the sky, and if it ever looked straight at you you were hosed.
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Dec 28, 2020 09:42
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well why not posted:Gareth Edwards was such an inspired choice for Rogue One. There's no one better at making big things look big. That part where the destroyer jumps in and just shrugs things off collisions Was Rogue One the first film to show capital ships coming out of hyperspace? It always struck me as brilliant how weird they made it look, because it reflects the weirdness of hyperspace in the first place, despite how ubiquitous it is in the franchise. It's like they decided to call Lucas's bluff or something. Rogue One isn't perfect on the whole, but the entire space battle at Scarif just lands every beat. Convincing stakes, tangible violence, sacrifice, visual novelty. I cared more about the Rebel pilots with 12 seconds of screen time in Rogue One than like, Poe.
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Dec 28, 2020 11:54
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Payndz posted:I've only seen Rogue One once and don't remember much about it, to the point I couldn't tell you anything about the male lead, but what I do remember well were the visuals of the Death Star as this colossal diseased eye in the sky, and if it ever looked straight at you you were hosed. Very fitting too, since that's exactly the point of the thing; a terror weapon representative of the might of the Empire, designed to induce instant contrition, and used against a planet that had given the most peaceful resistance to make a statement.
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Dec 28, 2020 12:10
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Acebuckeye13 posted:I can't remember if I read it here or elsewhere, but I once saw it argued that the reason why the original scene of the Death Star firing is so effective because even if we don't care about Alderaan, we do care about Leia, and when her planet is threatened she has a clear and immediate emotional response. (And, this being the first film, it also serves as an effective showcase for the Empire's cruelty and disregard for human life as so clearly embodied by Tarkin). That's definitely true. The thing with Alderaan is that despite us never seeing anyone on it, or even seeing the planet until the scene where it's destroyed, it's already established as being important to all of the protagonists. It's Leia's homeworld, so obviously it's important to her and we get the emotional connection to it through her. But it's also the planet Luke and Obi-Wan have been talking about needing to get to for all of the film so far, so it's destruction also changes the plot: Now what are Luke, Obi-Wan, Han & Chewie going to do now that the planet they desperately need to get to has been destroyed? The Hosnian system, in comparison, never gets mentioned in TFA before it gets destroyed, no one has any connection to it, and there's no one on there that the audience cares about. Which is why the biggest reaction that scene gets is "Wait, did they just destroy Coruscant?".
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Dec 28, 2020 13:04
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For that Threepio memory wipe scene, I half expected his restored memories to kick in and he'd suddenly remember his role in all the films, including the prequels and perhaps a corny joke around being made by Anakin Skywalker and no one belieiving him, or thinking Babu inadvertently fried something. Missed opportunity.
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Dec 28, 2020 13:11
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Isometric Bacon posted:For that Threepio memory wipe scene, I half expected his restored memories to kick in and he'd suddenly remember his role in all the films, including the prequels and perhaps a corny joke around being made by Anakin Skywalker and no one belieiving him, or thinking Babu inadvertently fried something. "What? Stormtroopers? Here? I need to warn the others! Oh no I've been shot!"
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Dec 28, 2020 13:34
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Nitevision posted:Was Rogue One the first film to show capital ships coming out of hyperspace? It always struck me as brilliant how weird they made it look, because it reflects the weirdness of hyperspace in the first place, despite how ubiquitous it is in the franchise. It's like they decided to call Lucas's bluff or something. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VAAVwX6pXHs&t=81s
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Dec 28, 2020 13:47
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ROS just feels like the execs showed up with a powerpoint of bullets that the movie needed to cover and then poo poo was just made up to make sure all those beats were hit. Watching it in theaters I got the feeling of watching a book adaptation to film. Just trying to cram 450 pages of content in to 2 hours. Having read a bunch of the old EU it deffo felt like some of those novels. Speaking of EU novels: https://comicbook.com/movies/news/star-wars-novelist-alan-dean-foster-episode-ix-treatment-retcon-the-last-jedi-terrible-film/ quote:Novelist Alan Dean Foster wrote a treatment for Star Wars: Episode IX that the prolific author says would have retconned "as much as possible" from Star Wars: The Last Jedi, which Foster calls a "terrible film" and a "terrible Star Wars movie." Foster, who penned the novel adaptations for creator George Lucas' original Star Wars and the J.J. Abrams-directed The Force Awakens, says he "hated" writer-director Rian Johnson's middle installment preceding what would become Abrams' Star Wars: The Rise of Skywalker. In Foster's unused treatment for Episode IX, the author attempted to correct or explain many of the "silly things" in Episode VIII of Disney-Lucasfilm's Star Wars sequel trilogy: Now the question is, was the article released as a hit piece by Disney cause they refuse to pay ADF royalties for his older books?
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Dec 28, 2020 20:15
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ADF's treatment leaked before this dispute started (or at least became public, maybe they were priming the public but I doubt it.)
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Dec 28, 2020 20:23
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Youtube person Jenny Nicholson had a video where she went through it (it's bad) https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aanyjLmB1Bs
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Dec 28, 2020 20:58
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Oh poo poo, I remember that, it had a flashback of Snoke as a young Sith fighting young Obi-Wan and getting disfigured after being knocked into "a vat of chemicals"
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Dec 28, 2020 21:11
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Everything about that treatment and ADF's opinions of Last Jedi are embarrassing.
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Dec 28, 2020 21:11
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Any attempt to 'fix' what VIII did in a sequel is bound to be a bucket of poo poo. Regardless of what they felt, they should have just run with it rather than wasting most of the film doing so. It, and the aforementioned studio mandated bullet points are the key reasons IX is terrible. It's like someone went through Reddit with a note pad and wrote down all the things people were angry about, shoved it infront of JJ and said 'Fix this'. It's weird to say, but I miss the days when these creators had nothing to do with, or completely ignored their fans and stuck to their own vision. Today you get the impression that cast and crew are often subjected to reading Reddit, or are continually bombarded with Twitter opinions, both for PR and also the fact we're now shoulders deep into the digital age. Those people (including us) are not the people you should be listening to, otherwise you end up with the same regurgitated hash of what they like again and again reheated in the microwave.
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Dec 28, 2020 21:30
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 Could this be the end for Pablo
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Dec 28, 2020 21:56
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Isometric Bacon posted:Any attempt to 'fix' what VIII did in a sequel is bound to be a bucket of poo poo. Regardless of what they felt, they should have just run with it rather than wasting most of the film doing so. JJ if you are reading this thread please gently caress off
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Dec 28, 2020 21:59
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George H.W. oval office posted:Uh, no peg 
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Dec 28, 2020 22:06
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No Mods No Masters posted:
Lol he made fun of people posting videos of themselves crying with joy at the Luke Skywalker CG homunculus
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Dec 28, 2020 22:08
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ROS feels like they sat down and and mathematically worked out how to please the minimum number of people.
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Dec 28, 2020 22:09
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There is one good thing about ROS, its better than revenge of the sith
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Dec 28, 2020 22:53
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well why not posted:Gareth Edwards was such an inspired choice for Rogue One. There's no one better at making big things look big. That part where the destroyer jumps in and just shrugs things off collisions One of my favorite little details in R1 is that, as far as I remember, you never actually see the Death Star jump to or exit hyperspace. It just appears over a planet between cuts like some sort of vengeful apparition come to mete out the wrath of god.
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Dec 28, 2020 23:07
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Optimus_Rhyme posted:There is one good thing about ROS, its better than revenge of the sith Not even close
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Dec 28, 2020 23:11
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I don’t think there’s a single line in the entire sequel trilogy as raw and emotional as Anakin’s “I hate you” and Obi Wan’s heartbroken response.
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Dec 28, 2020 23:26
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Revenge will always have the Opera House scene.
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Dec 28, 2020 23:42
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ruddiger posted:I don’t think there’s a single line in the entire sequel trilogy as raw and emotional as Anakin’s “I hate you” and Obi Wan’s heartbroken response. It's not a line of dialogue but (Rebels spoiler) Kanan's death was really poignant and super emotional. At least for me.
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Dec 28, 2020 23:54
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Mymla posted:ROS feels like they sat down and and mathematically worked out how to please the minimum number of people. I think the idea was to piss off the minimum number of people, pleasing the minimum number is just what also happens when you try to do that
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Dec 29, 2020 00:00
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ruddiger posted:I don’t think there’s a single line in the entire sequel trilogy as raw and emotional as Anakin’s “I hate you” and Obi Wan’s heartbroken response. They fly now?
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Dec 29, 2020 00:03
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They fly now https://www.cinemablend.com/news/2487187/the-full-history-behind-stormtroopers-and-jetpacks
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Dec 29, 2020 00:08
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Not gonna click that link but I wonder if they at all touch on how jetpacks were used by bounty hunters for at least 30 years by that point in the franchise so it's kinda unremarkable that Stormtroopers have them now?
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Dec 29, 2020 00:19
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Splinter of the Mind's Eye is the only Star Wars canon I respect. 
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Dec 29, 2020 00:41
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teagone posted:It's not a line of dialogue but (Rebels spoiler) Kanan's death was really poignant and super emotional. At least for me. which movie did kanan die in again?
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Dec 29, 2020 00:51
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Horizon Burning posted:which movie did kanan die in again? For some reason I blocked out "in the sequel trilogy" and was making a general comparison of emotional moments across the entire franchise.
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Dec 29, 2020 01:08
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I hate you is one of the funniest things uttered in the PT but second to I hate sand. Just garbage all around. Thank Filoni for The Clone Wars and redeeming those pieces of poo poo.
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Dec 29, 2020 01:16
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Vintersorg posted:I hate you is one of the funniest things uttered in the PT but second to I hate sand. Just garbage all around. It's absolutely fitting. All Anakin has at that point is just pure, childish hate. He's incapable of reflection or regret. Obi-Wan leaves because for all he can see there is nothing left of his friend.
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Dec 29, 2020 01:29
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"I don't like sand" is good also
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Dec 29, 2020 01:31
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Actually you now got me thinking about this. The final fight between Obi-Wan and Anakin in ROTS is unique in that Obi-Wan really wants to talk his friend down. He's been commanded to go there, against his wishes, and he- like Luke later- is holding out hope that he can turn Anakin back. He wants to win the argument. It's like arguing with a fascist online. You can't. Obi-Wan can literally dismember his opponent, it doesn't matter. Anakin won't give up. Like one question asked about this scene is why Obi-Wan won't kill Anakin. It's clearly a failure he regrets later, hence in Return of the Jedi he's convinced Anakin can't be turned, he has to be destroyed. But the reason Obi-Wan won't kill Anakin there is he didn't come here to do that. He never wanted to, he was never prepared for that. So yeah, that scene emphasizes just the tragedy of someone giving in to the worst side of themselves and they can't turn away even when it's actively killing them. Losing doesn't make you reconsider your beliefs. It's not enough.
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Dec 29, 2020 02:09
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