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Dec 29, 2020 03:31
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Please scale this to Hoxha. Thank you.
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Dec 29, 2020 03:32
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how many trees has this thread planted
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Dec 29, 2020 03:33
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we need MORE BUNKERS
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Dec 29, 2020 03:34
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Dec 29, 2020 03:37
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quote:In October, the Kyiv council renamed, among other streets, Patrice Lumumba St. to John Paul II St. We should change the street from John Paul II St. to cspam communism thread st.
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Dec 29, 2020 03:43
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can we rename this to the Patrice Lumumba Megathread in response
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Dec 29, 2020 03:51
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Atrocious Joe posted:https://en.lb.ua/news/2016/11/10/2284_kyiv_renames_boulevard_honour.html lol Ukraine sucks so much rear end
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Dec 29, 2020 03:54
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Raskolnikov38 posted:lol Ukraine sucks so much rear end https://twitter.com/the_RedJam/status/1340143735313756161
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Dec 29, 2020 04:03
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still surprised canada didnt vote no
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Dec 29, 2020 04:06
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Dec 29, 2020 04:06
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Nazi NATO country
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Dec 29, 2020 04:07
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T-man posted:even the qcs mods say free benghazi 2 freeing benghazi 2 is the legal weed of sa, imo
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Dec 29, 2020 04:24
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F Stop Fitzgerald posted:still surprised canada didnt vote no I think Canada has one the biggest Ukrainian expatriate communities in the world.
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Dec 29, 2020 04:26
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Needs TRUPM right below Sankara
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Dec 29, 2020 04:28
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Horseshoe theory posted:I think Canada has one the biggest Ukrainian expatriate communities in the world. yeah that was my point, canada loves Ukrainian nazis, putting up statues of them. they are basically their gusanos
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Dec 29, 2020 04:37
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The funny thing about Ukranian Canadians is that there are basically two waves of them. One that immigrated from the Ukranian parts of Austria-Hungary at the turn of the century. This wave was pretty socialist/soc-dem. Then there are those who immigrated after the war, who are more likely to sympathize with Bandera et al.
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Dec 29, 2020 05:16
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Lol
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Dec 29, 2020 05:41
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ToxicAcne posted:The funny thing about Ukranian Canadians is that there are basically two waves of them. One that immigrated from the Ukranian parts of Austria-Hungary at the turn of the century. This wave was pretty socialist/soc-dem. Then there are those who immigrated after the war, who are more likely to sympathize with Bandera et al. and it honestly looks like the second wave is trying to wipe the historical memory of the first by buying up all their old community halls, properties, turning them into bandera shrines, and painting the first wave as huge stalinists
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Dec 29, 2020 06:02
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Atrocious Joe posted:https://en.lb.ua/news/2016/11/10/2284_kyiv_renames_boulevard_honour.html they also banned the communist party which was consistently one of the largest parties in their parliament and got over 10% of the vote in the last election before they were banned. long live democracy
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Dec 29, 2020 09:07
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Dec 29, 2020 09:10
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uncop posted:No, I don't. I meant scientists don't need training in philosophy to produce theory, because the interactions of matter are enough to guide them to give them a working understanding of probable and vanishingly improbable structures. You are smuggling in your own plainly wrong assumption that there is no theory without ontology. There is no intelligible experience without a symbolic framework containing ontological assumptions, period. The philosophical discipline of ontology is the unearthing and critiquing of those assumptions. Diamat is that ontology which tries to unite the sciences, or at least tried to once upon a time. quote:
They're right and that process has continued to this day - nonetheless science is done by human beings operating within a socio-symbolic inscription that usually pragmatically corresponds to their social practice, and this inscription will contain the common sense ontological assumptions and prejudices of the society that has produced those scientists. This means even the most basic empirical terrains will have a range of interpretations and implications along the materialist/idealist axis, and that empirical scientists themselves will often be incapable of drawing out all those conclusions. quote:Diamat indeed claims a kind of funhouse mirror reflection style epistemology, and people who try to take out reflection also take out the materialism. Without it, diamat is nothing more than mysticism, side by side with the hegelian framework. Diamat as Lenin would have it is mostly just a mystical projection. All mysticisms posit transparent reflection/unmediated experience of reality-as-it-is, and it doesn't matter in the slightest if you call this in-itself matter or God. Positing brute experience as unmediated reflection is untenable after Kant, and pathological after the emergence of our contemporary neuroscientific paradigm. Hegel's framework is, of course, about as far away from that poo poo as you can can get. The only thing we experience immediately is mediation itself.
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Dec 29, 2020 11:01
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diamat weapons can be enchanted to +5 and that's all i really need to know
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Dec 29, 2020 11:31
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Any good readings on Marxist conceptions of spirituality and religion? Is there a reason why modern Marxists seem to be much less hostile to religion than in the past?
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Dec 30, 2020 03:53
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ToxicAcne posted:Any good readings on Marxist conceptions of spirituality and religion? Is there a reason why modern Marxists seem to be much less hostile to religion than in the past? The church was literally the largest landowner in Europe for most of history after the fall of Rome, and remained a major reactionary power throughout the 19th/early 20th century. And in the backwards semifeudal countries where Marxism ironically took power this was especially pronounced. Hence the whole "developing capitalism before advancing to socialism" idea that influenced Mao and many of the Bolsheviks (in China's case this was true of monasteries)
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Dec 30, 2020 04:15
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ToxicAcne posted:Any good readings on Marxist conceptions of spirituality and religion? Is there a reason why modern Marxists seem to be much less hostile to religion than in the past? USA flying spaghetti monster leftists are nothing compared to the late 19th century french left
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Dec 30, 2020 04:39
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the whole thread is insane but cuban slave doctors is definitely a new one for me https://twitter.com/UNWatch/status/1344043142786387968
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Dec 30, 2020 05:10
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ToxicAcne posted:Any good readings on Marxist conceptions of spirituality and religion? Is there a reason why modern Marxists seem to be much less hostile to religion than in the past? the recent book secular faith and spiritual freedom by martin haagland (or something like that) is an interesting take on spirituality, atheism, and marxism wikipedia has a summary https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/This_Life:_Secular_Faith_and_Spiritual_Freedom edit: it won't tell you anything about how marxists attitudes toward religion have changed over time or anything like that tho Finicums Wake fucked around with this message at 06:42 on Dec 30, 2020 |
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Dec 30, 2020 06:38
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F Stop Fitzgerald posted:the whole thread is insane but cuban slave doctors is definitely a new one for me IANASO but i think sending your slaves overseas is generally a bad idea
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Dec 30, 2020 06:57
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splifyphus posted:There is no intelligible experience without a symbolic framework containing ontological assumptions, period. The philosophical discipline of ontology is the unearthing and critiquing of those assumptions. Diamat is that ontology which tries to unite the sciences, or at least tried to once upon a time. That’s fine and all, but it’s talking past me. Scientists don’t need training in philosophy because the things they need to know about conceptualizing stuff are integrated into the practice of science. There is no need for a field of ontology in the abstract, disconnected from scientific practice. You know how synthesis is actually a brutal affair where the new destroys the old and merely integrates aspects of it? Marxism’s synthesis of philosophy and science erased the Marx’s and Engels’s philosophy as philosophy. Hegelian marxists and other academics aren’t continuers of some marxist philosophy, they’re trying to re-establish a sort of neo-marxist philosophy based on the philosophical roots of marxism, which marxism itself rejected. That’s also why half of these people accuse Engels of being the first distorter of Marx: he was too clear about what marxism was. Presenting Lenin as a mechanical materialist is also pure academic distortion. Engels was the first one talking of reflection, Lenin merely took up the terminology. Consistent academics are forced to go after Engels when they go after Lenin on this. But the marxist conception of reflection is not some kind of mystical direct experience, it’s a *mediation*. Marxists were students of Hegel, of course they understood that all experience is mediated and mediating. Reflection is the mediation of the concrete natural world into the abstracted world of experience and thought. It’s a one-sided and distorted window to nature, but a whole image can be reconstructed by contrasting countless reflections with each other and overcoming the contradictions between them.
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Dec 30, 2020 08:01
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https://www.thetricontinental.org/newsletterissue/52-kerala/ In early December, Kerala held local body elections across the state. The communists won more seats in these elections than all the seats won by the opposition. The right-wing Bharatiya Janata Party (BJP), which runs the Indian government in Delhi under the leadership of Prime Minister Narendra Modi, and the centre-right Indian National Congress, which is the main opposition in Kerala, ran a vicious campaign against the Left, including harsh personal attacks directed at Kerala’s Chief Minister Pinarayi Vijayan. The media – controlled almost exclusively by the major private corporations – led the attack on the Left and ignored new initiatives pushed by the Left in this remarkably difficult period. [....] Kerala’s Left went into this election with a series of important advantages. First, over the course of a century of struggle and governance, the communist movement has driven an agenda to improve the living conditions of the people, including by promoting health, education, and housing, and has inculcated a tradition of public action. Second, it was the Left that initiated a people’s planning campaign twenty-five years ago; this process enlivened the local self-government bodies and made them crucial platforms for public action and for the development of the Left alternative. Third, the current Left Democratic Front government has an exemplary record of managing crises that predates the pandemic, such as the catastrophic floods and the outbreak of the Nipah virus, both of which struck the state in 2018. Fourth, the Left’s mass organisations in the state are alert to the needs of the people and are often found working to provide relief, to fight against social indignity, and to fight to expand the rights of people. This was most clearly visible during the pandemic, when student, youth, women’s, workers, and peasant organisations delivered food and medicine to the people, built public washing facilities, and assisted local governments with testing, tracing, and enforcing the quarantine. It was this mass work that provided the best antidote to the virulence of the corporate media.
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Dec 30, 2020 12:19
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ToxicAcne posted:Any good readings on Marxist conceptions of spirituality and religion? Is there a reason why modern Marxists seem to be much less hostile to religion than in the past? I don't know if he's any good, but iirc Terry Eagleton is an explicitly Christian Marxist. The thread can probably render a proper verdict there. Marx wrote on the subject, and my impression is that he was primarily disappointed with his religion and those of others for reasons which at their core would have sounded very familiar to Jesus and much of the prophetic tradition. Also, unironically SMG posts.
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Dec 30, 2020 13:03
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Hodgepodge posted:I don't know if he's any good, but iirc Terry Eagleton is an explicitly Christian Marxist. The thread can probably render a proper verdict there. If nothing else, his review of Richard Dawkins’ dumbshit book is pretty amazing.
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Dec 30, 2020 13:18
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ToxicAcne posted:Any good readings on Marxist conceptions of spirituality and religion? Is there a reason why modern Marxists seem to be much less hostile to religion than in the past? I would go with the Latin Americans here. For example, a practical consequence of Marxist influences on Christian thinking was Liberation Theology: regarded as the menace as it was because while it didn't outright say it so, it tied together the Christian ideal with communism, and didn't take long for that become an extremely powerful catalyst during the 60s my state here in Brazil had it particularly strong because a lot of priests from Italy and Austria were shuffled to here due to their socialist sympathies (a popular priest in the south fought along the communist partisans even), turning the local Catholic establishment into a powerful force against the dictatorship, a funny side effect that the Vatican didn't expect at all lmao Besides, the promise of new life and new history in Christianity was evoked and harnessed by revolutionary socialism with great effect here in the continent, which is also a huge factor that weights in. I think the 20th mid century Marxists began to make a greater distinction between churches and Christianity exactly because of the popular power from those experiences. Likewise, revolutionary socialism was also embraced by parts of Islam with perhaps even greater effect in parts of Africa and Asia, and without it, socialist thought would not have reached the communities it otherwise had imo
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Dec 30, 2020 17:23
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Comrade Koba posted:If nothing else, his review of Richard Dawkins’ dumbshit book is pretty amazing. this is amazing and savage, so i guess he was pretty sharp in 2006
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Dec 30, 2020 17:23
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never quite understood how people can square spiritual belief with a materialist philosophy like marxism. theres other socialist traditions which come from or have some connection to religious or spiritual belief and many other philosophies or ideas which have influence from both marxism and religion or some merging of the two like liberation theology, but to be a marxist specifically i think more or less requires someone to be an atheist
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Dec 30, 2020 18:01
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https://twitter.com/pycpim/status/1342446168966455296?s=20
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Dec 30, 2020 18:08
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apropos to nothing posted:never quite understood how people can square spiritual belief with a materialist philosophy like marxism. theres other socialist traditions which come from or have some connection to religious or spiritual belief and many other philosophies or ideas which have influence from both marxism and religion or some merging of the two like liberation theology, but to be a marxist specifically i think more or less requires someone to be an atheist im bad at philosophical history, but it seems like while the whole package of "everything marx did" is atheistic, most of the practical elements- historical materialism and his critique of capitalism- are compatible with spiritual belief
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Dec 30, 2020 18:19
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gradenko_2000 posted:can we rename this to the Patrice Lumumba Megathread in response
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Dec 30, 2020 18:21
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| # ? May 10, 2024 22:26 |
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apropos to nothing posted:never quite understood how people can square spiritual belief with a materialist philosophy like marxism. theres other socialist traditions which come from or have some connection to religious or spiritual belief and many other philosophies or ideas which have influence from both marxism and religion or some merging of the two like liberation theology, but to be a marxist specifically i think more or less requires someone to be an atheist I think of the connection in terms of Nietzsche's slave morality. In my admittedly vulgar understanding, Nietzsche attributed this to the Jewish tradition in origin and the genius of Jesus in transforming it into a radical political force. Marxism goes about things in a manner productively informed by the positivist intellectual tendencies of the era. But the fundamental moral assumptions, the real moral basis, are a new and powerful articulation of this slave morality. My equally crude critique of his attempt to imagine an alternative master morality is that what he actually did was articulate the long standing ideology of the ruling class. This is simply the antithesis of Christianity, its shadow side. To his credit, he despised antisemitism and did not forsee the ways its metastasized form, fascism, would demonstrate the horrible reality of openly embracing "master morality." However, this really based only on a broad and shallow understanding of the ideas.
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Dec 30, 2020 18:33
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