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Jel Shaker posted:when you think about it, are we not all time travellers...? Well lockdown means we're no longer allowed to travel anywhere in space so at least there's always that.
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Jan 5, 2021 20:06
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stev posted:They need to just bite the bullet and adopt the NZ model where no one gets in and those that have to get in are forced to isolate (rather than just asked to). Variants aren't automatically an issue. The real problem is if the new variant is vaccine dodging. Which they seem very blase about considering the vaccine is all they've got beyond incredible damage to society. Like they've got their out, their solution which doesn't involve actually challenging the order... and they are risking it because they're such fuckups.
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Jan 5, 2021 20:06
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Jel Shaker posted:when you think about it, are we not all time travellers...? I'm always stuck in the now, no fair.
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Jan 5, 2021 20:20
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Regarde Aduck posted:Variants aren't automatically an issue. The real problem is if the new variant is vaccine dodging. Which they seem very blase about considering the vaccine is all they've got beyond incredible damage to society. its fine its very unlikely that the mutation both restructures the viral spike and remains viable and we're only rolling that dice >100 billion times per person infected
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Jan 5, 2021 20:23
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Jel Shaker posted:when you think about it, are we not all time travellers...? We all can, at 1 second per second.
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Jan 5, 2021 20:25
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Jel Shaker posted:when you think about it, are we not all time travellers...? Not me, I'm just a kind of meat hyper-cylinder existing in 4D space, which is why eternalism rules
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Jan 5, 2021 20:26
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Failed Imagineer posted:I'm just a kind of meat hyper-cylinder existing in 4D space
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Jan 5, 2021 20:29
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The Russian vaccine and I think at least one other uses modified virus rather than mRNA that protects against the spike proteinright? Does that mean that the same mutation would be unlikely to impact both or do the modified virus vaccines actually target in the same way?
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Jan 5, 2021 20:30
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The VAT changes are good. It means Amazon, eBay etc will actually have to collect and pay VAT from their international sellers. It will mean some small vendors whose UK sales are below a few thousand and who sell directly (rather than under a marketplace umbrella) will find it too much headache and won’t ship to the UK. But yeah international trade is complex and sometimes that poo poo happens.
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Jan 5, 2021 20:30
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peanut- posted:The VAT changes are good. It means Amazon, eBay etc will actually have to collect and pay VAT from their international sellers. No they're not. They're just plain lovely unless you consider being an rear end in a top hat to anyone foreign a good thing. It's a bad copy of the EU version, which is functional and fixes a few important oversights, but even the EU version only works because of the size of the EU. Having to pay the UK to be allowed to pay the UK is stupid as hell, and the EU solution has a backup plan to solve that problem.
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Jan 5, 2021 20:37
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peanut- posted:The VAT changes are good. It means Amazon, eBay etc will actually have to collect and pay VAT from their international sellers. Yeah I read the rules as having two thrusts - putting some sort of responsibility on online vendors rather than letting them continue to be a weird loophole in the globalised/nation state model of capitalism we have but also raising barriers to drive out smaller sellers and so increasing market concentration onto those same online marketplaces. One bad thing and a 'it depends' thing which isn't good with either the UK or EU state models but pretty much an inevitable step which will be taken.
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Jan 5, 2021 20:38
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peanut- posted:The VAT changes are good. It means Amazon, eBay etc will actually have to collect and pay VAT from their international sellers. If you genuinely believe this means Amazon etc will pay all the taxes they owe, to the point where it's worth killing the businesses of thousands of smaller businesses, I've got a bridge to sell you.
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Jan 5, 2021 20:41
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The really stupid thing in which the UK differs from the EU version is the £1000/p.a. registration fee. This is for literally every company in the world that wants to sell things to UK customers, even if they only sell to VAT-exempt businesses! Also "online marketplaces" are basically exempt (in the sense that the marketplace can handle it), so LMBO if you think this will do anything but help Amazon and the like, since that's the only way a small vendor can now sell their goods without a bunch of extra costs. Private Speech fucked around with this message at 20:53 on Jan 5, 2021 |
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Jan 5, 2021 20:50
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peanut- posted:The VAT changes are good. It means Amazon, eBay etc will actually have to collect and pay VAT from their international sellers. This is absolute shite.
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Jan 5, 2021 20:52
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Praise be to the international conglomerates. Don't worry about the small stores. They wont mind losing the business.
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Jan 5, 2021 20:53
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Gyro Zeppeli posted:If you genuinely believe this means Amazon etc will pay all the taxes they owe, to the point where it's worth killing the businesses of thousands of smaller businesses, I've got a bridge to sell you. Ok but unless you've got lots of bridges I think you're going to have to sell it to me on Amazon.
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Jan 5, 2021 20:56
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serious gaylord posted:This is absolute shite. Why? Genuinely curious as iirc I'm sure I've seen you post about working in imports etc before. The basic concept of this that an overseas seller should be subject to the same tax burden in the UK as a UK seller seems surprisingly controversial to the UKMT.
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Jan 5, 2021 20:58
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peanut- posted:Why? Genuinely curious as iirc I'm sure I've seen you post about working in imports etc before. why should an overseas seller have to pay tax in the UK as well as in their country of origin?
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Jan 5, 2021 21:02
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peanut- posted:Why? Genuinely curious as iirc I'm sure I've seen you post about working in imports etc before. It's a significant extra cost for non-UK businesses - nevermind as some of the companies mentioned that if every country in the world did this (rather than dealing with it via customs as is normal) then that would be a massive administrative burden to deal with it. And if every country charged £1000 p.a., well, that's £200k p.a. per company.
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Jan 5, 2021 21:04
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Yeah I don't get the dislike of it either but it hurts my head and I'm sure I don't understand something about it
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Jan 5, 2021 21:04
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Julio Cruz posted:why should an overseas seller have to pay tax in the UK as well as in their country of origin? It's VAT so the overseas business is not paying any tax. They're collecting it from the UK customer and remitting it to HMRC. Private Speech posted:It's a significant extra cost for non-UK businesses - nevermind as some of the companies mentioned that if every country in the world did this (rather than dealing with it via customs as is normal) then that would be a massive administrative burden to deal with it. And if every country charged £1000 p.a., well, that's £200k p.a. per company. Where are you getting the £1,000 a year from? You don't have to pay HMRC to register for VAT.
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Jan 5, 2021 21:06
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Julio Cruz posted:why should an overseas seller have to pay tax in the UK as well as in their country of origin? Why should UK businesses get undercut 20% by others who don't need to pay VAT? Or do they?! I don't get it
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Jan 5, 2021 21:07
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I think it's just a bit rich that after a decade of 'we can't tax foreign businesses because they'll pick up and leave' suddenly when we desperately need foreign trade we're imposing a tax that will cripple smaller overseas businesses (or stop them from trading with us entirely) but be negligible to the giant bastards.
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Jan 5, 2021 21:08
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peanut- posted:
I think that's the quote shatner got from his accountant to do the paperwork for him
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Jan 5, 2021 21:09
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peanut- posted:It's VAT so the overseas business is not paying any tax. They're collecting it from the UK customer and remitting it to HMRC. but this still means that two lots of sales tax are generated on the same sale, why should the UK benefit from a sale that takes place in another country?
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Jan 5, 2021 21:09
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jiggerypokery posted:Yeah I don't get the dislike of it either but it hurts my head and I'm sure I don't understand something about it I just assume because the tories did it it's bad for everyone but the worst of the worst.
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Jan 5, 2021 21:11
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Why should a UK business get undercut by 20%?
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Jan 5, 2021 21:12
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jiggerypokery posted:Why should UK businesses get undercut 20% by others who don't need to pay VAT? UK businesses pay VAT, overseas businesses pay their local sales tax(es) so no-one is automatically undercutting anyone the problem is that now the UK wants to get their slice of sales which have nothing to do with the UK except for the customer address on the box
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Jan 5, 2021 21:12
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Julio Cruz posted:but this still means that two lots of sales tax are generated on the same sale, why should the UK benefit from a sale that takes place in another country? Nah. If you export a goods from the UK you don't pay vat on it. Should be the same for everyone else, although if the vat rates are different I think there may be the difference to pay. Which is why the EU has standardized vat. I think. You edited. The tax is due on the spending of the UK money.
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Jan 5, 2021 21:12
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Regarde Aduck posted:I just assume because the tories did it it's bad for everyone but the worst of the worst. I assume it is poo poo too but for the life of me I can't understand why
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Jan 5, 2021 21:12
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peanut- posted:Why? Genuinely curious as iirc I'm sure I've seen you post about working in imports etc before. Because the long and short of it is that the big companies won't see any difference. Take Amazon for example, because of how they work and how they move goods around the world a sale made from a German company to a British person could be fulfilled from a warehouse in Kent, and tax, (this is where im a little out of touch with how they work so please do correct me if anyone knows for sure) is due from where the goods are at point of sale rather than where they originated from. This gives you weird situations where a person in Poland can buy a keyboard from a company in Spain but the goods are sent from a French warehouse so the Spanish company pays French VAT. What this means for us is that the majority of foreign Amazon orders in the UK are intra warehouse. Goods are moved between Germany/UK/Ireland all the time and then 'despatched' for the final leg. So if this is still how they still work then this new rule will have absolutely no effect on the tax Amazon pays, since it won't change. The flip side of this is now if I want to buy something from a non global superpower and they 'despatch' from Germany, then that website has to pay a poo poo load of money in admin for me to do that. And if they only do 10-20 sales to the UK per year its just not worth it. Which means I'm poo poo out of luck if this is a unique item, or more likely I just end up funneling more money to Amazon for an alternative/exactly the same product for them to not pay UK tax on anyway. serious gaylord fucked around with this message at 21:15 on Jan 5, 2021 |
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Jan 5, 2021 21:12
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jiggerypokery posted:Why should UK businesses get undercut 20% by others who don't need to pay VAT? They've decided, based on an EU precedent, that it'd be better to make overseas companies do that instead, so now companies are just going to not sell into the UK. In either case, neither the UK nor overseas company 'gets' that extra 20%. None of this takes away from VAT being a lovely regressive tax though.
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Jan 5, 2021 21:12
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Julio Cruz posted:why should an overseas seller have to pay tax in the UK as well as in their country of origin?
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Jan 5, 2021 21:13
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In other made-up, looney left project fear news https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2021/jan/05/mother-fears-son-could-die-as-brexit-stops-medical-cannabis-medicine-supply quote:The mother of a nine-year-old boy with a rare and severe form of epilepsy has told how she fears her son could die after the government announced his supply of a life-changing cannabis medicine from the Netherlands would stop because of Brexit. also quote:In desperation Deacon wrote to Boris Johnson begging him to intervene on 29 December. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0k29corrrL0
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Jan 5, 2021 21:14
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Lmao didn’t Keith “address the nation” earlier? I haven’t seen anything about it here or on Twitter.
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Jan 5, 2021 21:14
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VAT is the shittiest most regressive tax, agreed.
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Jan 5, 2021 21:15
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Bobby Deluxe posted:Oh wow, the Crit Role thing isn't just 'some' countries: Open an office in northern Ireland and just drive over the border to an Irish post office for the post run to RoW.
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Jan 5, 2021 21:17
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Bobby Deluxe posted:Oh wow, the Crit Role thing isn't just 'some' countries: If I had to guess, it relies on shenanigan's with being able to ship to NI, and then ship from there to ROI. And I guess from UK to Gibralter and onwards to Spain from there? I don't know how company shipping works.
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Jan 5, 2021 21:17
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Pantsmaster Bill posted:Lmao didn’t Keith “address the nation” earlier? I haven’t seen anything about it here or on Twitter. https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-55552872 Meh.
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Jan 5, 2021 21:17
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Forgive me its not where the goods are despatched from on the final leg for Amazon that determines which country you pay VAT on, its from which version of its site. So to use my example above, the Polish man buys a Spanish keyboard from Amazon.fr and thats why the VAT is payable in France, not Poland or Spain.
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Jan 5, 2021 21:18
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