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Dienes posted:I'm curious if anyone has seen or played the homebrew pirate class: https://www.dandwiki.com/wiki/Pirate_(5e_Class) Just from the first few abilities, it seems pretty OP. By fourth level, you're getting extra damage whenever you want it *and* forcing your target to focus on you or suffer penalties, the ability to have melee damage, and two separate +2s to AC. EDIT: And they get Extra Attack, an ability that lets them follow opponents when they move, and an ability that lets them frighten every enemy in 60 feet every shirt rest. drat. That's without even looking at the subclasses. Devorum fucked around with this message at 16:51 on Jan 15, 2021 |
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Jan 15, 2021 16:48
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Dienes posted:I'm curious if anyone has seen or played the homebrew pirate class: https://www.dandwiki.com/wiki/Pirate_(5e_Class) This class, like most homebrew, seems pretty op. Try comparing it to the rogue swashbuckler. It gets a bunch of extra attacks, a level 1 at will ability to add at least 1d6, extra ac while wearing leather armor, advantage on a bunch of skill checks, and then you get some aoe mini fireballs with that explosive subclass. I would recommend just taking a swashbuckler and doing a pirate themed background, maybe get the aquatic fighter fighting style
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Jan 15, 2021 16:52
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Trivia posted:Is it necessarily plausible to have a log blocking a paved path, one that is traveled frequently, and then needing to use strength of all things to clear it (instead of walking around)? Yes you loving weirdo. The world is a chaotic and imperfect place. The log has no long-term effects on the narrative. If it bothers you so much when a second person adds a detail then you are not looking for DnD you are looking for the Fiction section
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Jan 15, 2021 17:03
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Calm down dude. Jesus some of you nerds get so loving upset.
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Jan 15, 2021 17:06
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Ok, then please understand in my calmest voice that I think you're very very wrong and your ideas are bad
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Jan 15, 2021 17:07
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Trivia posted:Calm down dude. Jesus some of you nerds get so loving upset. 
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Jan 15, 2021 17:13
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Ok fine. That's like, your opinion, man. Also ironically another person telling me not to say others play wrong, yet claiming I'm wrong. Ok. So really it's just down to however the group wants to play! Cool, problem solved. Easy peasey. If you don't like the conversation then I'm sorry, put me on ignore and jog on. Nothing's keeping you here. I (think?) it's safe to assume that as a community of players you'd WANT new people to come in and share interest in the game. But boy howdy did I stir up a nest of hornets, Jesus. Like, it's not even really about the fuckin' log or the curtains or Brian Greenstrider. It's about the basic philosophy of the game, to which there's no "right" answer. So, with that said, I've found that SCs as they are commonly implemented are unsatisfying. Does anyone have any good ideas for them or a similar mechanic? Splicer posted:We're upset because it sucks hearing someone describing how they're working toward teaching a new player all the wrong lessons Well, I'm gonna say, if you guys are trying to teach me to not Be Bad, you're doing a very lovely job of it. Christ I feel like I'm being shouted down, insulted, and sniped. To everyone else that sent recommendations or were just more patient, thank you.
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Jan 15, 2021 17:23
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You asked if other ppl in the thread felt the same way about something, almost everyone agreed that the thing you didn't like was Good Actually, and you spent a bunch of effort telling us that actually your way is better. Don't ask what a group of people thinks about something and then wholly reject the response. Just admit you're looking for someone to agree with you and make you feel good.
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Jan 15, 2021 17:29
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Hackan Slash posted:This class, like most homebrew, seems pretty op. Try comparing it to the rogue swashbuckler. Oh, God, no, I'm not planning on running this. Its another player in our group who is dominating the campaign a bit because he can out-damage and out-roll everyone else in both combat and social situations, but doesn't see how the class is busted. The DM is brand new and pretty permissive, so its getting difficult to balance encounters, face time, etc. I'm hoping the new class features from Tasha's everyone else gets to add for next session helps. I'm glad I'm not crazy for thinking this is OP.
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Jan 15, 2021 17:31
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Trivia posted:Ok fine. That's like, your opinion, man. Also ironically another person telling me not to say others play wrong, yet claiming I'm wrong.
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Jan 15, 2021 17:34
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Trivia posted:So, with that said, I've found that SCs as they are commonly implemented are unsatisfying. Does anyone have any good ideas for them or a similar mechanic? The last skill challenge I did was just an eighty foot cliff with an odd humanoid shaped blob dangling near the top. They were handed climbing equipment by the guide that led them to the cliff but they could do anything they wanted. Unfortunately they're level one so nobody has fly or any other cool tricks to get up. So they were stuck climbing. I let them move their full movement speed up with a DC 10. If they failed the skill check they would fall 25 ft. (climbing gear (piton) makes it so they can't fall more than 25 ft.). When the fastest guy made it to the top he immediately went to check on the blob which was a bound and captured elf that was mangled (eye pecked out, tongue ripped out, intestines outside of body) but that was the trigger for the harpy to start singing their song - the elf was bait. So now the encounter had started and there were still people climbing up. The first player that made it up had begun working on pulling the elf up before the harpy started singing and then they wanted to drag the body into a safe area, totally ignoring the incoming harpy. I think the players had a lot of fun with it. I haven't done any other skill challenges except having someone roll athletics a few times for his Pit Fighting downtime. Tomorrow they're playing rugby.
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Jan 15, 2021 17:36
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Ignite Memories posted:You asked if other ppl in the thread felt the same way about something, almost everyone agreed that the thing you didn't like was Good Actually, and you spent a bunch of effort telling us that actually your way is better. Don't ask what a group of people thinks about something and then wholly reject the response. Just admit you're looking for someone to agree with you and make you feel good. Well, I'm trying to justify my thoughts, you know, in like a discussion. Fuckin' sorry if I didn't immediately accept the standard group think. I haven't wholly rejected responses. I listened to the less vitriolic of you and again it sounds like the reasonable answer is "do a proper session 0, and tailor it to the group / campaign. Some of us find that kind of play fun, but talk to your players first." In this situation I wasn't the DM, and there wasn't much to the session 0.
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Jan 15, 2021 17:37
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Splicer and Ignite Memories aren't more correct simply by way of stating very strongly that they are.
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Jan 15, 2021 17:38
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Okay, actual DMing question: My group is undercover as teachers at Neverwinter's magic college and have taken a bunch of students into the eternal forest/pocket plane looking for reagents. What they don't know is that the mindflayer they were sent to find is disguised as a TA and has a whistle that will agitate and draw in dragons... in this case, it'll attract chimeras to attack the party and students when they're camping for the night. While they were able to hold off the owlbears who rushed the group looking for easy meat, I feel like chimeras would be much tougher since they can breathe fire in a cone and toast some students instantly? Is this too much bullshit since it might be really hard to prevent some of the students from dying?
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Jan 15, 2021 17:40
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Splicer posted:Nono, I'm not saying people shouldn't say when other people are playing wrong. Quite the opposite. I'm saying that you are playing wrong, and you are teaching someone else to play the way you are, which is wrong. Ok, fine. Why? I mean, if you just want to drop a snipe and then not justify it, go right ahead. But why should I then listen to Splicer, random internet person on SA's DND thread? Like I've said many times, I'm new to DND, as are the rest of my group. It's the blind leading the blind here, and all I've had to go on is the Starter Set.
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Jan 15, 2021 17:41
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As a player it's not within your power to decide if there's a session 0. It's in your power to decide if someone else having a level of proactive agency bothers you, which you've already done. As a result, either you or the people around you are going to have objectively less fun.
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Jan 15, 2021 17:41
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Ignite Memories posted:As a player it's not within your power to decide if there's a session 0. It's in your power to decide if someone else having a level of proactive agency bothers you, which you've already done. As a result, either you or the people around you are going to have objectively less fun. No, it's not objectively true. The difference is a trade off of creative, narrative control and immersion. It is objectively true that having players invent stuff that exists in the world at whim reduces immersion but that doesn't mean it's a bad trade. It depends on what's fun for the particular player or group. I personally, as a player, would prefer if I didn't and if other players didn't randomly add stuff to the world at their whim. It's more FUN for me if they DON'T. You're not the final say on what's fun my man.
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Jan 15, 2021 17:45
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I have a question that doesn't involve player-created logs. Having my first session on Sunday and was helping my buddy build his Half-Orc Barbarian on DND Beyond. He ended up with absolutely ridiculous rolls and adding in his racial bonus this is what his ability scores look like: Strength (20) - yah he rolled an 18 with +2 racial bonus Dexterity (17) Constitution (16) Intelligence (12) Wisdom (15) Charisma (10) Am I going to need to re-balance some encounters due to his massive +7 to hit and +5 dmg bonus? I feel like he's going to decapitate every goblin in one swing.
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Jan 15, 2021 17:48
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change my name posted:Okay, actual DMing question: My group is undercover as teachers at Neverwinter's magic college and have taken a bunch of students into the eternal forest/pocket plane looking for reagents. What they don't know is that the mindflayer they were sent to find is disguised as a TA and has a whistle that will agitate and draw in dragons... in this case, it'll attract chimeras to attack the party and students when they're camping for the night. What are you trying to accomplish? It might be good if a bunch of students die if you want to signal to the players that this is above their abilities or that the world is dangerous. It may also prompt them to engineer a non-combat solution to the chimeras (see Tasha's Parleying with Monsters). But if they're the type to soldier on and fight anything in their path and you're worried they'll TPK (and you're not okay with that) then I'd change the encounter.
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Jan 15, 2021 17:49
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Perry Mason Jar posted:The difference is a trade off of creative, narrative control and immersion. I think that sums it up well and helps put into words what I'm thinking but don't know how to express. I mean, every player gravitates to what they like more right? I guess I'm the type that likes immersion and verisimilitude, while others here seem to like creative freedom. Cool. That's some useful poo poo to address in a session 0.
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Jan 15, 2021 17:49
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Trivia posted:Ok, fine. Why? I mean, if you just want to drop a snipe and then not justify it, go right ahead. Splicer posted:You are a bit yeah. You "invented" a problem (not knowing where east is) and then "solved" it by rolling perception (should really have been survival though). She "invented" a problem (the way is blocked by debris) and "solved" it by athleticsing it out of the way. It's all made up (tm). Giving the players an opportunity to take over the making up is pretty much the entire point of skill challenges. Splicer posted:There's nothing there. None of it is real. It's all made up. The GM has, by saying "this travel montage is going to be a skill challenge", stated that they don't care what's in between where they are and where they are going and wants everyone to have a bit of fun making stuff up and rolling some dice. Think of it like each player listing the parts of the journey they found most memorable, and as long as it's nothing that directly contradicts everything else that's going on then yeah that's probably something that happened. Splicer posted:I mean if we're doing a D&D-style dungeon crawl and I start describing how I yank at a sconce to open the secret door I just made up then yeah you'd be perfectly justified in going "This particular game doesn't work like that, the GM sets the secret doors, but keep that enthusiasm for later!". But "Skill challenge to make traveling a bit more interesting" is a very different kettle of fish, it's supposed to be a situation where the players get a taste of more player led storytelling. Splicer posted:Yeah but thr overland travel skill challenge described didn't present specific problems. The players just needed to get from point A to point B and the skill challenge is just a framework to narrate the montage. Whether it's a bug or a feature that the format incentivises the players to narrate problems that play to their strengths is a matter of opinion. Splicer posted:And if you lean towards bug then I'm afraid your root problem is the 5e resolution and resource management system Splicer posted:But next time they'll just say "I use my athletics to move any obstacles out of the way" which to me takes a bunch of the role out of roleplaying compared to someone talking about their druid being sad about the death of an old growth tree but accepting that its absence will give new trees the light to grow strong. And as a GM the stuff they talked about gives me fodder for later. Like the guy at the party talking about bribing himself up a permit yo clearcut the old growth forest a days travel away for cow pasture. Splicer posted:The point is that a bunch of writers sitting down writing a script is a different scenario to a bunch of people RPing at a table. Let's say I'm in a professional writing environment with a bunch of people and I come up with a fun scene that requires a character to know a guy called Brian Greenstrider who knows stuff about owlbears. I can go back to earlier in the book or script and insert Brian Greenstrider as a character, establish his knowledge of owlbears, then continue on from where I left off. But in an RPG I can't actually travel back in time to session one to insert Brian Greenstrider earlier in the narrative. So trying your best may actually involve accepting the limitations of the format and the limitations of everyone's storytelling capabilities and retconing stuff in. There are, obviously, "limits", and where those limits lie will vary from person to person, but usually those limits are strongly formed by familiarity and context rather than some kind of intrinsic personality trait.
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Jan 15, 2021 17:51
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Perry Mason Jar posted:What are you trying to accomplish? It might be good if a bunch of students die if you want to signal to the players that this is above their abilities or that the world is dangerous. It may also prompt them to engineer a non-combat solution to the chimeras (see Tasha's Parleying with Monsters). But if they're the type to soldier on and fight anything in their path and you're worried they'll TPK (and you're not okay with that) then I'd change the encounter. They're level 8, so two chimeras should be pretty easy, but that's not the point -- the mindflayer is intentionally trying to keep them distracted so things can happen on campus while they're gone, and it also needs to collect dragon teeth for reagents of its own (so the party kills the chimeras and he can scavenge the bodies afterwards with the students). I thought it might be a fun combat encounter as it'll be more about protecting strategic goals rather than smashing through enemies.
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Jan 15, 2021 17:52
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MrSargent posted:I have a question that doesn't involve player-created logs. That's the risk with standard array, eh? Since the campaign hasn't started you could also just say No sorry you can't play this guy he's too strong relative to the other players OR you could tell the other players No sorry you can't play this character they're too weak relative to the other players. Alternatively you could do neither and add more goblins. Or Monsters Know What They're Doing it and have creatures focus him down. But I think that's rather inelegant as the fundamental problem at the table is going to be "this guy hits like mad and does damage like mad and i never do " (just the general imbalanced party Feels Bad that point buy is meant to solve) more than it is going to be balancing encounters.
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Jan 15, 2021 17:53
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change my name posted:They're level 8, so two chimeras should be pretty easy, but that's not the point -- the mindflayer is intentionally trying to keep them distracted so things can happen on campus while they're gone, and it also needs to collect dragon teeth for reagents of its own (so the party kills the chimeras and he can scavenge the bodies afterwards with the students). I thought it might be a fun combat encounter as it'll be more about protecting strategic goals rather than smashing through enemies. Then I'm not seeing the problem? You don't want a bunch of NPCs to die because then the distraction will collapse? Have a different distraction prepared in case that happens. Or just keep more students alive for Reasons. Also you might be surprised how invested your players will be in protecting a sole surviving student or tracking down a chimera that flew away after toasting a bunch of students.
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Jan 15, 2021 17:55
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Trivia posted:I think that sums it up well and helps put into words what I'm thinking but don't know how to express. I mean, every player gravitates to what they like more right? I guess I'm the type that likes immersion and verisimilitude, while others here seem to like creative freedom. Cool. I will agree with you that it is good for the players to have a chance to talk about their expectations. If you can find a group where the DM wants to define every aspect of the world and the players want to define none of them, that is where you will have the most fun. But I just think it's important to note that every improv class in the world encourages you to happily accept and expand on the details provided to you by your scenemates. Ignite Memories fucked around with this message at 17:57 on Jan 15, 2021 |
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Jan 15, 2021 17:55
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Perry Mason Jar posted:Then I'm not seeing the problem? You don't want a bunch of NPCs to die because then the distraction will collapse? Have a different distraction prepared in case that happens. Oh no, it's more that I think my players will be upset if a bunch of the students they've been trying to integrate themselves with die, hah
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Jan 15, 2021 17:56
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change my name posted:Oh no, it's more that I think my players will be upset if a bunch of the students they've been trying to integrate themselves with die, hah Then I think you should absolutely have or allow a bunch of students to die.
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Jan 15, 2021 17:57
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MrSargent posted:I have a question that doesn't involve player-created logs. You've got three options: 1) Give everyone these stats 2) Have a chat with your friend and explain that he Rolled Too Good (tm) and revert everyone to the standard array 3) Option 2 but also give him a pair of bracers of defence as a consolation prize
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Jan 15, 2021 18:02
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Perry Mason Jar posted:That's the risk with standard array, eh? Since the campaign hasn't started you could also just say No sorry you can't play this guy he's too strong relative to the other players OR you could tell the other players No sorry you can't play this character they're too weak relative to the other players. He is one of my friends that I played Rolemaster with back in the day and we are just used to rolling for everything so went with that approach. But seeing how much that affects player power, I think I might ask him to redo his ability scores using the point buy system. He seems totally cool with that though as he doesn't want to be overpowered compared to everyone else.
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Jan 15, 2021 18:03
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Ignite Memories posted:I will agree with you that it is good for the players to have a chance to talk about their expectations. If you can find a group where the DM wants to define every aspect of the world and the players want to define none of them, that is where you will have the most fun. D&d is a weird game because for some people it's about improv and for some people it's a tactical challenge wargame, and the two halves can be contradictory: if what you want is challenge, making up the game yourself might feel like cheating. Also depending on your table, you might trust the DM to make up a good story, but (e.g.) not trust everyone else to not constantly respond to "what do you see" with "boobies lol" or similar.
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Jan 15, 2021 18:09
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Splicer posted:A lot of it was in reply to TheAardvark so you might not have read it. Honestly I remember some of that but not other bits. I do think it might have gotten lost in all the posts. That or all the poster's names started to jumble together. Looking at those previous posts I can appreciate a lot of the points and believe me, they're useful. However, opening with "it's all made up" helps nothing. That's feels like it's some sort of "gotcha" statement. I mean, the ol' Runaway Trolley problem in philosophy is just made-up too, but that doesn't stop people from discussing it ya? When you say that SCs are meant to give players a taste of player-led storytelling, that was entirely news to me. As I had understood it, it was an opportunity to give players a chance to use skills they otherwise might not, to make them feel unique in the group. Nowhere from what I learned was it a chance at world-building.
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Jan 15, 2021 18:11
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Hieronymous Alloy posted:D&d is a weird game because for some people it's about improv and for some people it's a tactical challenge wargame, and the two halves can be contradictory: if what you want is challenge, making up the game yourself might feel like cheating. This is what I'm dreading about the one-shot I'm starting up this weekend. My GF really like Critical Role and this will be her first game, but when I tried to give her suggestions on making her character she didn't want to make them "too strong" because it doesn't fit for "roleplay reasons."
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Jan 15, 2021 18:14
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MrSargent posted:He is one of my friends that I played Rolemaster with back in the day and we are just used to rolling for everything so went with that approach. But seeing how much that affects player power, I think I might ask him to redo his ability scores using the point buy system. He seems totally cool with that though as he doesn't want to be overpowered compared to everyone else. Awesome! Yeah I found with experienced players, or at least players that are actually going to be fun to play with, they have no issue tossing away overpowered stats. I'd seek to have either everyone doing point buy or no one for parity but probably it doesn't matter. change my name posted:This is what I'm dreading about the one-shot I'm starting up this weekend. My GF really like Critical Role and this will be her first game, but when I tried to give her suggestions on making her character she didn't want to make them "too strong" because it doesn't fit for "roleplay reasons." No issue here.
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Jan 15, 2021 18:15
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Perry Mason Jar posted:Awesome! Yeah I found with experienced players, or at least players that are actually going to be fun to play with, they have no issue tossing away overpowered stats. I'd seek to have either everyone doing point buy or no one for parity but probably it doesn't matter. Thanks a lot for your help. Just sent out a text asking everyone to use the point buy method. As much as I wanted to describe the carnage of his OP Barbarian laying waste to some goblins, I think this will make for a much more fun game.
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Jan 15, 2021 18:26
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change my name posted:This is what I'm dreading about the one-shot I'm starting up this weekend. My GF really like Critical Role and this will be her first game, but when I tried to give her suggestions on making her character she didn't want to make them "too strong" because it doesn't fit for "roleplay reasons." It's always a balance. You want characters to be effective but you don't want everyone just playing the same perfectly optimized builds every time or every group would end up the same. Like, every single Conquest paladin *should* be a Fallen Aasimar, it's the perfectly optimized choice, but how boring would it be if my conquest paladin just mirrored every other person's out there with no flair? It's only really an issue if one person in the group is way more or way less optimized than everyone else so the dm can't easily tune.
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Jan 15, 2021 18:27
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Hieronymous Alloy posted:D&d is a weird game because for some people it's about improv and for some people it's a tactical challenge wargame, and the two halves can be contradictory: if what you want is challenge, making up the game yourself might feel like cheating. That's a good point, and for the record i'm not saying anyone should be creating logs in tactical grid combat (except roll20 hurr). I like a crunchy combat that everyone takes seriously - but I think it's very important to lean away from that gamification when it comes time to describe noncombat things like skill challenges because the system itself has always been terribly limited on that side. I think both halves are crucial to enjoying the game to the fullest, because there's a thousand better tactical combat games out there without any improvisational elements. As for boobies man, I don't think he should be played with at any table. But group curation can be a lengthy and difficult process. Ignite Memories fucked around with this message at 18:32 on Jan 15, 2021 |
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Jan 15, 2021 18:27
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Hieronymous Alloy posted:It's always a balance. You want characters to be effective but you don't want everyone just playing the same perfectly optimized builds every time or every group would end up the same. Like, every single Conquest paladin *should* be a Fallen Aasimar, it's the perfectly optimized choice, but how boring would it be if my conquest paladin just mirrored every other person's out there with no flair? Yeah I kind of realized this and don't think it's a huge deal if she goes for a scimitar over a rapier or w/e, especially for a short non-campaign
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Jan 15, 2021 18:28
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Perry Mason Jar posted:It is objectively true that having players invent stuff that exists in the world at whim reduces immersion but that doesn't mean it's a bad trade. Is it? Can't players inventing stuff be an expression of immersion? They're so engrossed by the experience that they are imagining details in addition to those presented by the DM. Isn't that immersion?
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Jan 15, 2021 18:37
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PeterWeller posted:Is it? Can't players inventing stuff be an expression of immersion? They're so engrossed by the experience that they are imagining details in addition to those presented by the DM. Isn't that immersion? If you're reading a good book you may imagine the finer features of a character that wasn't deeply described. If you put a whole different character into the book then you're doing something else - you're co-writing, you're writing fan fiction, etc. Totally fine but you're no longer immersed in the book in the sense that you're getting lost in the narrative of the book. And probably no one is writing fan fiction as they're actively reading the book as opposed to having been engrossed in it and then adding to it later. You can get immersed in the world of CYOA book but if you scribble in a 4th option and write "go to Pg. 7 of my purple notebook" it's quite different from following the adventure. There's probably a better word than immersion for what I'm trying to describe, someone who's better with semantics please help.
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Jan 15, 2021 18:47
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Trivia posted:Honestly I remember some of that but not other bits. I do think it might have gotten lost in all the posts. That or all the poster's names started to jumble together.  Trivia posted:Looking at those previous posts I can appreciate a lot of the points and believe me, they're useful. However, opening with "it's all made up" helps nothing. That's feels like it's some sort of "gotcha" statement. I mean, the ol' Runaway Trolley problem in philosophy is just made-up too, but that doesn't stop people from discussing it ya? Trivia posted:When you say that SCs are meant to give players a taste of player-led storytelling, that was entirely news to me. As I had understood it, it was an opportunity to give players a chance to use skills they otherwise might not, to make them feel unique in the group. Nowhere from what I learned was it a chance at world-building.
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Jan 15, 2021 18:47
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