EVE 2021: Much Abloo About Dr. Who

The Something Awful Forums > Discussion > Video Games > The MMO HMO > EVE 2021: Much Abloo About Dr. Who

Zazz Razzamatazz: Apr 19, 2016; by sebmojo

So does this victory make things harder for us?

They only got half their titans out, but those titans (assuming they stay in Delve) are free to do whatever, while ours have to stay committed to keeping the camp up, right?

If they attack an objective with them we're limited to a subcapital response, because if we drop caps on that fight too, they could break out the rest in M2?

# ? Jan 27, 2021 16:44

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# ? Jun 12, 2024 10:08

Velius: Feb 27, 2001

Zazz Razzamatazz posted:

So does this victory make things harder for us?

They only got half their titans out, but those titans (assuming they stay in Delve) are free to do whatever, while ours have to stay committed to keeping the camp up, right?

If they attack an objective with them we're limited to a subcapital response, because if we drop caps on that fight too, they could break out the rest in M2?

My impression is tomorrow is going to be tough, we have a keepstar timer and multiple ihub timers at around the same time. Guess we�ll see if they do something with those titans!

# ? Jan 27, 2021 16:54

Eltoasto: Aug 26, 2002; We come spinning out of nothingness, scattering stars like dust.

Not really, they don't use their titans for anything and only go after keeps that are under jammers. We only got this m2 titan fight due to a fluke and they have been avoiding a titan brawl since then.

This certainly makes them feel better while simultaneously giving some alliances the chance to pull out if they want to. They still don't have any plans beyond jamming systems and then killing the keep, and we have been doing pretty well at keeping systems from getting jammed.

# ? Jan 27, 2021 16:54

SpaceDrake: Dec 22, 2006; I can't avoid filling a game with awful memes, even if I want to. It's in my bones...!

Dik Hz posted:

I wouldn't go that far. Subcap HAC battles have been pretty even, despite PAPI bringing 30% more dudes every fight.

This is why I went for the WW1 analogy - despite absolute shitloads of fighting, the invaders have not accomplished a single strategic objective of real note for a whole month. Production remains on track, goons can still reship, there's at least some krabbing and moneymaking going on, Delve is vigorously defended and we still have multiple highly safe locations to log off at. And the assault on 1DQ hasn't even really begun in earnest yet. And several of their coalition members now have serious problems in their home territories - Brave may have a bit of an easier time of it now (maybe), but it sounds like Frat needs to get a lot of its assets back north or they might be in real trouble.

# ? Jan 27, 2021 16:54

Rhymenoserous: May 23, 2008

Zazz Razzamatazz posted:

So does this victory make things harder for us?

They only got half their titans out, but those titans (assuming they stay in Delve) are free to do whatever, while ours have to stay committed to keeping the camp up, right?

If they attack an objective with them we're limited to a subcapital response, because if we drop caps on that fight too, they could break out the rest in M2?

Well from what I�ve heard Frat is leaving the war. But the real answer is �It depends on if the average titan holder is willing to risk his toy again� and I�m gonna say a lot of those answers are gonna be no.

# ? Jan 27, 2021 16:55

ShaneMacGowansTeeth: May 22, 2007; I think this is it... I think this is how it ends

To recap, the cost of not killing the M2 keep is so far: over 250 dead titans, plus countless dead supers, caps and subs on the initial timer, over 300 titans logged off for nearly a month, multiple dead supers, caps and subs on previous breakout attempts and now over 400 dead dreads, more dead supers, caps and subs plus 130 more titans still logged off on this breakout for a still living keep. How on earth do they think they're going to break the 1DQ grid?

# ? Jan 27, 2021 17:10

Collateral Damage: Jun 13, 2009

Eltoasto posted:

Not really, they don't use their titans for anything and only go after keeps that are under jammers. We only got this m2 titan fight due to a fluke and they have been avoiding a titan brawl since then.

Not just since then, they've been trying to avoid an all out supercap brawl for the entire war and the first M2 battle showed pretty well why.

# ? Jan 27, 2021 17:13

DEEP STATE PLOT: Aug 13, 2008; Yes...Ha ha ha...YES!

ShaneMacGowansTeeth posted:

How on earth do they think they're going to break the 1DQ grid?

didn't pgl recently say that they are not going to try and are just looking for ~goodfights~ now

# ? Jan 27, 2021 17:29

Sickening: Jul 16, 2007; Black summer was the best summer.

Rhymenoserous posted:

Well from what I�ve heard Frat is leaving the war. But the real answer is �It depends on if the average titan holder is willing to risk his toy again� and I�m gonna say a lot of those answers are gonna be no.

Oh for sure. The folks who have their most precious toy trapped for 3 weeks are not going to jump into another fight with them.

# ? Jan 27, 2021 17:29

Jazzzzz: May 16, 2002

Quasi-snark observations with the benefit of hindsight:

"Not being a trusted titan pilot" - this is Vily we're talking about, the guy who flies freighters around T5Z doing logistics because he doesn't trust anyone enough to delegate. If anyone gets butthurt because Vily didn't trust 'em, I'd say they probably deserve it.

A breakout attempt on a weeknight at a time when the dudes hellcamping you have the fewest people online? After a month of us smugposting and growing HUGH BREESE complacency? Inconceivable. Our leadership saw this coming a mile off, but there's not a ton they could do to get in front of it. "Be available for rage pings 24/7" doesn't work for most folks.

passpi line members will be eating this breakout up, 1T+ of lost dreads or not, because it looks like their dudes came up with a plan to extract titans from the hellcamp and executed it well, even knowing it would be costly, which they will take as evidence of their leaders finally growing a pair.

Long term effects, who knows: How long until they replace the dreads? Is FRT really bailing to pivot to the front up north? As usual, Flanders is on the money.

# ? Jan 27, 2021 17:30

RFC2324: Jun 7, 2012; http 418

Jazzzzz posted:

Quasi-snark observations with the benefit of hindsight:

"Not being a trusted titan pilot" - this is Vily we're talking about, the guy who flies freighters around T5Z doing logistics because he doesn't trust anyone enough to delegate. If anyone gets butthurt because Vily didn't trust 'em, I'd say they probably deserve it.

A breakout attempt on a weeknight at a time when the dudes hellcamping you have the fewest people online? After a month of us smugposting and growing HUGH BREESE complacency? Inconceivable. Our leadership saw this coming a mile off, but there's not a ton they could do to get in front of it. "Be available for rage pings 24/7" doesn't work for most folks.

passpi line members will be eating this breakout up, 1T+ of lost dreads or not, because it looks like their dudes came up with a plan to extract titans from the hellcamp and executed it well, even knowing it would be costly, which they will take as evidence of their leaders finally growing a pair.

Long term effects, who knows: How long until they replace the dreads? Is FRT really bailing to pivot to the front up north? As usual, Flanders is on the money.

While there is lots of pr spin to be done, they DID finally come up with a risky plan and ride it out for the first time, and if they keep it up they can do some damage, but that requires they keep up with the aggression. I don't think they have it in them.

# ? Jan 27, 2021 17:42

FAT32 SHAMER: Aug 16, 2012

RFC2324 posted:

While there is lots of pr spin to be done, they DID finally come up with a risky plan and ride it out for the first time, and if they keep it up they can do some damage, but that requires they keep up with the aggression. I don't think they have it in them.

Their entire plan hinged on distracting our titans with a trillion isk in dreads, and there�s not enough nocx in Jita to rebuild them all + if they had 700 capital manufacturing slots available they would take something like 30 days to build

# ? Jan 27, 2021 17:48

FAT32 SHAMER: Aug 16, 2012

Like it was a good plan but it�s not going to be employable in the next attempt unless they really do have a dread cache of a thousand and somehow have enough capital guns to fit them all

Also the fuel costs in moving those dreads will be sheer insanity

# ? Jan 27, 2021 17:49

RFC2324: Jun 7, 2012; http 418

FAT32 SHAMER posted:

Their entire plan hinged on distracting our titans with a trillion isk in dreads, and there’s not enough nocx in Jita to rebuild them all + if they had 700 capital manufacturing slots available they would take something like 30 days to build

Oh, it was a one shot plan, they can't do it again, but the morale victory is more important than we are admitting, and when your coalition is that big morale is the most important thing. They have to stop it from fracturing.

# ? Jan 27, 2021 17:52

Baron of Bad News: Aug 4, 2009

ullerrm posted:

I mean, props to them, they got them out. Morale improved. But I suspect that once the endorphin rush dies down, it's going to be a mixed bag. On one hand, they got about a third of their titans out. On the other hand, they only got 1/3rd of the bottom group out, and at a fairly high price.

PAPI claims to have over a thousand dreads cached; assuming that wasn't a boast, they can blow half of that cache on replacing tonight's losses. So, at best, they can only do a stunt like this one more time before they're cashed out. (And it'll take a few days before they can really do it again. They need to move that cache up to T5. Plus, PAPI policy is to only replace the hull/rigs, so the ~500 capitals that died today will mean their players forking out for replacing mods/fuel/implants, etc. and get those moved up as well.)

It'll take months to replenish that dread cache -- capitals take a long time to build, and doing so means burning down their mineral reserves, which are an extremely precious resource at the moment given CCP's current Starvation design.

But, all that aside, looking forward to the next N months: What does having those titans enable that wasn't possible before? They still have another 200ish titans trapped in M2, which means their supercap fleet is still not at full strength; until it is, they are going to be avoiding anything that could lead to a supercap slugfest (hitting keepstars, etc). In many ways, having a massive dread ball was a far more useful tool for making progress in Delve -- HAW dreads for fighting HAC fleets, SR dreads for killing FAX hackers, etc. -- than a handful of titans. So it'll be interesting to see how this plays out.

Oddly enough, it also looks like the majority of the titans that escaped were FRT, which is a weird thing; if anything, future breakouts would benefit from having more AUTZ pilots in M2, not fewer.

Isn't FRT getting heavily engaged up north in their home space though? Maybe they decided they needed their titans to go north?

# ? Jan 27, 2021 17:56

FAT32 SHAMER: Aug 16, 2012

RFC2324 posted:

Oh, it was a one shot plan, they can't do it again, but the morale victory is more important than we are admitting, and when your coalition is that big morale is the most important thing. They have to stop it from fracturing.

Oh for sure, but the morale of the still stuck dudes isn�t going to get better knowing that they missed the main event because 1) the Timezone they chose to do it in was cancer 2) they weren�t trusted enough to be informed of it in the first place

Like for the overall line member who can now freely shitpost on reddit again without getting a huge dose of facts, it�s great, but we�ve been smoking those linemembers out numbered for a while now and the only reason we�ve eaten poo poo recently is because our forces were split between the camp and objectives

# ? Jan 27, 2021 17:58

Jazzzzz: May 16, 2002

made the mistake of opening /r/eve; hoo boy

RFC2324 posted:

While there is lots of pr spin to be done, they DID finally come up with a risky plan and ride it out for the first time, and if they keep it up they can do some damage, but that requires they keep up with the aggression. I don't think they have it in them.

I think you're drastically underestimating the power of groupthink (again: /r/eve). The breakout has been/will be a huge morale boost that they can coast on for a while, barring another major strategic fuckup.

FAT32 SHAMER posted:

the only reason we�ve eaten poo poo recently is because our forces were split between the camp and objectives

Do you see that changing?

# ? Jan 27, 2021 17:59

1001 Arabian dicks: Sep 16, 2013; EVE ONLINE IS MY ENTIRE PERSONALITY BECAUSE IM A FRIENDLESS SEMILITERATE LOSER WHO WILL PEDANTICALLY DEMAND PROOF FOR BASIC THINGS LIKE GRAVITY OR THE EXISTENCE OF SELF. ASK ME ABOUT CHEATING AT TARKOV BECAUSE, WELL, SEE ABOVE

all the tapis boasting over 500b-2000b BR loss is hilarious

# ? Jan 27, 2021 18:00

andromache: Aug 27, 2009; Lawful Neutral Paper Pusher Elemental.

Jazzzzz posted:

Quasi-snark observations with the benefit of hindsight:

"Not being a trusted titan pilot" - this is Vily we're talking about, the guy who flies freighters around T5Z doing logistics because he doesn't trust anyone enough to delegate. If anyone gets butthurt because Vily didn't trust 'em, I'd say they probably deserve it.

A breakout attempt on a weeknight at a time when the dudes hellcamping you have the fewest people online? After a month of us smugposting and growing HUGH BREESE complacency? Inconceivable. Our leadership saw this coming a mile off, but there's not a ton they could do to get in front of it. "Be available for rage pings 24/7" doesn't work for most folks.

passpi line members will be eating this breakout up, 1T+ of lost dreads or not, because it looks like their dudes came up with a plan to extract titans from the hellcamp and executed it well, even knowing it would be costly, which they will take as evidence of their leaders finally growing a pair.

Long term effects, who knows: How long until they replace the dreads? Is FRT really bailing to pivot to the front up north? As usual, Flanders is on the money.

It still boggles the mind that 400 dreads dropped point blank on our titans yielded only 6 titan kills. Yeah, putting them there made us have to choose what to shoot, and I�ve been hearing Asher and Elo saying all war how quickly supers can mulch dreads, but goddamn. I�d have expected them to get more than 6.

Now test gets to discover how little mex and nocx is out there and the pure insanity that is T2 dread gun morphine sourcing.

# ? Jan 27, 2021 18:25

Dalael: Oct 14, 2014; Hello. Yep, I still think Atlantis is Bolivia, yep, I'm still a giant idiot, yep, I'm still a huge racist. Some things never change!

andromache posted:

It still boggles the mind that 400 dreads dropped point blank on our titans yielded only 6 titan kills. Yeah, putting them there made us have to choose what to shoot, and I�ve been hearing Asher and Elo saying all war how quickly supers can mulch dreads, but goddamn. I�d have expected them to get more than 6.

Now test gets to discover how little mex and nocx is out there and the pure insanity that is T2 dread gun morphine sourcing.

I hope someone on our end thought about that earlier and bought all the stocks

# ? Jan 27, 2021 18:31

Zakrello: Feb 17, 2015; missile imbound

https://zkillboard.com/kill/90262735/

a wild 6th titan lostmail from trapi appears

# ? Jan 27, 2021 18:31

FAT32 SHAMER: Aug 16, 2012

I�m really mad I did t buy extra morphine in Jita rn

# ? Jan 27, 2021 18:31

Floppychop: Mar 30, 2012

quote:

Thonking McThonkthonk > my recent stay at the m2- hotel has been met with hostility and poor accommodation. there was no room service available and it almost felt like the owners were actively trying to kill me whilst all i wanted to do was relax for a while

view was nice though 4/5 stars

# ? Jan 27, 2021 18:33

Jazzzzz: May 16, 2002

FAT32 SHAMER posted:

I�m really mad I did t buy extra morphine in Jita rn

the Caldari are cracking down on opioid trafficking

# ? Jan 27, 2021 18:41

ellbent: May 2, 2007; I NEVER HAD SOUL

I�m getting the idea here that I asked at a pretty bad moment because someone was desperate to set their money on fire at the time, but thanks for the replies on the trucking question.

Think I�ll start a new character just for the tutorial (nine years is a long time) and then do some light, toe-in-the-water deliveries on my real guy to see if it�s what I�m looking for. I just wish the sequel to Rebel Galaxy hadn�t been as flight sim-y.

# ? Jan 27, 2021 18:43

raminasi: Jan 25, 2005; a last drink with no ice

ellbent posted:

I�m getting the idea here that I asked at a pretty bad moment because someone was desperate to set their money on fire at the time, but thanks for the replies on the trucking question.

Think I�ll start a new character just for the tutorial (nine years is a long time) and then do some light, toe-in-the-water deliveries on my real guy to see if it�s what I�m looking for. I just wish the sequel to Rebel Galaxy hadn�t been as flight sim-y.

You may already know which you want to do, but the two flavors of space trucking that are available are public courier contracts and NPC distribution missions. If you're not sure, see if one or the other clicks more with you.

# ? Jan 27, 2021 18:52

RFC2324: Jun 7, 2012; http 418

raminasi posted:

You may already know which you want to do, but the two flavors of space trucking that are available are public courier contracts and NPC distribution missions. If you're not sure, see if one or the other clicks more with you.

You can probably use distribution missions to grind out l4 agents, and then you can sell locator services!

# ? Jan 27, 2021 18:56

Baculus: Oct 25, 2007; I DID A BIG CACA IN MY DRUG STORE DIAPER

FAT32 SHAMER posted:

Their entire plan hinged on distracting our titans with a trillion isk in dreads, and there’s not enough nocx in Jita to rebuild them all...

I love the economic analysis of every single one of their strategic fuckups - material analysis is the fastest way to burn through all the bullshit

# ? Jan 27, 2021 19:13

MrTargetPractice: Mar 17, 2004

ellbent posted:

I’m getting the idea here that I asked at a pretty bad moment because someone was desperate to set their money on fire at the time, but thanks for the replies on the trucking question.

Think I’ll start a new character just for the tutorial (nine years is a long time) and then do some light, toe-in-the-water deliveries on my real guy to see if it’s what I’m looking for. I just wish the sequel to Rebel Galaxy hadn’t been as flight sim-y.

Be careful with player contracts. I checked it out myself yo see what the money is like and it's actually not too bad. There was a large number of scam contracts though. Players post deliveries with huge collateral that start/end at player owned bases. The scam is they somehow make those POSes unshockable for you. So look out for short trips with a huge collateral/reward/m3 ratio.

There was a contract that went from Jita to my home lowsec system for like 10million isk but well over a billion in collateral. I did some looking and found this.

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1MIhf2x0_9Va1Dmoj8SDJnSXEb9hjadT_fmDQjy0repE/edit#gid=1945203470

Not sure how often it gets updated but the delivery station was on this list.

# ? Jan 27, 2021 19:22

Z the IVth: Jan 28, 2009; The trouble with your "expendable machines"; Fun Shoe

Baculus posted:

I love the economic analysis of every single one of their strategic fuckups - material analysis is the fastest way to burn through all the bullshit

They could reprocess the liberated titans I supposem :thunk:

# ? Jan 27, 2021 19:24

Ynglaur: Oct 9, 2013; The Malta Conference, anyone?

Klyith posted:

Only problem with that is it's a massive win for the people with 500 titans... but you could solve that at the same time by making 500 titans less of a win.

It's almost as if this has been the real problem the whole time. :hmmyes:

# ? Jan 27, 2021 19:25

DisgracelandUSA: Aug 11, 2011; Yeah, I gets down with the homies

MrTargetPractice posted:

Be careful with player contracts. I checked it out myself yo see what the money is like and it's actually not too bad. There was a large number of scam contracts though. Players post deliveries with huge collateral that start/end at player owned bases. The scam is they somehow make those POSes unshockable for you. So look out for short trips with a huge collateral/reward/m3 ratio.

There was a contract that went from Jita to my home lowsec system for like 10million isk but well over a billion in collateral. I did some looking and found this.

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1MIhf2x0_9Va1Dmoj8SDJnSXEb9hjadT_fmDQjy0repE/edit#gid=1945203470

Not sure how often it gets updated but the delivery station was on this list.

Don't take contracts that deliver to citadel's unless it's that one market citadel in perimeter.

Also, inb4 ganked.

# ? Jan 27, 2021 19:26

L0cke17: Nov 29, 2013

I made a decent chunk of cash doing contracts of like 10 ammo with 200m collateral from one of the lowsec asset safety stations through pushx. The campers on the undock nuked the interceptors that tried to run the contracts. I didn't want to push my luck and get those characters blacklisted from pushx so I just did 1 from each of like 6 characters and 5 of them failed and ended up paying out when the pubbie died to the station camp.

# ? Jan 27, 2021 19:44

SHISHKABOB: Nov 30, 2012; Fun Shoe

So what's the Lore of being logged out in space? I'm guessing that, since when you log back in it makes you fly in out of nowhere, "logging out" makes your ship computer pick a random spot in space to... warp to. Which doesn't make sense because bubbles.

# ? Jan 27, 2021 20:14

Wibla: Feb 16, 2011

ellbent posted:

I�m getting the idea here that I asked at a pretty bad moment because someone was desperate to set their money on fire at the time, but thanks for the replies on the trucking question.

Think I�ll start a new character just for the tutorial (nine years is a long time) and then do some light, toe-in-the-water deliveries on my real guy to see if it�s what I�m looking for. I just wish the sequel to Rebel Galaxy hadn�t been as flight sim-y.

For that gameplay I'd play Elite instead :v:

# ? Jan 27, 2021 20:19

Frida Call Me: Sep 28, 2001; Boy, you gotta carry that weight
Carry that weight a long time

Wibla posted:

For that gameplay I'd play Elite instead

Yeah this is great advice, ED has about 1% as many "griefers" that are out to ruin your day as a space trucker - and interaction with other players is opt-in.

# ? Jan 27, 2021 20:23

dragonshardz: May 2, 2017

SHISHKABOB posted:

So what's the Lore of being logged out in space? I'm guessing that, since when you log back in it makes you fly in out of nowhere, "logging out" makes your ship computer pick a random spot in space to... warp to. Which doesn't make sense because bubbles.

E-warp - which is what happens when you log out - isn't blocked by bubbles, because CONCORD and Jove tech or something.

# ? Jan 27, 2021 20:39

gadgethugs: Apr 15, 2007

raminasi posted:

You may already know which you want to do, but the two flavors of space trucking that are available are public courier contracts and NPC distribution missions. If you're not sure, see if one or the other clicks more with you.

There is also the "doing your own industry logistics" flavor of space trucking which I subscribe to. Just don't forget to always grab some passengers to keep it interesting.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aYbKWOi-ZRE

# ? Jan 27, 2021 20:58

notaspy: Mar 22, 2009

Can someone give me a quick catch-up on what has happened.

They attempted a jail break, which was sort of successful but came at the cost of a load of other forces.

Sound about right?

# ? Jan 27, 2021 21:09

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# ? Jun 12, 2024 10:08

evilweasel: Aug 24, 2002

notaspy posted:

Can someone give me a quick catch-up on what has happened.

They attempted a jail break, which was sort of successful but came at the cost of a load of other forces.

Sound about right?

they got between one half and two thirds of their trapped titans out at the cost of 400 dreads

definitely a strategic win for them but a very expensive one

# ? Jan 27, 2021 21:20

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