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oldpainless posted:DS9 is by far the best Trek. I think one of the producers described it as “TNG is Superman and DS9 is Batman”. I hope this helps! That's a pretty great way to put it actually. You have one that defines the ideal, and the other one that's like "that's cool, but I have no superpowers and my parents died, how do I get there from here?" Not all of DS9 has aged well, but the majority of it really has. There's a running theme of various societies coming to terms with the fact that either the old ways aren't working anymore, or maybe they're working a little too well as long as nobody asks any hard questions. And by the end they're all course-correcting to various degrees. It's really the most optimistic Trek even though it goes to dark places, because it shows its work. I particularly love the whole "your empire sucks" speech given to Worf near the end: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=as886JnsjtQ
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Jan 26, 2021 17:47
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as a pandemic project I decided to watch + livetweet through all of star trek for the first time (because what else am I going to do inside) I stalled out and took a break early ds9/late tng but I definitely think a lot of the show is very optimistic but in ways in which are very in line with the times they were filmed -- boy does it show sometimes that TOS was filmed in the 60s, and TNG in the late 80s/early 90s just good spectrum of 'cultural issues that they're generally accepting are problems' vs 'cultural blindspots that they haven't fully noticed yet' with 'poo poo the producers wouldn't let them get away with' covering a large portion of the middle
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Jan 27, 2021 11:26
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flatluigi posted:'poo poo the producers wouldn't let them get away with' covering a large portion of the middle There are definitely a few issues very noticeable in their absence and this is almost always why It's nice that there is a gay couple on Discovery but that would have been progressive on TNG, now it's just not being garbage. I appreciate what they're trying to do with Adira and Grey but it has... lacked finesse. I realize Trek is often ham-handed and I am reserving judgement for hindsight on that pair
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Jan 27, 2021 14:42
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"You are seen."
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Jan 27, 2021 16:31
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Was watching that 70s movie Time after Time where Malcom McDowell plays Victorian-era HG Wells chasing Jack the Ripper to modern San Francisco. Of course a modern woman falls for this timid Victorian gentleman and starts to make out with him at her apartment. In regards to his shyness she blurts out “I feel like I’m practically raping you!” which, uh was a really weird line. Fun movie otherwise through.
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Jan 27, 2021 19:38
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They made that into a tv show a few years back but it came out the same time as twenty other time travel shows so nobody watched it.
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Jan 27, 2021 20:06
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Detective No. 27 posted:They made that into a tv show a few years back but it came out the same time as twenty other time travel shows so nobody watched it. It only aired like three episodes and then was cancelled
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Jan 27, 2021 22:21
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Len posted:It only aired like three episodes and then was cancelled Too bad they didn't see that coming.
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Jan 27, 2021 22:30
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Nckdictator posted:Was watching that 70s movie Time after Time where Malcom McDowell plays Victorian-era HG Wells chasing Jack the Ripper to modern San Francisco. Of course a modern woman falls for this timid Victorian gentleman and starts to make out with him at her apartment. In regards to his shyness she blurts out “I feel like I’m practically raping you!” which, uh was a really weird line. From what I know of HG Wells' personal life, him being "sexually timid" is more unrealistic than the time travel
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Jan 28, 2021 02:00
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There's historically been a theme in media about trying to make people(almost exclusively women) with major psychiatric disorders who go off their meds "sexy", "exciting", "quirky" or "geniuses" United States of Tera quote:The show is a representation of a seemingly typical American family who must cope with the daily struggles of dissociative identity disorder (DID). Tara Gregson is a wife and mother of two children in Overland Park, Kansas, a suburb of Kansas City, who has been diagnosed with DID. Suffering side effects from the medication, she is depressed at her inability to focus, to feel, to be intimate, to create art, and to progress in therapy to discover the painful source of her dissociation. With approval from her therapist, she discontinues the medication, knowing that multiple personalities will reemerge No specific examples from that show but it's an extremely 2000s take on mental health where it's summed up as the meds make you a bummer so life is more interesting just leaning into the zany mental breakdown. That the idea of MPD has undergone extreme revision in the last few decades definitely makes it aged poorly given it plays to the manufactured trope of wildly different personalities sharing the same body. I guess the show was popular in 2009 but I've never heard it mentioned ever since then in any context. Black Box quote:Catherine Black (Kelly Reilly) is a famous neurologist who secretly has bipolar disorder; the only person who knows is her psychiatrist, Dr. Helen Hartramph (Vanessa Redgrave), who has been with Catherine since her first break and has been a maternal figure for Catherine since her mother, who also suffered from bipolar disorder, committed suicide quote:Dr. Catherine Black has a meeting with her psychiatrist, Dr. Helen Hartramph, in which she tells the doctor that she briefly went off her meds and made plans to commit suicide. Her boyfriend, Will Renseller, had proposed marriage to her but she didn't answer because he doesn't know about her bipolar disorder. Catherine works at the Neuroscience Research and Treatment Center aka "The Cube." She meets a patient named Anthony who a few months ago showed symptoms of schizophrenia. She then meets the new Chief of Neurosurgery, Dr. Ian Bickman, who is known for being a playboy. Catherine accepts Will's proposal when she tells him her secret but goes off her meds after he shows her a house they might live in as a family. She tells Will she doesn't want children but says they can make it work. While still off her meds, she catches Ian taking Modafinil, which enables him to focus; soon after this, she makes out with him. Catherine then meets with Will and makes passionate love. On the same night, just before she leaves, she throws him the engagement ring. The medical team at The Cube discovers that Anthony has a brain tumor. Ian operates on him and Anthony returns to normal. Anthony tells Catherine he no longer wants to be a physicist but go into neuroscience instead. Catherine later visits her brother Josh, his wife Regan, and their daughter Esme. She cares about Esme very dearly and asks her to be her Maid of Honor. In a flashback, Catherine's mother is seen committing suicide by drowning herself in the ocean. Once Catherine is on her meds again, she goes to see Esme, but Regan tells her that she needs to take a break from them. It is revealed that Esme is Catherine's biological daughter. Catherine then goes to a beach similar to where her mother died. She calls Helen to ask her for reason to go on living. Helen says that her work is the reason to keep on living. Will meets with Catherine, and he says that he will stay and be with her because he likes who Catherine is when she is off her meds. Black Box I at least remember getting a lot of negative press from mental health advocates at the time. 2013/14 seems like the tipping point where people finally realized making a female character with a serious mental illness who goes on/off meds for plot reasons was pretty problematic.
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Feb 1, 2021 07:03
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The Bloop posted:There are definitely a few issues very noticeable in their absence and this is almost always why Generally a mantra among Star Trek fans is 'gently caress Rick Berman' for a good reason.
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Feb 1, 2021 07:40
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pentyne posted:2013/14 seems like the tipping point where people finally realized making a female character with a serious mental illness who goes on/off meds for plot reasons was pretty problematic. And yet Homeland only ended in 2020.
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Feb 1, 2021 12:02
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AceOfFlames posted:And yet Homeland only ended in 2020. I thought about that but that show was about her trying to keep her condition secret and getting meds illegally to manage it, not some weird poo poo like stopping her meds in order to juice her brain up to 400% to crack the case. If it was, it's just as bad. The Black Box one is especially gross given that the pilot episodes starts with her saying she went off the meds and wanting to kill herself, then ends with her fiancee saying he likes her when she's off her meds. Also the whole hoping off the meds and cheating or engaging in some highly emotional destructive behavior then being completely fine a day later once back on.
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Feb 1, 2021 12:17
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In general, 'obvious mental illness as a cute character quirk/obvious fetish bait' is something that was nearly omnipresent for a while in a lot of media and has not aged well at all.
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Feb 1, 2021 12:23
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pentyne posted:There's historically been a theme in media about trying to make people(almost exclusively women) with major psychiatric disorders who go off their meds "sexy", "exciting", "quirky" or "geniuses" I get your point, but I get the feeling you never actually watched The United States of Tara, because from what I recall, it was nothing like your description, and really was stressing the bonds of the family in multiple instances.
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Feb 1, 2021 13:48
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Am reminded of a trend that's taking a while to die, maybe because it's been around in some form or another for way too long, is 'female character who exists mostly to be subject to a downright fetishistic level of suffering and/or humiliation for the protagonist to avenge', and it doesn't really help when they ARE the protagonist and avenging it is meant to show strength. See also 'skinny brunette daughterwaifu who may be ambiguously lesbian but definitely chaste and has to be constantly protected from sexualised violence'.
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Feb 1, 2021 13:58
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Ghost Leviathan posted:Am reminded of a trend that's taking a while to die, maybe because it's been around in some form or another for way too long, is 'female character who exists mostly to be subject to a downright fetishistic level of suffering and/or humiliation for the protagonist to avenge', and it doesn't really help when they ARE the protagonist and avenging it is meant to show strength. See also 'skinny brunette daughterwaifu who may be ambiguously lesbian but definitely chaste and has to be constantly protected from sexualised violence'. It’s most egregious in The Girl With the Dragon Tattoo, nothing else comes close.
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Feb 1, 2021 14:10
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I don’t understand from a plot/premise point of view why the sequel to Taken wasn’t Maggie Grace going around torturing people to save Liam Neeson, but I also do understand very well from a cultural pathology point of view why it wasn’t. EDIT: But I never knew that five years ago there was a tv series about Liam Neeson avenging his murdered sister. I AM GRANDO has a new favorite as of 14:53 on Feb 1, 2021 |
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Feb 1, 2021 14:40
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Did it involve him wandering the streets of Glasgow with an iron bar looking for black men to attack?
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Feb 1, 2021 14:49
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Wiki makes it sound like a paper-bag-test world tour where he brutalizes all kinds of people in two hemispheres.
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Feb 1, 2021 14:55
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It's one of those trends that really got popular with Buffy and only got worse with Xerox copies. Even Buffy could fall into laziness where it wanted to. The series' conceit of the patriarchal "Watcher's Council" that both fights supernatural evil and trains the one Vampire Slayer in the world was really dumb. I'm doing a rewatch with my girlfriend who hasn't seen the show and she keeps asking "Why don't they have a loving trust fund set up for the Slayer? They clearly have money" and I really can't argue that. If anything it would have strengthened Buffy eventually breaking off from them as a story in and of itself, instead of the creepy story they went with (which was fine, it just went to really dark places for no real reason).
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Feb 1, 2021 15:17
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I suspect that Buffy wasn't really expected to get more than a single season, so they probably didn't think too hard about things
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Feb 1, 2021 15:22
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Megillah Gorilla posted:Did it involve him wandering the streets of Glasgow with an iron bar looking for black men to attack? I forgot that this is something the actual Liam Neeson confessed to as he himself began aging poorly.
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Feb 1, 2021 15:24
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mind the walrus posted:It's one of those trends that really got popular with Buffy and only got worse with Xerox copies. Even Buffy could fall into laziness where it wanted to. The series' conceit of the patriarchal "Watcher's Council" that both fights supernatural evil and trains the one Vampire Slayer in the world was really dumb. I'm doing a rewatch with my girlfriend who hasn't seen the show and she keeps asking "Why don't they have a loving trust fund set up for the Slayer? They clearly have money" and I really can't argue that. If anything it would have strengthened Buffy eventually breaking off from them as a story in and of itself, instead of the creepy story they went with (which was fine, it just went to really dark places for no real reason). The reason is that most of the slayers don't live very long. Buffy dies in season 1, and that was pretty normal and expected.
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Feb 1, 2021 15:29
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I've been watching a lot of Best of the Worst and let me tell you, avenging a sexually abused and killed woman isn't a recent trend for movies. That's the premise of like 70% of the action movies they watch.
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Feb 1, 2021 15:48
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If you need an excuse to go white knight But can't stand the idea that you're not right Just go out real late For who can't advocate And no self-serving deeds come to light
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Feb 1, 2021 16:00
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Push El Burrito posted:I've been watching a lot of Best of the Worst and let me tell you, avenging a sexually abused and killed woman isn't a recent trend for movies. That's the premise of like 70% of the action movies they watch. I mean it's basically the plot of Dracula, published in 1897, and I bet that's not even close to being the earliest example.
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Feb 1, 2021 16:13
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Rascar Capac posted:I mean it's basically the plot of Dracula, published in 1897, and I bet that's not even close to being the earliest example. Dracula definitely didn't age well since it's basically about a scary Eastern European immigrant raping innocent British women. AceOfFlames has a new favorite as of 16:18 on Feb 1, 2021 |
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Feb 1, 2021 16:15
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Ghost Leviathan posted:In general, 'obvious mental illness as a cute character quirk/obvious fetish bait' is something that was nearly omnipresent for a while in a lot of media and has not aged well at all. Crazy Ex-Girlfriend basically deconstructs the entire premise of women with mental disorders being sexy and hot or generally being worthy of praise because you defied your doctors.
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Feb 1, 2021 16:25
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sassassin posted:The reason is that most of the slayers don't live very long. Buffy dies in season 1, and that was pretty normal and expected. The reboot comic series just introduced the idea that slayers who last too long are sent on suicide missions in case they start thinking they should have real lives. But even in the series, the Council wants to replace Giles at one point because they think he's too close to his slayer and not willing to see her as disposable.
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Feb 1, 2021 16:25
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Megillah Gorilla posted:Did it involve him wandering the streets of Glasgow with an iron bar looking for black men to attack? Antifa Turkeesian posted:I forgot that this is something the actual Liam Neeson confessed to as he himself began aging poorly. I think it's an example of someone aging well. Volunteering that he had been extremely racist as a young man and had grown to be deeply ashamed of it.
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Feb 1, 2021 16:27
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dracula aged just fine except for van helsing's optimism about Texas joining the union
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Feb 1, 2021 16:44
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indiscriminately posted:I think it's an example of someone aging well. Volunteering that he had been extremely racist as a young man and had grown to be deeply ashamed of it. The most baffling thing about that whole incident is that he brought this up completely unprompted in a press conference. And then he tried to backpedal by saying he would have beaten to death anyone of whatever ethnicity had raped his friend. It was the weirdest thing.
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Feb 1, 2021 19:03
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pentyne posted:There's historically been a theme in media about trying to make people(almost exclusively women) with major psychiatric disorders who go off their meds "sexy", "exciting", "quirky" or "geniuses"
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Feb 1, 2021 23:58
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Mooseontheloose posted:Crazy Ex-Girlfriend basically deconstructs the entire premise of women with mental disorders being sexy and hot or generally being worthy of praise because you defied your doctors. Crazy Ex-Girlfriend handles depression, anxiety, alcoholism, intrusive thoughts and borderline personality disorder with more grace and compassion than I would ever have expected. It's honest in ways most shows aren't. It's just very, very good. e: This song is about poisonous self-loathing for example! https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zgUKQCVieWM HopperUK has a new favorite as of 01:33 on Feb 2, 2021 |
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Feb 2, 2021 01:25
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HopperUK posted:Crazy Ex-Girlfriend handles depression, anxiety, alcoholism, intrusive thoughts and borderline personality disorder with more grace and compassion than I would ever have expected. It's honest in ways most shows aren't. It's just very, very good. One day I'll work out how to get people to watch Crazy Ex-Girlfriend and not be immediately turned off by the title, premise, or structure. A musical sitcom about a 'Crazy Ex-Gilfriend" dealing with mental health issues is possibly the least appealing show you could pitch to me, but I love it so much and want others to love it too.
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Feb 2, 2021 02:55
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IshmaelZarkov posted:One day I'll work out how to get people to watch Crazy Ex-Girlfriend and not be immediately turned off by the title, premise, or structure. Calling it a sitcom is like calling Always Sunny a sitcom. Its technically true but wildly mischaracterizes what makes the show so special. It uses humor and zaniness to mask what is some pretty dark and bleak drama. The entire plot premise sounds like a classic romcom except it plays it straight and highlights how extremely troubling it would be in real life. Also, while so much is played for laughs anyone remotely familer with mental health struggles would immediately spot what is going on in the first season with the main characters behavior. pentyne has a new favorite as of 04:01 on Feb 2, 2021 |
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Feb 2, 2021 03:58
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I don't want to watch a show about that poo poo at all, no matter how self-serious it is.
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Feb 2, 2021 04:07
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IshmaelZarkov posted:One day I'll work out how to get people to watch Crazy Ex-Girlfriend and not be immediately turned off by the title, premise, or structure. Rachel Bloom put every single musical number from the show on Youtube, I'd suggest starting with one of those. Which one is very dependent on what you want to show. My go-to, and the one that got me into it, is Group Hang. It's spoiler-free if that matters, extremely funny, relatable from several angles, and also displays the show's sensibilities by having a verse about an anecdote awkwardly bombing and the entire back end of the song instead devolving into being baffled at how weirdly culturally insensitive the restaurant they're in is. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w7FC_EK44Rw
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Feb 2, 2021 04:16
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mind the walrus posted:It's one of those trends that really got popular with Buffy and only got worse with Xerox copies. Even Buffy could fall into laziness where it wanted to. The series' conceit of the patriarchal "Watcher's Council" that both fights supernatural evil and trains the one Vampire Slayer in the world was really dumb. I'm doing a rewatch with my girlfriend who hasn't seen the show and she keeps asking "Why don't they have a loving trust fund set up for the Slayer? They clearly have money" and I really can't argue that. If anything it would have strengthened Buffy eventually breaking off from them as a story in and of itself, instead of the creepy story they went with (which was fine, it just went to really dark places for no real reason). Because Buffy was also ultimately the director's wank fantasy. A lot of Whedon's stuff has aged pretty badly given what we're not longer able to ignore, Firefly in particular. (though even at the time, people were pointing out a supposedly half Chinese galaxy had very few Chinese people)
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Feb 2, 2021 04:30
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