(Thread IKs:
fart simpson)
|
Unironically owns, Biden needs to bring back the dancin and singin armed forces.
|
#
?
Feb 23, 2021 18:08
|
|
|
|
| # ? May 29, 2024 14:34 |
|
|
Grapplejack posted:China sees it as a way to damage the dollar and US hegemony, most likely Grapplejack posted:Or, and hear me out, maybe they aren't playing 50d chess and are just playing the same lovely game as the west with a different coat of paint So which is it?
|
|
#
?
Feb 23, 2021 18:26
|
|
|
Lostconfused posted:So which is it? quote:During the cold war, the anticommunist ideological framework could transform any data about existing communist societies into hostile evidence. If the Soviets refused to negotiate a point, they were intransigent and belligerent; if they appeared willing to make concessions, this was but a skillful ploy to put us off our guard. By opposing arms limitations, they would have demonstrated their aggressive intent; but when in fact they supported most armament treaties, it was because they were mendacious and manipulative. If the churches in the USSR were empty, this demonstrated that religion was suppressed; but if the churches were full, this meant the people were rejecting the regime's atheistic ideology. If the workers went on strike (as happened on infrequent occasions), this was evidence of their alienation from the collectivist system; if they didn't go on strike, this was because they were intimidated and lacked freedom. A scarcity of consumer goods demonstrated the failure of the economic system; an improvement in consumer supplies meant only that the leaders were attempting to placate a restive population and so maintain a firmer hold over them.
|
|
#
?
Feb 23, 2021 18:45
|
|
|
Lostconfused posted:So which is it? You can do both if your primary goal is the usurpation of the United States as the dominant hegemon and the rerouting of the current imperialist systems to your benefit instead E: to specify in order to do this the most important step is removing the dollar as the reserve currency which is what an enormous amount of US power can be attributed to; if your goal is to replace them you want to chip away at their advantage here and doing things like boosting bitcoin adds to that. ee: another example: the dollar being the reserve currency is largely why the US can lay sanctions on people. If they lost their lead in this regard or a viable alternative was picked up sanctions would lose effectiveness pretty heavily. You can sort of see this now with the Euro and the Iranian sanctions, since Europe hasn't gone in on the sanctions with the US Grapplejack has issued a correction as of 19:00 on Feb 23, 2021 |
|
#
?
Feb 23, 2021 18:50
|
|
|
Grapplejack posted:You can do both if your primary goal is the usurpation of the United States as the dominant hegemon and the rerouting of the current imperialist systems to your benefit instead this is megapraxis
|
|
#
?
Feb 23, 2021 18:53
|
|
|
So a Chinese youtuber I follow make a video about the recent China military released video. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kui_QKpluWw The video has Eng subtitle. He used google earth info to reference land features in the video and pinpoint where everyone were and kind of sorted out the chronological order of how the 4 Chinese soldier got killed. Basically this happened around noon when the Indian soldiers beat 3 men to dead (another 1 was drown during match to the triangle beach), before the mass number of Chinese soldiers arrive later and had an actual clash with the Indians in the evening. There were like over a hundred Indians on the China video, so you figure the Chinese soldier number was double that. My point is basically the Chinese side only published how many people died before the clash, they never said how many Chinese died during the clash. And the clash was old fashion cold weapon stick fight so the dead ratio should be similar. And the Indian side had more than 20 people died too, 20 was the number of dead bodies they count in the first day. As soon as they found out the Chinese side didn't release any number, they also stop talking about it.
|
|
#
?
Feb 23, 2021 19:29
|
|
|
stephenthinkpad posted:Encouraging the global speculation market or financial market is not beneficial to china, because china's core business is opposite of that, which are the manufacturing and infrastructure industries. And you can't realistically grow these "making physical poo poo" business faster than 3% annually. So china would only manipulate cryptocoin if she can realistically crash the dollar, which is not likely, because neither cryto nor rmb are ready to use as an currency substitute outside of china in near term. Given that China seems to be mostly mining and selling cryptocurrency instead of buying and holding it, I don't think there's a long-term goal. I think it's more that China needs money for its actual long-term goals and while bitcoin mining is dirty, so is making iPhones. Bitcoin only becomes an issue if it's taking significant resources away from legitimate economic development or citizens are getting too brazen with using it to evade financial controls.
|
|
#
?
Feb 23, 2021 19:31
|
|
|
Grapplejack posted:You can do both if your primary goal is the usurpation of the United States as the dominant hegemon and the rerouting of the current imperialist systems to your benefit instead lmao "rinky dink bitcoin speculators operating in a legal gray area are actually a Chinese plot against the dollar" has to be one of the more insane trot (or trot-esque) takes on this i've read on this board, and there have been many Bathtub Cheese has issued a correction as of 19:37 on Feb 23, 2021 |
|
#
?
Feb 23, 2021 19:34
|
|
|
gradenko_2000 posted:I tend to believe that if China ever had enough combined hashing power to do a 51% attack on bitcoin*, or some other dumping scheme that would hurt its value at a time when it'd be advantageous to do so, that they'd pull the trigger. they don’t even need to functionally control the network to hurt bitcoin, they can force all the giant miners to shut down (or just cut their power), removing most of the hashing power and leaving the frisbee on the roof for a while Microcline posted:Given that China seems to be mostly mining and selling cryptocurrency instead of buying and holding it, I don't think there's a long-term goal. I think it's more that China needs money for its actual long-term goals this isn’t what’s happening, rich people are just moving their money out of China tax free and some people in the middle class are getting a bit of runoff profit. no bitcoin money is being saved to invest in infrastructure or anything Bathtub Cheese posted:"rinky dink bitcoin speculators operating in a legal gray area are actually a Chinese plot against the dollar" I don’t think it’s A Chinese Plot but it’s also not a rinky dink operation. based on the amount of mining capacity China has (60-65% of the whole network), you can estimate they’re producing roughly the same CO2 output as Bolivia just to mine bitcoin. hundreds of millions have been invested in it and billions more have been moved out of the country.
|
|
#
?
Feb 23, 2021 19:59
|
|
|
the miners in China are selling bitcoin for RMB too but the buyers of that coin are wanting to flip it for USD or euro or whatever. Because, on average, the price goes up even in the short term that's a good deal but also even if it doesn't it gets around capital controls and taxes. Of course the miners might flip straight to USD et al if they have a way to utilize it. Ultimately every bitcoin mined in China is turning Chinese electricity into foreign currency in a foreign account, even tho there is obviously buying and selling going on in China as well. It's not good for China in any way really.
|
|
#
?
Feb 23, 2021 20:14
|
|
|
Grapplejack posted:You can do both if your primary goal is the usurpation of the United States as the dominant hegemon and the rerouting of the current imperialist systems to your benefit instead How is bitcoin going to replace the US dollar as a reserve currency? You completely gloss over this. Anyways, with or without Chinese participation there’s no chance of that happening.
|
|
#
?
Feb 23, 2021 20:15
|
|
|
yah bitcoin is not a currency and has no hope to be
|
|
#
?
Feb 23, 2021 20:16
|
|
|
Chomskyan posted:How is bitcoin going to replace the US dollar as a reserve currency? a warlord could pay their army in bitcoins then tax the territory they conquer in bitcoins
|
|
#
?
Feb 23, 2021 20:21
|
|
|
indigi posted:I don’t think it’s A Chinese Plot but it’s also not a rinky dink operation. based on the amount of mining capacity China has (60-65% of the whole network), you can estimate they’re producing roughly the same CO2 output as Bolivia just to mine bitcoin. hundreds of millions have been invested in it and billions more have been moved out of the country. how diffuse is that capacity, though? bitcoin isn't that big or influential of a share of the global economy, it's like you say, more a facilitator of capital flight and other crimes -- even if Chinese miners were all capable of the lockstep, collective action that this thread seems to think they are because of course "Asians are a hivemind" (AKA the the usual kneejerk racist stance of imperialists with a flaking coat of red spray paint on cspam)
|
|
#
?
Feb 23, 2021 20:32
|
|
|
Chomskyan posted:How is bitcoin going to replace the US dollar as a reserve currency? You completely gloss over this. Anyways, with or without Chinese participation there’s no chance of that happening. It's never going to replace it, but having a dumbass meme currency take up space in exchanges helps to water down the US dollar reserves, and can help push the idea of moving to an 'independent' currency for global trade, something that's been pushed by China / Russia / Saudi Arabia for a while now. Granted SA probably has a religious angle to it in addition to getting away from the US but w/e
|
|
#
?
Feb 23, 2021 20:48
|
|
|
Bitcoin isn’t a currency but a speculative commodity with a ridiculous boom/bust cycle. It isn’t a reliable threat to the USD; now the e-rmb, that is another kettle of fish.
|
|
#
?
Feb 23, 2021 20:54
|
|
|
but all currencies are just speculative commodities
|
|
#
?
Feb 23, 2021 21:20
|
|
|
Grapplejack posted:It's never going to replace it, but having a dumbass meme currency take up space in exchanges helps to water down the US dollar reserves, and can help push the idea of moving to an 'independent' currency for global trade, something that's been pushed by China / Russia / Saudi Arabia for a while now. Granted SA probably has a religious angle to it in addition to getting away from the US but w/e How does bitcoin being around “water down” the US dollar? None of this makes sense. The dollar is the reserve currency because of the massive size of the US economy, the pegging of oil prices in the dollar, and the general political/military influence of the US government. Bitcoin, in addition to having none of those advantages, is an unstable mess with serious built-in limitations that make it completely unviable as any kind of stable currency, let alone the global reserve. Bitcoin being around doesn’t threaten the dollar any more than the hundreds of other existing fiat currencies each of which have many times bitcoins utility. It makes no sense for China to push bitcoin to unseat the dollar
|
|
#
?
Feb 23, 2021 21:28
|
|
|
Chomskyan posted:How does bitcoin being around “water down” the US dollar? people buy bitcoins to avoid USAs control of SWIFT international payment systems. this decreases the power of US hegemony
|
|
#
?
Feb 23, 2021 21:36
|
|
|
Chomskyan posted:How does bitcoin being around “water down” the US dollar? None of this makes sense. The dollar is the reserve currency because of the massive size of the US economy, the pegging of oil prices in the dollar, and the general political/military influence of the US government. Bitcoin, in addition to having none of those advantages, is an unstable mess with serious built-in limitations that make it completely unviable as any kind of stable currency, let alone the global reserve. Bitcoin being around doesn’t threaten the dollar any more than the hundreds of other existing fiat currencies each of which have many times bitcoins utility. It makes no sense for China to push bitcoin to unseat the dollar Have you considered the US may get hit will 2 more different natural disasters and have to print 7 more trillion dollar to handle the budget? This pamdanic is just a preview of more climate change events to come.
|
|
#
?
Feb 23, 2021 21:47
|
|
|
Rutibex posted:but all currencies are just speculative commodities yes but not all speculative commodities are currencies, you silly goose
|
|
#
?
Feb 23, 2021 22:03
|
|
|
Rutibex posted:people buy bitcoins to avoid USAs control of SWIFT international payment systems. this decreases the power of US hegemony no one is buying oil or silicon chips or consumer goods in bitcoins, but when italy needs motherboards from taiwan or south africa needs natural gas from saudi arabia they buy in United States Dollars. you think international remittance is what dollar hegemony means you needs to study the gently caress up
|
|
#
?
Feb 23, 2021 22:05
|
|
|
Antonymous posted:no one is buying oil or silicon chips or consumer goods in bitcoins, but when italy needs motherboards from taiwan or south africa needs natural gas from saudi arabia they buy in United States Dollars. you think international remittance is what dollar hegemony means you needs to study the gently caress up all money is just a mass confidence delusion. dollars and bitcoins don't exist except except in the minds of people, and there is a finite amount of delusion energy. if people lose faith in dollars and buy bitcoin it decreases the power of the dollar mass delusion.
|
|
#
?
Feb 23, 2021 22:25
|
|
|
Bathtub Cheese posted:how diffuse is that capacity, though? bitcoin isn't that big or influential of a share of the global economy, it's like you say, more a facilitator of capital flight and other crimes -- even if Chinese miners were all capable of the lockstep, collective action that this thread seems to think they are because of course "Asians are a hivemind" (AKA the the usual kneejerk racist stance of imperialists with a flaking coat of red spray paint on cspam) the great majority of bitcoin mining in China occurs in bigass warehouses out in the sticks full of racks upon racks of GPUs with enormous cooling capacity. it's not like a bunch of Chinese citizens are running miners in the background on their PCs like folding@home or something; it's all pretty centralized since the only thing that makes it profitable is doing it at scale in out-of-the-way places with very low electricity costs. like someone pointed out earlier, you could spot the heat signatures of these places via satellite and I don't think Chinese miners will do any lockstep collective action (that doesn't benefit themselves), my suggestion is that the government might get involved stephenthinkpad posted:Have you considered the US may get hit will 2 more different natural disasters and have to print 7 more trillion dollar to handle the budget? This pamdanic is just a preview of more climate change events to come. absolutely, but that doesn't make bitcoin a potential replacement. nothing does
|
|
#
?
Feb 23, 2021 22:36
|
|
|
Rutibex posted:people buy bitcoins to avoid USAs control of SWIFT international payment systems. this decreases the power of US hegemony neither east nor west, btc republic
|
|
#
?
Feb 23, 2021 22:37
|
|
|
Rutibex posted:there is a finite amount of delusion energy no there isn't
|
|
#
?
Feb 23, 2021 22:37
|
|
|
Rutibex posted:all money is just a mass confidence delusion. dollars and bitcoins don't exist except except in the minds of people, and there is a finite amount of delusion energy. if people lose faith in dollars and buy bitcoin it decreases the power of the dollar mass delusion. wow ur like so deep bro, drat can I read your economics blog?
|
|
#
?
Feb 23, 2021 23:11
|
|
|
indigi posted:the great majority of bitcoin mining in China occurs in bigass warehouses out in the sticks full of racks upon racks of GPUs with enormous cooling capacity. it's not like a bunch of Chinese citizens are running miners in the background on their PCs like folding@home or something; it's all pretty centralized since the only thing that makes it profitable is doing it at scale in out-of-the-way places with very low electricity costs. like someone pointed out earlier, you could spot the heat signatures of these places via satellite nah there's plenty of True Believer small timers too. I knew a dude who wouldn't shut the gently caress up about bitcoin in like 2012 & I think about him often when I get the FOMO. and people have bitcoin trading apps, idk what they're called, those don't mine tho edit: maybe the difficulty has spiked so that home mining doesn't make sense I don't really follow this stuff that close Antonymous has issued a correction as of 23:17 on Feb 23, 2021 |
|
#
?
Feb 23, 2021 23:14
|
|
|
Rutibex posted:all money is just a mass confidence delusion. dollars and bitcoins don't exist except except in the minds of people, and there is a finite amount of delusion energy. if people lose faith in dollars and buy bitcoin it decreases the power of the dollar mass delusion. Can you use it to pay taxes? Yes = Currency No = Not Currency hth
|
|
#
?
Feb 23, 2021 23:16
|
|
|
Antonymous posted:nah there's plenty of True Believer small timers too. I knew a dude who wouldn't shut the gently caress up about bitcoin in like 2012 & I think about him often when I get the FOMO. and people have bitcoin trading apps, idk what they're called, those don't mine tho yeah the difficulty is now too high for individuals to recoup the cost of power/parts. I’m sure a bunch of people in China run it in the background on their home computer just for some ideological reason but it would contribute a vanishingly small amount to the percentage of mining capacity in China even if you had a million people doing it together as a pool
|
|
#
?
Feb 23, 2021 23:20
|
|
|
I am not saying bitcoin will replace the dollar, I am saying if the US don't actively outlaw cryto business and also keep printing unlimited amount of USD to get stay out of more financial crisis, some international capital will get together and push a viable global trading e-currency. Right now the best candidate is e-rmb but China is not ready to trade huge volume of rmb outside of china, because they want to have more control of the rmb, and the US will actively sabotage every e-rmb application in world trade. But if bitcoin is legal and it open the door of legal crypto payment in a lot of payment platforms, then its going to be very easy to start a new e-currency back by some major international capitals. It could be back by Saudi Arabia-UAE-paypal-VISA-Softbank-Elon Musk and it can be based on some tangible things such as energy. Make 1 energy bux represent 1kw or 1k BTU energy or something. It can be adopted very fast. You guys make it sound like using dual currency is very cumbersome in daily life. No actually a lot of lovely countries with high inflation already deal with dual currency in their everyday life, it's not big deal. You just switch from paper money to bio protected wallet on your phone.
|
|
#
?
Feb 23, 2021 23:50
|
|
|
isnt the limited number of daily transactions possible with bitcoin a major limiting factor in it every being seriously used outside of speculation, tax evasion and drugs
|
|
#
?
Feb 24, 2021 00:49
|
|
|
^yeah, and every “solution” requires a hard fork which at this point is impossible to get everyone on board for stephenthinkpad posted:You guys make it sound like using dual currency is very cumbersome in daily life. l oh sorry I’m only talking about Bitcoin and it’s particular limitations. e-rmb or some other sanely-constructed e currency is totally viable to compete with or displace USD on a medium to long term timeline
|
|
#
?
Feb 24, 2021 01:48
|
|
|
Btw currencies usually have some type of authority that manages its supply (or keeps on printing it forever), gold and bitcoins don’t have that type of regulation. Intangible “Value” itself is primarily a human concept to begin with. Also the entire reason the Fed is sweating bullets over the e-rmb is because they may not actually be able to control it. Also, the EU has been talking up pushing the Euro more as an independent reserve currency (there will probably be a crypto version eventually). Ardennes has issued a correction as of 01:54 on Feb 24, 2021 |
|
#
?
Feb 24, 2021 01:52
|
|
|
Rutibex posted:people buy bitcoins to avoid USAs control of SWIFT international payment systems. this decreases the power of US hegemony this is what Venezuela was hoping the Petro would achieve is the Petro still even supported?
|
|
#
?
Feb 24, 2021 01:52
|
|
|
on the off chance that bitcoin even somehow jumps over all the hurdles, overcomes hoarders, speculatory issues and attacks, wild swings in value, slow transactions and limits, even if it gets past all of that and societies use it to function as a currency base like the gold standard, independent of perfidious Big Government influence - its going to get rapidly get replaced in the next depression when the realities of debt deflation hits people. there's a reason the gold standard failed miserably
|
|
#
?
Feb 24, 2021 01:57
|
|
|
https://twitter.com/NickKristof/status/1364213811952066569
|
|
#
?
Feb 24, 2021 03:37
|
|
|
what are the two Michaels. sounds silly
|
|
#
?
Feb 24, 2021 03:39
|
|
|
Rutibex posted:all money is just a mass confidence delusion. dollars and bitcoins don't exist except except in the minds of people, and there is a finite amount of delusion energy. if people lose faith in dollars and buy bitcoin it decreases the power of the dollar mass delusion. Bitcoin is a financial singularity. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WZEJ4OJTgg8 2/23/2021 - 9:49 PM EST Bitcoin is currently trading at $50,441 USD NocoinerStomper58 has issued a correction as of 03:49 on Feb 24, 2021 |
|
#
?
Feb 24, 2021 03:42
|
|
|
|
| # ? May 29, 2024 14:34 |
|
|
nice edit
|
|
#
?
Feb 24, 2021 03:50
|
|