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Kitty Forman getting billed like third whenever she's on whether or not she actually talks is a stone baller move on her part
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Feb 27, 2021 03:51
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Karma Tornado posted:Kitty Forman getting billed like third whenever she's on whether or not she actually talks is a stone baller move on her part She loving deserves it and a hat tip to her agent for making it happen.
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Feb 27, 2021 03:54
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me, i'm still disappointed with the lack of Sy Ableman post episode 1
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Feb 27, 2021 04:04
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Well, that's pretty much all my guesses wrong, isn't it? This was also the first episode I didn't like. I felt like they spent too much time showing us stuff we either already knew or would have been perfectly content assuming. (Literally everyone's been assuming "Wanda presumably watched sitcoms growing up" and just going with it, because it's an unimportant incidental, not an actual plot point.) Plus it was just way too on the goddamn nose. Yes, thank you WandaVision, I had Nick at Nite growing up and the pastiches were very obvious. Was there a point to stopping the goddamn show flat to go "look, look, these are the actual shows we made clever references to, here's clips from them"? For a show that's been so goddamn smart up until now, the way it suddenly assumed that the audience is idiots was jarring. (The bit with the bomb and its blinking toaster light was another "oh poo poo, we forgot you guys are morons, let's stop and explain it" moment, I thought.) And then, clashing with that, there was stuff that just felt really unexplained and obtuse. Could anyone tell what the gently caress was going on in Agatha's flashback? I guess the intent was that she was somehow overcoming the other witches and absorbing their life forces and that's why she's still alive 300 years later, but that's a best guess and I'm really, really not sure. She was at their mercy, right? Nothing about the staging made it seem like she was suddenly getting one over on the other witches, or was actually doing anything at all. And then when all the other witches die, and Agatha's mom sees that happen, she does the exact same thing and dies the exact same way. It played like it was intentional, like the coven was punishing Agatha by killing themselves. That'll show her! And what'd she do, anyway? Why was her mom like "nah you're evil forever, bye"? So weird. I'm also... not sure about that retcon? Okay, great, Wanda's a baby witch who got supercharged by an Infinity Stone, sure. But it raises an immediate question made all the more glaring by his absence: explain Pietro, then! Seriously, I'm not being sarcastic. If you're going to suddenly posit an external reason for why Wanda survived the Mind Gem process, you actually do have to explain why Pietro didn't die and got powers of his own, then! Powers that, mind you, have nothing to do with witchery! You guys couldn't shell out for five minutes of Aaron Taylor-Johnson's time? Couldn't fit it into the running time of "however the gently caress long we want" and couldn't bear to cut that crucial Dick Van Dyke montage? Overall I'm really worried now, because it felt like not only did I just see all the plates they've kept spinning so ably start to wobble, but the plot didn't move forward at all and I have no idea how the gently caress they're going to wrap every single plot thread satisfactorily next week, especially when so many of them are still so disparate. We need what/who the gently caress Fake Pietro actually is (and by the way if they're seriously going with "oh Agatha just made a random dude, him being played by Evan Peters was just a total coincidence, wink wink" that's too cutesy by half), what happened to Monica, a confrontation between Monica and Wanda, what Evil SWORD Dude's deal is and why he faked the facility attack footage (and if it was to get Wanda to hit the drone so he'd be able to boot up White Vision, that makes no goddamn sense because he'd have no way of knowing that'd work, the drone was unrecoverable unless Wanda hauled it back out of the Hex and threw it at his feet to prove a point and he had no way of predicting that'd happen, and most importantly, he's in charge, if he wants a drone strike he gets one, he doesn't need to justify it, and he could've just said it happened, why spend time and resources making the fake video when it doesn't even convince anyone and the people it doesn't convince don't get a say), we need to know just who/what the gently caress the kids are since now we know that the in-Hex Vision was a construct or whatever and not even his real body, we need Agatha's actual motives, we need a fight between Wanda and Agatha, we need a fight between White Vision and Hex Vision, and we need a confrontation between Wanda and Vision, which ought to be lynchpin of the entire thing, the entire series has been about their relationship and the show has very intentionally been keeping them apart from each other as they each learn the truth. That seems like a pretty tall loving order for 40-odd minutes, doesn't it? I mean, maybe they can do it, most of the show's been great. But yikes. There were bits I liked -- emotionless White Vision is good fanservice and he should only last until next episode before he gets merged with Hex Vision (of course, I've been wrong an awful lot so far, but that seems obvious), and that's exactly as much time as White Vision deserves to ever get in the MCU. Kathryn Hahn descending into moustache-twirling was a disappointment, but Elizabeth Olsen kept acting the gently caress out of her bits, and saved what she could. The Vision/Wanda flashback was lovely, and the entire SWORD visit and trip to real Westview were utterly heartbreaking. That reveal of the deed, that Wanda's been building her dream life on the bones of the actual house that Vision bought for them so they could actually just have a normal life in the suburbs... that was perfect. site posted:it seems to have soft retconned vision and wanda being married pre infinity war. in their IW intro scene i had the impression that they were still kinda early days into a relationship FoneBone posted:you all need to let Dottie go edit: Okay, regarding the scene I found utterly confusing: Apparently there's interplay between the colors blue and purple that makes it more clear if you're not colorblind and never saw the colors change at all? I didn't know me saying that purple is a fake idea in my life would turn out to be foreshadowing. CapnAndy fucked around with this message at 04:51 on Feb 27, 2021 |
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Feb 27, 2021 04:42
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I think the Agatha flashback was meant to imply that she has some kind of connection to an external supernatural force, likely whoever the villain of Doctor Strange 2 is. maybe it's just poorly explained, I dunno, we'll see next week for me, the childhood/sitcom flashbacks imparted significant emotional weight to seeing how and why Wanda created the Hex. yes, the same information could have been conveyed through dialogue, but I don't think that climax would have worked nearly as well without the added context I do agree that it feels like there's too much plot left for one more episode to resolve, even if it's the longest of the series, though
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Feb 27, 2021 05:03
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Yeah, I kinda thought they made it clear Agatha was not joking when she said she could not control what was happening. She opened a door to dark magic and couldn't close it. Even in the present when she's in full villainy she makes it plain to Wanda that her powers are limited and took years of practice to get under some control. I dunno if it's Nightmare or Mephisto or whatever, but that's my guess. I have no strong stakes with Dottie, I just like Emma Caufield and want her around.
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Feb 27, 2021 05:26
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I agree the Agatha flashback was outright bad to the point where Kathryn Hahn was even bad in it compared to the rest of the episode. It's the only scene so far that seemed like a rushed CW level TV scene to me. Like they had a bunch of witches casting a spell to sacrifice someone and they went with purple lasers, then when the flow of energy was meant to reverse there was no change in the CGI or in Agatha's movements or posture. The dialogue, acting, set design, cinematography, CGI, it really stuck out. I liked the rest though.
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Feb 27, 2021 05:36
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The episode was mostly backstory and exposition that would have been better done if slowly spooned out over the previous 7 episodes. The end of the last episode is begging for the audience to want to know what happens next and then the new episode is just explaining what has already happened that we didn't know about.
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Feb 27, 2021 05:41
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Next episode we pretty much have to -Defeat Hayward (Jimmy will do it?) - Return Westview to normal. (Assuming mass memory loss for everyone in the Hex apart from our main characters) - Fight & Merge the 2 Visions - The twins age up - Defeat Agatha? I’m guessing she’ll get defeated but will push Wanda into the Dr Strange 2 film right when she gets her ‘happy ending’. Monica will also have to get a moment to shine. Unfortunately will probably be the last time we see Pietro too.
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Feb 27, 2021 06:06
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I think maybe the kids are just real kids that Wanda picked up for her fantasy, the aging up could be explained by like... I dunno, maybe she's hotswapping the younger kids for older ones on the fly and editing in a morph effect to hide it. I thought the missing kid on the milk carton was a hint at who they actually were, so I'm thinking they'll stop being her kids but will still be around the MCU, with their powers.
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Feb 27, 2021 06:20
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Argue posted:I think maybe the kids are just real kids that Wanda picked up for her fantasy, the aging up could be explained by like... I dunno, maybe she's hotswapping the younger kids for older ones on the fly and editing in a morph effect to hide it. I thought the missing kid on the milk carton was a hint at who they actually were, so I'm thinking they'll stop being her kids but will still be around the MCU, with their powers. She made a Vision from scratch, you don't think she can magic up some kids too? It was horribly abbreviated, but she was pregnant and gave birth to them.
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Feb 27, 2021 06:24
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The whole Scarlet Witch thing is really stuck in my head for some reason. Mostly because it's giving me strong Phoenix vibes, but also because I can't let go of the idea of Wanda going back in time to empower herself, for some reason. Could EVEN MORE time traveling be what starts causing the multiverse problems that Strange has to deal with in his sequel? Also, Quicksilver just being "some guy" strikes me as a lie, or maybe Agatha doesn't realize what she actually did. They already pulled a "MULTIVERSE... PSYCH!" thing before with Far From Home, doing it again seems kinda tacky.
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Feb 27, 2021 07:19
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FilthyImp posted:Cute how Wandavision's latest episode hints as a secret Project Cataract involved with vision, given that cataracts have that whole milky white look aka his emotionless comics version  CapnAndy posted:I felt like they spent too much time showing us stuff we either already knew or would have been perfectly content assuming. quote:Yes, thank you WandaVision, I had Nick at Nite growing up and the pastiches were very obvious. quote:blinking toaster light quote:Could anyone tell what the gently caress was going on in Agatha's flashback? "I guess the intent was that she was somehow overcoming the other witches and absorbing their life forces" She finds a way to turn the attack back on the witches and take their power. Remember the EAT YO MAGIC commercial two episodes ago? Yeah it's a mix of her actually frightened that they can get one over on her and using manipulation to get their guards down "I can't control it help!" And "I'm still good, momma!" Also: "and Agatha's mom sees that happen, she does the exact same thing and dies the exact same way. " Momma Harkness has a claw-like crown effect when she goes witchy so I'm assuming it was something leveled up. She also goes for the chest/heart, mirroring when Wanda goes Super Wiccan! quote:explain Pietro, then! Kaveman posted:That episode really dragged
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Feb 27, 2021 08:00
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bessantj posted:They said it! They said the name! This shows the dangers in letting speculation cloud your view of something. You see, I saw something like this on social media yesterday morning before I watched Wandavision. (I think it was "they said the thing.") And I was CONVINCED that The thing being said was "No More Mutants!" or even better "No, More Mutants!" So the whole time I am watching episode 8, this is clouding my view of the episode. Agatha: Why is your magic so powerful? Me: Because she is a mutant. Wanda: Look there is my mother. And my father. (Agatha gives her this whole "okay, if that's what you believe" look.) Me: He's not her real dad, her real dad is Magneto. Agatha: How did you survive in your home during that Civil war? Me: It was her mutant powers! Agatha: Your magic should have withered and died on the vine. Me: That's why there isn't other (or few) Mutants. In this universe there powers just fade out, but Wansa is going to fix all that! Agatha: I know what you are now! Me: Yeah, a mutant. Agatha: I thought that it was just a legend! Me: Here it is, she's going to say it! Agatha: You are....The Scarlet Witch! Me: Wut? (Long farting noise.) I get that this is something entirely in my head, but I feel so disappointed that it wasn't the cool thing it really seemed to be building towards.
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Feb 27, 2021 11:42
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I don't think you're actually too far off. They're definitely setting up the prospect that Wanda's powers are an aspect of her being a mutant. That's literally how her original powers worked; her mutation gave her the ability to hex things. The fact that Agatha specifically refers to it as a probability hex here is direct reference to her comics mutant power. So yes, the big reveal of this specific episode is that she's the fabled Scarlet Witch, a super special magic user foretold to be able to use chaos magic. But I'll wager that the next step here is revealing that she's also a mutant...and furthermore, that Pietro never actually interacted with the Mind Stone at all, and that his superspeed was also something inborn; we all simply assumed that he must have through some sort of Hydra experimentation but the fact is it was never actually stated, much less shown. BrianWilly fucked around with this message at 12:49 on Feb 27, 2021 |
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Feb 27, 2021 12:47
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Agatha flat out says that Wanda stopped that bomb from going off with her powers that she wasn't supposed to have yet. She's a mutant even if they didn't say it there.
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Feb 27, 2021 17:36
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Vince MechMahon posted:Agatha flat out says that Wanda stopped that bomb from going off with her powers that she wasn't supposed to have yet. She's a mutant even if they didn't say it there. Is Doctor Strange a mutant?
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Feb 27, 2021 17:38
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Klungar posted:Is Doctor Strange a mutant? No, but he also had to be trained in how to use magic and could not just do it. Just like the comics, her mutant power is an inherent ability to tap into this stuff. If you're saying that her powers being magic based here means she's not a mutant then she's never been one in the comics either. Your choice.
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Feb 27, 2021 17:41
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Wanda isn't a mutant in the comics anymore.
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Feb 27, 2021 18:39
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Skwirl posted:Wanda isn't a mutant in the comics anymore. Wasn't this a big retcon from when they didn't have the X-Men movie rights?
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Feb 27, 2021 18:54
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Vince MechMahon posted:Wasn't this a big retcon from when they didn't have the X-Men movie rights? Yeah, but it hasn't been re-retconned yet and ATM all the mutants loving hate Wanda for the whole "No More Mutants" thing.
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Feb 27, 2021 18:55
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Currently in the comics, since at least 2015, she's supposed to have "never been" a mutant. This was, of course, a notoriously sloppy retcon that was made specifically to line her up with the MCU version, who debuted in the same year. But make no mistake: she's going to be a mutant here. It doesn't matter what's currently in the comics; as before, the MCU will determine what the comics do, not the other way around. Marvel has mutants back, they know we want mutants, they're already laying down the setup. They didn't have to change the Age of Ultron origin if they didn't want to; Wanda could just as easily be some sort of destined superwitch because the Mind Stone made her that way. Instead, they specifically went out of their way to retcon the source of her powers to say that Wanda has always had the ability to alter probability, which was her original mutant power, and that the Infinity Stone amplified it.
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Feb 27, 2021 18:58
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BrianWilly posted:Currently in the comics, since at least 2015, she's supposed to have "never been" a mutant. This was, of course, a notoriously sloppy retcon that was made specifically to line her up with the MCU version, who debuted in the same year. Oh yeah absolutely. The movies/tv shows aren't going to follow the comics except for when they want to. I can't remember if it was this thread or a different one that had someone who thought there was a comic of Wandavision that was basically the same as the show up until I want to say this was when there were just 3 episodes, and I just thought "no, none of the movies or tv shows have ever been like that, why would this be different?"
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Feb 27, 2021 19:03
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BrianWilly posted:Currently in the comics, since at least 2015, she's supposed to have "never been" a mutant. This was, of course, a notoriously sloppy retcon that was made specifically to line her up with the MCU version, who debuted in the same year. She is not a mutant. She had a natural affinity for magic. It is explicit.
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Feb 27, 2021 19:21
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Jagermonster posted:She is not a mutant. She had a natural affinity for magic. It is explicit. What are you talking about, the comics or the show?
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Feb 27, 2021 19:32
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I mean, nothing's been completely confirmed yet so you can believe what you want, but "affinity for magic" is literally how Wanda's mutant powers worked sooo v vLike I don't think people are grokking that they are reproducing her "original origin" pretty much word for word here. Moreover, if Wanda' just naturally magical, then what does that make Pietro? If the Mind Stone didn't literally give her powers but just amplified what was there, then why did Pietro get superspeed? Is that just an affinity for magic as well? He went through, what, a completely different Hydra experiment?
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Feb 27, 2021 19:35
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Marvel Studios/Feige's approach tends to be to take well-known or received plots from the comics, or even just a few striking panels/moments, and then work them into a story that fits the unique entity the movie franchise is. So you get certain moments that are beat for beat from the comics almost, like Vision being dissected by the government while Wanda watches aghast, or "Who the hell is Bucky?", but the surrounding storylines vary from being similar in general (Winter Soldier) to barely at all (WandaVision).
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Feb 27, 2021 19:37
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BrianWilly posted:
Maybe Pietro got touched by the speed stone.
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Feb 27, 2021 19:44
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Skwirl posted:Yeah, but it hasn't been re-retconned yet and ATM all the mutants loving hate Wanda for the whole "No More Mutants" thing. When and if that un-retcon that I can't wait for the issue of X-Men where she goes to Krakoa and everyone has to awkwardly be like "ooo sorry we kind of indoctrinated a bunch of kids to see you as our Satan figure... well, enjoy the Tiki Bar"
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Feb 27, 2021 19:45
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BrianWilly posted:Currently in the comics, since at least 2015, she's supposed to have "never been" a mutant. This was, of course, a notoriously sloppy retcon that was made specifically to line her up with the MCU version, who debuted in the same year. It wasn't just a sloppy retcon. It was one that never made any sense. I am going to reread Axis so I have the exact order of things down, but I remember it being so dumb and it led to a bunch of nothing stories.
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Feb 27, 2021 19:46
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TwoPair posted:When and if that un-retcon that I can't wait for the issue of X-Men where she goes to Krakoa and everyone has to awkwardly be like "ooo sorry we kind of indoctrinated a bunch of kids to see you as our Satan figure... well, enjoy the Tiki Bar" Especially given the absolute loving monsters they've welcomed with open arms.
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Feb 27, 2021 19:46
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Jagermonster posted:She is not a mutant. She had a natural affinity for magic. It is explicit. Comic folk are just waiting for the shoe to drop wrt She's A Mutant. It's been there ever since they teased Wanda and Pietro as results of infinity stone manipulation. The development is Agatha says she's unique > was unique before the stone amped her up > mutant ability that gave her access to chaos magics. MCU folk just accept that her powers were stone-based all along, just like Danvers. Here it's more of a case of stone unlocked full potential of latent abilities > is once-in-an-eon Megawitch as a result. I think they did an awesome job establishing a foil with Wanda/Agatha. Ags also found a way to unlock a bunch of power (either through the Darkhold book, study, or deal with devil poo poo), but then required a shitload of training to do High Level poo poo that Wanda sleepwalking through. The Pietro question could either be she prob-hexed him unintentionally when it was his turn and it gave him speed powers, or Mutant! FilthyImp fucked around with this message at 19:52 on Feb 27, 2021 |
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Feb 27, 2021 19:50
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Retcons at the present made it so Wanda and Pietro both are not mutants and are not the children of Magneto, right? So bizarre.
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Feb 27, 2021 19:52
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Skwirl posted:Especially given the absolute loving monsters they've welcomed with open arms. And put into positions of government! It's fine, though. Go have a drink with the Shadow King. Be all right.
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Feb 27, 2021 19:52
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tbh i don't see how being able to use magic as a kid necessitates being a mutant but also if that's how they want to play it i don't really mind either
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Feb 27, 2021 19:54
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Dawgstar posted:And put into positions of government! It's fine, though. Go have a drink with the Shadow King. Be all right. Here children, listen to this story about how terrible the Scarlet Witch is from your Aunty Selene.
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Feb 27, 2021 19:54
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site posted:tbh i don't see how being able to use magic as a kid necessitates being a mutant but also if that's how they want to play it i don't really mind either It's basically "A PROBABILITY HEX? LOCALIZED IN YOUR APARTMENT? AT THAT AGE? WITHOUT TRAINING? Can I see how you did it?"
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Feb 27, 2021 20:03
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Looking for a sanity check here, I think I may be too in the weeds looking for clues. I thought something Heyward said in the scene with Wanda at Sword headquarters was really strange. He said something to her akin to "You're not going to bring him back to life, are you?" That immediately jumped out to me as odd, because there is nothing at all in what we've seen and know about Wanda up to this point that would lead someone to believe she had the power or capability to bring Vision back to life. The only thing I can possibly think is that they both had "infinity stone" energy or some poo poo which is why she could destroy his in Infinity War, but that's a stretch in assuming that she could bring him back. Anyways it struck me as really weird, as if it were someone giving her the idea in the back of her head to bring him back to life. And yet he shouldn't know that she could possibly do that. Am I thinking too much about this? mikeraskol fucked around with this message at 20:33 on Feb 27, 2021 |
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Feb 27, 2021 20:30
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no, it was a strange thing for him to say
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Feb 27, 2021 20:37
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We have movies plotted out with release schedules through 2023 right now, tons of film and TV shows, and that's without Covid interference pushing everything back. Oh and none of them are X-Men or X-Men related. Just from a practical standpoint I don't think it's super likely they'd define one character as a mutant now and then just sort of keep that weird status quo for the next several years. Maybe in 2025 when there's finally an X-Men movie they'll toss in a "there have been others before us" kind of line, but I don't think it's about to matter.
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Feb 27, 2021 20:45
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