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so since we've expanded out to "compact" SUVs I'm seeing the Equinox with the turbo has 3500lbs of towing capacity and is pretty affordable. I assume it won't be as nice inside or to drive as a european or japanese car but anything I should know? Is it bad? e. there's 2018s and 2019s with decently low mileage, AWD and the turbo, well within our price range. Leperflesh fucked around with this message at 03:32 on Mar 9, 2021 |
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Mar 9, 2021 03:27
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Mr Interweb posted:mostly to save gas. the additional goodies that come standard are really nice icing, tho I'm assuming the hybrid costs more. Calculate how much the difference between the hybrid and trim you want. Estimate how much money you'll be spending on gas per year with both hybrid and non-hyrbid. How much are you saving per year and how long will it take to recoup the extra initial cost? mariooncrack fucked around with this message at 03:32 on Mar 9, 2021 |
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Mar 9, 2021 03:29
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mariooncrack posted:I'm assuming the hybrid costs more. Calculate how much the difference between the hybrid and trim you want. That's the amount of money you'll be spending to "save" on gas money. Estimate how much money you'll be spending on gas per year. How long will it take to recoup that cost? seems to be a $3,500 difference and according to https://www.fueleconomy.gov i'd break even within 5 years.
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Mar 9, 2021 03:46
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If you're comfortable with that, then go try it out. I've had friends ask the same question and it turned out that it would take almost a decade to offset the initial cost.
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Mar 9, 2021 04:03
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mariooncrack posted:If you're comfortable with that, then go try it out. really? do they not drive a lot? i used it calculating 12k miles/r which is average
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Mar 9, 2021 04:08
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Mr Interweb posted:really? do they not drive a lot? i used it calculating 12k miles/r which is average You might want to check your math. I'm seeing about 35 mpg for the regular Corolla versus 50 for the hybrid 12000 mi/yr x 1 gal/35 mi = 342 gallons per year for the regular Corolla 12000 mi/yr 1 gal/50 mi = 240 gallons per year for the hybrid That's a difference of about 100 gallons of gasoline per year. At $2.50 per gallon, your savings are going to be about $250 per year. So it will take you about 14 years to make up the difference. Make sure you're speccing out the two to identical trim levels so the hybrid system is the only difference. You also may have other reasons for preferring the hybrid other than pure economics, which is fine.
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Mar 9, 2021 04:30
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Bear in mind the hybrid is probably also better for the environment if that’s a factor for you.
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Mar 9, 2021 06:13
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Speaking of, anybody heard anything interesting about that zf phev transmission jeep is using?
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Mar 9, 2021 06:14
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I haven't seen $2.50 gas around here since ~2008. If it's in California, figure more like $3.25, higher in cities.
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Mar 9, 2021 07:50
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Mr Interweb posted:cool. what about heated seats? nice but unnecessary? my heater's been broken for a while so just having a functional one will probably be a godsend by itself. Obviously depends on where you live. We have real winters here so I love every piece of heater equipment I have. Seat heaters are must, steering wheel heater is also nice but not really necessary. I also love my park auxiliary heater but I have understood those are uncommon in the US.
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Mar 9, 2021 08:47
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Traffic jam assist where the car starts/stops/steers is magic. I agree with other posters that adaptive cruise makes longer journeys much less tiring, especially if the lane following is good (Audi I'd like an auto horn feature to beep at people who pull into a different lane without looking on the autoroute.
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Mar 9, 2021 11:47
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Mr Interweb posted:so i was gonna think about getting a standard corolla, but the corolla hybrid is lookin' mighty fine and comes with a lot of the stuff you guys already mentioned (plus it saves me from having to decide which trim to get). I drove one thinking because it's a hybrid it might have some decent torque but was disappointed, it's very anemic and even more bland than a regular Corolla, at least the XSE model looks really cool, has better features and drives better overall. The Corolla Hybrid literally looks and drives like an appliance on wheels. The XSE is way better imo, the only reason I would buy the Corolla hybrid is for the fuel economy and that's it. MSRP of the XSE is a bit more, but I'm guessing with the popularity of the Hybrid you should be able to get an XSE even cheaper if you know how to work the local dealers against each other. And for me the way it (and hybrids in general) transitions from gas to electric motor driving around is extremely annoying, I'd rather go full EV or just stick with ICE. Applebees Appetizer fucked around with this message at 14:33 on Mar 9, 2021 |
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Mar 9, 2021 14:25
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So let’s say you go to CarMax and look up some cars. Can you put a reasonable amount of trust in the vehicle history reports? Some of them are local/state government reported and I know owners don’t always report things, but I’m mainly wondering about unrepaired recalls.
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Mar 9, 2021 14:30
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Applebees Appetizer posted:I drove one thinking because it's a hybrid it might have some decent torque but was disappointed, it's very anemic and even more bland than a regular Corolla, at least the XSE model looks really cool and has better features, the Corolla Hybrid literally looks and drives like an appliance on wheels. The XSE is way better imo, the only reason I would buy the Corolla hybrid is for the fuel economy and that's it. MSRP of the XSE is a bit more, but I'm guessing with the popularity of the Hybrid you should be able to get an XSE even cheaper if you know how to work the local dealers against each other. the corolla isan appliance on wheels, if you want something different you should look elsewhere the transition is odd at first but I promise you, you get used to it very quickly
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Mar 9, 2021 14:33
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KYOON GRIFFEY JR posted:the corolla isan appliance on wheels, if you want something different you should look elsewhere I get that, but the XSE is a huge step up from the blandness of the Hybrid. At least the XSE is trying really hard not to be an appliance 
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Mar 9, 2021 14:35
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the civic is also a huge step up from the blandess of the corolla like if you buy a corolla it's because you like plain white bread toast with salted land o lakes butter to go with your oatmeal, which is what you eat for breakfast every single day at precisely 8:15 in the morning in your kitchen painted in gray, white, and taupe shades. it's fine if you like this. lol no it isn't jesus christ have standards people but to further torture this metaphor, if you like this poo poo you can't complain that the oatmeal is bland because that is the point
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Mar 9, 2021 14:41
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life is killing me posted:So let’s say you go to CarMax and look up some cars. Can you put a reasonable amount of trust in the vehicle history reports? Some of them are local/state government reported and I know owners don’t always report things, but I’m mainly wondering about unrepaired recalls. Vehicle history reports in general should be taken with a grain of salt - mostly for what they don't include. I've never heard of a report that had something listed that truly never happened, but it's quite easy for a vehicle to have a minor to moderate crash that never hits a Carfax. Recalls in particular are a different bag because there is a reporting system specifically for that, and it's managed by NHTSA. If you get the VIN and pop it into safercar.gov NHTSA will tell you whether or not there's a recall outstanding. Recalls are handled by manufacturer dealerships and it would be an Extremely Bad Day if a dealership was found to be flagging cars as recall complete without doing the work.
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Mar 9, 2021 15:02
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To add to that, an open recall isn't a particularly big deal to me. If there's an open recall you can take the car to the dealer and they are obligated to fix it, for free. It's a little bit of a pain but not a reason to pass on the car if you negotiate down a bit. The only issue is if there are parts availability problems. I had an open recall on a Focus for over a year because they couldn't get the door latch parts in to do the job.
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Mar 9, 2021 15:03
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IOwnCalculus posted:Vehicle history reports in general should be taken with a grain of salt - mostly for what they don't include. I've never heard of a report that had something listed that truly never happened, but it's quite easy for a vehicle to have a minor to moderate crash that never hits a Carfax. Yeah the crash reporting is iffy to me though I’ve found some vehicles with reported crashes and registration history. The only recalls I’m worried about are safety-related for the vehicles I’m looking at, but these are a few years old and I’d be surprised if there were open recalls—less surprised if there was an accident. KYOON GRIFFEY JR posted:To add to that, an open recall isn't a particularly big deal to me. If there's an open recall you can take the car to the dealer and they are obligated to fix it, for free. It's a little bit of a pain but not a reason to pass on the car if you negotiate down a bit. That’s fair, I’m worried about safety recalls mostly, and still doing research on the pickup model and year I’m looking at for recall info and common problems. On a related note, one that stands out is from Carvana; they offer a 7-day trial/test drive and I’m wondering if this is worth it to have the vehicle inspected during that time or is Carvana worth dealing with at all
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Mar 9, 2021 15:19
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KYOON GRIFFEY JR posted:the civic is also a huge step up from the blandess of the corolla That depends I think. If you want a manual yes definitely, the manual in the Civic is worlds better than the corolla manual. For the CVT I think Toyota wins that one because Toyota makes the best CVT in the business. This is comparing the Civic Sport and Corolla XSE. I would also argue the the interior of the XSE is better, the Civic's interior feels really cheap imo.
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Mar 9, 2021 15:20
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the civic is still absolutely a more engaging drive
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Mar 9, 2021 16:00
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Red_Fred posted:Bear in mind the hybrid is probably also better for the environment if that’s a factor for you. Why do you think that? The difference in fuel used doesn't make up for the pile of toxic waste generated to mine and manufacture the batteries. All you're doing is shifting the pollution to <insert poor county here>.
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Mar 9, 2021 16:03
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life is killing me posted:On a related note, one that stands out is from Carvana; they offer a 7-day trial/test drive and I’m wondering if this is worth it to have the vehicle inspected during that time or is Carvana worth dealing with at all Carvana and Carmax both have similar policies. If you do not trust your own ability to inspect the car in this timeframe, it is absolutely worth your time and money to pay for an independent inspection before you run out the clock / miles on the return period. In general with either of these you're going to pay a premium compared to what you might be able to find even at a regular dealership in your market, let alone a private seller. If you're looking at oddball stuff you might be able to find a good deal, especially if it's something where there simply aren't many available in your local-ish market.
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Mar 9, 2021 16:11
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IOwnCalculus posted:Carvana and Carmax both have similar policies. If you do not trust your own ability to inspect the car in this timeframe, it is absolutely worth your time and money to pay for an independent inspection before you run out the clock / miles on the return period. I’d been reading you can get decent prices compared to dealerships just because they have less overhead, but have been reading some damning stuff about Carvana in particular, especially with their trade-in offers and the entire trade-in process. Some sites are saying the offers you get from Carvana can typically be less than that of CarMax or from a normal dealership somehow, which is weird to me. It makes me just want to shop local dealerships and find competitive pricing to negotiate a bit rather than deal with some service that leaves no room to negotiate. I went into this thinking it would be better to deal with a service like Carvana and not have to haggle or mess with a salesperson—and now I’m kind of thinking that dealing with a salesperson isn’t so bad as long as I don’t accept tacked-on options I don’t need and know what I’m buying...basically keep a clear head and keep myself from getting bamboozled e: I’m not necessarily looking at oddball stuff but am looking for a specific make/model/trim/options that seem to be scarce locally in the model years I’m looking at, and I’m getting a wake-up call on what I should expect to pay for what I want and how many miles on it. life is killing me fucked around with this message at 16:24 on Mar 9, 2021 |
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Mar 9, 2021 16:22
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Motronic posted:Why do you think that? The difference in fuel used doesn't make up for the pile of toxic waste generated to mine and manufacture the batteries. Dude, I know you're just trolling here with circa-2008 Rush Limbaugh's hottest takes, but this is the thread where non-car people come to learn about cars. Lifecycle analysis is a huge complex subject that can't actually be boiled down to "this car is objectively better than that car," but the overwhelming consensus among everybody who studies environmental impacts of transportation is that the impact of building hybrids and BEVs is worth the tradeoff versus tailpipe carbon emissions. Anybody who cares about the environmental impact of their car purchase should be choosing non-car transportation as much as possible, then buying a fuel-efficient used car made in the past decade or so and keeping it in good repair as long as possible, both to keep their own emissions down and to reduce their contribution to the demand for the hugely energy-intensive process that is building any new car.
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Mar 9, 2021 16:30
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Whenever people bring up the environmental impact of 'green' technologies, they usually don't do a comparison between the green technologies and 'non-green' technologies. Most of the time they compare the technologies to some platonic ideal technology. That is assuming that they don't get their facts incorrect. For an off-topic example, it is commonly stated on this forum that solar cells use rare earth metals, and that's not true at all. I think that particular belief comes from cadmium telluride solar cells. Neither Cd or Te are rare earth metals, CdTe cells aren't even the most popular kind of solar cell and the material inputs to make the cells aren't even substantial, the CdTe material being a very thin film on a glass plate.
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Mar 9, 2021 16:40
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Space Gopher posted:Dude, I know you're just trolling here with circa-2008 Rush Limbaugh's hottest takes, but this is the thread where non-car people come to learn about cars. It's not a hot take: it's fact. Inconvenient fact, but nonetheless. Most hybrids need to be driven for at least a couple hundred thousand miles to get anywhere near making up for their externalized manufacturing costs to the environment. If you want to dispute something I post you're going to need to try a lot harder than calling it a hot take. Save the lithium cells for where they matter in cars in regards to environmental payoff: EVs.
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Mar 9, 2021 16:43
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Motronic posted:Why do you think that? The difference in fuel used doesn't make up for the pile of toxic waste generated to mine and manufacture the batteries. 
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Mar 9, 2021 16:45
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life is killing me posted:I’d been reading you can get decent prices compared to dealerships just because they have less overhead, but have been reading some damning stuff about Carvana in particular, especially with their trade-in offers and the entire trade-in process. Some sites are saying the offers you get from Carvana can typically be less than that of CarMax or from a normal dealership somehow, which is weird to me. It makes me just want to shop local dealerships and find competitive pricing to negotiate a bit rather than deal with some service that leaves no room to negotiate. I went into this thinking it would be better to deal with a service like Carvana and not have to haggle or mess with a salesperson—and now I’m kind of thinking that dealing with a salesperson isn’t so bad as long as I don’t accept tacked-on options I don’t need and know what I’m buying...basically keep a clear head and keep myself from getting bamboozled I think the general consensus is that CarMax and the like will never be the best deal you can find (especially compared to private sales), but probably won't be the worst deal either. They're a compromise for people who value a no-haggle experience, salespeople who have no reason to be dishonest because they're not on commission, and the ability to cross shop tons of different makes and models at once. I'm sure you could get a better deal at a dealership with some work, but it's no guarantee. As for trade ins, we went to CarMax and got an offer from them (which was basically right where KBB and other online sites estimated it would be, but less than we likely could have gotten with some work on Craigslist/FB marketplace). The dealer where we bought offered far less. They only went up when we showed them the CarMax offer, which they grudgingly matched.
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Mar 9, 2021 17:11
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Motronic posted:It's not a hot take: it's fact. Inconvenient fact, but nonetheless. Most hybrids need to be driven for at least a couple hundred thousand miles to get anywhere near making up for their externalized manufacturing costs to the environment. You've provided absolutely nothing but your rear end as a source for your claims. If you're saying that a Prius needs to go 200k mi before it nets out as an environmental benefit over a similar non-hybrid car, then I've got good news for you about their typical lifespan and the expected environmental impact of "buy a Prius and drive it until it don't go no more" strategies. Adding "EVs are a better use of those batteries" means your whole argument makes no mathematical sense. A Corolla Hybrid battery pack is 1.3 kWh - that's roughly standard for a non-plug-in small hybrid. A Bolt is a roughly comparable EV; it uses a 66 kWh battery. If 1.3 kWh of batteries and a much smaller electric motor is enough to cancel out the Corolla hybrid's fuel economy advantage over an ICE-only Corolla under whatever metrics you're using, then the Bolt will never ever catch up; it's 50 times worse. Yet, somehow, despite the extensive research on automotive lifecycle impacts conducted at places like Argonne, nobody's ever seen fit to point this out. Perhaps this is the work of the same people who covered up the 100 mpg carburetor?
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Mar 9, 2021 17:17
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Motronic posted:Does it also do the thing where it hijacks all bluetooth sources it's been paired with when it's been turned on so like, even if you were listening to something/on your phone with headphones and you turn the tractorcar on your podcast stops/it takes over your drat phone call? I don't think I've been in a situation like that. I have had to scramble for my phone to hit "pause" when I've turned the car on to use the 12V outlet and suddenly a random song starts playing. I usually start playing whatever I want to listen to before I start the car. The aggressive cruise control is a much bigger problem, honestly. I don't need the engine jumping to 4000 rpm just to stop me from going 110 km/h when my cruise control is set to 105.
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Mar 9, 2021 17:42
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incogneato posted:I think the general consensus is that CarMax and the like will never be the best deal you can find (especially compared to private sales), but probably won't be the worst deal either. They're a compromise for people who value a no-haggle experience, salespeople who have no reason to be dishonest because they're not on commission, and the ability to cross shop tons of different makes and models at once. I'm sure you could get a better deal at a dealership with some work, but it's no guarantee. CarMax seems like a decent decision I guess, just wasn’t wowed by their prices I saw for the pickups I looked at. Looking at 2014-2017 RAMs and the prices for a 2014 Laramie with 55k-60k miles were a lot higher than I expected for a truck that isn’t CPO and is 7 years old. Yeah they seem in good condition and I’m probably expecting too much but drat.
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Mar 9, 2021 17:44
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KYOON GRIFFEY JR posted:the civic is also a huge step up from the blandess of the corolla The current gen Corolla is perfectly fine though? My father in law has a base model and it’s not really any worse than a base Civic.
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Mar 9, 2021 17:49
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Hybrid vs not really depends on the specifics for a car. For example with a rav4, an equivalent hybrid costs $1100 more than the conventional. The conventional AWD MPG is 29 combined vs 40 MPG combined. If gas is 2.50/gal the break even point here is 46k miles. If your gas costs more it will be way sooner. On top of that the hybrid powertrain has more power and is more refined. So unless you wanted one of the specific rav4 models with certain types of mechanical AWD systems, there is absolutely no reason to ever buy the non hybrid model. The differences may not be as stark for every hybrid model. I disagree about hybrids being worse for the environment. If there is any substantial fuel consumption difference, these differences will end up resulting in a total lifecycle emission being lower, usually way lower, than the less efficient car, and this carries over very well to PHEV and EV cars. See https://afdc.energy.gov/vehicles/electric_emissions.html. EVs have drastically higher manufacturing impact but even on a dirty grid will pass the break even point on emissions within a few years vs a gas car. And the grid will get better over time. Now on the corolla example the price difference really kills the deal. $3125 extra for the hybrid is a ton at that price point. And it only comes as an LE trim. If you drive the hybrid a ton it will make up for the cost difference but it really is marginal.
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Mar 9, 2021 18:01
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Bouillon Rube posted:The current gen Corolla is perfectly fine though? My father in law has a base model and it’s not really any worse than a base Civic. The base Civic does drive better overall and has a better motor in terms of power delivery (K series FTW), especially with the manual transmission. BUT the quality of the interior of the Corolla is better, and Toyota has a better CVT if you prefer automatics. Exterior styling is pretty even imo. The Corolla's engine is anemic and has no power band at all so if you like a peppy, torquey motor the Civic is clearly better, but if you're ok with slow as balls with average handling and better fuel economy you'd be fine with a Corolla. It's all personal preference, but base model to base model the Civic is a better car overall if driving dynamics are at all important to you.
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Mar 9, 2021 18:15
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Bouillon Rube posted:The current gen Corolla is perfectly fine though? My father in law has a base model and it’s not really any worse than a base Civic. oatmeal is perfectly fine, too. it doesn't drive as well as the Civic; whether or not you care about this is a personal question.
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Mar 9, 2021 18:51
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"but lithium mining" said the Jeremy clarkson fan
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Mar 9, 2021 19:10
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Deteriorata posted:You might want to check your math. I'm seeing about 35 mpg for the regular Corolla versus 50 for the hybrid uh...yeah, looks like the savings wasn't comparing the hybrid to the standard, but rather to the average car (which is at 27 mpg). so i was doing some more browsing, and so tell me what you guys think of this. instead of a corolla hybrid or even a corolla, what if i get something like a kia forte or hyndai accent? - several thousands of dollars cheaper than a corolla - mileage is either as good or even slightly better - they have a much longer warranty of 5 years and 10 for powertrain - they seem almost as reliable as corollas (i believe hyndai is even more reliable than honda. at least for the accent anyway) thoughts?
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Mar 9, 2021 22:03
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Leperflesh posted:so since we've expanded out to "compact" SUVs I'm seeing the Equinox with the turbo has 3500lbs of towing capacity and is pretty affordable. I assume it won't be as nice inside or to drive as a european or japanese car but anything I should know? Is it bad? just signal boosting since I edited this after I posted it: any thoughts, plus or minus, on the Equinox? e. oh hey there's also a diesel one, with the 1.6L rare as hen's teeth, 2018-19 only, doesn't have higher tow capacity, mostly 2WD, and cost more, but I did find one. https://www.autotrader.com/cars-for-sale/vehicledetails.xhtml?listingId=577411852 Leperflesh fucked around with this message at 23:51 on Mar 9, 2021 |
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Mar 9, 2021 22:15
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My experience regarding carvana prices: the car I bought from them was the cheapest 2016+ manual sportwagen with under 30k miles from any dealer in the nation. So yeah for rare stuff it can certainly be a good option.
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Mar 9, 2021 23:36
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