|
Harrow posted:Yeah, this would be a big improvement, I think. I forgot a will seed in the bank palace and had to go back and accidentally ran my alert ranking to 100% ignoring all the cameras, even then I got in a couple battles that were longer than usual and once I stopped being hounded by enemies I just used a calmer-thingie and knocked it back down
|
#
?
Mar 11, 2021 18:19
|
|
. It's help managing a system that I never had to think about in the first place.
|
|
| # ? May 25, 2024 00:53 |
|
|
I think, at absolute minimum, her main ability feels backwards. She's a journalist, so she Having her guarantee Treasure Demons would also be cool, but I think it should be a later rank ability, if not a capstone, rather than incidentally happen along the way.
|
|
#
?
Mar 11, 2021 18:24
|
|
|
The best Devil SL in the series is Tanaka by a broad margin.
|
|
#
?
Mar 11, 2021 18:28
|
|
|
Yeah Iwai was the other character that had a pretty 'meh' Confidant bonus in base P5 but they revamped it so that he's decent in Royal and even then his Link is good, so. I don't think Ohya has the worst link, but at least Chihaya had amazing bonuses to make up for it.
|
|
#
?
Mar 11, 2021 18:43
|
|
|
Harrow posted:Yeah, this would be a big improvement, I think. I have more trouble with alert levels in Strikers than P5/R.
|
|
#
?
Mar 11, 2021 18:47
|
|
|
Ohya is probably one of the last relics of an earlier game paradigm if anything. The Alert level seems so completely toothless in vanilla P5 (it’s a bit more interesting in Royal) but the game spends a good amount of time teaching you it. If I had to guess, the alert level originally was meant to be a serious impediment to progress if you gained it, and there would be automatic increases at times that were unavoidable (think how the calling card skyrockets it to 100, but imagine if say when Madarame encounters Ann and Yusuke in his Sayuri room he got 50% alert level until you lowered it). Add in alert levels locking off paths, and that I imagine the whole secure a route to the treasure was originally meant to be more convoluted too. Something like having to open up a direct path that the Alert Level has to be neutralised for, and I can see a version of the game where what Ohya does makes palaces a lot easier. But they moved away from such an intense heist based gameplay and left Ohya and the simplified system in because they already had missed a console generation making Persona 5. In fact, they nearly missed two. Lord_Magmar fucked around with this message at 19:17 on Mar 11, 2021 |
|
#
?
Mar 11, 2021 19:15
|
|
|
This is more of a cultural question but can anyone explain why some confidants are referred to on the map by their last names, while others are by their first names? All the Phantom Thieves are first names, which makes sense I guess. Last name people: Ohya Maruki Akechi Iwai Kawakami Mishima Yoshida Takemi First name people: Sojiro Chihaya Shinya Hifumi e: I realize there is a problem with using the term "first names" and "last names" in this context so pretend I said "given names" and "family names" Badger of Basra fucked around with this message at 19:47 on Mar 11, 2021 |
|
#
?
Mar 11, 2021 19:27
|
|
|
Badger of Basra posted:This is more of a cultural question but can anyone explain why some confidants are referred to on the map by their last names, while others are by their first names? I am curious about this too. I had thought in Japanese culture when talking to someone you use lastname+honorific unless they were really close to you. This is especially important if someone is higher "rank" socially. However in the game the characters will also call themselves by firstname + honorific. There is a whole conversation when Makoto joins about whether they should keep referring to her as "Makoto-Senpai" until she urges them to drop the honorifics. This isn't a translation issue either as I was playing with Japanese VA and I noticed too a lot of times the Japanese VA saying a character's last name, but in the English subtitles it would use the first name.
|
|
#
?
Mar 11, 2021 20:09
|
|
|
Shinya is a kid at least, so that part's easy. Hifumi is a weird one, since you could say it's because she's the same age as you... but when you first meet Yusuke he's 'Kitagawa-kun' til he joins. Sojiro is another case where you probably refer to him as Sakura-san at first in actuality, but since Futaba's gonna join and she's super familiar with him they just go with Sojiro and you eventually become his family anyway. Almost nobody outside of the adults refer to him as Sakura since Joker's never voiced and the non-Futaba members use 'Boss'. I got no idea about Chihaya.Solaris 2.0 posted:I am curious about this too. I had thought in Japanese culture when talking to someone you use lastname+honorific unless they were really close to you. This is especially important if someone is higher "rank" socially. However in the game the characters will also call themselves by firstname + honorific. There is a whole conversation when Makoto joins about whether they should keep referring to her as "Makoto-Senpai" until she urges them to drop the honorifics. It's also worth noting that English translations often play a bit harder and looser with that. P3 is a closer case where you see Mitsuru/Akihiko get a bit stricter with last names unless they're people they've formed a bond with (Mitsuru with Yukari, Akihiko with Junpei/Ken/Shinjiro). P4 would normally have most of them refer to each other by last names other than cases like Chie/Yukiko but for ease of the English audience most of them just use first names in English. I think BBTAG reverts to this style and it's a little jarring. Other games it's more noticeable if you've played either language option. Danganronpa for instance generally uses last names in Japanese and first names in English with some personal exceptions.
|
|
#
?
Mar 12, 2021 01:48
|
|
|
Sojiro is your pseudo-parent, Shinya is a little kid you look after, Chihaya is a weird country bumpkin and Hifumi is just plain weird.
|
|
#
?
Mar 12, 2021 02:00
|
|
|
You know I always thought it was kind of odd that in P4 to exclusively call your uncle by his last name.
|
|
#
?
Mar 12, 2021 02:05
|
|
|
Solaris 2.0 posted:I am curious about this too. I had thought in Japanese culture when talking to someone you use lastname+honorific unless they were really close to you. of course, the tl definitely increases the amount given names are used, so i couldnt tell you what the jp version uses for the confidant names. but in terms of what the tl presents most of it makes sense. hifumi could be a carryover from when she was gonna be a thief, but she's the same age as the protag and a girl, so him calling her hifumi-san wouldn't be that strange. in chihaya's case, she doesn't seem that much older than the protag - she feels about college-age to me? - so you can imagine the 'mifune-san' 'no, no, chihaya-san's fine, im not THAT old, calling me mifune-san makes me feel like my mom' convo. and all the ones that are last name feel like they've got at least a decade on joker, except akechi - but flavor-wise everyone calling akechi by his last name makes sense, it's an extremely 'rival character' thing to do, and akechi's obviously playing at that trope. the most obvious example there is literally everyone in yugioh calling kaiba kaiba, except for mokuba, his little brother, who's the only guy in the entire show to use his given name of seto.
|
|
#
?
Mar 12, 2021 02:06
|
|
|
I'm assuming some balance between 'Asian values, don't call him Ryotaro, have some respect' and 'he's your mom's brother and she changed her last name when she married so him and Nanako are the only Dojimas you know'.
|
|
#
?
Mar 12, 2021 02:06
|
|
|
Funky Valentine posted:You know I always thought it was kind of odd that in P4 to exclusively call your uncle by his last name. Especially strange for me because when you talk about Dojima, you almost invariably talk about Nanako...Dojima.
|
|
#
?
Mar 12, 2021 02:07
|
|
|
ApplesandOranges posted:I'm assuming some balance between 'Asian values, don't call him Ryotaro, have some respect' and 'he's your mom's brother and she changed her last name when she married so him and Nanako are the only Dojimas you know'. I'm not an expert on how uncles are addressed but I know that aunts being called givenname-chan is actually really common, especially if they're younger than your mom, so I have to imagine givenname-san wouldn't be strange for an uncle you're close to. But Dojima says he hasn't seen the protag since he was a baby, so that's out of the picture.
|
|
#
?
Mar 12, 2021 02:19
|
|
|
Also, Dojima presents himself early as a fairly strict no-nonsense guy. Whereas Sojiro for all he’s gruff does a lot of stuff he doesn’t have to that shows he’s probably a lot softer than he pretends. Plus the protagonist of 4 is a polite young man, the protagonist of 5 is a snarky abused youth.
|
|
#
?
Mar 12, 2021 02:22
|
|
|
ApplesandOranges posted:Yeah I played P5R semi-optimally (since I'd played P5, I knew about some time-saving tips and minmaxing) but I didn't religiously follow a guide and I had way too much free time at the end. Harrow posted:I'm kind of curious: did anyone actually have trouble with the alert levels in Persona 5, vanilla or Royal? I always found that the stealth was simple enough, and the default levels of alert reduction on ambushing an enemy were generous enough, that I never once had to actually think about the alert level while exploring Palaces. That alone makes whatever they tried to do with Ohya's abilities just kinda
|
|
#
?
Mar 12, 2021 02:44
|
|
|
One of my favorite touches is that Joker isn’t wearing his fake glasses in the flashbacks, so it’s clear he wanted to wear them to try to start over on the dl at his new place. He’s really trying (depending on your dialogue choices, of course), and that bastard Kamoshida just ruins it.
|
|
#
?
Mar 12, 2021 02:48
|
|
|
so he's clark kent?
|
|
#
?
Mar 12, 2021 03:00
|
|
|
Wanna know how I got these glasses? Well, I'm Joker baby!
|
|
#
?
Mar 12, 2021 03:02
|
|
|
Badger of Basra posted:This is more of a cultural question but can anyone explain why some confidants are referred to on the map by their last names, while others are by their first names? 佐倉惣治郎 vs. Sakura Soujiro(u) RillAkBea fucked around with this message at 03:26 on Mar 12, 2021 |
|
#
?
Mar 12, 2021 03:23
|
|
|
Endorph posted:names chat I think an important point, as well, is dealing with the character (as in type) differences between Japanese and English. Kawakami Sadayo is, including the space, five total characters in Japanese - and in that version, in the text box, all characters have both family and given name. So if someone calls, say, Ryuji "Sakamoto", both names are always right there at the top of the speech bubble and are therefore more easily referenced at any time than in English where the character limit is stricter because of the differences in how the languages work. So for the localization, you're dealing with "OK in type we can really only refer to this character by either family OR given name in their speech bubble, and for ease of understanding we should make that universal throughout the text as much as possible". This is the logic that makes the most sense to me, at least. EDIT: beaten
|
|
#
?
Mar 12, 2021 03:25
|
|
|
mastajake posted:One of my favorite touches is that Joker isn’t wearing his fake glasses in the flashbacks, so it’s clear he wanted to wear them to try to start over on the dl at his new place. He’s really trying (depending on your dialogue choices, of course), and that bastard Kamoshida just ruins it. I imagine he gets a bit better at trying to hide once the Phantom Thief stuff starts as he finally has an avenue to vent his anger at pretty much everything.
|
|
#
?
Mar 12, 2021 03:29
|
|
|
mastajake posted:One of my favorite touches is that Joker isn’t wearing his fake glasses in the flashbacks, so it’s clear he wanted to wear them to try to start over on the dl at his new place. He’s really trying (depending on your dialogue choices, of course), and that bastard Kamoshida just ruins it. He doesn't wear his fake glasses in half the cutscenes either, and they come up with increasingly contrived reasons why he isn't wearing them. I think the glasses were a late development.
|
|
#
?
Mar 12, 2021 03:56
|
|
|
I'm going with 'they didn't want to make Joker look too sterotypically pretty so they gave him glasses' since he's supposed to be this delinquent nobody wants to talk to and if he was too anime handsome that would seem unlikely. But yeah, it's almost definitely a cutscene thing, they jump through a lot of hoops like that like right before the 4th palace they had 'oh we know it's holidays but there's a school assembly tomorrow' except we're never actually shown the assembly but it's so that we can have the cutscene of them arriving in the palace with everyone in their school uniforms.
|
|
#
?
Mar 12, 2021 04:04
|
|
|
Joker looks weird without the glasses/mask.
|
|
#
?
Mar 12, 2021 04:05
|
|
|
Sorry i'm late but Maruki's insulting Arena handle would be Deluded Doctor Snack. Also, neonchameleon posted:And when you itemise the ultimate of the councillor persona it gives a gun to the person in dire need of counselling Akechi Now that's some funny poo poo. I had no idea
|
|
#
?
Mar 12, 2021 06:01
|
|
|
DC Murderverse posted:*the Kawakami stuff is insane and uncomfortable and I hated it so much. I get what it’s going for, the game has a lot to say about toxic relationships but I really do not think that solving her problems only to immediately try to pick her up as a 17 year old is absolutely nuts and kind of makes her a worse character because how do you talk about wanting to be a better teacher and then date a student! I made an alternate reality save just to watch the scene and get the mark for my award and Tbh I feel worse dating any of the other girls because they're like, teenagers. Yeah Joker is but I'm not and he's a blank slate anyways. Motto posted:I'd give her the cool design she had before Hashino weighed in. I hadn't heard about that but a google search indicated it was this?  I'd have probably liked her more even if she was otherwise the same. Ohya really should've done a Rumor thing like in p2. Harrow posted:Yeah, this would be a big improvement, I think. I had a bit of trouble in Royal since I was so overleveled on Merciless I just hated having to spend any time fighting chumps in Madarame's palace and would just run by. Acerbatus fucked around with this message at 06:19 on Mar 12, 2021 |
|
#
?
Mar 12, 2021 06:15
|
|
|
Acerbatus posted:Tbh I feel worse dating any of the other girls because they're like, teenagers. Yeah Joker is but I'm not and he's a blank slate anyways. This is always weird to me because I never consider characters in games to be self-inserts. So to me Joker dating anybody of his own age range feels like "aww, look at those teens" instead of feeling like I, personally, am dating those girls
|
|
#
?
Mar 12, 2021 10:22
|
|
|
Deltasquid posted:This is always weird to me because I never consider characters in games to be self-inserts. So to me Joker dating anybody of his own age range feels like "aww, look at those teens" instead of feeling like I, personally, am dating those girls 
|
|
#
?
Mar 12, 2021 13:12
|
|
|
Deltasquid posted:This is always weird to me because I never consider characters in games to be self-inserts. So to me Joker dating anybody of his own age range feels like "aww, look at those teens" instead of feeling like I, personally, am dating those girls Whilst a fair point, Persona 3-5 protagonists are very much blank slates so you can self-insert into them if you so wish.
|
|
#
?
Mar 12, 2021 13:29
|
|
|
Lord_Magmar posted:Whilst a fair point, Persona 3-5 protagonists are very much blank slates so you can self-insert into them if you so wish. For me - it has always felt like the same vibe as when little girls play with dolls and make them date or make them kiss. "let's put Joker with Hifumi this time - they'd be SO cute together!"
|
|
#
?
Mar 12, 2021 14:10
|
|
|
Probably worth keeping in mind that the intended audience is primarily high-school age teenagers and not the already embittered adults that likely make up most, if not all, the people posting here. They're still enjoyable, and all, yes, but some things just don't connect in the same way, if at all.
|
|
#
?
Mar 12, 2021 14:24
|
|
|
Lord_Magmar posted:Whilst a fair point, Persona 3-5 protagonists are very much blank slates so you can self-insert into them if you so wish. I know that's part of their appeal/idea behind a mute character, yes, but I have a lot of trouble understanding people who do. Characters always have their own design that differs from the player, as well as inferred character traits, even if they aren't explicited. If anything blank slate characters are just boring (Byleth in FE:3H comes to mind) or have sufficient panache and character like Joker that their body language and mannerisms make them stand out sufficiently. Likewise, I can't treat my dnd characters or characters in Western RPGs as self-inserts. I see them as distinct characters, and I get input on how their story goes but they're not me...
|
|
#
?
Mar 12, 2021 14:26
|
|
|
Dating also makes some scenes way funnier than they'd be otherwise, in particular if it's a party member. When Yosuke complains about not having any luck getting a date I just imagine Yu going "I've been dating Yukiko for three months so good luck with that". Or even better in 5: I really enjoyed Sae going from "Makoto can't be involved in this, it doesn't make sense" to "Oh poo poo, she's a phantom thief" and all that's missing is for Joker to go "Also we're dating. For months."
|
|
#
?
Mar 12, 2021 17:13
|
|
|
Deltasquid posted:I see them as distinct characters, and I get input on how their story goes but they're not me... They are our shadows, our true selves?
|
|
#
?
Mar 12, 2021 17:13
|
|
|
Brandfarlig posted:Dating also makes some scenes way funnier than they'd be otherwise, in particular if it's a party member. When Yosuke complains about not having any luck getting a date I just imagine Yu going "I've been dating Yukiko for three months so good luck with that". Or even better in 5: I really enjoyed Sae going from "Makoto can't be involved in this, it doesn't make sense" to "Oh poo poo, she's a phantom thief" and all that's missing is for Joker to go "Also we're dating. For months." This has kind of an amusing side effect in Strikers. There's a scene where you can go on a date with one of the girls, or, as is usually an option, go with The Boys instead. If you take one of the Phantom Thief girls, the game sorta treats it like a first date, which can be a little annoying if you wanted to carry over your romance choices from the previous game. If you go with The Boys instead, Ryuji laments that none of you have girlfriends, and one of your dialogue options lets you imply that Joker does have a girlfriend and hasn't told Ryuji yet. So weirdly, the best way to pretend to carry over whatever romance choice you made in P5 is to not take whoever Joker's dating on a date and take your bros instead 
|
|
#
?
Mar 12, 2021 17:22
|
|
|
I'm about 12 hours into P4G and about to start the Kanji rescue. 1) Kanji is...well I hope the writing improves on this character. He has a lot of potential, but oh man is that midnight channel bathhouse scene cringy 2) Chie vs Yukiko ok so far I am on team Chie. She likes steak and kung-fu movies, and literally kicks rear end. But it's still early game so we will see. Marie is an interesting character as well, but not sure if Yu can romance her? 3) I had thought I could re-visit Yukiko's castle to get bonus equipment, but I forgot to visit the TV world in between starting the Kanji plot. Did I miss my chance?
|
|
#
?
Mar 12, 2021 18:07
|
|
|
Solaris 2.0 posted:1) Kanji is...well I hope the writing improves on this character. He has a lot of potential, but oh man is that midnight channel bathhouse scene cringy Kanji's chapter is one of the bigger sources of debate around Persona 4. Personally I love him as a character but his dungeon stumbles a lot in what it's trying to achieve, and fair warning, there are going to be some pretty bad scenes shortly after his dungeon as well. Solaris 2.0 posted:2) Chie vs Yukiko ok so far I am on team Chie. She likes steak and kung-fu movies, and literally kicks rear end. But it's still early game so we will see. Marie is an interesting character as well, but not sure if Yu can romance her? Answer to your question: yes, you can romance Marie. Solaris 2.0 posted:3) I had thought I could re-visit Yukiko's castle to get bonus equipment, but I forgot to visit the TV world in between starting the Kanji plot. Did I miss my chance? Talk to Yukiko at the TV World entrance and she can take you back to her castle. In general, once you finish a character's dungeon, you can get back to it by talking to that character in the main TV World hub room.
|
|
#
?
Mar 12, 2021 18:14
|
|
|
|
| # ? May 25, 2024 00:53 |
|
|
Lotus Aura posted:Probably worth keeping in mind that the intended audience is primarily high-school age teenagers and not the already embittered adults that likely make up most, if not all, the people posting here. Actually there was an interesting poll from when P5 came out that showed most players are in fact adults https://www.neogaf.com/threads/deng...2030%20and%2039 quote:Age: I guess they could have started with P3 or 4 and moved into the second demo by 5 but still. These games are for olds who want to imagine high school life was cool instead of horrible, kinda like how cheerleaders are popular because guys want to imagine they were cool enough to be with a cheerleader. gently caress that FF Tactics kid, escapism is cool and good. NikkolasKing fucked around with this message at 19:01 on Mar 12, 2021 |
|
#
?
Mar 12, 2021 18:58
|
|