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So, still slogging through Back Arrow. It's really been a disappointment, overall. One thing that stands out is the USP for the series, the conviction based combat system. Now, in theory, it's brilliant. Shonen fights are basically philosophical duels with more punching anyway, so you can take that a little further by making it literal. Duels between characters can center around undermining their philosophy, so scoring one hit on an opponent whose conviction is that he's untouchable renders him much less effective, or one of the heroes could always fight best when all hope seems lost, leading to the other protagonists rigging things up to look worse. We don't see that, though. Convictions are, at most, a gimmick, like a guy who doesn't let himself get roped in being able to toss around someone using bolos. It's not adding a tactical angle to fights or using them to enrich characters. Instead it's just... there. The overarching plot is also on a major tangent right now, with the heroes getting drawn into a war because they took an invitation to where the war is happening. Comparing to another show where Yuki Kaji hates him some walls, there's an obvious problem. Attack on Titan was always heading towards the basement. It may have been incredibly slow and somewhat roundabout, but there was a clear chain of reasoning for why doing thing X was moving towards the secrets of the world. Meanwhile, Back Arrow got to the wall, couldn't destroy or get over the wall, and left to do some other plot with no clear reason to think it'll have anything to do with breaking the wall. It's things happening, but it's not movement. It's just a side plot taking up space without a compelling reason for emotional investment. I don't quit shows often, and I quit mech anime less, but man. I don't think this is going to win me back. On the more positive side of things, though, the final Rebuild movie came out in Japan, and from what I've seen, it looks really good. So that's nice.
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Mar 13, 2021 10:13
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I've been watching Back Arrow too and have had similar feelings. Though even with the main plot going like nowhere, I could forgive that if the show was like at all interesting on an episode to episode basis whether in character or theme or even if just the fights were cool. But the fights suck, the characters are bland (And honestly it feels like there are too many), and thematically there's like nothing interesting going on. Like it kind of reminds me of that really bad middle portion of Xabungle but somehow worse (And that show at least started strong and sort of picked back up eventually). I had hopes for Back Arrow considering the names involved but this is an astoundingly nothing show.
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Mar 13, 2021 10:36
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I suppose I'll have to present a different perspective on Back Arrow then. Let me be frank here. I've been increasingly enjoying the series on a moment to moment basis, especially when Shu joined up with the team and then after they all arrived in Lutoh, since Prax and the princess brought more appealing personalities or dynamics into the picture. And well, the silly humor or lighthearted gags often make me smile. For me, there's usually something amusing or entertaining going on. That said, I can at least see where a few of the previous arguments are coming from. There's surely a lot more that could be done with the whole conviction concept and, with a couple of exceptions, they haven't focused on that angle lately after some initial exploration. It will presumably be further addressed later on, yet at this time the criticism is valid on that front. Structurally speaking...I think it makes narrative sense that if the characters couldn't easily get through the wall, as they've firmly established during episodes 7 and 8, they would take some time to consider their options and deal with emergent situations in the meanwhile. It's not like they are living in an empty setting, you know? Given the rather retro-style of storytelling involved here, spending some time on the equivalent of "wandering through the desert" or "monsters of the week" doesn't particularly bother me either, since it's normal to have a stretch of eps like that. It also reminds me of Gun X Sword, where the protagonist was on a quest for revenge but his group doesn't even meet the main villain until episode 12 out of 26. I've seen enough anime in my life to expect that the outcome of the upcoming conflict, one way or another, will inevitably end up taking us in a new direction as far as the wall and/or its secrets are concerned. In other words, there's a transition point between now and the second half. That's what the Rekka vs. Lutoh war seems to be intended for. Even so, they have also been dropping little bits and pieces of relevant information every so often, thus it's not like the whole overarching plot has been completely out of sight. The mecha fights have been short, there's no question about that, but the choreography and/or cinematography has been pretty good. Specifically, I really liked the fight with Kai back in episode 5 and the more recent ones with Prax. Most of the other battles have been rather low in terms of challenge or stakes, which is usually to be expected at the beginning of a series, yet there is admittedly an increasing need to have a longer or at least more ambitious confrontation. I think the upcoming war between the nations should provide an opportunity to do so. I agree that the characters are rather broadly written, which is basically true of every single anime that Kazuki Nakashima has scripted. I suppose the main difference here is that Arrow himself hasn't had enough development as of yet. He's still the same sort of person at the moment. Not too unusual for a shonen-style protagonist...if there has been any drama, it's been more between Shu and Kai/Ren or between Prax and the princess. Which, all things considered, are useful yet still secondary characters. That said, I thought the most recent episode was actually pretty good in terms of giving the female characters some spotlight after being sidelined for a while. It's definitely taking a moderate risk by leaving the protagonist's arc for later, given his amnesia and so forth. That's part of why it's hard to carry out any thematic analysis at this time, since most of the movement has merely been build up for the second half. I won't blame people too much if they're not enjoying it thus far, but I am still having a lot of fun on my end. wielder fucked around with this message at 17:31 on Mar 13, 2021 |
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Mar 13, 2021 16:30
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Weaknesses like the Conviction stuff have been apparent since early episodes, but the Lutoh arc was a significant improvement for me over the lull in 6-7 where they tried some awful episodic stuff with the Bishie Farm and then had to spin their wheels before we could start digging into Lutoh's dark secrets. It's definitely in the group of shows I'm excited to see drop each week and found those plot developments/backstories plus Rekka's maneuvering to be compelling. Even though they still have issues with needing more from Elsha/Atlee/Ren and Elsha's grandpa not being wiped from existence. I also think since we had Muga get cloning ability they've done a decent job at giving the fights spectacle even if they don't live up to the Conviction concept. Prax appearing and Elsha finally getting some real action definitely help there as well.
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Mar 14, 2021 03:55
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wielder posted:
I mean, the protagonist of SSSS Gridman had amnesia and was often sidelined for Akane and Rikka, but he still had progression and drove the plot forward. Meanwhile, the latest arc just has Back Arrow be... there. It's not defined by the choices the protagonists make, but getting tossed from plot point to plot point. Good on you for having fun and all, but I feel like there's a lot wrong with the show structurally, in addition to a lot of problems week to week. Like, we had a mad scientist who introduces his crimes against humanity with a choir, and it wasn't worth more than a "huh". That's just disappointing. So many things that should be fun, and... they aren't. (For example, Shu was interesting for a while, but in the current arc, he's lost pretty much all the agency that made him worth watching, so we get him just going along with the plot instead of driving it.)
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Mar 14, 2021 10:03
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Is Yuuta really the protagonist of SSSS, though?
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Mar 14, 2021 10:13
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Potsticker posted:Is Yuuta really the protagonist of SSSS, though? I never said he was. He's not the one with amnesia, either.
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Mar 14, 2021 10:28
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chiasaur11 posted:I never said he was. ENTIRELY fair.
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Mar 14, 2021 10:36
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Was the new FMP series good? I already read the novels so I don't need the story if it's good but I wanna see the Levatein in action
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Mar 14, 2021 16:27
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Gaius Marius posted:Was the new FMP series good? I already read the novels so I don't need the story if it's good but I wanna see the Levatein in action It's ok; it goes pretty fast and sticks to the main novels so there's not any comedy interludes with short story adaptations but it covers the plot well enough. It goes through Continuing On My Own, Burning One Man Force, and Come Make My Day. Dancing Very Merry Christmas came between TSR and IV is skipped since it got a radio drama and doesn't have a lot of impact on the overall plot anyway. The Laevatein only gets one fight, in the next to last episode, so if that's what you want you can cut to that one.
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Mar 14, 2021 16:49
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Midjack posted:It's ok; it goes pretty fast and sticks to the main novels so there's not any comedy interludes with short story adaptations but it covers the plot well enough. It goes through Continuing On My Own, Burning One Man Force, and Come Make My Day. Dancing Very Merry Christmas came between TSR and IV is skipped since it got a radio drama and doesn't have a lot of impact on the overall plot anyway. The Laevatein only gets one fight, in the next to last episode, so if that's what you want you can cut to that one. That would mean you miss out on far too much Savage savagery, though.
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Mar 14, 2021 16:53
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Darth Walrus posted:That would mean you miss out on far too much Savage savagery, though. FMP spoilers Did they skip the fight with him in the Savage fighting the mech he usually uses that I can't remember the name of? If so that's lame as hell, I remember reading that in it's extremely poorly translated glory and thinking that it'd be sick as poo poo in an anime Midjack posted:It's ok; it goes pretty fast and sticks to the main novels so there's not any comedy interludes with short story adaptations but it covers the plot well enough. It goes through Continuing On My Own, Burning One Man Force, and Come Make My Day. Dancing Very Merry Christmas came between TSR and IV is skipped since it got a radio drama and doesn't have a lot of impact on the overall plot anyway. The Laevatein only gets one fight, in the next to last episode, so if that's what you want you can cut to that one. That kinda sounds lame, rushing through three lns in 12 episodes seems weak as hell, at least it got finished I guess Edit: Just downloaded, I didn't realize they used CGI, absolutely unwatchable, I'll just use the LN's as reference Gaius Marius fucked around with this message at 17:27 on Mar 14, 2021 |
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Mar 14, 2021 17:01
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Gaius Marius posted:FMP spoilers No, the arena fights in the Crossbow and going against the Mithril defector in the M9 still happen, albeit in the space of like 4 episodes so it's kind of fast but still there. And they didn't finish the series, it has another season to go before they make it to the end. The PS4 game isn't a bad way to experience the rest of the plot, and it's even fully voiced in both English and Japanese.
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Mar 14, 2021 18:21
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Midjack posted:No, the arena fights in the Crossbow and going against the Mithril defector in the M9 still happen, albeit in the space of like 4 episodes so it's kind of fast but still there. And they didn't finish the series, it has another season to go before they make it to the end. The PS4 game isn't a bad way to experience the rest of the plot, and it's even fully voiced in both English and Japanese. I am glad people got to experience the end of FMP even if they didn't wanna read the novels, I have some problems with a lot of it, but as a whole it was a good time and people deserve that.
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Mar 14, 2021 18:51
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Gaius Marius posted:FMP spoilers Why on Earth are you pre-emptively assuming that they skipped the best bits?
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Mar 14, 2021 19:00
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Darth Walrus posted:Why on Earth are you pre-emptively assuming that they skipped the best bits? The lad said they skipped Savage Savagery, I assumed they meant the Savage vs Gernsback
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Mar 14, 2021 19:01
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Gaius Marius posted:When did this happen? I swear I leave a genre for five minutes and poo poo actually starts getting made. It came out three or four years ago. Here's my review from another thread.
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Mar 14, 2021 19:04
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Gaius Marius posted:The lad said they skipped Savage Savagery, I assumed they meant the Savage vs Gernsback I said that would happen if you jumped to the last episode for the Laevatien.
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Mar 14, 2021 19:09
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Darth Walrus posted:I said that would happen if you jumped to the last episode for the Laevatien. Ahhhh I feel you now
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Mar 14, 2021 19:20
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chiasaur11 posted:I mean, the protagonist of SSSS Gridman had amnesia and was often sidelined for Akane and Rikka, but he still had progression and drove the plot forward. Different type of story, I'd say, since among other differences that all had to be resolved within 12 episodes and so the pacing fits that length. quote:Meanwhile, the latest arc just has Back Arrow be... there. It's not defined by the choices the protagonists make, but getting tossed from plot point to plot point. I do happen to think any real character analysis of the guy is both limited and premature, yet I could reasonably argue he has been making a couple of choices to that effect. For example, there's his deciding to help the village people even after he was betrayed by them early on or, more recently, how he was willing to apologize for staying back at the wall when he decided to turn himself into a sword to give Elsha support rather than directly defeating Prax by himself. Not that it's incredibly original material or anything. quote:Like, we had a mad scientist who introduces his crimes against humanity with a choir, and it wasn't worth more than a "huh". That's just disappointing. So many things that should be fun, and... they aren't. Hey, I still liked that scene. It's incredibly silly in a good way.  quote:(For example, Shu was interesting for a while, but in the current arc, he's lost pretty much all the agency that made him worth watching, so we get him just going along with the plot instead of driving it.) Fair enough, although I think he still contributes to making the show fun right now, but we also know there's going to be a reckoning between him, Kai and Ren in the near future. dogsicle posted:Weaknesses like the Conviction stuff have been apparent since early episodes, but the Lutoh arc was a significant improvement for me over the lull in 6-7 where they tried some awful episodic stuff with the Bishie Farm and then had to spin their wheels before we could start digging into Lutoh's dark secrets. It's definitely in the group of shows I'm excited to see drop each week and found those plot developments/backstories plus Rekka's maneuvering to be compelling. Even though they still have issues with needing more from Elsha/Atlee/Ren and Elsha's grandpa not being wiped from existence. Yup, plus with the sword transformation it does seem like Muga could literally do anything...at least as long as Arrow lacks a sufficient firm conviction. wielder fucked around with this message at 23:42 on Mar 14, 2021 |
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Mar 14, 2021 23:38
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cant get getter robo armageddon intro out of my head send help Also thrilled at the The Thing episode. I went into this show thinking the robots were too goofy looking but the artists somehow make them super cool
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Mar 15, 2021 04:48
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Marx Headroom posted:cant get getter robo armageddon intro out of my head send help
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Mar 16, 2021 03:36
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It's one of the best looking mecha anime ever made and it's insane it's as good as it is considering the original director walked off with all the scripts three episodes in
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Mar 16, 2021 06:04
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GorfZaplen posted:It's one of the best looking mecha anime ever made and it's insane it's as good as it is considering the original director walked off with all the scripts three episodes in I wonder how many drinks you'd need to buy Imagawa to get a peek at those scripts, or if he just burned them out of gleeful spite.
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Mar 16, 2021 08:08
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Sunrise Beyond and Bandai just announced a new mecha IP: http://gundamnews.org/new-mecha-anime-kyokai-senki-launched-by-bandai-sunrise-beyond
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Mar 16, 2021 09:47
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Bloody Pom posted:Sunrise Beyond and Bandai just announced a new mecha IP: http://gundamnews.org/new-mecha-anime-kyokai-senki-launched-by-bandai-sunrise-beyond Unfortunately, the lead writer is Noboru Kimura, whose original screenplays tend to range from mediocre to crap. You may recognise him as the writer of Gundam Build Divers (not Re:Rise - that was Yasuyuki Muto).
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Mar 16, 2021 13:31
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Bloody Pom posted:Sunrise Beyond and Bandai just announced a new mecha IP: http://gundamnews.org/new-mecha-anime-kyokai-senki-launched-by-bandai-sunrise-beyond I know most giant robot shows are made to sell toys/kits. But it's still weird to see an animated robot and realize that the accent colors are where they are on the robot because it's easy to do that color separation on the model kit.
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Mar 16, 2021 14:06
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Gaius Marius posted:it's kind of a total mess Mind explaining what you mean in spoilers for me? I'm almost done and yes it's insanely fun, I get pretty good Pacific Rim/G Gundam vibes. I'm definitely checking out some of the other Getter stuff after this My only complaint is I have no idea who most of these characters are and I can't tell if I lacked Getter background lore or if the narrative is just glossy like that Marx Headroom fucked around with this message at 15:38 on Mar 16, 2021 |
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Mar 16, 2021 15:36
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Marx Headroom posted:My only complaint is I have no idea who most of these characters are and I can't tell if I lacked Getter background lore or if the narrative is just glossy like that Armageddon assumes that you're familiar with at least the characters from Getter Robo/Getter Robo G.
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Mar 16, 2021 16:57
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Darth Walrus posted:Unfortunately, the lead writer is Noboru Kimura, whose original screenplays tend to range from mediocre to crap. You may recognise him as the writer of Gundam Build Divers (not Re:Rise - that was Yasuyuki Muto). lmao hard pass
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Mar 16, 2021 18:07
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Marx Headroom posted:Mind explaining what you mean in spoilers for me? I'm almost done and yes it's insanely fun, I get pretty good Pacific Rim/G Gundam vibes. I'm definitely checking out some of the other Getter stuff after this Like the other dude said the original director took his ball and went home after the third episode which is pretty obvious once you know it cause the tone totally changes, the plot also just wibble wobbles a lot and new peeps show up every ten seconds without good introductions.
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Mar 16, 2021 19:57
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i can handle the nonsensical plot and the paper thin characters. it's super robots, after all. my big problem with armageddon is that the invaders are usually completely invulnerable to all forms of attack until they arbitrarily stop for no particular reason. they aren't even weak to getter rays!
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Mar 16, 2021 20:15
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Sometimes they even like them. Ya just gotta roll with it.
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Mar 16, 2021 20:18
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I wanna get into Majestic Prince because the mechas look awesome, but I heard that it's based off a manga - should I read the manga or watch the anime
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Mar 16, 2021 23:19
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just watch the anime. it's a nice little show that doesn't overstay its welcome. there's a sequel movie, but it is pretty much just a single extended fight scene and doesn't really continue the story or anything.
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Mar 16, 2021 23:26
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Gripweed posted:I know most giant robot shows are made to sell toys/kits. But it's still weird to see an animated robot and realize that the accent colors are where they are on the robot because it's easy to do that color separation on the model kit. It's especially weird because most Gundam and Eva designs were made designed to be difficult to manufacture out of sheer spite. It's kind of amazing how much mech anime we're getting this year. I'm not sure how much will be good, but people are taking a lot of shots. Eight TV anime, six movies, and at least a few games and shorts makes for a pretty wide spread, even without a conventional TV Gundam announced. Nice mix of new and old, too. This one... I'm not terribly optimistic.
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Mar 16, 2021 23:38
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gimme the GOD drat candy posted:just watch the anime. it's a nice little show that doesn't overstay its welcome. there's a sequel movie, but it is pretty much just a single extended fight scene and doesn't really continue the story or anything. Is there a way to read the manga?
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Mar 16, 2021 23:39
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chiasaur11 posted:It's especially weird because most Gundam and Eva designs were made designed to be difficult to manufacture out of sheer spite. God bless Ippei Gyoubu.
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Mar 16, 2021 23:51
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Bloody Pom posted:Sunrise Beyond and Bandai just announced a new mecha IP: http://gundamnews.org/new-mecha-anime-kyokai-senki-launched-by-bandai-sunrise-beyond "Now stick with me here. What if Gundam... but a Knightmare Frame?" "Hmm. Sounds good but we need to get the female demographic." "Meeps?" "Meeps."
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Mar 17, 2021 00:24
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Droyer posted:Is there a way to read the manga? Other than learning Japanese, it doesn't seem like there is, at the moment. What I've heard from people who claim to have read it suggests it's not too much of a loss. At minimum, it went in a pretty different direction than the anime. (Which makes sense with the anime airing in 2013 and the manga not ending until 2019.)
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Mar 17, 2021 00:34
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