Scikar posted:

While there's a lot to be learned from the Catalonia situation, I don't think it actually makes much difference to Scottish independence strategy. There have been very different reactions from Spain over time, with the full range of "Scotland is totally different to Catalonia and we would have no problem with independent Scotland joining the EU" to "we absolutely cannot allow this precedent to be set". That reaction varies a lot with the latest developments in Catalonia of course, and I'm sure any serious movement on Scottish independence would feed back into that process as well. I think Spanish opposition is probable but far from the biggest barrier and I'm sure it could be worked around.


In their campaigning for the upcoming election, a whole bunch of Scottish Tories have been saying things like "a vote for anyone but us is a vote for independence" - I don't think Johnson's advisors are dumb enough to let him say anything like that on a national level, but I think public opinion is shifting towards the referendum itself being legit, if it happens. This is a consequence of the way unionists have opposed the referendum itself, when they stuck the line of the last one being "once in a generation" they had a consistent point, but far too many are just outright saying the quiet part loud as "if you don't want independence then you must prevent another referendum", which implies that the converse is also true.

I suppose it's easy enough for me to say since I'm not SNP, don't have any particular attachment to independence as a means unto itself. I just want to live in a fairer society, and I think an independent Scotland is a more realistic way to achieve that than anything that could be done via Westminster. But I would happily settle with an intact UK that has the possibility of someone vaguely left-wing leading it. Anyway, point is for me the minutiae of which path is particularly more likely to achieve full independence or not don't really matter, what's important is establishing what the people of Scotland actually want. If the message is clear enough then the outcome will eventually follow one way or another.

e: Also, from the other side - it doesn't matter if a convenient excuse exists for Westminster to declare the referendum illegitimate. We all know the Tories will just manufacture an excuse if it doesn't arise naturally. There's no point trying to pre-empt them by cornering them inside their own rules, because those rules only apply to power when it suits them.

goddamnedtwisto posted:

and are now banning everyone mentioning her history.

Now on one hand, Reddit... but on the other Reddit users. I seriously doubt discussions of her hiring were careful, considered debate on her situation at the time or the psychology of abuse, do you?

goddamnedtwisto posted:

Just in case anyone was unsure how to think about the Reddit admin kerfuffle - all you need to know is Kiwifarms and Glinner have lined up on one side of the argument.

The Perfect Element posted:

Surprised by the lack of discussion of Patel's new immigration rules, announced today. From coverage on the news, and her interview with Radio 4, it can be summed up thusly:

- People, whether legitimate asylum seekers or not, should not be able to stay in the country if they have arrived illegally
- Therefore, we will only accept asylum seekers who have arrived legally (a stance which is banned by the Geneva Convention, which states that a legitimate asylum seeker should be accepted regardless of the legality of their arrival)
- There are very few legal channels to enter the UK
- So from now on, anyone who arrives is not eligible to stay in the UK

Moreover:

- ANYONE who arrived at the UK by travelling through another safe country (e.g. anywhere in the EU) should have claimed asylum there, and therefore is defacto in the country illegally

Oh, and:

- People should not be allowed to appeal their asylum claims through the courts, so we're putting a stop to that as well.

It seems pretty bad to me.

thrashingteeth posted:

All aboard the decades of Britain wanting to LARP Children of Men forever

Jakabite posted:

Unfortunately I'm not sure this is all you need to know. She seems like a pretty scummy person, what with employing her dad who raped and tortured a 10 year old to be her campaign manager, and banning any and all mention of herself on the site. Oh and being married to and supportive of an open paedophile. I don't feel like it's an argument any decent person should wade into too heavily but yeah even if a ton of people are attacking her for all the wrong reasons, doesn't mean she's cool and good.

learnincurve posted:

I have a confession: I never voted for Blair

Jakabite posted:

Unfortunately I'm not sure this is all you need to know. She seems like a pretty scummy person, what with employing her dad who raped and tortured a 10 year old to be her campaign manager, and banning any and all mention of herself on the site. Oh and being married to and supportive of an open paedophile. I don't feel like it's an argument any decent person should wade into too heavily but yeah even if a ton of people are attacking her for all the wrong reasons, doesn't mean she's cool and good.

serious gaylord posted:

What a surprise a bunch of tory mps are now saying their Labour councils are bad and perhaps they should be taken over too.

Bobby Deluxe posted:

https://forums.somethingawful.com/showthread.php?threadid=3918745&pagenumber=728&perpage=40&userid=0#post513458804

You were warned.

Noxville posted:

It’s getting more than a little fashy at the moment what with the protest bill, the travellers bill, the asylum reforms and the incessant flag shagging. Like, just the last few days have felt REALLY bad

https://twitter.com/PoliticsForAlI/status/1374758594931986433?s=19

bessantj posted:

Well OK then, but what about child poverty? We're going to do something about that now yeah?

Jakabite posted:

I don't feel like it's an argument any decent person should wade into too heavily but yeah even if a ton of people are attacking her for all the wrong reasons, doesn't mean she's cool and good.

bessantj posted:

Well OK then, but what about child poverty? We're going to do something about that now yeah?

learnincurve posted:

You just know someone is eyeing up the Fourth plinth in Trafalgar Square for a massive gently caress off flag pole.

thrashingteeth posted:

BET THEY'LL BRING BACK HANGING NEXT

Bobby Deluxe posted:

ouuuh, i just nutted all over yer flag lol

It's weird, because on the one hand she also has oppositional defiant disorder, which - accusations of affluenza aside - is an interesting condition that is perhaps not the best trait to be looking for in a mod /admin.

But I posted about it initially because in a statement a few days ago, the entire /r/ukpolitics subforum was closed after one of the moderators posted a link to a hate piece by Julie loving Bindel which specifically calls her out at the end.

So I can also understand why the ban might have happened to stop terf poo poo being mainstreamed. The problem is that zero explanation was given for why it happened, so the freeze peach warriors have now flooded the sub and the official statement simply refers to a "spectator article" which makes "a three word mention of her in passing."

sinky posted:

All children in poverty will be given a small Union flag to wave.

Guavanaut posted:

All UK cities to be prefaced with London to promote Unionism. Londonderby, Londondundee, Londonely, Londonlondon.

goddamnedtwisto posted:

I already said this is the real solution to the problems of the regions, just make the plane out of the black box everything London. Extend the Travelcard to zone 256, rename Cornwall West Uxbridge, teach Glaswegians to do the Lambeth Walk, you'll all have amazing public transport, terrifying pub prices, and surprisingly reasonable council tax in no time.

Reveilled posted:

Another reason this is causing a shitstorm is that, reddit being a cesspool, it's not uncommon for its moderators to get doxxed and harrassed, and a lot of mods are now mad that reddit previously has been of zero help to them when they were on the receiving end.

kingturnip posted:

In a shocking twist, it'll turn out someone Michael Gove knows really well will run the business that wins the flag-making tender.
They will immediately close their UK offices and relocate to China.

Guavanaut posted:

Guavanaut posted:

I will laugh so much when a bunch of them end up being

peanut- posted:

I'm fairly certain the Metropolitan line terminates somewhere in Wales already.

goddamnedtwisto posted:

The funny thing is that the outer limits of the Met already show the weakness in my plan because the Oyster card can't actually go beyond Zone 9 (it's already stymied bringing Thameslink fully into the system), and they can't be arsed replacing all of them to remove the restriction.