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Xun
Apr 25, 2010

Milo and POTUS posted:

You can find plenty of games without bots during normal hours. But early hours (3-6am) of the morning? Forget it.

So that basically means never since I'm playing from europe :v:

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Heran Bago
Aug 18, 2006



Heran Bago posted:

I'm way out of practice. Am I more likely to have a better pub / randos experience with facit or community.tf?

E: Thanks Warpy for the invite!q

Faceit trip report: real fun!

Player competence is generally good. I didn't encounter anyone objectively terrible. I gave and recieved long distance healing bolts which I wouldn't expect to come up on official servers. Saw both solid and creative building placements. Spy callouts were especially good for EU servers where people tend to talk less. Good latency too. Wait times were not bad at all.

Matches were about a 50-50 mix of steamrolls and down-to-the-wire matches, with nothing in-between. Some players were of course really loving good, but I didn't notice any anger or tryhard mentality. Not a single bot!

I like removing bullet spread, but I like random crits and being able to leave and join games in-progress. I would not want a more casual mode, but highlander would be cool.


I also tried teamwork.tf, both to compare it with and because I mistook it (and earlier community.tf) for creators.tf. I had a clean experience that wasn't quite as strict with the setup. I don't think I'll try any other community servers, faceit is good enough.

Baron von Eevl
Jan 24, 2005

WHITE NOISE
GENERATOR

🔊😴
I've said it before and I'll say it again, we should have a server variable to remove random crits from rapid-fire weapons only.

Ambaire
Sep 4, 2009

by Shine
Oven Wrangler

Baron von Eevl posted:

I've said it before and I'll say it again, we should have a server variable to remove random crits from rapid-fire weapons only.

I live for the times when my minigun decides to chain crit and delete someone halfway across the map.

LazyMaybe
Aug 18, 2013

oouagh
really the biggest issue there is that random crits remove damage falloff, which temporarily totally transforms the kind of weapon the minigun is

Gwyneth Palpate
Jun 7, 2010

Do you want your breadcrumbs highlighted?

~SMcD

every time I play TF2 I get pissed off when I die to a bullet that somehow magically penetrated two to six walls and hit me, sometimes up to half a loving second after I've gone behind cover

my ping is 50ms or better, this should not be happening

ArfJason
Sep 5, 2011
welcome to the wonderful world of lag compensation and server vs client disparity

Jippa
Feb 13, 2009

Gwyneth Palpate posted:

every time I play TF2 I get pissed off when I die to a bullet that somehow magically penetrated two to six walls and hit me, sometimes up to half a loving second after I've gone behind cover

my ping is 50ms or better, this should not be happening


Are you playing on official match making servers? If so it's probably hacking bots. Scroll back a few pages and see the discussion of "faceit" and sign up.

ArfJason
Sep 5, 2011
No he means the lag compensation poo poo that makes it seem like heavies can shoot around corners sometimes and which weve all suffered more than a hundred times

Gwyneth Palpate
Jun 7, 2010

Do you want your breadcrumbs highlighted?

~SMcD

Jippa posted:

Are you playing on official match making servers? If so it's probably hacking bots. Scroll back a few pages and see the discussion of "faceit" and sign up.

It's:

ArfJason posted:

No he means the lag compensation poo poo that makes it seem like heavies can shoot around corners sometimes and which weve all suffered more than a hundred times

I run TF2 Bot Detector, so bots stand out like a sore thumb. They always have a different name than their account name.

drrockso20
May 6, 2013

Has Not Actually Done Cocaine
If I remember correctly at least part of that is because there's some weirdness in how Heavy determines line of sight for his mini-guns, like it uses his head to determine it rather than where the gun is actually located, thus Heavy can sometimes shoot through certain pieces of level geometry that seem like they should block the shots

ArfJason
Sep 5, 2011
Most (if not all) source engine games trace hitscan originating from the center of the players camera, ie: the head. This happens in csgo, hl2, and tf2, and the only weirdness youd see in regular play is shooting over stuff like short walls and boxes even though the gun is covered by those when seen in third person. It has nothing to do with the usual scenario, as they are corners rather than short height cover.
The problem is cuz of the discrepancy between what the server sees vs what the client sees. The server sees you as being exposed at the time of death, while your client, using prediction to compensate for latency sees you as covered, because the kill hasnt arrived yet. The kill eventually arrives after however many miliseconds, and then you die despite being "behind cover" and you scream in despair at this lovely loving goddamn game and vow never to play again. A tale as old as time

Baron von Eevl
Jan 24, 2005

WHITE NOISE
GENERATOR

🔊😴

Gwyneth Palpate posted:

It's:


I run TF2 Bot Detector, so bots stand out like a sore thumb. They always have a different name than their account name.

Yeah, it's frustrating but if it makes you feel any better what actually happened is that you got shot before you went behind the wall (at least according to the one that shot you) and you're only just finding out about it now.

Jabor
Jul 16, 2010

#1 Loser at SpaceChem
It doesn't matter so much if you see that you're behind cover, what matters is whether the other player sees that you've gone behind cover - and that's affected by their ping and interp values as well as yours.

Baron von Eevl
Jan 24, 2005

WHITE NOISE
GENERATOR

🔊😴
There's also the delay in them communicating that to the server, and then the server communicating that to you (by making you die).

the holy poopacy
May 16, 2009

hey! check this out
Fun Shoe
If you have a lovely connection that drops a lot it becomes very evident how that stuff happens because when you lose communication everything snaps back to the last server update and you can see just how far your client prediction let you think you were traveling from the point you lost contact.

demostars
Apr 8, 2020
faceit tf2 owns, but the map selection does not own. have gotten a grand total of two games on maps that weren't badwater and upward. shame, cause i'd like to get a sunshine or viaduct in at some point!!

deselecting them doesn't even guarantee you won't get them it will just make your queues longer too :/

demostars fucked around with this message at 08:45 on Mar 26, 2021

Jippa
Feb 13, 2009

ArfJason posted:

Most (if not all) source engine games trace hitscan originating from the center of the players camera, ie: the head. This happens in csgo, hl2, and tf2, and the only weirdness youd see in regular play is shooting over stuff like short walls and boxes even though the gun is covered by those when seen in third person. It has nothing to do with the usual scenario, as they are corners rather than short height cover.
The problem is cuz of the discrepancy between what the server sees vs what the client sees. The server sees you as being exposed at the time of death, while your client, using prediction to compensate for latency sees you as covered, because the kill hasnt arrived yet. The kill eventually arrives after however many miliseconds, and then you die despite being "behind cover" and you scream in despair at this lovely loving goddamn game and vow never to play again. A tale as old as time

Gotcha. I think we are relatively spoiled in western europe because we have lots of people that live relatively close together. I notice a big difference playing on the stockholm server compared to the luxembourg one even if the ping is only about 20 more.

I also forget how bad the stock tf2 without configs is (huge viewmodel, bad net settings etc).

drrockso20
May 6, 2013

Has Not Actually Done Cocaine

demostars posted:

faceit tf2 owns, but the map selection does not own. have gotten a grand total of two games on maps that weren't badwater and upward. shame, cause i'd like to get a sunshine or viaduct in at some point!!

deselecting them doesn't even guarantee you won't get them it will just make your queues longer too :/

I mean Badwater and Upward are probably the best maps in Faceit's current selection, and Sunshine is probably one of the worst so not all that surprising really

demostars
Apr 8, 2020

drrockso20 posted:

I mean Badwater and Upward are probably the best maps in Faceit's current selection, and Sunshine is probably one of the worst so not all that surprising really

right now it feels like because of the subpar map selection Huge Pubbies just have those two maps selected plus whatever else they dislike the least. i've gotten to experience exactly One match on them that wasn't a complete stomp one way or another. at least on harvest or dustbowl (the other two maps i've gotten to play) things were more back and forth, but that's also a detriment for the latter in a way.... so gently caress it, let me try 5cp on faceit at some point please, even if it isn't on what clearly should have been chosen, badlands. i'll even sub for captain if i can't get even a borneo at some point

e: ideally i'd want the maplist to be something like this for a good mix of modes if only limited to 9:

cp_steel
ctf_doublecross
cp_process
cp_badlands
koth_viaduct
koth_lakeside
pl_swiftwater
pl_upward
pl_badwater

but, really, there could probably be close to thirty maps that would work for the 12v12 casual game mode, since it doesn't need to be nearly as serious as a 6v6 or highlander game. i wouldn't hate the odd cp_powerhouse or plr_nightfall for kicks 8)

demostars fucked around with this message at 10:34 on Mar 26, 2021

mfcrocker
Jan 31, 2004



Hot Rope Guy
I've been seeing a better variety of maps recently; about half my games are still on badwater (which is great that's always been my favourite map) but I'm also seeing stuff like harvest and viaduct crop up

Heran Bago
Aug 18, 2006



Is there any high ping advantage?

Otacon
Aug 13, 2002


Heran Bago posted:

Is there any high ping advantage?

Face stabs

Butt Detective
Mar 24, 2013

Only the dead can know peace from these hats.

Heran Bago posted:

Is there any high ping advantage?

Lag compensation! I play on Uncle Dane’s Chicago server sometimes despite being in the UK, and landing headshots on ~100 ping is dumb and easy.

Baron von Eevl
Jan 24, 2005

WHITE NOISE
GENERATOR

🔊😴
Yeah, I remember a cheat from a little while back involved manually spiking your ping so everyone kinda froze and then you could nail easy headshots before lowering your ping again.

Heran Bago
Aug 18, 2006



Hotkey to pause/resume linux iso torrents.

8 Ball
Nov 27, 2010

My hands are all messed up so you better post, brother.
https://streamable.com/53qeaz

Doesn't happen often but it's v satisfying to beat the odds

Milo and POTUS
Sep 3, 2017

I will not shut up about the Mighty Morphin Power Rangers. I talk about them all the time and work them into every conversation I have. I built a shrine in my room for the yellow one who died because sadly no one noticed because she died around 9/11. Wanna see it?
How am I so good decent okay with the shotgun but so bad with the scattergun. Is it just that I'm getting pick offs with the shotgun after damaging them with my main and that biases me or what. I want to be good with scout so bad and I've got good awareness and timings for setting up flanks but I just cannot pour enough damage into them to make it stick even in the instances I catch them totally by surprise. Also I may as well quit using the soda popper since that hype meter is pretty much impossible for a lovely player to fill but I do like the quick reload.

WorldIndustries
Dec 21, 2004

Milo and POTUS posted:

How am I so good decent okay with the shotgun but so bad with the scattergun. Is it just that I'm getting pick offs with the shotgun after damaging them with my main and that biases me or what. I want to be good with scout so bad and I've got good awareness and timings for setting up flanks but I just cannot pour enough damage into them to make it stick even in the instances I catch them totally by surprise. Also I may as well quit using the soda popper since that hype meter is pretty much impossible for a lovely player to fill but I do like the quick reload.

go with the pistol, it helps you soften up targets for the scattergun or catch them trying to get away. if you can be accurate with the pistol it has very very good damage

Ditocoaf
Jun 1, 2011

Milo and POTUS posted:

How am I so good decent okay with the shotgun but so bad with the scattergun. Is it just that I'm getting pick offs with the shotgun after damaging them with my main and that biases me or what. I want to be good with scout so bad and I've got good awareness and timings for setting up flanks but I just cannot pour enough damage into them to make it stick even in the instances I catch them totally by surprise. Also I may as well quit using the soda popper since that hype meter is pretty much impossible for a lovely player to fill but I do like the quick reload.

I felt the same way for a while, something about the the way the scattergun made me feel like it has worse spread than it does. Combined with the Scout's move speed and the bonus damage, I think I was going for greedier, twitchier shots than I would with a shotgun.

The solution ended up being to turn off viewmodels for a while and try to tell myself I just had the stock shotgun. I eventually turned them back on (I use the world view models now, which are great) but during that time my aim improved a lot.

Jippa
Feb 13, 2009
Use the winger to take the high ground (on cp and koth type maps). If you have decent movement it makes you much harder to hit and you can just bounce around.

I think it took me years to figure out what those top tier scouts who would destroy me without me being able to land any thing on them (as a solly) were doing. It makes you have to land an airshot on them and massively reduces the amount of surfaces you can splash damage them with.

Jippa fucked around with this message at 18:45 on Mar 27, 2021

cock hero flux
Apr 17, 2011



Milo and POTUS posted:

How am I so good decent okay with the shotgun but so bad with the scattergun. Is it just that I'm getting pick offs with the shotgun after damaging them with my main and that biases me or what. I want to be good with scout so bad and I've got good awareness and timings for setting up flanks but I just cannot pour enough damage into them to make it stick even in the instances I catch them totally by surprise. Also I may as well quit using the soda popper since that hype meter is pretty much impossible for a lovely player to fill but I do like the quick reload.

the soda popper is good for burst damage but when you're looking for consistency the stock scattergun is the best weapon by far. if you're new, use it. it's the most reliable way to get a hang of how scout primaries work. if you're good and want to try hard, use it, it's the best one. The other ones are mostly just for fun or for when you find that your own particular playstyle makes one more effective for you than it is for other people. Stock will give you the best results most of the time.

The soda popper is good for deleting classes with less health than soldier almost instantly but you need 2 completely clean shots to do that. If one of them is off by even a little bit they'll live and then there's a good chance that they'll either escape, get healing, or the rest of their team will kill you while you reload or try to pistol them. It's not a good crutch like it used to be when it gave you minicrits for some insane reason. You have to be precise.

Girbot
Jan 13, 2009
Aim for the belt

8 Ball
Nov 27, 2010

My hands are all messed up so you better post, brother.
Scout gameplay for me is focused 50% on dodging and 50% on actually landing shots so I feel like I miss more than I should at the expense of dying less. His speed makes it a lot harder to line up shots than the slower shotgun classes too, a scout should always be moving whereas a soldier could probably stop and tank a few hits while they line up some meat shots

the holy poopacy
May 16, 2009

hey! check this out
Fun Shoe
I haven't been playing a ton of scout lately but when I did honestly I would usually just wing em a couple times and then gently caress off if I didn't get the drop on someone. Scattergun is for running up and planting in some oblivious sucker's backside.

Oxygenpoisoning
Feb 21, 2006
A big thing with scout is strafe aiming. Trying to flick when you’re moving erratically to dodge will make it less likely to hit shots. It’s better to try to line up your shot then let your movement carry your crosshair over the target so you only have to time the click of your mouse:

As others have said, abusing props and high ground make it a lot harder for you to get hit, especially by soldiers. Air strafing is also good since it adds just a little bit more confusion. I usually jump toward a projectile class the strafe to the left or right hard when I think they are about to shoot. It also throws off other hitscan classes, but you should stay grounded and a-d strafe in those situations.

I also don’t generally attack head on and choose my fights. If I think I can get a solid shot it I’ll usually stick around a fight, but if someone sees me on the approach and I can leave I do, because 2 seconds to reset is better than a spawn timer and getting back to the fight.

Gwyneth Palpate
Jun 7, 2010

Do you want your breadcrumbs highlighted?

~SMcD

It's like playing pyro -- pretty much all of the mastery of pyro is learning when to run away, not how to attack. The answer is generally "sooner than you're thinking."

reignofevil
Nov 7, 2008
True mastery of pyro is reflecting the huntsman and nailing a headshot.

Victory Position
Mar 16, 2004

Zookeeper Steve posted:

watching this guy do a 12 hour single segment speedrun of hundreds of demoman jump maps. the jrpg of explosive jumping
https://twitch.tv/zike1017

Pulling this back from a few pages prior because this kicks rear end.

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Milo and POTUS
Sep 3, 2017

I will not shut up about the Mighty Morphin Power Rangers. I talk about them all the time and work them into every conversation I have. I built a shrine in my room for the yellow one who died because sadly no one noticed because she died around 9/11. Wanna see it?
Since I've seen more than different people complain about it in matches, are sentries on koth maps really considered bad manner or is it just typical pubbie complaining. What the hell are engineers supposed to do on those maps differently

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