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This is apropos of nothing, but I just had a flash of the blinding obvious. A flash which helps me to understand both why the CCP's propaganda is so bad, and also why they do the things they do so shamelessly. They view the world in an absolute binary. There are goodies and baddies, and the goodies are shining beacons of all that is right and beautiful in the world, and the baddies are baby blood drinking nun raping lazy worthless scum. It explains why their propaganda is so blatant, heavy handed and awful. Because they are just repeating the "truth" of it. We are good and great and the best, and you are bad. There is no more to it. And anything that there is more to it is also bad. It explains why they are so pissy and thin skinned in regards to lukewarm criticism. If you are criticizing us, then you are against us, and if you are against us then therefore you are the worst kind of scum that ever existed. This is true because we are cool and good and the best. It also explains why and how they don't understand any of the nuanced diplomatic actions that others might do. In their mind it is all You will do what we say because you are scared of us. If you do not do what we say then you are the evillest of the evil. Wait? you are doing some of what we say, and will maybe do the rest later if we change? I don't understand. Therefore you must be bad. I am sorry, because all of this is self evident, and I should have realized it sooner, but I am a dumbarse.
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Mar 27, 2021 09:23
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Yeah, using rabid nationalism to cover for the ideological failings of a supposedly "Communist" one party state has a way of biting you in the rear end, especially when the people in charge actually start drinking the koolaid themselves instead of just doling it out to the masses.
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Mar 27, 2021 10:28
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Burberry is one of my [Regina Ip] favorite brands, especially its classic wool scarf, which is beautiful and warm. However, on the basis of the false and unreasonable accusations made by the brand against Xinjiang, I decided to stop buying and discontinuing its products immediately until they apologize or withdraw the charges. 
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Mar 27, 2021 10:48
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barbecue at the folks posted:Yeah, using rabid nationalism to cover for the ideological failings of a supposedly "Communist" one party state has a way of biting you in the rear end, especially when the people in charge actually start drinking the koolaid themselves instead of just doling it out to the masses. This is pretty much the same problem the USA has when the masses have been baited with rabid conservatism and nationalism long enough that true believers start being in charge of things rather than 'just' cynical business ghouls using red meat to get people to vote against their interests. I imagine the attitude in the Chinese government isn't entirely that level of entitlement and myopia, but it only takes a few narcissistic failsons in charge who take anything but total supplication as a personal insult for the whole environment to get real stupid real fast, and it takes forever to clean up after them. (again, that should sound familiar)
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Mar 27, 2021 12:49
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ninjoatse.cx posted:Did you ever teach in China? Don't recall reading any of your stories. No sorry US I just figure it’s tik tok meme stuff
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Mar 27, 2021 13:23
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Wife's cousin said that she has nothing to wear now that there is a boycott (that she is abiding by) against the aforementioned brands. She is under the impression that the western companies don't want cotton from china because they are racist. She's a rich 20-something fail-daughter in Dalian.
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Mar 27, 2021 13:38
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BrigadierSensible posted:This is apropos of nothing, but I just had a flash of the blinding obvious. A flash which helps me to understand both why the CCP's propaganda is so bad, and also why they do the things they do so shamelessly. I understand the urge to psychoanalyze and all but you gotta understand that "those people I don't like have no understanding of nuance and are basically automatons" is not exactly a convincing argument. They're people and just as complex and nuanced as anyone even if the result is them being assholes.
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Mar 27, 2021 13:42
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The PRC's ability to confuse cause and effect and always see itself as the victim in any situation would probably give Imperial Germany a run for its money.
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Mar 27, 2021 14:00
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ninjoatse.cx posted:..abuh? Cotton absolutely is a "top quality" material if you're going to be grouping it with linen and/or wool. You can't substitute it with wool or (flax) linen for anywhere near the same effect or properties. It's not a global textile staple because "we can't afford to produce anything better." It absolutely is. It has poo poo properties for wear (low lifetime, long dry time, absorbs odors, awful texture, etc) and the only upside is being cheap as chips and mass producable. It makes for a poo poo summer textile and a borderline deadly winter textile. ThisIsJohnWayne posted:Wool or linnen underwear thanks but no. Sounds like someone's only experience with wool is cheap guardhair from a sheep. Besides that, you should really be wearing silk underwear. It's better for your health, and far more comfortable than the low quality of your cotton tightie whities. The Chinese knew about silk.
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Mar 27, 2021 15:55
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Will we see the Communist party's rule collapse in our lifetime?
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Mar 27, 2021 16:07
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Randarkman posted:The PRC's ability to confuse cause and effect and always see itself as the victim in any situation would probably give Imperial Germany a run for its money. Honestly though it makes sense when you consider the ten zillion layers of hypocrisy that Westerners think and act through. Who can fathom the mind of the inscrutable European?
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Mar 27, 2021 16:10
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I would blow Dane Cook posted:Will we see the Communist party's rule collapse in our lifetime? I believe I'll outlive the CCP, but I'm sure plenty think they'll be around.
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Mar 27, 2021 17:09
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I would blow Dane Cook posted:Will we see the Communist party's rule collapse in our lifetime? I have thought for a while that they're just going to be a larger, more successful North Korea. So we'll be stuck with them for a while.
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Mar 27, 2021 17:40
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Vesi posted:Burberry is one of my [Regina Ip] favorite brands, especially its classic wool scarf, which is beautiful and warm. This is an all time amazing picture. I would blow Dane Cook posted:Will we see the Communist party's rule collapse in our lifetime? I dearly wish the PRC would make the Taiwan transformation in my lifetime, but I doubt it. That said, in 1988 it looked like the USSR was going to be around forever so who knows. Blistex posted:Wife's cousin said that she has nothing to wear now that there is a boycott (that she is abiding by) against the aforementioned brands. She is under the impression that the western companies don't want cotton from china because they are racist. She's a rich 20-something fail-daughter in Dalian. I've been reading they're calming down the official boycott rhetoric already because lots of people are posting "wait, why are they mad about the uyghurs? is something going on in xinjiang?" and now they're having to censor those posts too. 
Grand Fromage fucked around with this message at 18:28 on Mar 27, 2021 |
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Mar 27, 2021 18:20
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Dont Touch ME posted:It absolutely is. It has poo poo properties for wear (low lifetime, long dry time, absorbs odors, awful texture, etc) and the only upside is being cheap as chips and mass producable. It makes for a poo poo summer textile and a borderline deadly winter textile. Tell me more about textile supremacy.
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Mar 28, 2021 01:33
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Grand Fromage posted:I dearly wish the PRC would make the Taiwan transformation in my lifetime, but I doubt it. That said, in 1988 it looked like the USSR was going to be around forever so who knows.
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Mar 28, 2021 04:20
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Don Gato posted:Have you never experienced the attitude of people assuming Chinese is some kind of unpronounceable language to foreigners before? I've also encountered it to a lesser extent with Korean and Japanese. Makes no sense to me since it's not like there are any sounds there that are foreign to English but it's fun asking people what their Western names are. Can you clarify what you mean? Do you mean that character in particular or Chinese in general? When I learned Chinese, I discovered there were loads of sounds that didn't exist in English, and vice versa. Same was true of Korean. Several words have the ü sound in them and that sound doesn't exist in English. Then there's the whole ji, qi, xi, zhi, chi, shi distinction, again not something English really has. At my school, we had a student with the name of Xun and no English speaker could pronounce it. The eventually just started calling him Sean.
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Mar 28, 2021 05:10
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ya maybe your lovely american english but hawaii english has like every phoneme outside of africa lol
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Mar 28, 2021 06:31
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Doesn't Hawaii have like all the languages at once and then some
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Mar 28, 2021 06:48
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Atlas Hugged posted:Can you clarify what you mean? Do you mean that character in particular or Chinese in general? When I learned Chinese, I discovered there were loads of sounds that didn't exist in English, and vice versa. Same was true of Korean. Several words have the ü sound in them and that sound doesn't exist in English. Then there's the whole ji, qi, xi, zhi, chi, shi distinction, again not something English really has. At my school, we had a student with the name of Xun and no English speaker could pronounce it. The eventually just started calling him Sean. Fur20 posted:ya maybe your lovely american english but hawaii english has like every phoneme outside of africa lol So can you provide some examples of Hawaiian English where the same phonemes as Chinese are spoken by non-Mandarin speakers and not anglicized versions in loan words?
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Mar 28, 2021 09:29
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none of our loan words were ever anglicized, they were just used by the original native speakers and incorporated into our creole with phonetic accuracy. only americans are so disgusted with other languages that they have to make words sound more english. we are a culturally distinct group under an illegal imperial occupation. there IS a catch. a lot of our east asian loan words are sourced from 100+ years ago during the plantation era, so if we use any of them around modern native speakers they're like ??????? only my great grandma talked like that Fur20 fucked around with this message at 09:42 on Mar 28, 2021 |
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Mar 28, 2021 09:38
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lol ok
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Mar 28, 2021 09:58
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Guess I'm gonna sit here and munch on some tǔsī with extra qǐsī and drink some kěkǒukělè glad that loan words are always preserved in with perfect original pronunciation outside of America. Specifically America that is, no other Anglophone counties.
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Mar 28, 2021 10:09
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English is just bad at non-english languages which is such a fuckinng fail for a lingua franca. Like if my language is infinitely better at chinese transcription there’s something lol about yours
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Mar 28, 2021 10:14
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Atlas Hugged posted:Can you clarify what you mean? Do you mean that character in particular or Chinese in general? When I learned Chinese, I discovered there were loads of sounds that didn't exist in English, and vice versa. Same was true of Korean. Several words have the ü sound in them and that sound doesn't exist in English. Then there's the whole ji, qi, xi, zhi, chi, shi distinction, again not something English really has. At my school, we had a student with the name of Xun and no English speaker could pronounce it. The eventually just started calling him Sean. I mean in that name specifically. Also people overestimating how hard it is for westerners to say things. Like i get it, no one can say my last name properly despite being 5 letters and 2 syllables but still if it's something like Wang or Kim, most people are gonna be able to say it right no need to call yourself Kevin Smithy. If we're talking about the language specifically I can go on for a while about things in Mandarin, Cantonese or Japanese that aren't in English. I assume Korean is similar but all my knowledge of Korean is swears I picked up from a friend. Also Hawaii is great because when I'm there no one has trouble pronouncing my name right, it's loving amazing.
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Mar 28, 2021 10:45
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It's not just American English speakers that refuse to pronounce "foreign" sounding names and places. Look at what the English did in India. "We call the ancient city in which we live Mumbai." "What? Bombay?" "No, It's Mumbai. The sounds are completely different." "Right. So Bombay it is. There'll be no changing that for at least a generation or two." Rinse and repeat with several other cities. I mean Kolkatta - Calcutta, and Bengalaru - Bangalore are at least similar, at least to foreign ears. Then there is my huge bugbear, the way that lazy fuckwits can't be arsed to pronounce peoples names properly. I made a huge effort when in China to try and at least pronounce peoples/my students names properly. And if I failed, at least I was trying. So many arsefaces don't even do that. Sorry to stick with the India-ness of it, but it shits me so much when I hear the white commentators on the TV failing to pronounce a name as easy as Laxman, (phonetically it pronounced more like Luckshmun), or Muralithuran, (pronounced exactly as it is spelled.). Not even to get into the muddy waters of when Cheteshwar Pujara played county cricket in England, his teammates couldn't even be arsed to try and pronounce his relatively simple first name, and instead called him "Stephen".
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Mar 28, 2021 12:27
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That's not just English. But it seems there are alot of people (funnily enough often Americans and British people) who think the language is way more unique and clunky than it is. All languages do their own language names of foreign stuff, and it always ends up looking somewhat mangled.
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Mar 28, 2021 12:38
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goblin week posted:English is just bad at non-english languages which is such a fuckinng fail for a lingua franca. Like if my language is infinitely better at chinese transcription there’s something lol about yours Can provide a language you think is good at transcribing other languages for juxtaposition?
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Mar 28, 2021 12:48
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It was never called Mumbai though. Until 25 years ago.
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Mar 28, 2021 12:53
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Randarkman posted:That's not just English. But it seems there are alot of people (funnily enough often Americans and British people) who think the language is way more unique and clunky than it is. All languages do their own language names of foreign stuff, and it always ends up looking somewhat mangled. English is in reality I think more clunky in some ways because spelling is wildly inconsistent and often non-English things are written using the most common romanization rules for that language, but those often have unique rules in and of themselves and cannot be "correctly" pronounced without it, so you'll end up with people making a hash of things when they pronounce something as their best guess of what it's supposed to be based on how it's spelled but... what else can they do? Some systems for transliterating other languages are purely syllabic (Japanese and Korean for example) and you get something that at least can't be "mispronounced" since there's no question of how the written characters are to be pronounced, but it's not like those really give a close approximation of what the actual native pronunciation is (this is of course handwaving away what "native" pronunciation is because that in itself is can of worms).
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Mar 28, 2021 12:56
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The past two pages have gone from the China thread to the "hold my beer, here comes an ignorant take" thread.
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Mar 28, 2021 13:17
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LimburgLimbo posted:Can provide a language you think is good at transcribing other languages for juxtaposition? So this is gonna sound weird but personally I found slavic languages (polish and russian mainly) good at transcribing languages like chinese and french due to their very narrow relation between letters and phonemes. Like there's only one way to read each letter, and there's plenty of consonants to carry the distinctions like "ji, qi, xi, zhi, chi, shi". Meanwhile English people see the word "karaoke" and pronounce he first half as "kerry". :P
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Mar 28, 2021 13:24
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goblin week posted:Meanwhile English people see the word "karaoke" and pronounce he first half as "kerry". :P Maybe in Australia. The irony here being that the 'oke' is a contraction of a transliteration of 'orchestra'.
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Mar 28, 2021 13:46
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goblin week posted:So this is gonna sound weird but personally I found slavic languages (polish and russian mainly) good at transcribing languages like chinese and french due to their very narrow relation between letters and phonemes. I remember being taught that pinyin romanization was based on the Cyrillic alphabet and consonant sounds, with the partial goal of helping Russian speakers to learn Chinese. I can’t find anything to confirm that, but it was unveiled at the height of Sino-Soviet friendship in the 50s.
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Mar 28, 2021 13:50
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goblin week posted:So this is gonna sound weird but personally I found slavic languages (polish and russian mainly) good at transcribing languages like chinese and french due to their very narrow relation between letters and phonemes. Like there's only one way to read each letter, and there's plenty of consonants to carry the distinctions like "ji, qi, xi, zhi, chi, shi". Meanwhile English people see the word "karaoke" and pronounce he first half as "kerry". :P As someone that was mostly taught by talking at home, distinguishing some of those sounds when you're tasked with writing them down can be a bit of a challenge, though. Especially the Cs and Ss.
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Mar 28, 2021 14:10
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ninjoatse.cx posted:The past two pages have gone from the China thread to the "hold my beer, here comes an ignorant take" thread. *click* always was goblin week posted:So this is gonna sound weird but personally I found slavic languages (polish and russian mainly) good at transcribing languages like chinese and french due to their very narrow relation between letters and phonemes. Like there's only one way to read each letter, and there's plenty of consonants to carry the distinctions like "ji, qi, xi, zhi, chi, shi". Meanwhile English people see the word "karaoke" and pronounce he first half as "kerry". :P Yeah the one way to read letters is the ultimate weakness of English for transcribing, which I referenced earlier. If you don't know the origin language in English *and* the specific romanization rules there's no way to inuit the "correct" pronunciation. But do people in those languages really write that way? i.e. would you write phonetically in Polish for Chinese stuff or do they tend to use pinyin? I'd be interested in seeing a case of like a Polish speaker with know knowledge of Mandarin pronouncing some Mandarin words written phonetically in Polish and how close it would be. This seems like the sort of stuff that someone would make a youtube video of, if I knew how to search in Polish.
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Mar 28, 2021 14:22
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ninjoatse.cx posted:The past two pages have gone from the China thread to the "hold my beer, here comes an ignorant take" thread. An accurate simulation of drinking beer with some uncles on the sidewalk
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Mar 28, 2021 15:56
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Meanwhile from China,  https://www.reuters.com/article/chi...g-idUSL1N2LQ03Z Reuters only posted a low resolution version, found the one above embiggened. MrMoo fucked around with this message at 17:10 on Mar 28, 2021 |
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Mar 28, 2021 16:34
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LimburgLimbo posted:Guess I'm gonna sit here and munch on some tǔsī with extra qǐsī and drink some kěkǒukělè glad that loan words are always preserved in with perfect original pronunciation outside of America. Specifically America that is, no other Anglophone counties. It's an extremely funny thing to say, since American English is really not bad at keeping something like the original pronunciations compared to... any other language I've studied or heard. Like lmao at hearing foreign words in Chinese or Korean and trying to puzzle out what on Earth they originally were. And England English seems to require anglicizing foreign words in a way American doesn't. I've heard English people talking about China, who I know for a fact speak fluent Mandarin, and in English they'll talk about the city of Gwayng Jew or whatever. Don Gato posted:I assume Korean is similar but all my knowledge of Korean is swears I picked up from a friend. Korean is more English-like but still has sounds that either don't exist in English, or do but aren't used in English to distinguish different sounds. It's still way easier for an English speaker than Chinese. Grand Fromage fucked around with this message at 17:45 on Mar 28, 2021 |
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Mar 28, 2021 17:42
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MrMoo posted:Meanwhile from China, There is just so much to unpack here. Do they think this is how cotton is still picked in the US? I am still in awe about how Chinese media thinks its an incredible own and reveal to bring up slavery and sharecropping. As if it's this deep dark secret of the USA instead of something openly acknowledged.
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Mar 28, 2021 17:56
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