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Somfin posted:Yup Bitcoin: Currency is dead, I wanna be the Fed
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Mar 28, 2021 14:55
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welp, since I started mining on my 3080, daily income has slid from about $10 to about $7, so the hash difficulty is definitely ramping. I expect to cash out another $200 in about 10 days, and I will probably be able to grab another $200 worth before some combination of difficulty ramp plus summer heat causing my "hey this thing replaces my space heater" to no longer be true. Not terrible, if I had turned it on day 1 I would have more than paid the card off, and as it is, I'll come close. When the difficulty makes it impractical to mine on 3080s at all, I really hope consumer silicon availability in general is better. I've been waiting since release to upgrade to a 5900x at retail, but it's looking like by the time that happens we may be on to entirely new architecture and I'll switch mobos etc entirely  I'd pay $650 for a $550 block but I am not paying $800. edit: cashing out Etherium and immediately buying Pfizer stock feels like the most 2021  thing I could be doing. The upside is, if I take a bath on the stock it means Pfizer is hosed in some way, a thing that would be more useful to me than a few hundred bucks.
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Mar 28, 2021 15:21
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Cabbages and Kings posted:welp, since I started mining on my 3080, daily income has slid from about $10 to about $7, so the hash difficulty is definitely ramping. Thank you for contributing to climate change and sex trafficking 
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Mar 28, 2021 15:24
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Spoken like someone who has never heard of SESTA/FOSTA
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Mar 28, 2021 15:27
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Jose Valasquez posted:Thank you for contributing to climate change and sex trafficking My room's power consumption went down when I started mining, because the heat of doing so is fairly well distributed through my room, and this caused me to stop using an old, derelict, inefficient space heater. We had this conversation like 20 pages ago but if you need to run 250w of electric heat anyway, there's little difference between doing it with a miner, and a space heater. A friend of a friend is nearby is heating his RV with a mining rig, at a rate that's both heating the RV and earning more ETH than the RV parking spot costs. Pretty good closed loop, even if this is the last winter it will be fiscally reasonable. So, no, no climate change contribution here; also I worked in efficiency for like 8 years and personally offset like 1000x my lifetime consumption and as far as I am concerned those saved gigawatt hours are mine to burn  Sex trafficking? Sure, crypto is the payment of choice now, but is there any actual evidence that the amount of it is increasing as a result of crypto? At HOPE 2018, a career sex worker and advocate gave a presentation on sex workers and the darknets and she mostly saw crypto as a positive thing for sex workers, in terms of making payments easier and safer. So, curious where that sentiment is coming from, since this person was also clearly concerned about trafficking and did not make the connection to crypto during that presentation that touched on both things. Ultimately I don't care that much, I am an American with an at present comfortable life style, so, basically anything I do is predicated on global suffering and inequity, but curious if there's some aspect of this I don't understand. The way I see it, crypto exists, the value will float based on supply, but if people are exchanging crypto for illegal slavery, the amount of crypto in existence doesn't matter much. xtal posted:Spoken like someone who has never heard of SESTA/FOSTA Me or Jose? The HOPE 2018 presentation I saw was very much motivated by SESTA; it's available from 2600 for sixty cents: https://store.2600.com/products/the-circle-of-hope-2018-sex-worker-rights-and-internet-freedom-download
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Mar 28, 2021 15:38
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I meant the other person.
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Mar 28, 2021 15:46
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Everyone who talks about making money and saving electricity will encourage someone else to start mining. The wastefulness spreads like a virus. So then they only care about their own gain, okay. Then they should keep quiet about it. Each time they talk about making money, they're inspiring more people to compete against them. For personal, and global benefit, miners shouldn't talk about mining.
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Mar 28, 2021 15:57
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Cabbages and Kings posted:Sex trafficking? Sure, crypto is the payment of choice now, but is there any actual evidence that the amount of it is increasing as a result of crypto? At HOPE 2018, a career sex worker and advocate gave a presentation on sex workers and the darknets and she mostly saw crypto as a positive thing for sex workers, in terms of making payments easier and safer. So, curious where that sentiment is coming from, since this person was also clearly concerned about trafficking and did not make the connection to crypto during that presentation that touched on both things.  gently caress off. The number of sex workers who were somehow made safer taking crypto instead of cash is insignificant compared to the explosive growth in child porn creation enabled by crypto and the darknet. Every law enforcement agency interviewed, right up to the FBI, say they're struggling to investigate a meaningful number of cases out of the volume they're seeing.
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Mar 28, 2021 16:01
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What sex workers are even accepting crypto? I can't imagine prostitutes or strippers wanting anything other than cash. Cammers have established and legal platforms already and don't need it.
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Mar 28, 2021 16:23
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Shumagorath posted:
can you provide some citations that would also indicate that having more crypto minted is furthering the problem? This exact issue is why I stopped mining bitcoin back when it spiked to $35 (and sold out of ~15 coins cuz my broke rear end needed an alternator for a 1994 Sentra, lol ) but I'm sort of hard pressed to imagine that in 2021 having more NFTs in existence matters at all.It also seems like "the darknet" is as much / more of a problem than blockchains, and the feds whining about criminals misusing something the navy fostered as an intelligence weapons program is pretty lol. Surveillance Valley (2017, IIRC) makes the argument that ToR remains an incredibly useful intel program, and haven't there been a bunch of darknet busts related to the tracabilility / permanence of things in the blockchain? I have only followed that from the TCC thread about various drug markets getting popped, but that is the impression I have. I don't need convincing that mining generally and NFTs generally are loving dumb; I also find it all pretty hilarious, outside of the yes really dark aspects that go along with the global criminal world. I'm not even going to say underworld; the US gov't has been complicit in as much poo poo as they have gone to war against, when it comes to dark money etc. Of course I'm on the side of the FBI as it relates to them prosecuting piece of poo poo abusers or high financial criminals or whatever, but that's all part of the same general intel apparatus the CIA uses to destabilize sovereign governments when it suits us. keithy george posted:For personal, and global benefit, miners shouldn't talk about mining. This is a fair point and I will take it to heart. Cabbages and VHS fucked around with this message at 16:34 on Mar 28, 2021 |
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Mar 28, 2021 16:32
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https://twitter.com/doozical/status/1375525819599056904
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Mar 28, 2021 16:33
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Edit: On second thought I'd rather not touch this subject
xtal fucked around with this message at 16:44 on Mar 28, 2021 |
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Mar 28, 2021 16:37
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Cabbages and Kings posted:My room's power consumption went down when I started mining, because the heat of doing so is fairly well distributed through my room, and this caused me to stop using an old, derelict, inefficient space heater. We had this conversation like 20 pages ago but if you need to run 250w of electric heat anyway, there's little difference between doing it with a miner, and a space heater. A friend of a friend is nearby is heating his RV with a mining rig, at a rate that's both heating the RV and earning more ETH than the RV parking spot costs. Pretty good closed loop, even if this is the last winter it will be fiscally reasonable. Every single time you mine part of mining involves helping with transactions that banks absolutely would not help with. If you’re willing to except your $200 bribe to keep looking the other way and that’s OK with you then fine. Personally is very not OK with me and I’m never loving mining at all. You are a money mule for criminals. Every time you click mine you’re supporting an infrastructure that makes it much much much easier to do human trafficking profitability.
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Mar 28, 2021 16:49
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But hey man you have like 200 bucks and can you really measure the depth of human suffering?
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Mar 28, 2021 16:52
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Really says a lot that the argument changed to this at this point
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Mar 28, 2021 16:56
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xtal posted:Really says a lot that the argument changed to this at this point I have been consistent in this thread. Mining gives you currency BECAUSE mining is how the network processes transactions. You a literally helping process currency directly involved with criminal empires. It is THE currency of human trafficking. If you mine you are helping with human trafficking. Directly.
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Mar 28, 2021 16:59
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Cabbages and Kings posted:can you provide some citations that would also indicate that having more crypto minted is furthering the problem? quote:but I'm sort of hard pressed to imagine that in 2021 having more NFTs in existence matters at all. But this was particularly funny: quote:This exact issue is why I stopped mining bitcoin back when it spiked to $35 (and sold out of ~15 coins cuz my broke rear end needed an alternator for a 1994 Sentra, lol
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Mar 28, 2021 17:13
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Oh yeah if people are being trafficked then what are their names checkmate 
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Mar 28, 2021 17:13
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the reality is a lot more complex than that and it would take a lot to convince me that crypto has actually displaced paper currency in terms of market transaction volume so by this argument anyone who uses USD and helps fuel the economy that creates value is also complicit. Also if we're getting this abstract, my participation in US culture and paying taxes seems like it's probably causing a lot more direct measurable harm than mining basically any amount of crypto. beyond that, PoS is here to stay, so "miners are the problem" will become "stakeholders are the problem"; meanwhile, this poo poo is increasingly getting packaged inside conventional financial products available as retirement vehicles etc. I think crypto is dumb as gently caress, but the more it gets subjected to SEC regulations and the more available it is inside package funds from conventional banks, the more here to stay it is. I think that ship has sailed. Shumagorath posted:No, because then you'll find another way to justify it to yourself like so: Cabbages and VHS fucked around with this message at 17:19 on Mar 28, 2021 |
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Mar 28, 2021 17:15
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Cabbages and Kings posted:the reality is a lot more complex than that and it would take a lot to convince me that crypto has actually displaced paper currency in terms of market transaction volume If you process a transaction or help with the network you are directly contributing to helping criminals move dirty money efficiently. Nice try saying if you use the American dollar you are doing the same thing. I don’t process the transactions of strangers online. You do.
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Mar 28, 2021 17:18
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you've overwhelmingly changed my mind with your well researched and cited positions and I will immediately stop mining and donate all proceeds to some appropriately leftist environmental cause.
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Mar 28, 2021 17:20
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Cabbages and Kings posted:you've overwhelmingly changed my mind with your well researched and cited positions and I will immediately stop mining and donate all proceeds to some appropriately leftist environmental cause. Im noticing that you like to talk about the environmental thing and not about the human trafficking aspect. Prove me wrong: mining directly transfers criminal money. Cabbages and Kings posted:“Sex trafficking? Sure, crypto is the payment of choice now” spunkshui fucked around with this message at 17:26 on Mar 28, 2021 |
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Mar 28, 2021 17:22
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Cabbages and Kings posted:the reality is a lot more complex than that and it would take a lot to convince me that crypto has actually displaced paper currency in terms of market transaction volume
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Mar 28, 2021 17:28
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spunkshui posted:If you process a transaction or help with the network you are directly contributing to helping criminals move dirty money efficiently. So the proper comparison is to bankers?
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Mar 28, 2021 17:28
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xtal posted:So the proper comparison is to bankers? No, this money would not go into banks. It would go into duffle bags. The comparison is being a money mule. Thats what they would have to go back to.
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Mar 28, 2021 17:34
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On further thought, although it might seem that miners only encourage competition against themselves by bragging about their gains, they ultimately win out. Although they'll lose out to some competitors, they'll gain in there being a larger increase in people getting FOMO and paying fiat for the cyptro they're snagging. So I guess they do benefit by bragging about it.
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Mar 28, 2021 20:29
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i've donated blood many times and probably saved at least a dozen lives so I'm entitled to murder at LEAST one person
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Mar 28, 2021 20:34
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Cabbages and Kings posted:I don't care about anything other than myself You do you, man.
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Mar 28, 2021 20:42
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I don't think you get to mine bitcoins and then immediately turn around and use without any irony. you have forfeited your entitlement to use that emoticon at that point
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Mar 28, 2021 20:46
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Stefan Prodan posted:i've donated blood many times and probably saved at least a dozen lives so I'm entitled to murder at LEAST one person Also I just so happen to be a qualified surgeon who has saved MANY lives, so I feel pretty comfortable with the giddy thrill that only murder can bring. Sorry if that's not good enough for you all.
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Mar 28, 2021 20:47
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Cabbages and Kings posted:We had this conversation like 20 pages ago you were wrong then, too. you can't actually beat thermodynamics, no matter how poorly you post. believe me, I've tried
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Mar 28, 2021 20:50
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Hammerite posted:I don't think you get to mine bitcoins and then immediately turn around and use Did moridin ever mine bitcoins?
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Mar 28, 2021 20:52
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LordSaturn posted:you were wrong then, too. you can't actually beat thermodynamics, no matter how poorly you post. believe me, I've tried You are right that you can't beat thermodynamics, and that 300w of electricity is going to produce the same amount of heat in a GPU or a space heater, and if it's actively being vented into a closed space with a fan, it's going to warm up that closed space. I've got ambient temperature and power consumption (and humidity, and lux) data for this room because there's a pot and vegetable grow space in the closet and I don't want to overload anything with my work and personal PCs; when I started mining I quickly realized I could turn my space heater off, and my power consumption over an average 24 hour period in this space dipped slightly, average temperatures stayed the same (+/- 5F). By the same token it is now getting warmer and I would clearly have stopped mining for heat reasons, if I hadn't been overwhelmingly persuaded by the kind peanut gallery here to see the error of my ways already. Waltzing Along posted:You do you, man. Are you the same Waltzing Along who posted this in 2017? Waltzing Along posted:This is the thing I find surprising, too. It seems every time this topic comes up, a bunch of goons shout it down and joke about kiddie porn and drugs and bubbles. But it just keeps climbing and more and more legitimate uses are appearing as well. I have nothing invested other than believing the goon speak. But at this point, I wish I had just bought some or mined some on a lark and not listened to all the people who didn't do the same. Because I would have made a pretty decent amount of money for very little work. When you made this post, the answer was pretty clearly "yes". Are you going to tell me that your thinking on that has changed and that if I offered you 10 btc for $100, you wouldn't buy them? Honestly, reading your entire post history here now seems like a thing I might do just to see how your mentality changed from the point where you made the OP to the point that you started inventing quotes to strawman people. Cabbages and VHS fucked around with this message at 21:00 on Mar 28, 2021 |
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Mar 28, 2021 20:55
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Hey, remember when you were in 1st grade and you didn't know how to do multiplication? Kinda crazy how after 4 years of learning stuff you know more now. Also funny how some people never get past the selfishness of youth. Actually it's not funny. They are sad pathetic beings.
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Mar 28, 2021 21:14
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Cabbages and Kings posted:When you made this post, the answer was pretty clearly "yes". Are you going to tell me that your thinking on that has changed and that if I offered you 10 btc for $100, you wouldn't buy them? Honestly, reading your entire post history here now seems like a thing I might do just to see how your mentality changed from the point where you made the OP to the point that you started inventing quotes to strawman people. Compromising your morals for $500k is very different than doing it for $7 a month
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Mar 28, 2021 21:19
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Waltzing Along posted:Hey, remember when you were in 1st grade and you didn't know how to do multiplication? I doubt if you were in first grade in 2017, a time when these issues around crypto had been well discussed for a decade already, but giving you the benefit of the doubt on that, to be clear, you are saying that if you could go back and buy 10 BTC for $100, you would not do that? What about Palantir IPO stock? What about Google? Everyone is going to draw these lines differently, but I have a very hard time believing anyone who's not opulently wealthy would turn down a chance for total financial independence in this way. I can believe you've changed your stripes and thinking, but I don't believe that you (or anyone in this thread) would actually turn down the opportunity to retroactively go back and grab 10 BTC at 2008 prices or whatever, any more than I think anyone with a chance to go buy Google at IPO with 2021 information would do so. Jose Valasquez posted:Compromising your morals for $500k is very different than doing it for $7 a month I'm getting $3-400 a month which more than pays our entire power bill in a year where we've been hosed over by COVID causing us to have no childcare, causing my wife to have to suspend a lot of the part time work she was doing. Yeah, I did buy the 3080 as a stupid don't-go-crazy toy for myself because I managed to snag one at MSRP; it was probably a mistake, but, here we are. If it was $7 a month it is not remotely worth the stress or hassle!!
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Mar 28, 2021 21:24
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Cabbages and Kings posted:My room's power consumption went down... dude, you own a 1994 Nissan Sentra, live in a room and seem to think 10 dollars is a lot of money. this is probably going to shock you, but what you are describing is hardly a 'comfortable life style'. bitcoin is an automated, decentralized Ponzi scheme.
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Mar 28, 2021 21:25
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tango alpha delta posted:dude, you own a 1994 Nissan Sentra, live in a room and seem to think 10 dollars is a lot of money. this is probably going to shock you, but what you are describing is hardly a 'comfortable life style'. No, in 2010 when I cashed out Bitcoin, I drove a 1994 Nissan Sentra and lived in a heavily water damaged thousand square foot rental that had mold issues everywhere, and had $120k in student debt. Ten years later I live in a 2000 square foot house and drive a 2015 Forester, have $6k in student debt, and still think that $300 a month is a lot of money, yes. If someone does not think that $300 is a lot of money in a month, good for them, they must have more money than we do. I don't bother power / humidity profiling the whole house, because the results aren't useful to my horticulture and would just depress me. quote:bitcoin is an automated, decentralized Ponzi scheme. Cabbages and VHS fucked around with this message at 21:32 on Mar 28, 2021 |
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Mar 28, 2021 21:27
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Cabbages and Kings posted:No, in 2010 when I cashed out Bitcoin, I drove a 1994 Nissan Sentra and lived in a heavily water damaged thousand square foot rental that had mold issues everywhere, and had $120k in student debt. ok, let's dance i guess; i'm retired, own my home and my vehicles, have absolutely no debt and make a hell of a lot more than $300 a month in passive income without having anything at all to do with cryptocurrency. i also get to sleep well at night because my investments do not enable sex trafficking, global warming or child pornography. you need to sit down and shut the gently caress up, because the adults are talking now. e:oh and bitcoin is an automated, distributed Ponzi scheme.
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Mar 28, 2021 21:33
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Cabbages and Kings posted:you've overwhelmingly changed my mind with your well researched and cited positions and I will immediately stop mining and donate all proceeds to some appropriately leftist environmental cause. You won't do this, despite knowing that what you're saying would be a good thing to do, because you think being this selfless is "unreasonable."
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Mar 28, 2021 21:33
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