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(Thread IKs: Nuns with Guns)
 
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Dapper_Swindler
Feb 14, 2012

Im glad my instant dislike in you has been validated again and again.

Acebuckeye13 posted:

I will say that Jason Schreier had some great, in-depth articles about game development when he was at Kotaku, like How BioWare's Anthem Went Wrong, and The Story Behind Mass Effect: Andromeda's Troubled Five-Year Development

he also did a great article about sony of late.

https://twitter.com/jasonschreier/status/1380476925811032065

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Terrible Opinions
Oct 18, 2013



Dapper_Swindler posted:

yeah. like i am fine with journalists not being some amazing players of video games. but it gets really loving sad when said people clearly loving suck at the games and therefor make a game look worse. aka the doom/cuphead stuff. like i get it, your on the clock and have like 5 other games. also i am not some difficulty snob. i play most stuff on easy or normal. when you see some dude struggling worse then darksidephil at basic movement in Doom 2016. its pretty sad.
I don't know if Doom 2016 is this particular case but I know a lot of the time the garbage stream shown is literally the first time a journo has been allowed to play the game and the last before the release. Because the demand for content churn their bosses just plop a game on them and then go live with the first functional footage. Which I gotta say usually leads to a garbage result with even the simplest and easiest tasks.

Arist
Feb 13, 2012

who, me?


I definitely also find it weird that people constantly bring up that Cuphead video as if it's some tone-deaf nightmare when the dude playing the game knew he was bad at it and posted it to make fun of himself, and that context has been completely lost.

I should point out that there definitely are real problems with "games journalism." Austin Walker, formerly of Giant Bomb and Waypoint (which, I should mention, suffers the exact same issue I just outlined from Kotaku, they're not some shining beacon of "how to do it right"), outlined in a tweet thread I'm not going to go looking for why he more-or-less left that industry, and it was the irreconcilable schism between what people within that space wanted to put out and what people would read, which was almost uniformly purchasing advice.

Dapper_Swindler
Feb 14, 2012

Im glad my instant dislike in you has been validated again and again.

Terrible Opinions posted:

I don't know if Doom 2016 is this particular case but I know a lot of the time the garbage stream shown is literally the first time a journo has been allowed to play the game and the last before the release. Because the demand for content churn their bosses just plop a game on them and then go live with the first functional footage. Which I gotta say usually leads to a garbage result with even the simplest and easiest tasks.

yeah, thats my guess too. i mean there is also an unwriten rule of the world where when a upcoming game leaks onto stores early. the dude doing the first stream is a moron playing lovely music and skipping past all the tutorials and content and then just dying over and over again.

Arist posted:

I definitely also find it weird that people constantly bring up that Cuphead video as if it's some tone-deaf nightmare when the dude playing the game knew he was bad at it and posted it to make fun of himself, and that context has been completely lost.

I should point out that there definitely are real problems with "games journalism." Austin Walker, formerly of Giant Bomb and Waypoint (which, I should mention, suffers the exact same issue I just outlined from Kotaku, they're not some shining beacon of "how to do it right"), outlined in a tweet thread I'm not going to go looking for why he more-or-less left that industry, and it was the irreconcilable schism between what people within that space wanted to put out and what people would read, which was almost uniformly purchasing advice.

i mean i like both to some degree. i think part of the issues is with books and movies, its maybe a 15 dollar or so price(more for books in some cases). but alot of games its like 60 or more. like sure i'll take a risk are preorder a 30 buck game on psn because AA warhammer doom clone looks fun. but folks want to know if the 60/70 plus buck Big game will be worth the money. i mean yeah, i love my big navel gazing critical reviews too. but i think alot of folks read reviews to know if they will have fun/good times if they blow 60 bucks on this thing. personally, i think there is room for both, but the system is loving hosed, so you get mostly the lovely parts.

Dapper_Swindler fucked around with this message at 19:25 on Apr 14, 2021

Groovelord Neato
Dec 6, 2014


How can Doug afford to pay the people he kept around after Demo Reel failed. Amazing he's so stupid he doesn't own the rights to Nostalgia Critic too.

Froghammer
Sep 8, 2012

Khajit has wares
if you have coin

Groovelord Neato posted:

How can Doug afford to pay the people he kept around after Demo Reel failed. Amazing he's so stupid he doesn't own the rights to Nostalgia Critic too.
They have an office, so there's gotta be money coming from somewhere

Srice
Sep 11, 2011

Kotaku also employed Tim Rogers for awhile so heck, while Kotaku management sucks they had a bunch of talented people working there (until conditions became bad enough to drive their best people away. Rip).

Nuns with Guns
Jul 23, 2010

It's fine.
Don't worry about it.

Arist posted:

Kotaku doesn't even give review scores

e: this shouldn't even really be interpreted as a defense of Kotaku, whose typical headline structure I find incredibly annoying most of the time, too specific to be interesting or relatable. But people keep blaming some weird amalgam of problems from various sources in the industry as a boogeyman that doesn't really exist anywhere

It's because Kotaku was the outlet gamergate first latched onto as part of Zoe Quinn's ex alleging that a journalist working there was one of the people Zoe cheated on him with. Places like KotakuInAction cropping up on reddit for mocking gaming journalism because of that and it kind of carried over since then.

Impermanent
Apr 1, 2010
all sources for games journalism are extremely hit or miss at their best. i remember Walker had an extremely too-early knee-jerk reaction against disco elysium before he gave the game a chance and 180'd on it (but still defended his earlier critique as an issue with the game's tone varying wildly, which, lol).

but what's the alternative? people love tim rogers but his perspective on games is really "there's something to like in every game, and game liking is a skill" which while true and really interesting when someone is talking about why something works, really winds up leaving him failing to highlight when something messes up (except by comparison, for example his childhood copy of pac-man).

works by like liz ryerson http://ellaguro.blogspot.com/ or the catamites https://myfriendpokey.tumblr.com/post/644360345699467264/crafty-craft i never see referenced basically anywhere

campster does interesting work and I appreciate that he takes time to highlight indie games instead of exclusively covering AAA stuff or Canonized Classics (sorry noah caldwell-gervais but have you considered playing a video game that hasn't gone platinum)

Gwen
Aug 17, 2011

Arist posted:

I definitely also find it weird that people constantly bring up that Cuphead video as if it's some tone-deaf nightmare when the dude playing the game knew he was bad at it and posted it to make fun of himself, and that context has been completely lost.
He wasn't even pretending it was a review! And he said afterwards that he liked the game.

imagine having humility and the internet turns it back on you ten thousand fold.

egg tats
Apr 3, 2010

Impermanent posted:

all sources for games journalism are extremely hit or miss at their best. i remember Walker had an extremely too-early knee-jerk reaction against disco elysium before he gave the game a chance and 180'd on it (but still defended his earlier critique as an issue with the game's tone varying wildly, which, lol).

I think you're misattributing Colin Spacetwinks opinions there, actually. I don't remember is Austin had.

also the dude who played cuphead badly was literally not a games journalist. he was a general tech reporter at ces who does not really play games

edit:
vvvvvvv

the idea that someone that bad at posting paid :10bux: to post is embarrassing and depressing, regardless of the context in which they revealed this fact

egg tats fucked around with this message at 20:52 on Apr 14, 2021

Bleck
Jan 7, 2014

No matter how one loves, there are always different aims. Love can take a great many forms, whatever the era.

Arist posted:

I definitely also find it weird that people constantly bring up that Cuphead video as if it's some tone-deaf nightmare when the dude playing the game knew he was bad at it and posted it to make fun of himself, and that context has been completely lost.

the idea that someone that bad at video games gets paid to play video games is embarrassing and depressing, regardless of the context in which he revealed this fact

fun hater
May 24, 2009

its a neat trick, but you can only do it once

Bleck posted:

the idea that someone that bad at video games gets paid to play video games is embarrassing and depressing, regardless of the context in which he revealed this fact

its fun to laugh at yourself sometimes lol lighten up

Bleck
Jan 7, 2014

No matter how one loves, there are always different aims. Love can take a great many forms, whatever the era.

fun hater posted:

its fun to laugh at yourself sometimes lol lighten up

and you call yourself a fun hater. you make me SICK

No.1 Special
Apr 4, 2011
Mother's Basement - Get Hype For Jojo Part 6: Stone Ocean (spoiler-safe, premise described)

https://youtu.be/LllNIcs_N7I

Some More News - Dark Money In The Courts, Freak In The Sheets

https://youtu.be/lqlKMrq387Q

Famethrowa
Oct 5, 2012

Bleck posted:

the idea that someone that bad at video games gets paid to play video games is embarrassing and depressing, regardless of the context in which he revealed this fact

lol come on.

ButterSkeleton
Jan 19, 2020

SIZE=XX-LARGE]PLEASE! PLEASE STOP SAYING THE R WORD. GOD, IF SOMEBODY SAID THE R WORD, I WILL HECKIN LOSE IT. JUST PEE PEE MY JORTS. CAN'T YOU JUST CALL THEM A SMOOTHE BRAINED DOTARD LIKE THE REST OF US NORMAL PEOPLE? DERRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRR

P.S. FREE LARRY YOU FUCKIN COWARDS.
Did you guys know I was purposely really bad at videogames all along

Who's laughing now

Booky
Feb 21, 2013

Chill Bug


sometimes, people are Bad at games....... i never really got the "lol game journos" thing for some of them being crummy at a game they reviewed :v:

also update on sarah z's video (she edited parts of the description and addressed a PM she got with info in the rest of the comment):

MagusDraco posted:

Look like Sarah Z and the agency they make videos with are being sent explicit legal threats for parts of the video.

So that's fun. (From the pinned youtube comment):


:eyepop: dang they're really addison caining her

ButterSkeleton
Jan 19, 2020

SIZE=XX-LARGE]PLEASE! PLEASE STOP SAYING THE R WORD. GOD, IF SOMEBODY SAID THE R WORD, I WILL HECKIN LOSE IT. JUST PEE PEE MY JORTS. CAN'T YOU JUST CALL THEM A SMOOTHE BRAINED DOTARD LIKE THE REST OF US NORMAL PEOPLE? DERRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRR

P.S. FREE LARRY YOU FUCKIN COWARDS.
It's because it's funny that people who make a living playing videogames can be bad at them

Dapper_Swindler
Feb 14, 2012

Im glad my instant dislike in you has been validated again and again.

Impermanent posted:

all sources for games journalism are extremely hit or miss at their best. i remember Walker had an extremely too-early knee-jerk reaction against disco elysium before he gave the game a chance and 180'd on it (but still defended his earlier critique as an issue with the game's tone varying wildly, which, lol).

but what's the alternative? people love tim rogers but his perspective on games is really "there's something to like in every game, and game liking is a skill" which while true and really interesting when someone is talking about why something works, really winds up leaving him failing to highlight when something messes up (except by comparison, for example his childhood copy of pac-man).

works by like liz ryerson http://ellaguro.blogspot.com/ or the catamites https://myfriendpokey.tumblr.com/post/644360345699467264/crafty-craft i never see referenced basically anywhere

campster does interesting work and I appreciate that he takes time to highlight indie games instead of exclusively covering AAA stuff or Canonized Classics (sorry noah caldwell-gervais but have you considered playing a video game that hasn't gone platinum)

yeah, one of my favorite game critics is tehsnaker, he does long as gently caress videos about weird oldish bad/"bad" A/AA games and how somethings work and somethings don't. https://www.youtube.com/user/Tehsnakerer he also does some mainstream/AAA games but its mostly weird small games. and he usually finds good ideas or mechanics in them.

i love weird in depth social and mechanical stuff like him or noah or that dude who made the video about the killzone series.

LanceHunter
Nov 12, 2016

Beautiful People Club


Booky posted:

also update on sarah z's video (she edited parts of the description and addressed a PM she got with info in the rest of the comment):


:eyepop: dang they're really addison caining her

Hiveswap's studio really bringing the Star Citizen energy.

Terrible Opinions
Oct 18, 2013



Dapper_Swindler posted:

yeah, one of my favorite game critics is tehsnaker, he does long as gently caress videos about weird oldish bad/"bad" A/AA games and how somethings work and somethings don't. https://www.youtube.com/user/Tehsnakerer he also does some mainstream/AAA games but its mostly weird small games. and he usually finds good ideas or mechanics in them.

i love weird in depth social and mechanical stuff like him or noah or that dude who made the video about the killzone series.
Oaxaca is a gift we are unworthy of.

Yardbomb
Jul 11, 2011

What's with the eh... bretonnian dance, sir?

Terrible Opinions posted:

Oaxaca is a gift we are unworthy of.

His video made me buy it to support that crazy rear end dev and the game's so weird that it was a good time.

Dapper_Swindler
Feb 14, 2012

Im glad my instant dislike in you has been validated again and again.

Terrible Opinions posted:

Oaxaca is a gift we are unworthy of.

i also like his review of greedfall because it lined up with my feelings. there are cool ideas but it takes the safest choice every time plus. also his yakuza stuff is great. the We the revolution episode is good too because its such a great Papers please type idea for a game and it just fucks up at the end with some dumb rear end magical realism poo poo.

Dapper_Swindler fucked around with this message at 21:39 on Apr 14, 2021

macabresca
Jan 26, 2019

I WANNA HUG
Super Eyepatch Wolf posted on twitter his story about a new pc and it quickly turned into existential horror

https://twitter.com/EyePatchWolf/status/1382355450050580486

Violet_Sky
Dec 5, 2011



Fun Shoe

Endorph posted:

everyone gets mad at the wall video but the worst thing walker ever did is the sailor moon video he did where, in order

1) talked about how much he wanted to gently caress the cast of sailor moon
2) 'wow they're 14!?'
3) 'the legal age in japan is 13 so its fine!'
4) 'actually, the men who designed these characters must have wanted men to gently caress them'
5) 'also this show sucks except if you want to gently caress them'

That was the moment where I bailed on Doug for good. Sailor Moon has a lot of things to make fun about it, but Doug didn't even try. (Big surprise.)

Dapper_Swindler
Feb 14, 2012

Im glad my instant dislike in you has been validated again and again.
https://www.polygon.com/animation-c...4xrGD7_XXhPpx6I

have an article about one of the few things from my online childhood/teenhood that aged well and even got funnier with age.

MonsieurChoc
Oct 12, 2013

Every species can smell its own extinction.

macabresca posted:

Super Eyepatch Wolf posted on twitter his story about a new pc and it quickly turned into existential horror

https://twitter.com/EyePatchWolf/status/1382355450050580486

That's bleak.

Dias
Feb 20, 2011

by sebmojo

macabresca posted:

Super Eyepatch Wolf posted on twitter his story about a new pc and it quickly turned into existential horror

https://twitter.com/EyePatchWolf/status/1382355450050580486

There are few things more despair-inducing than buying/building a new computer and the thing just refusing to work.

Arc Hammer
Mar 4, 2013

Got any deathsticks?

Violet_Sky posted:

That was the moment where I bailed on Doug for good. Sailor Moon has a lot of things to make fun about it, but Doug didn't even try. (Big surprise.)

The old DiC dub is hilariously bad and worth it to laugh at on its own. They're cousins, you say?

Neo_Crimson
Aug 15, 2011

"Is that your final dandy?"

macabresca posted:

Super Eyepatch Wolf posted on twitter his story about a new pc and it quickly turned into existential horror

https://twitter.com/EyePatchWolf/status/1382355450050580486

This is why I try to steer people towards resources for building your own PC, even if they're not technically inclined. Pre-builts are more expensive, and with bigger OEMs you have to deal with weird proprietary bullshit, cost-cutting, and awful customer service. It's often easier to bite the bullet and put it together yourself.

That said, wow SEPW has an existential breakdown every other week doesn't he?

Jimbot
Jul 22, 2008

Micro Center tends to have pretty good pre-builts but you have to go to their physical store to pick them up.

Antigravitas
Dec 8, 2019

Die Rettung fuer die Landwirte:

Impermanent posted:

but what's the alternative?

I'd just like to highlight Three Moves Ahead here because it ties into reviewers and being bad at games as well. It's a strategy game podcast by a number of people: Troy Goodfellow, Rob Zachny, Jon Bolding, Rowan Kaiser, and a number of people I forget. It's niche but really well made.

And one recurring theme in the podcast is what a game is actually saying with its mechanics. In the episode on Dawn of Man they discuss how strange it is that the game completely leaves out the massive societal changes that came with the change from nomadic to settled. The period massively drove specialisation and stratification of society, but none of it is reflected in the game's mechanics. In other words, people in Dawn of Man don't live in a society. That observation made me look at some other strategy games and I realised how weird it is that a game like Surviving Mars barely acknowledges society existing either.

I don't think you can start that kind of discussion withougt having a good grasp of the mechanics of a game. I consider it an important to engage with games not just on the textual level but subtext as well, and the mechanics are often the subtext of games. Like the Ur-example of Sim City demonstrates, the foundations of a game's mechanics are often deeply rooted in how someone sees the world, and that in turn influences what a game actually says.

And also, Rowan Kaiser was correct regarding Stellaris.

Sydin
Oct 29, 2011

Another spring commute
The reason I learned to build and diagnose in the first place was because of some truly nightmarish Dell support episodes when I was younger.

Libluini
May 18, 2012

I gravitated towards the Greens, eventually even joining the party itself.

The Linke is a party I grudgingly accept exists, but I've learned enough about DDR-history I can't bring myself to trust a party that was once the SED, a party leading the corrupt state apparatus ...
Grimey Drawer

macabresca posted:

Super Eyepatch Wolf posted on twitter his story about a new pc and it quickly turned into existential horror

https://twitter.com/EyePatchWolf/status/1382355450050580486

Oof, that's rough. This story is why I never wanted to deal with IT ever again after finishing my apprenticeship as IT-System Electronician.

I was doing RMA during my 2-year apprenticeship. And I'm internally wincing every time he tries talking to customer service, because it's so close to my own experiences.

Nuns with Guns
Jul 23, 2010

It's fine.
Don't worry about it.

Arcsquad12 posted:

The old DiC dub is hilariously bad and worth it to laugh at on its own. They're cousins, you say?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=shc8GX7YiKo

Star Man
Jun 1, 2008

There's a star maaaaaan
Over the rainbow

Arcsquad12 posted:

The old DiC dub is hilariously bad and worth it to laugh at on its own. They're cousins, you say?

I should play Snow White because I have the most talent.

If there is just one line the Viz dub should have kept from the DiC dub, it's that one.

Twincityhacker
Feb 18, 2011

Hey, so one of the youtubers I watch Max Miller of Tasting History has decided to go PRO on the food history and cooking thing! https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jHpkqBFKmvA

He was furloughed from Disney for the past year from his marketing job, and he got the call to come back to work. ( In the past he was also a face character on Disney cruises ) But Max didn't think it was fair to either his paetrons or his corporate overlords to do both his marketing job *and* his youtube job, so he decided tendered his resignation today.

And he's apparently writing a cookbook too! So maybe go check out his channel? He does cooking history things, like "this is what the folks in ancient Babylon might have eaten for New Years: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7IYYhoO-hiY and "the history of pancakes" https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SD3WKbXhm6M

Ghostlight
Sep 25, 2009

maybe for one second you can pause; try to step into another person's perspective, and understand that a watermelon is cursing me



Libluini posted:

No it's not. Or do I not count as Human in your eyes?
You are not art.

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Bakeneko
Jan 9, 2007

Neo_Crimson posted:

This is why I try to steer people towards resources for building your own PC, even if they're not technically inclined. Pre-builts are more expensive, and with bigger OEMs you have to deal with weird proprietary bullshit, cost-cutting, and awful customer service. It's often easier to bite the bullet and put it together yourself.

That said, wow SEPW has an existential breakdown every other week doesn't he?

Building your own PC from scratch isn’t for everyone because of how complicated it is, but there are always going to be local independent computer technicians who will do the work for you and still charge way less than the likes of Dell. They’re far easier to get ahold of, and all the ones I’ve dealt with have been very helpful both in picking out parts beforehand and making sure everything works properly once it’s set up.

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