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It's all emotional based purchasing because who in their right mind would pay over $200k for a 20 year old GTR when you can get an almost brand new and much better GTR for half that? I mean I get the nostalgia thing to a point but this is ridiculous, there's a very good chance the bubble will burst and those cars won't ever be worth that again in a very long time.
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Apr 23, 2021 15:28
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It's the muscle car bubble for Gen X. I managed to sell my Legacy after 2 years of ownership for 25% more (through a broker so I lost a bit of that) than I paid for earlier this year. The market is really wild.
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Apr 23, 2021 15:59
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Applebees Appetizer posted:It's all emotional based purchasing because who in their right mind would pay over $200k for a 20 year old GTR when you can get an almost brand new and much better GTR for half that? It's absolutely a bubble but it's the muscle car boom all over again. It was stupid then, it's stupid now but it hasn't changed the fact that a GTO is worth $$$$$ still. Whatever crash there will be there will never be a cheap GTR ever again. It's authenticity that people want and the 25 year rule driving the prices. Anyone can buy a brand new car, it will be faster, newer, far easier to live with. That's the problem though, anyone can. There are only so many GTRs available and that authentic exclusivity is worth a gently caress ton. Land Cruisers and Hiluxes are the same way, a new Tacoma is boring and common. That drives the prices up because these vehicles have their mark on our collective culture and everyone wants to chase that high.
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Apr 23, 2021 16:01
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But there are far less GTOs and Hemi Cudas left and they are a hell of a lot older too, and most of them aren't even driven anymore at this point. They are also very well documented and people know what they are getting. Paying 200k for a ragged on 20 year old GTR is not even near the equivalent, the import dealers are taking advantage and are selling these cars sight unseen because of people making emotional and uninformed purchases and the only people benefiting from it are the dealers. I can guarantee you that if I buy a 1970 Hemi Cuda now it will without a doubt be worth more in ten years, do you think you can honestly say that about a 2001 GTR at this point? Sorry but I just don't see it happening. I know you're biased because you're a dealer but even you aren't approaching the ridiculous inflated levels that are going on with the sports cars. Exclusivity isn't that big of a deal because I rarely see new GTRs to begin with it's not like they are Corvettes. I think it's more of a fanboy Fast n Furious thing honestly.
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Apr 23, 2021 16:31
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Applebees Appetizer posted:I can guarantee you that if I buy a 1970 Hemi Cuda now it will without a doubt be worth more in ten years, do you think you can honestly say that about a 2001 GTR at this point? I do? Just my opinion but I certainly think a GTR will continue to go up in value for decades to come. It's stupid but so are GTO prices.
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Apr 23, 2021 16:37
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GTOs are 50 years old tho they have an excuse 
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Apr 23, 2021 16:46
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Applebees Appetizer posted:But there are far less GTOs and Hemi Cudas left and they are a hell of a lot older too, and most of them aren't even driven anymore at this point. They are also very well documented and people know what they are getting. Millenials and younger people, like me, don't care about a Hemi Cuda beyond "huh neat". A GTR is in our fabric, our media we consumed when we were kids just like boomers and their Cudas or GTOs or Stingrays. It is quite literally the exact same thing happening again as the muscle car boom. There is no difference, zero. A 70s Cuda sucks, is inefficient, unsafe and lovely to drive. An R34, when compared to a new one, is exactly the same. It sucks. The problem you have is your trying to both apply logic (These things aren't worth 200k plus I know what they are actually like) but emotion (the bubble will burst and the prices will tumble back down!) depending on how you feel. It's chaos out there, absolute chaos and logic has no place besides a foothold onto justifications we can all spin up. I don't give a hot poo poo about GTRs besides 'huh neat' but the reason they are going for so much is because as soon as legality clicks over for the USA for those R34s the prices will never touch the ground ever again. The USA is such a massive market and there are so little GTRs left that the literal exact thing you are claiming won't happen (for some reason) will happen. Weave into it the whole "do you REALLY own your car?" thing that is currently happening with any new one and it's easy to harken back to the days when men were men, Spice Girls was new and I could eat 10 Air Heads without feeling like death. I'm into the Land Cruiser and Hilux side of things but if I didn't get in when I did I wouldn't attempt to jump in now besides buying one for myself, maybe. But even then, you can't buy a Hilux, at all. Or even a new Land Cruiser here soon, the prices will reflect that reality, not the more logical one.
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Apr 23, 2021 16:48
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I’m a millennial but would kill for a Hemi Cuda due to religiously watching Nash Bridges as a kid.
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Apr 23, 2021 17:09
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To further Kaker's point, the R34 was much rarer than the 32 or 33 to start with, and more expensive. They're the hero car of many different pieces of media. On top of that, they can still be made fast by today's standards. It's the muscle car thing again, but with more objective awesome.
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Apr 23, 2021 17:42
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The Electronaut posted:I’m a millennial but would kill for a Hemi Cuda due to religiously watching Nash Bridges as a kid. As a Millennial? Pass. Gimme a 4wd Tercel or Wagovan anyday. Virgin Cuda vs the Chad R34 Body on frame versus unibody construction Truck/van suspension with leaf springs and live axles out back versus independent suspension Drum brakes? seriously.  4 wheel discs. Huge leaded fuel drinking stump pullin' tow truck v8 versus boosted inline six 3-4 speed manual versus 5 respectively. Dumb comparison is dumb. They're different cars imaged in the same nostalgia for two different generations.
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Apr 23, 2021 17:44
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It’s rarity too tho. Hemis in certain packages are extremely rare that’s why they go for ridiculous money. I saw a convertible hemi go for over a million but it was all original with ridiculously low miles. If you can find an R34 that’s all original with super low miles I can see it but good luck with that. The cars these guys are pimping out are poo poo.
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Apr 23, 2021 17:52
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Applebees Appetizer posted:It’s rarity too tho. Hemis in certain packages are extremely rare that’s why they go for ridiculous money. I saw a convertible hemi go for over a million but it was all original with ridiculously low miles. If you can find an R34 that’s all original with super low miles I can see it but good luck with that. The cars these guys are pimping out are poo poo. There is absolutely nothing inherent to a Hemi that makes it worth more than a GTR and as pointed out, it's a significantly worse car. If you're OK with Hemi prices but not OK with GTR prices then that's you being a boomer. It's absolutely the exact same thing. You can't be for one and not the other without invoking some sort of emotional response of your own.
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Apr 23, 2021 18:10
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KakerMix posted:Millenials and younger people, like me, don't care about a Hemi Cuda beyond "huh neat". A GTR is in our fabric, our media we consumed when we were kids just like boomers and their Cudas or GTOs or Stingrays. It is quite literally the exact same thing happening again as the muscle car boom. There is no difference, zero. A 70s Cuda sucks, is inefficient, unsafe and lovely to drive. An R34, when compared to a new one, is exactly the same. It sucks. This is a very long post to simply put it this way: Nostalgia is a very expensive and wonderful drug and I am here for all of it.
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Apr 23, 2021 19:25
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I’m nostalgic but cheap
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Apr 23, 2021 19:32
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KakerMix posted:There is absolutely nothing inherent to a Hemi that makes it worth more than a GTR and as pointed out, it's a significantly worse car. If you're OK with Hemi prices but not OK with GTR prices then that's you being a boomer. It's absolutely the exact same thing. You can't be for one and not the other without invoking some sort of emotional response of your own. I'm not saying I was all for it or ok with it, it just makes more sense to me that a 50 year old rare muscle car has more value than a not very rare 20 year old GTR that's just my dumb opinion to add to the conversation. There's nothing emotional for me about it. So lets just agree to disagree instead of making personal jabs ok?
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Apr 23, 2021 19:45
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Applebees Appetizer posted:I'm not saying I was all for it or ok with it, it just makes more sense to me that a 50 year old rare muscle car has more value than a not very rare 20 year old GTR that's just my dumb opinion to add to the conversation. There's nothing emotional for me about it. So lets just agree to disagree instead of making personal jabs ok? The reality we live in, right now, is 200k mile 4Runners selling for 10k, MK4 Supras selling for goofy money and Del Sols being lusted after on any number of car sites and instagram accounts. Mid-80s Grand Wagoneers slamming 30k all day and 60 series Land Cruisers going for even more. I wish GTRs weren't so expensive, but they are. Adapt or find yourself increasingly confused and out of touch. Making wide sweeping generalizations and state them as facts isn't really a way to debate 
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Apr 23, 2021 20:10
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I have now sold 2 4 door Skylines for a very nice profit, both on consignment and both went to high school kids who just got their license, so I do not see Skyline prices ever going down, they are ingrained into people's minds as cool cars. I wish I had sent my 2 doors to consignment but I didn't know about it then. Here is a new experience: had a vehicle supposed to be here 4-5 weeks ago but the ship got put on quarantine going through Panama Canal because some crew tested positive for virus. Just got the notice that it is ready at port now (Pajero Mini)  
everdave fucked around with this message at 20:41 on Apr 23, 2021 |
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Apr 23, 2021 20:34
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Adapt to what? I'm not a dealer like you or a buyer so ultimately I don't give a poo poo because it doesn't affect me either way Doesn't mean I can't have an opinion about it tho  [e] my whole point was I feel sorry for people that are going to pay 200k for a car that turns out to be problematic piece of poo poo, that's what the instagram you posted is all about, people getting ripped off isn't it? All because of a crazy market and people knee-jerk-emotional purchasing from people taking advantage of a situation. I'm not saying ALL of those cars aren't worth it but my guess is most of them are not, going by that guy's instagram it looks like a crap shoot Applebees Appetizer fucked around with this message at 20:54 on Apr 23, 2021 |
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Apr 23, 2021 20:40
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Applebees Appetizer posted:[e] my whole point was I feel sorry for people that are going to pay 200k for a car that turns out to be problematic piece of poo poo edit; a tragedy is when you bust your knuckles but a comedy is when you spend 200k on a POS stone soup fucked around with this message at 21:31 on Apr 23, 2021 |
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Apr 23, 2021 21:28
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stone soup posted:why sympathize with this particular group of people, though? a pos that's worse than an 8k cobalt, in the skylines case
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Apr 23, 2021 21:44
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stone soup posted:why sympathize with this particular group of people, though? On that instagram account, there are people who didn't mind busting their knuckles even after overpaying for a salvaged vehicle and finding major flaws right off the bat. No one likes a shyster anyway. The instagram dude points out that much of what is left now are rotting wrecks pulled out of wherever they ended up after being deemed too expensive to keep on the road in Japan. It's one thing to fix the car up and represent it as exactly that, another to try and hide it while expecting a premium price. Who would buy these things except for an enthusiast who would love having the car either way if the dealer was honest? Drives the price up on wrecks, too, for what that is worth. I look at that like pick-ups in the US. Everything, everything, is vastly inflated in price. Sure, they're tough and easy to repair, but don't try and say that a 250,000 mile plus 2008 5.7l Ram is worth 6-8k. At that mileage and age, either major assemblies have been replaced, or something big and expensive is about to fail. Especially if the thing has been used like a truck. Makes it real difficult to buy a work vehicle, from my perspective.
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Apr 24, 2021 00:41
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Same thing with a 20+ year old GTR/Silvia/RX7 from Japan, odds are it's been raced to hell and back every saturday night for most of it's life and needs more than just a good cleaning. It must be a significant problem because that guy is basically pleading with people to ease up and make sure you know exactly what the hell you are getting and don't over pay for these piles of poo poo because it's just driving up the price on everything elseteam free spirit posted:Emotions and fast buying decisions without pushing the brakes and lowering the boost will keep pushing the big money game.
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Apr 24, 2021 01:31
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cursedshitbox posted:As a Millennial? Pass. Gimme a 4wd Tercel or Wagovan anyday. I wasn’t comparing, what makes you think I was?
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Apr 24, 2021 01:53
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I regularly drool over cars on Japanese classics site because they have startup videos and a ton of pics but I think way early in this thread someone posted the auction sheet of the teal SW20 they were selling as immaculate and it had prior damage, tons of cheap repairs and was definitely made to look better by photography. Strong bullshit vibes overall but sadly not surprising that people will do unethical things to pump profits on a nostalgia bubble.
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Apr 24, 2021 17:12
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LeeMajors posted:I regularly drool over cars on Japanese classics site because they have startup videos and a ton of pics but I think way early in this thread someone posted the auction sheet of the teal SW20 they were selling as immaculate and it had prior damage, tons of cheap repairs and was definitely made to look better by photography. I thought it was the bunch on the west coast that KakerMix warns about in the OP with that one. Edit: I am wrong, keep reading for Kaker's post below. Midjack fucked around with this message at 17:52 on Apr 24, 2021 |
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Apr 24, 2021 17:21
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BlackMK4 posted:Anyone seen this going around yet? Someone is looking up auction sheets / history on some of the more visible cars that have been imported by places like Japan Classics.  Reading some of his posts, it seems like Duncan and Japanese Classics went after him with takedown notices on some of his posts for exposing their shenanigans.
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Apr 24, 2021 17:22
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Lol. How dare you expose our scam!!!! It's one thing for a market to increase organically but to intentionally inflate it by putting out garbage with lipstick on it is bullshit. There's maybe a handful of cars worth the premium, the rest are in between or poo poo but are being sold at the premium price anyway.
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Apr 24, 2021 17:44
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Delorence Fickle posted:
Yeah that's the big takeaway from that, specifically Duncan and Japanese Classics are poo poo poo poo poo poo. I mildly felt that before when I bought an Acty from them years ago (that started me down JDM) and just their general vibe. Same with Duncan, I asked them about a Jimny around that same time and they didn't know anything about it, or if the AC worked. Then that teal SW20 was posted from Japanese Classics a goon was asking about and I just happened to be able to find it at auction. Whoops Japanese Classics wasn't even being remotely honest about it at all wow. There is plenty of money to be made without being shitheads but people just can't help themselves.
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Apr 24, 2021 17:51
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KakerMix posted:There is plenty of money to be made without being shitheads but people just can't help themselves. Gotta max those returns baybee.
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Apr 24, 2021 19:57
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It's gonna be like the muscle car boom, the only thing left will be rolling shells with questionable histories and owners saying "I know what I got" Won't be surprised if these dealers start pumping out GTR clones sold as the real thing because there won't be any actual GTRs left to sell
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Apr 24, 2021 21:25
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Applebees Appetizer posted:It's gonna be like the muscle car boom, the only thing left will be rolling shells with questionable histories and owners saying "I know what I got" Fake ATTESA will be a thing to see.
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Apr 24, 2021 21:27
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It won't have that obviously, it will just be RWD turbo coupes dressed up to look like a GTR, priced like the real thing of course [e] pretty sure R32 GTR clones are a thing already
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Apr 24, 2021 21:33
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I still want to drive a Mazda 323 GTR or GTAe. Not sure if I'd actually want to own one though.
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Apr 24, 2021 21:42
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Applebees Appetizer posted:It won't have that obviously, it will just be RWD turbo coupes dressed up to look like a GTR, priced like the real thing of course I guess though I'd kind of expect someone dropping that kind of money on a 30 year old car to either look under it themselves or get it looked at before forking over the briefcase of $100 bills.
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Apr 25, 2021 18:47
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Midjack posted:I guess though I'd kind of expect someone dropping that kind of money on a 30 year old car to either look under it themselves or get it looked at before forking over the briefcase of $100 bills. Thing is they'll probably advertise it as such, because once there's no actual GTRs left to sell there will be buyers looking for the next best thing and with plenty of GTs available why not. It won't cost as much as a real GTR (hyperbole on my part there) but the price will still be ridiculous I'm sure. Same thing happened with the muscle cars, clones were pretty common. My dad had a 442 convertible clone made out of a regular Cutlass for a few years, nobody knew the difference. And a neighbor of mine back in 90's made a GTO clone out of a 1970 LeMans, it was pretty drat accurate except for the engine and drivetrain, unless you looked under the hood and knew what you were looking at you'd never know the difference. He just painted it orange, put a wing on the trunk and the decals on. Bucket seats, etc.
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Apr 26, 2021 15:03
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I’ve been following Jimmy Oakes on YouTube, he recently did the same conversion for a GT. I know what I’m looking at and still think it looks drat good.
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Apr 26, 2021 15:35
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Applebees Appetizer posted:Thing is they'll probably advertise it as such, because once there's no actual GTRs left to sell there will be buyers looking for the next best thing and with plenty of GTs available why not. It won't cost as much as a real GTR (hyperbole on my part there) but the price will still be ridiculous I'm sure. We've been there for 20 years. Lotta Corolla SR5s out there getting called hachi-roku
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Apr 26, 2021 18:11
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Boys who love boys
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Just won a 1985 4wd Carry with 3600 miles verified, I actually have a Sambar on the way with 1800 miles.  
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Apr 27, 2021 03:06
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Charles posted:I still want to drive a Mazda 323 GTR or GTAe. Not sure if I'd actually want to own one though. Me too buddy  After rebuilding the back half of my Subaru Forester, their problems seem... lesser.
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Apr 27, 2021 06:53
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I feel like I've seen about 20+ posts today in various jdm/rhd groups about CarVX for Japanese vehicle history reports. Anyone here used them before? Legit? For $30 I'm tempted to roll the dice on my Acty VIN and see what's up.
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Apr 27, 2021 23:13
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