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bee posted:Here's a fun timeline for the thread, maybe someone can help me decipher wtf just happened: Consultants are often brought into companies to take the heat. That's what I expect happened there. What happened with your boss however is a completely different story. They should know this game already. Have clients bounced you from contracts before/regularly? I'd guess you would have told us that if it happened, so I'm guessing not. Sorry you're going through this.
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Apr 27, 2021 13:30
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I think the weird companies are the one's that don't let you roll over any time year to year. Do they just shut down during December as everyone burns their remaining PTO? I'm capped at 240 hours for PTO accrual and earn ~2 days/month. I'm at the cap, so I just take the last two Fridays off every month. One day, I won't have a toddler and will be able to take a real vacation again.
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Apr 27, 2021 13:47
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Motronic posted:What happened with your boss however is a completely different story. They should know this game already. Have clients bounced you from contracts before/regularly? I'd guess you would have told us that if it happened, so I'm guessing not. bee, nothing you could have done would have changed the outcome, imo. Chalk it up as experience and move on.
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Apr 27, 2021 14:10
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bee posted:Here's a fun timeline for the thread, maybe someone can help me decipher wtf just happened: It's always the worst when an effortpost turns out to be post #40 on the page. My reading is that Motronic is right and that it's also probable they changed their mind and decided to go internal soon after you started (someone's crony became available sooner than expected, maybe) and shoved you out the door. Gigantic  at telling an HR person to "be more transparent"
Eric the Mauve fucked around with this message at 14:28 on Apr 27, 2021 |
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Apr 27, 2021 14:13
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Out of curiosity, the last person in the role quit after two weeks - did they bail on the project, or did they leave your firm? Fundamentally I suspect the client has decided to cancel their contract with your firm, and as a body-for-hire, that means you're likely to get the axe as well. In your last paragraph - are you talking about your firm's employees, or your client's employees?
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Apr 27, 2021 14:17
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MrLogan posted:I think the weird companies are the one's that don't let you roll over any time year to year. Do they just shut down during December as everyone burns their remaining PTO? I've only seen PTO reset on an employee's hire date, which in most cases spreads it out some. But it definitely leads to people burning use it or lose it PTO as that date approaches. Hell, I'm in that situation soon since there was nowhere to go go last year.
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Apr 27, 2021 14:18
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Dik Hz posted:Nah, boss saw it coming and specifically recruited someone to take the fall so he wouldn't lose any of his people. The $500 spot bonus was to assuage his guilt. If this is bee's first contract with that consulting firm I totally agree.
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Apr 27, 2021 14:18
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bee posted:Here's a fun timeline for the thread, maybe someone can help me decipher wtf just happened: I think Motronic is correct, with the added possibility that you got fired to protect your boss's business with that company? MrLogan posted:I think the weird companies are the one's that don't let you roll over any time year to year. Do they just shut down during December as everyone burns their remaining PTO? No, usually you just lose some days. Some shops (like Sundae's) plan around that by purposefully shutting down at year end, but at most places those who submit their requests and get approval can take those days, those that don't, don't. Omne fucked around with this message at 14:28 on Apr 27, 2021 |
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Apr 27, 2021 14:21
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MrLogan posted:I think the weird companies are the one's that don't let you roll over any time year to year. Do they just shut down during December as everyone burns their remaining PTO? We accrue monthly but you can run a negative balance during the year if you so desire. Everyone resets on Jan 1, it's use-it-or-lose-it with the actual goal of getting everyone to use it. I've seen people get improves on performance reviews for not taking enough time off. You're supposed to be smart enough and adult enough to plan through the year to use it. You have to get MD level approval to use in Dec-Jan-Feb (in part because we have 2 week paid mandatory vacation in the last two weeks of December, which doesn't come out of PTO) but that's almost always forthcoming if you ask a couple months in advance.
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Apr 27, 2021 14:22
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KYOON GRIFFEY JR posted:Out of curiosity, the last person in the role quit after two weeks - did they bail on the project, or did they leave your firm? Yeah this is the obvious natural thing to assume but in that case, why the hell did they say "we're sacking you because your performance sucks but we won't tell you why" instead of simply "we decided to go a different direction and end our relationship with your company, sorry"? Hard to avoid concluding that outfit has a deeply hosed up group of executives.
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Apr 27, 2021 14:23
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Yeah, as a consultant in a head of X role, really don't take it personally. There's nothing you can do about a corporate wide change in direction, and only slightly more you could do about being scapegoated for recruitment issues (assuming 'pay more' and 'reform the culture' weren't in your toolbox). Your consultant boss letting go as soon as they didn't have work for you is, again, lovely but not your fault. You became a liability, and dropping you cleared the book. Remember that the next time you get the urge to kill yourself working for a job.
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Apr 27, 2021 14:24
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Dik Hz posted:Nah, boss saw it coming and specifically recruited someone to take the fall so he wouldn't lose any of his people. The $500 spot bonus was to assuage his guilt. Yeah the way they went about it is super weird but this is pretty much it.
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Apr 27, 2021 14:25
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quote:I tell the CEO that I'm confused by this feedback and he tells me that I should read the 5 dysfunctions of a team. 
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Apr 27, 2021 14:25
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oh absolutely, it's super weird. the only thing I can think of that could maybe possibly make sense is if the client company could use poor performance as an off-ramp to get out of the contract, but that seems a little odd too. If one of our clients told us they wanted to go in a new direction we'd let them, there's no point in trying to keep clients that don't want your services even if there's a contract in place.
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Apr 27, 2021 14:26
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Tibalt posted:(assuming 'pay more' and 'reform the culture' weren't in your toolbox). 
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Apr 27, 2021 14:27
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Motronic posted:If this is bee's first contract with that consulting firm I totally agree. Yes, it was my first contract with that firm. The person who was in the role prior to me was hired by the company itself, then when she quit after a fortnight the company engaged the firm to find them another HR manager, and the firm hired me. Something else that was off about this is that my boss has asked me to send an email tomorrow to the leadership team and my direct reports in the company to announce that I'm leaving and it's my last day. Boss said that I was able to say that I was leaving as I'd decided that the role wasn't a good fit and I wanted to pursue other opportunities or whatever - I said that sounded disingenuous, because that's not what happened, and it wouldn't really matter what I said because everyone in that company is up in each other's business so everyone is going to know I got fired so what's the point of lying about it? Boss kinda shrugged and said it was up to me how I announced my departure. What should I do? I'm inclined to just say as little as possible, I'm working from home tomorrow and only going in to drop my laptop off and get my Pusheen mug back.
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Apr 27, 2021 14:33
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bee posted:Yes, it was my first contract with that firm. The person who was in the role prior to me was hired by the company itself, then when she quit after a fortnight the company engaged the firm to find them another HR manager, and the firm hired me. Oh yeah, you were either hired because this was a likely outcome of this contract and/or it's a small firm who doesn't have enough other business to carry you until there's another contract. There is nothing you could have done to change this outcome. There is nothing you did to cause this outcome. Again, I'm sorry. As for that email: that's gonna cost money. Id' only do that in exchange for meaningful severance. Otherwise I'd do nothing other than go get my mug. This is a gently caress You: Pay Me situation.
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Apr 27, 2021 14:36
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bee posted:Yes, it was my first contract with that firm. The person who was in the role prior to me was hired by the company itself, then when she quit after a fortnight the company engaged the firm to find them another HR manager, and the firm hired me. You're being fired (twice) and your boss from the consulting company wants you to send an email to the client company saying you are leaving on your own? ETA: What Motronic said
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Apr 27, 2021 14:36
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bee posted:Yes, it was my first contract with that firm. The person who was in the role prior to me was hired by the company itself, then when she quit after a fortnight the company engaged the firm to find them another HR manager, and the firm hired me. Oh hell, then you were only ever supposed to be a short term stopgap until they sorted out another internal hire after their last one left them high and dry. Everything they told you was a lie, don't let it make you question yourself. e: honestly it sounds like some kind of side deal was made between your direct employer and the company you briefly worked at to gently caress you over for their mutual benefit. The only thing you did wrong this whole time was being too inexperienced in this area to realize you were being played for a sucker. Eric the Mauve fucked around with this message at 14:40 on Apr 27, 2021 |
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Apr 27, 2021 14:37
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KYOON GRIFFEY JR posted:Out of curiosity, the last person in the role quit after two weeks - did they bail on the project, or did they leave your firm? The contract is still in place, my boss is taking over my role until he figures out what to do next. I say good luck to him once he realises how much bullshit I was dealing with on a daily basis and he starts to get blamed for issues operations blamed me for that I had next to no control over. In the last paragraph, I am referring to the minimum wage staff who work directly for the company. Who for some magical reason the CEO can't understand why his company can't seem to retain.
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Apr 27, 2021 14:41
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bee posted:Yes, it was my first contract with that firm. The person who was in the role prior to me was hired by the company itself, then when she quit after a fortnight the company engaged the firm to find them another HR manager, and the firm hired me. Are they still paying you? If not, don't send e-mails for them. If they are still paying you, send the e-mails they tell you to send and cash the check. See above. Also, I want to say that I think you did everything right and made all the right choices. And still got a lovely outcome. Sucks.
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Apr 27, 2021 14:42
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I wouldn't be able to resist the temptation to jam so many cliches into that exit email. "In light of the ngoing situation, management and I have mutually decided, for health reasons, that I'll focus on spending more time with my wife and family."
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Apr 27, 2021 14:46
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Thanks everyone, I appreciate your insight and kind words. It's just hard to rationalise when I felt like I was working really hard and suddenly get punted. I'm getting two weeks severance, which is a week more than I am legally entitled to in my country. Boss has also offered to give me a reference and allow me to leave my employment with his company up on LinkedIn for the next few weeks while I am looking for a new job. So I guess that tomorrow, as much as I would enioy returning the CEO's copy of the 5 Dysfunctions of a Team by setting it ablaze and launching it through the office window, I'll curb that particular urge and just grab my mug and yeet on outta there
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Apr 27, 2021 14:54
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KYOON GRIFFEY JR posted:oh absolutely, it's super weird. the only thing I can think of that could maybe possibly make sense is if the client company could use poor performance as an off-ramp to get out of the contract, but that seems a little odd too. If one of our clients told us they wanted to go in a new direction we'd let them, there's no point in trying to keep clients that don't want your services even if there's a contract in place. Nobody ever hires a consultant if they're happy with the status quo. This client's org is so hosed up that: - Their old head of HR quit after two weeks on the job - There were no defined targets for bee to know if they're on track to hit or not (which is a shared responsibility but at least partially on the client) - When the HR consultant asks the client CEO for feedback, the client CEO's response is to shut down the conversation and go through the consulting firm's chain of command instead - This happens: quote:I've watched employees at this company get a written warning for having multiple allegations made against them for using drugs on shift. Other employees repeatedly don't show up for their shifts yet somehow don't get fired. Last week I had an investigation meeting with another employee who failed to adequately supervise someone in his care, resulting in a member of the public being assaulted. Those employees all get warnings It would not surprise me if they're dysfunctional enough to turn "we gave you an entire quarter and you didn't magically fix all our deep-rooted culture problems" into "your performance is unacceptable, you're done."
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Apr 27, 2021 14:55
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bee posted:So I guess that tomorrow, as much as I would enioy returning the CEO's copy of the 5 Dysfunctions of a Team by setting it ablaze and launching it through the office window
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Apr 27, 2021 14:55
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Space Gopher posted:This client's org is so hosed up that: To be fair, while this is certainly possible it's probably likelier that person bailed because they got a better offer right after starting. bee posted:I'm just stunned. I've watched employees at this company get a written warning for having multiple allegations made against them for using drugs on shift. Other employees repeatedly don't show up for their shifts yet somehow don't get fired. Last week I had an investigation meeting with another employee who failed to adequately supervise someone in his care, resulting in a member of the public being assaulted. Those employees all get warnings, but I get sacked? This is just loving so bizarre to me This stuff makes me wonder--is this outfit in the business of housing, as it's said, troubled youths? It would explain a lot if it was.
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Apr 27, 2021 15:00
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bee posted:What should I do? I'm inclined to just say as little as possible, I'm working from home tomorrow and only going in to drop my laptop off and get my Pusheen mug back. Dik Hz posted:Are they still paying you? If not, don't send e-mails for them. If they are still paying you, send the e-mails they tell you to send and cash the check. See above.
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Apr 27, 2021 15:05
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I'm not sure why exactly the first HR person bailed but I know she did it without having something else lined up, because she asked my boss if he would take her on as a consultant. The client is in the human services sector, but they're a for-profit.
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Apr 27, 2021 15:10
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bee posted:The client is in the human services sector, but they're a for-profit. Yeah, so are the "Homes for Troubled Youths" in my area. They're renowned for being the absolute worst places on Earth to work. If your ex-employer was anything like that then you have my sincerest congratulations on no longer working there.
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Apr 27, 2021 15:43
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bee posted:The contract is still in place, my boss is taking over my role until he figures out what to do next. I say good luck to him once he realises how much bullshit I was dealing with on a daily basis and he starts to get blamed for issues operations blamed me for that I had next to no control over. ya i mean you gotta recognize the difference between you, a body-for-hire on a contract, and an employee of the company in terms of how you are going to be interacted with but yep, situation sucks, I'm sorry. It's fairly normal but that doesn't make it good or right. gently caress your boss, don't send poo poo. "I am leaving to pursue the opportunity of not working here any more"
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Apr 27, 2021 15:52
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bee posted:I'm not sure why exactly the first HR person bailed but I know she did it without having something else lined up, because she asked my boss if he would take her on as a consultant. Someone else bailing from a job after 10 days with nothing else lined up should be a strong tell. I don't think you did anything wrong here bee, the company is run by assholes. Now I'm wondering if there were some "questionable" suggestions that you laughed off, and you were pushed out because you didn't want to play felony-ball with them.
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Apr 27, 2021 17:03
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Tibalt posted:I wouldn't be able to resist the temptation to jam so many cliches into that exit email. "In light of the ngoing situation, management and I have mutually decided, for health reasons, that I'll focus on spending more time with my wife and family." ...in these trying times
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Apr 27, 2021 17:20
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After a great deal of soul searching
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Apr 27, 2021 17:34
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Volmarias posted:After a great deal of soul searching ... I couldn't find any in the EC
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Apr 27, 2021 18:03
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You could make up a reasonable excuse for why you'd feel more comfortable writing out the email if you got 4 rather than 2 weeks of severance. "I have some good working relationships in the company and they could potentially refer me to a new job - but if I write I'm leaving for my own reasons they won't believe I'm looking and I'm unlikely to get that support. If you give me 4 weeks of severance I'd be ok with giving up that help." Or both be insulting and make it clear you're looking for $$. "I consider lying to be unethical, but if I got 2 months severance I would feel I'm leaving on my own terms and therefore would be able to write the email without going against my moral compass." Tomfoolery fucked around with this message at 18:25 on Apr 27, 2021 |
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Apr 27, 2021 18:23
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"I'll write that email if you and client write me letters affirming that this is non voluntary on my part and you won't attempt to block unemployment."
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Apr 27, 2021 18:49
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God drat, Bee. Sorry, dude.  From your posts/perspective, it definitely sounds like you were used as a kickball for a dysfunctional/in-transition organization. My general view is that barring hilariously inept or malicious behavior, it isn't possible to be legit fire-worthy from a corporate job in only three months. You got done dirty.
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Apr 27, 2021 18:55
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Apparently the lastest KPMG audit embarassed an important but distant director by pointing out me [I] as a single point of failure for his yearly $200M budgeting and scheduling process. I got informed of this in a super ninja secret teams meeting with the poor guy who got ordered to fix this indignity. The solution is of course to move it all into our ERP/scheduling system which is going to be even MORE of a black box but sure it'll probably be more robust. And a lot of work, ok. But this poo poo is nowhere near being a problem or even time sink for me either way so I got to be perkily honest like "To be frank its more like half a point of failure tops because i barely remember how i designed or operated that monster spreadsheet in the first place".  I mean it will likely be fun to do it right this time around? No need to be embarrassed guys, KPMG actually got it right, calm down. Threadkiller Dog fucked around with this message at 21:44 on Apr 27, 2021 |
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Apr 27, 2021 20:26
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PTO Chat: When I started my current gig 5 years ago I negotiated 4 weeks vacation instead of the standard 2 weeks. Somehow it got input wrong (4+2) to 6 weeks at start. I've never said a word about it and no one else has either, and I just got my 5 year +1 week, so now I get 7 weeks. I report to an SVP that literally does not care when/if/how long you take PTO. Feels good man.
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Apr 27, 2021 20:37
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Sundae posted:God drat, Bee. Thanks, it certainly feels that way <3 I sent the email to the leadership team and made it as bland as possible, basically a slightly longer version of "today is my last day, thanks for the opportunity to work and learn here, good luck to you in the future" and only the IT manager, who has always been kind to me given our shared love of nerdy poo poo, replied to wish me goodbye and good luck. Kinda says a lot, really. I'll consider it to be a bullet dodged, and hopefully poach the imo underpaid IT manager for my partner's start up sometime later in the year. 
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Apr 28, 2021 03:50
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