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ymgve
Jan 2, 2004


:dukedog:
Offensive Clock

Escobarbarian posted:

I noticed that too and it’s so weird

He probably told Popola to write some because he is busy doing Important poo poo like slaughtering sheep and planting seeds.


Anyway, what kind of person are you?



I'm a B myself.

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Blaziken386
Jun 27, 2013

I'm what the kids call: a big nerd
That seems weird, considering writing letters is literally what you're doing every time you save the game

weird inconsistency because it's new content, maybe?

Miss Mowcher
Jul 24, 2007

Ribbit

Pollyanna posted:

Replicant suffers from repeating itself. It asks the player to go through all of its massive areas at least twice, with no real difference between each visit. You have to offer something new if you revisit a place. Something has to meaningfully change.

Ocarina of Time, for example, rarely made you go through the exact place and instead took you to places you saw but simply couldn’t access. For example, Jabu Jabu vs the Ice Cavern, finding Saria vs. the Forest Temple, drained Lake Hylia, etc. When it did make you revisit the same places, it’s never the same experience - e.g. the Kokiri Village, Castle Town, Gordon City.

Not so in Replicant. If you’ve been to the Aerie once, you’ve been to the Aerie a thousand times, and you’ll experience nothing new going back there. Facade doesn’t change, the Forest of Myth doesn’t change, the Lost Shrine doesn’t change, the Junk Heap sure as gently caress doesn’t change, you get the idea. And yet you have to go to them a bunch of times! Imagine if you had to go to the amusement park three or four times in Automata and it was the same every time.

The level design in this game is just very lazy and reuses existing locations without changing them significantly over time. Hell, there’s a timeskip in the game just like in Ocarina of Time and yet it doesn’t really change the world as a result. Huge missed opportunity.

:hmmyes:
Also, the game needing multiple playthroughs would be a lot better if they changed more stuff, just adding some scenes is lazy. Nier A was better about this (route B is still too samey)
If it were a book/movie I’d say it needed a good editor to improve the pacing.

Still, a game worth playing and I like it despite all its flaws. Hope that Taro keeps improving on the gameplay/design of his games.

Last Celebration
Mar 30, 2010
Iirc Taro’s openly admitted that Replicant being as repetitive as it is (as well as most of his stuff to some degree) is because he doesn’t wanna charge people $60 for a 10-15 hour game, so hopefully he’ll just lay off it if there’s no need for it.

chiasaur11
Oct 22, 2012



ZZZorcerer posted:

:hmmyes:
Also, the game needing multiple playthroughs would be a lot better if they changed more stuff, just adding some scenes is lazy. Nier A was better about this (route B is still too samey)
If it were a book/movie I’d say it needed a good editor to improve the pacing.

Still, a game worth playing and I like it despite all its flaws. Hope that Taro keeps improving on the gameplay/design of his games.

I have complicated feelings about Route B, since its flaws and its value are of a piece. The repetition is tedious, but it makes everything feel safe and comforting, like nothing too bad will happen, because of how long you've spent (and repetition makes everything feel longer) being "safe" there. Likewise, 9S's gameplay is less fun, but that makes the player get more attached to 2B, and feel her absence more when she's not around.

It all gives Route C much more punch, and it's helpful to understand 9S better... but it's tedious in and of itself, to the point where I don't really blame people for quitting, even if going the whole way is worth it.

Miss Mowcher
Jul 24, 2007

Ribbit
Repetitive gameplays still needs to be good. If the junk heap were fun to traverse and had engaging combat then going through it multiple times wouldn’t feel like a chore.So I don’t buy that excuse.

Combat mechanics seem a lot better (didn’t play the original) but the enemies/level design still suck. I really enjoy the change in perspective and 3rd person bullet hell ideias, but the execution is lacking a lot.

chiasaur11 posted:

I have complicated feelings about Route B, since its flaws and its value are of a piece. The repetition is tedious, but it makes everything feel safe and comforting, like nothing too bad will happen, because of how long you've spent (and repetition makes everything feel longer) being "safe" there. Likewise, 9S's gameplay is less fun, but that makes the player get more attached to 2B, and feel her absence more when she's not around.

It all gives Route C much more punch, and it's helpful to understand 9S better... but it's tedious in and of itself, to the point where I don't really blame people for quitting, even if going the whole way is worth it.

I liked playing as nines in B to see stuff with a different perspective but they needed to rethink how to do the A route and then expand it on B to make it better, the problem is in the execution not on the concept.

From the first quote in this post:
“You have to offer something new if you revisit a place. Something has to meaningfully change.”

Miss Mowcher fucked around with this message at 04:27 on Apr 28, 2021

Pollyanna
Mar 5, 2005

Milk's on them.


Last Celebration posted:

Iirc Taro’s openly admitted that Replicant being as repetitive as it is (as well as most of his stuff to some degree) is because he doesn’t wanna charge people $60 for a 10-15 hour game, so hopefully he’ll just lay off it if there’s no need for it.

I’d rather pay 60 dollars for a really, really good and tightly developed 10-15 hour game than a good 10-15 hour game + a repetitive merely-okay 30-40 game.

Gutcruncher
Apr 16, 2005

Go home and be a family man!
I just wish I could skip the dungeons themselves on repeat playthroughs. Even if it still makes me do the boss fights and the overworld stuff, just let me skip that much

Pollyanna
Mar 5, 2005

Milk's on them.


For ending C, do I have to start a clear file from after ending B, or can I reload from an earlier file on the B playthrough?

Blaziken386
Jun 27, 2013

I'm what the kids call: a big nerd
quick question: does anyone know if you can change the date to make regular vegetables grow faster

because the only part 1 sidequest I havent finished is the watermelon one, and I'd rather plant seeds than buy them for absurd prices

BisbyWorl
Jan 12, 2019

Knowledge is pain plus observation.


Pollyanna posted:

Also working my way through my second playthrough and I paid more attention to the cutscene for Junk Heap. Gideon really is a huge shithead, isn’t he? Whines his rear end off when his mom’s gone, causes the accident that kills his brother, then turns around and blames a bystander for it. I wish we could kick his rear end.

Grimoire Nier shows that even Jakob was a bastard. His first thought when Nier walked in was to try and kill him, and he was planning on breaking Gideon's legs so he wouldn't try to go into the Junk Heap to look for their mom.

Blaziken386 posted:

quick question: does anyone know if you can change the date to make regular vegetables grow faster

because the only part 1 sidequest I havent finished is the watermelon one, and I'd rather plant seeds than buy them for absurd prices

Changing the date works just fine. If you're on PC you don't even have to quit the game, just save, swap time, and reload.

RubberLuffy
Mar 31, 2011

Blaziken386 posted:

quick question: does anyone know if you can change the date to make regular vegetables grow faster

because the only part 1 sidequest I havent finished is the watermelon one, and I'd rather plant seeds than buy them for absurd prices

On console people have been using timezone changes to cheat the farm. Like setting it to UTC-11, planting, UTC+13, or something of that nature.

Blaziken386
Jun 27, 2013

I'm what the kids call: a big nerd

RubberLuffy posted:

On console people have been using timezone changes to cheat the farm. Like setting it to UTC-11, planting, UTC+13, or something of that nature.
Blugh, that's annoying

on a related note, I went to hand in a pumpkin to complete yonah's sidequest just now, but she only wants to talk about helping emil... but going to emil's house would lock me out of every quest. Did I seriously screw myself over by waiting too long? :shepicide:

e: she'll accept it if you reload the map, thank god

Blaziken386 fucked around with this message at 05:32 on Apr 28, 2021

BisbyWorl
Jan 12, 2019

Knowledge is pain plus observation.


Blaziken386 posted:

Blugh, that's annoying

on a related note, I went to hand in a pumpkin to complete yonah's sidequest just now, but she only wants to talk about helping emil... but going to emil's house would lock me out of every quest. Did I seriously screw myself over by waiting too long? :shepicide:

e: she'll accept it if you reload the map, thank god

Emil's house isn't the cutoff point for part 1, the actual cutoff is getting vapor moss for Popola right after Emil's house. As long as you don't pick up that shiny object you'll be fine.

Escobarbarian
Jun 18, 2004


Grimey Drawer

Blaziken386 posted:

That seems weird, considering writing letters is literally what you're doing every time you save the game

weird inconsistency because it's new content, maybe?

Maybe. In one of the Grimoire NieR stories it has references to him writing letters to her.

History Comes Inside!
Nov 20, 2004




Pollyanna posted:

For ending C, do I have to start a clear file from after ending B, or can I reload from an earlier file on the B playthrough?

There are new story beats, you have to go again from clear.

axeil
Feb 14, 2006
Oh my god gently caress Black Pearls. I just spent two hours farming them.

Why in the hell do you need fifteen of the things when they're a super rare drop?

Putrid Grin posted:

Using and xbox controller and special K, and what bugs me is that it worked just fine until it didnt.

I'd recommend just watching the Special K discord. If it helps I'm using SK_v21.04.24_NieR_Replicant_Radical_Replicant_v_0.2.3 and there are no problems for me. I think I'll stay on this version till they have a fully functional one that 100% fixes everything, adds >60 fps, PS button prompts, etc.

axeil fucked around with this message at 08:27 on Apr 28, 2021

Ytlaya
Nov 13, 2005

axeil posted:

I suppose Automata was kind of like that too, Route A is very normal except for the whole fake out on the aliens all being dead.

For me one of the biggest surprises in Automata was that the Aliens actually existed. The minute it mentioned an alien invasion I thought "this has gotta be bullshit and there's probably some other reason humanity was wiped out, like maybe humanity built the machines or something" but nope, turns out there actually were aliens and they had literal flying saucers!

Blaziken386
Jun 27, 2013

I'm what the kids call: a big nerd

Blaziken386 posted:

very slight spoilers regarding The Lore of the series: there's a new loading screen!


I shared this a while back, but apparently there's more than one new loading screens


Accord, you're popping up all over the place, aren't you?

Ytlaya posted:

For me one of the biggest surprises in Automata was that the Aliens actually existed. The minute it mentioned an alien invasion I thought "this has gotta be bullshit and there's probably some other reason humanity was wiped out, like maybe humanity built the machines or something" but nope, turns out there actually were aliens and they had literal flying saucers!
They were clearly established in an epilogue drama-cd of Replicant about Emil's adventures

Yoko Taro is always serious about his joke endings :yokotaro:

stev
Jan 22, 2013

Please be excited.



Huh, I got to the Mansion expecting to be greeted by freaky moon head boy. I had no idea Emil was just a dude with stone vision to begin with.

Last Celebration
Mar 30, 2010
I knew the aliens were real because of the supplemental post-Gestalt stuff materials but it’s still pretty funny to know that they made robots stronger/smarter than them and got the poo poo kicked out of them for it.

BisbyWorl
Jan 12, 2019

Knowledge is pain plus observation.


Ytlaya posted:

For me one of the biggest surprises in Automata was that the Aliens actually existed. The minute it mentioned an alien invasion I thought "this has gotta be bullshit and there's probably some other reason humanity was wiped out, like maybe humanity built the machines or something" but nope, turns out there actually were aliens and they had literal flying saucers!

I just find it hilarious how absolutely hosed the Earth is in Nier.

First you got Magic Goddess Dust murdering people and creating giant monsters to kill everyone else, then the hail mary plan to deal with that goes completely off the rails, then right when the dust is settling from that loving aliens invade the world.

Escobarbarian
Jun 18, 2004


Grimey Drawer

BisbyWorl posted:

I just find it hilarious how absolutely hosed the Earth is in Nier.

First you got Magic Goddess Dust murdering people and creating giant monsters to kill everyone else, then the hail mary plan to deal with that goes completely off the rails, then right when the dust is settling from that loving aliens invade the world.


Oh my god, one of the most :psyduck: moments from the book was definitely the reveal of WCS being some sort of “contract” with an evil god where if you decline you die and if you accept you become Legion. Just completely loving nuts, and again something that literally never impacts the game in any way

Blaziken386
Jun 27, 2013

I'm what the kids call: a big nerd

Escobarbarian posted:

Oh my god, one of the most :psyduck: moments from the book was definitely the reveal of WCS being some sort of “contract” with an evil god where if you decline you die and if you accept you become Legion. Just completely loving nuts, and again something that literally never impacts the game in any way
Well, less of contract, and more of a... Pact.

BisbyWorl
Jan 12, 2019

Knowledge is pain plus observation.


So I finished the Fisherman's Gambit quest line, and something got me curious.

Some of the later fish go against the original tell of dragging the bobber underwater, and instead gives a harder vibration on the first wiggle, and you have to pull on that.

Are there any other tells if you play on KB+M, or are you forced to pull on every first wiggle and lose your bait any time you get the wrong fish?

Wiggly Wayne DDS
Sep 11, 2010



BisbyWorl posted:

So I finished the Fisherman's Gambit quest line, and something got me curious.

Some of the later fish go against the original tell of dragging the bobber underwater, and instead gives a harder vibration on the first wiggle, and you have to pull on that.

Are there any other tells if you play on KB+M, or are you forced to pull on every first wiggle and lose your bait any time you get the wrong fish?
no other tells, a real issue if you had vibration turned off and no hint that the mechanic existed from fishing pt 1-5. only matters for sandfish and giant catfish from what i recall

Nina
Oct 9, 2016

Invisible werewolf (entirely visible, not actually a wolf)
I missed doing all these poo poo jobs to hear the cutest party banter in the medium feels good to be home

boz
Oct 16, 2005

Nina posted:

I missed doing all these poo poo jobs to hear the cutest party banter in the medium feels good to be home

Yeah that's the real reward.

Nina
Oct 9, 2016

Invisible werewolf (entirely visible, not actually a wolf)
10 years of adoration for this game and I didn't realize Facade had like a dozen sidequests in the first act lol. The real spice of the experience for me is really just noticing stuff that was always there but I missed

Frida Call Me
Sep 28, 2001

Boy, you gotta carry that weight
Carry that weight a long time
FFXIV got me really interested in the NieR story, where should i start?

Escobarbarian
Jun 18, 2004


Grimey Drawer
Start by watching a video of Drakengard Ending E, then play Replicant, read the fan-translated version of Grimoire NieR, play Automata, and get your hands on whatever ancillary stuff you can find. Then you’ll be ready for the true NieR - the Japan-only gacha game or whatever it is

stev
Jan 22, 2013

Please be excited.



Frida Call Me posted:

FFXIV got me really interested in the NieR story, where should i start?

You should be able to find Drakengard and a working PS2 on eBay.

Replicant (a remake of Nier) just came out, and Automata is sort of a sequel but can be played first if you want.

Escobarbarian
Jun 18, 2004


Grimey Drawer
Seriously though this joke ending to a PS2 game from 2003 is the actual opening to NieR

https://youtu.be/6OPW-RdzStA

Veotax
May 16, 2006


Frida Call Me posted:

FFXIV got me really interested in the NieR story, where should i start?

The raids are mostly based on Nier Automata, featuring mostly characters and concepts from that game. The final raid features two bosses taken from Replicant.

The remake of Replicant just came out and while it's generally improved and overall the better version of that game, it's still a 10 year old low budget JRPG at it's heart. The original is however one of my favourite games of all time, but you need to know what you're getting into with it.

Story wise, the games are fairly stand alone. Automata takes place something like ten thousand years after Replicant and while there are references to the first game it largely does it's own thing. You could play them in either order, they do spoil each other to some degree but not enough to ruin the other, mostly just raise questions about things you might not have thought were odd otherwise.

Frida Call Me
Sep 28, 2001

Boy, you gotta carry that weight
Carry that weight a long time

stev posted:

You should be able to find Drakengard and a working PS2 on eBay.

Replicant (a remake of Nier) just came out, and Automata is sort of a sequel but can be played first if you want.

i legitimately have beaten drakengard on the PS2 ages ago

Sakurazuka
Jan 24, 2004

NANI?

Same only cowards skip it or watch an LP

Nina
Oct 9, 2016

Invisible werewolf (entirely visible, not actually a wolf)
I don't think I'd recommend for anyone to play Automata first if they have a choice. It sets weird expectations for playing a low key and scrappy but dark and well-written Zelda-like that is Nier proper.

I've arrived to the weird point in my love for this pseudoseries where I love Nier, don't much care to revisit Automata, yet I actually love the Yorha stage plays a whole lot.

Pollyanna
Mar 5, 2005

Milk's on them.


By all accounts Reincarnation is a bog standard gacha, which is unfortunate. I still wanna figure out what story it might have, though.

Lunchmeat Larry
Nov 3, 2012

Probably been mentioned but are the FF14 raids at all relevant or interesting to the actual Nier story/world, or is it just a fanservicey thing?

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History Comes Inside!
Nov 20, 2004




axeil posted:

Oh my god gently caress Black Pearls. I just spent two hours farming them.

Why in the hell do you need fifteen of the things when they're a super rare drop?


Did you collect the one in the back room of the post office that respawns for each playthrough, saves you farming 4 of them altogether :v:

They aren’t even the worst material.

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