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a pipe smoking dog posted:I don't know about pistachios but aren't cashews harvested in insanely awful conditions? Like the plant emits caustic chemicals and they are mostly harvested by literal slaves who are forced to work until their skin burns off?  This, but for every time you discover how unethical a given thing is under capitalism.
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May 4, 2021 16:00
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E:  Necrothatcher posted:great, now you've ruined cashew nuts for me Chidi from the Good Place being convinced he's doomed because he drank almond milk despite knowing the environmental impact, is a very relatable character. Mostly because he's intensely annoying like me
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May 4, 2021 16:02
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DesperateDan posted:Not eating meat is one thing, telling folk in this godforsaken nation you don't drink alcohol is a real eye opener, like I grew horns mid conversation Oh God this. I've been tee-total all my life, and the amount of poo poo people give you is amazing. Xmas is a minefield,as its apparently time to stick loving alcohol where it should never be. which is anywhere. I'll nope out of the "ethics of meat" conversation as I work with lab mice. We do have several vegetarians here, so it shows that personal ethics are weird as hell
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May 4, 2021 16:02
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At least with avocados I guess you can look for Spanish ones where the pickers are only subject to the normal EU levels of abuse, underpay and exploitation that you have to buy into if you eat any supermarket veg, and there are fewer rainforests to cut down.
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May 4, 2021 16:03
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Grey Hunter posted:Oh God this. I've been tee-total all my life, and the amount of poo poo people give you is amazing. Xmas is a minefield,as its apparently time to stick loving alcohol where it should never be. I don't think there's any inconsistency here. Ive also worked with lab mice, and it's always emphasized how delicate these decisions are and how you need to reduce animal suffering to the absolute minimum required for statistically significant and ethical experimentation
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May 4, 2021 16:05
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If you're killing the mice anyway then is it ethical to eat them afterwards?
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May 4, 2021 16:08
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big scary monsters posted:If you're killing the mice anyway then is it ethical to eat them afterwards? Probably less jacked up on drugs than the average cow.
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May 4, 2021 16:09
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I'm sure you can buy cashews that aren't harvested in terrible conditions, cashews taste good and there is no ethical consumption under capitalism.
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May 4, 2021 16:12
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Shyrka posted:The other day I was chatting to a friend and I mentioned having a sausage roll and they lit up and asked me if the vegetarian thing passed. The disappointment when I clarified it was fake sausage was palpable. I find it funny that you can get attacked from both "sides" for this - by meat eaters who think you shouldn't be allowed the thing if you're not going to eat meat, and by a subset of vegetarians who think you shouldn't try to imitate the thing because of its association with meat. There's nothing wrong with wanting a savoury meat patty/tube while not wanting to eat animals, I say. E: which leads to silliness like not being able to market vegetarian things as "burgers", or (as I believe the dairy industry in Europe is agitating for) not being allowed to sell milk-substitutes in milk-carton-reminiscent packaging, or in the same part of the shop, lest somebody be fooled into thinking it came from a cow. Bobstar fucked around with this message at 16:17 on May 4, 2021 |
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May 4, 2021 16:13
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Failed Imagineer posted:Also the only song I know of to use the lyrics "spreadable headcheese" Spreadable headcheeeeeeeeeese Not the best thing to be singing along to at work when someone walks into your office.
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May 4, 2021 16:14
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By the time I've eaten all the world's fish they will hopefully have invented a good veggie sausage
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May 4, 2021 16:17
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Bobstar posted:I find it funny that you can get attacked from both "sides" for this - by meat eaters who think you shouldn't be allowed the thing if you're not going to eat meat, and by a subset of vegetarians who think you shouldn't try to imitate the thing because of its association with meat.
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May 4, 2021 16:22
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Communist Thoughts posted:By the time I've eaten all the world's fish they will hopefully have invented a good veggie sausage I don't get how the burgers have got so good but the sausages are still so blah
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May 4, 2021 16:23
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Cashew nut harvesting: There are quite a few articles on it over the past few years, here's one in Metro: https://metro.co.uk/2019/04/04/women-india-pay-price-cashew-nut-demand-vegan-diets-rise-9110415/ Teetotal I've been teetotal for over 15 years now as I became allergic to it (or, rather, started experiencing extreme reaction - blood pressure rocketing up, tachycardia etc). Exceptions: 1 thimble-sized portion pear wine at my dad's 70th in 2015 - made me really ill, an individual pot of rum'n'raisin icecream - but I don't think there was any alcohol actually in it, a baileys-flavoured icecream, and some brandy cream (that was last year, me attempting to see whether I could cope with it). Seems I can tolerate tiny amounts of alcohol in foodstuff but NOT in liquid form (ie not a glass of wine or lager or whatever). I can also get it on my skin without a problem. I did go teetotal for a year back in the 80s as a New Year's Resolution (and to stop an old secretary at work forcing spirits down my neck every Friday lunchtime when I was a humble temp - she took not wanting to drink as a personal insult) and did get all the hassle from drinker friends. Saying you're allergic stops all that poo poo. Sustainable food: Soylent green. Bobstar posted:E: which leads to silliness like not being able to market vegetarian things as "burgers", or (as I believe the dairy industry in Europe is agitating for) not being allowed to sell milk-substitutes in milk-carton-reminiscent packaging, or in the same part of the shop, lest somebody be fooled into thinking it came from a cow. An oat cow. Jaeluni Asjil fucked around with this message at 16:27 on May 4, 2021 |
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May 4, 2021 16:25
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multijoe posted:I don't get how the burgers have got so good but the sausages are still so blah All sausages are blah, including meat ones, because the sausaginity has ascended to Offler, and we are left with the earthly remains. Duh. vvvv Listen to this dude Twisto. He knows what he's talking about Bobstar fucked around with this message at 16:40 on May 4, 2021 |
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May 4, 2021 16:26
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Failed Imagineer posted:E: His reaction to the trolley problem remains one of the funniest bits of telly ever made: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DtRhrfhP5b4 (and once again for others ITT, if you *haven't* watched The Good Place, you need to rectify this immediately. If a sitcom based around the philosophy of ethics, the nature of good and evil, and the existence of an afterlife that manages to make all of it funny doesn't at least intrigue you then I really don't know what to say to you. It doesn't even come with the normal US sitcom disclaimer of "don't bother with season <x>" - even if season 3 gets a bit aimless at times it lays all the ground for season 4 and what might be the most satisfying finale to any television show in history.)
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May 4, 2021 16:27
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goddamnedtwisto posted:and once again for others ITT, if you *haven't* watched The Good Place, you need to rectify this immediately. If a sitcom based around the philosophy of ethics, the nature of good and evil, and the existence of an afterlife that manages to make all of it funny doesn't at least intrigue you then I really don't know what to say to you.  Also they literally have this discussion about eating a tomato and all of the negative poo poo that goes into it, in the context of the bad place having completely rigged the world so that everything gives you net negative karma, so nobody has actually managed to get to the good place in thousands of years. Unrelated, but one of my friends asked who to vote for 'tactically' in the local elections and I'm having to break it to him that the reason the site he was using is no longer there is because it was a lib dem front that swung several seats in the last election. Bobby Deluxe fucked around with this message at 16:43 on May 4, 2021 |
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May 4, 2021 16:38
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multijoe posted:I don't get how the burgers have got so good but the sausages are still so blah I saw a Beyond sausage the other day which I’ll try. The Linda McCartney Lincolnshire ones aren’t bad (and as a bonus are GF)
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May 4, 2021 16:39
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therattle posted:I saw a Beyond sausage the other day which I’ll try. The Linda McCartney Lincolnshire ones aren’t bad (and as a bonus are GF) Linda McCartney vegan sausage rolls are actually pretty drat good, if a little greasy - certainly better than most cheap meat sausage rolls. I had a vegan hot dog a while back that was certainly passable, too. I wonder if the actual difficulty with vegan sausages is getting the texture right when they're fried? It seems like they cracked sausage rolls and hot dogs even before they cracked decent vegan burgers,
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May 4, 2021 16:45
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Dying early is a selling point of meat, not a drawback.
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May 4, 2021 17:01
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Oh dear me posted:Untrue, unless 40 years isn't long enough to tell. I mean I don't doubt that happened to you, but it definitely hasn't to me, nor to other veggies I've known. I've been vegetarian my whole life apart from trying bacon 2 or 3 times when I was a teenager - my parents became vegetarian when they were about 20 and kept it up their whole lives since. Still, meat often smells quite good to me. Sometimes I'll walk past a burger bar or a kebab van or something and think "that smells good"... but I still don't want to eat it. I would probably enjoy the taste if I could get over the thought of eating an animal. The exception is pork and pork-based meats like sausages and chorizo. There's something about it that smells of absolutely rancid death to me.
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May 4, 2021 17:01
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I went veggie last year, or pescetarian at least. Highly recommend it! Do not highly recommend Aldi's plant based sausage. Had to pick all the pieces out of my beans and rice concotion I made last night and was grumbling to myself all evening.
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May 4, 2021 17:03
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There's going to come a time when they make synthetic meat that's indistinguishable from the real stuff for cheaper, and on that day the cow will become extinct Meat replacements are already pretty decent for some things, mostly trash meat like hot dogs. I'm a big fan of the Quorn hot dogs, I'll take one of those over a real hotdog anyday. Replacements for chicken and burgers still have a way to come, especially in the texture department, replacements never seem tough enough to be real to me. But if you look back over the last few decades, we're a million miles from where we were. If you wanted a vegetarian option in a restaurant in 1990 you got extremely sad vegetable lasagne and you hated it.
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May 4, 2021 17:05
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Gort posted:There's going to come a time when they make synthetic meat that's indistinguishable from the real stuff for cheaper, and on that day the cow will become extinct I think this suggests a lack of understanding of how food fashion works. If it becomes harder to get it will only become more in demand by those who can afford it. Nothing kills the fashionability of a food than it being easy to acquire and prepare.
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May 4, 2021 17:06
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Necrothatcher posted:nailed it. "So, I held a gun to the heads of your children and threatened to shoot them and feed them to the dogs unless you licked a bit of bacon, would you do it?" "Yes" "Oh so you're not THAT committed to being a vegan then"
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May 4, 2021 17:07
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Eat more wild venison. It's the inferior alternative to introducing wolves, bears and lynx, but until then we need to eat them to keep their numbers in balance. It's basically the Yellowstone Elk situation but with (a) the UK being poo poo compared to Yellowstone and (b) humans being poo poo compared to wolves, bears, and cougars.
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May 4, 2021 17:08
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Necrothatcher posted:picked the vegan option for dinner. This is so frustrating. So many times I've been in mixed company eating out and got a "why are you choosing that? You're not vegan/vegetarian?!". Maybe it looks like it'll be good! Some people seem to think it has to be all meat all the time if you do eat meat. There does seem to be a "manliness" element to it as well - as if you don't eat a whole cow every day and dress like a lumberjack/rancher then you might be one of them. I'm somewhat relieved that I haven't had to face much of the booze reactions since I went teetotal during furlough (serious alcoholic for a long time - sober for just over a year and 3 months now  ). I haven't been to a pub in all this time and I'm actually a bit confused as to what to order when I eventually do return hah.Are the Linda McCartney saussies a different recipe now? I haven't had them since I was vegetarian over a decade ago and they were really dry/mealy compared to other options at the time.
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May 4, 2021 17:10
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franco posted:This is so frustrating. So many times I've been in mixed company eating out and got a "why are you choosing that? You're not vegan/vegetarian?!". Maybe it looks like it'll be good! Some people seem to think it has to be all meat all the time if you do eat meat. What gets me is when people say non-vegans shouldn't pick the vegan option from the menu because it means there's less for the actual vegans. Like vegan food is in more limited supply and less sustainable than meat and that carnivores have a solemn duty to eat only meat at all times.
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May 4, 2021 17:15
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I certainly got a LOT of toxic backlash as a kid for not eating meat, OH MY GOD PEOPLE MAKE LIFESTYLE CHOICES. Anyway I had a beyond sausage at the weekend which was pretty decent but at £5 for 2 I won't be rushing out to buy more. Violife extra mature for your mac and cheeze though I'm all about that stuff.
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May 4, 2021 17:16
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https://twitter.com/darshnasoni/status/1389542738400620549 Jesus. I knew something was up when the CPS went straight to a murder charge for something that it seemed like they could have easily swept under the carpet as the old "excited delirium", but when even the police pathologist is saying "Yeah there's actual boot impressions in his head" it's a bit hard to claim the usual "difficult situation, immense stress, mistakes were made and lessons will be learned" bullshit.
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May 4, 2021 17:16
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WhatEvil posted:I've been vegetarian my whole life apart from trying bacon 2 or 3 times when I was a teenager - my parents became vegetarian when they were about 20 and kept it up their whole lives since. Still, meat often smells quite good to me. Sometimes I'll walk past a burger bar or a kebab van or something and think "that smells good"... but I still don't want to eat it. I would probably enjoy the taste if I could get over the thought of eating an animal. I used to feel nauseous going past the Butchers, smell was just vile. And honestly, when I had a flatmate who ate meat I just couldn't be in the living room/kitchen when he was cooking because it was even nastier No problem with the look of it, I can happily watch cooking shows where they butcher a pig or whatever, I just cannot handle the stench
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May 4, 2021 17:16
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franco posted:Are the Linda McCartney saussies a different recipe now? I haven't had them since I was vegetarian over a decade ago and they were really dry/mealy compared to other options at the time. No still the same, still as dry, better if you fry them rather than bake. Quorn sausages are the best for dirty breakfast.
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May 4, 2021 17:18
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I used to visit a proper industrial butchers for work and once you've smelled them a regular one seems quite pleasant by comparison.
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May 4, 2021 17:19
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Tesco vegan jam donuts taste identical to the regular ones and don't go stale for at least three days (and counting!). Absolute game changer.
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May 4, 2021 17:24
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blunt posted:Tesco vegan jam donuts taste identical to the regular ones and don't go stale for at least three days (and counting!). Absolute game changer. Hmm putting them on the list for this evenings shop, which is just a Tesco Express with ideas above its station and never has loving anything
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May 4, 2021 17:26
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When I was about 15 I had a boyfriend who worked in the slaughterhouse of Harris pork pies in Wiltshire. He hated it but it was the only work around. He said they stunned the pigs but he could see they were still afraid and he swore the only reason they were stunned was to stop them wriggling around and upsetting the humans. I tried being a vegetarian but I am too weak of will. Every time I get a bag of mince or whatever from the shops I feel guilty.
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May 4, 2021 17:26
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Gorn Myson posted:I'm looking forward to the follow up hypothetical questions where they try to get you to agree that in certain scenarios you might eat meat. Pablo Bluth posted:Eat more wild venison. It's the inferior alternative to introducing wolves, bears and lynx, but until then we need to eat them to keep their numbers in balance. It's a shame that the British conception of hunting has to go and throw a bunch of completely unnecessary pageantry and inhumanity into the mix. franco posted:There does seem to be a "manliness" element to it as well - as if you don't eat a whole cow every day and dress like a lumberjack/rancher then you might be one of them.  ).Instead, there's poo poo like this, which would have been cringeworthy during the Yorkie not for girls days https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8jugdgnuqtw
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May 4, 2021 17:28
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This must be an incredibly silly question and one that has been asked and answered a million times before but, say the world wakes up tomorrow and no one eats beef or diary. What happens to all the cows? The farmers certainly aren't going to feed and care for them out of the kindness of their hearts, are they?
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May 4, 2021 17:30
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If that happens, there's probably mass slaughters and piles of burning cows on the more industrial farms, and the smaller farms where they do actually like the cows probably go bankrupt. There's a lot of cow products that do still get used industrially though, from tallow to leather, so that would all probably collapse too. That's not going to happen though, Lund University recently did a study into dairy futures, and there's a few plausible scenarios, most of which have some combination of plant based dairy and lab-grown dairy protein vastly reducing the amount of cattle over a period of decades, but still leaving some.
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May 4, 2021 17:35
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Dead Goon posted:This must be an incredibly silly question and one that has been asked and answered a million times before but, say the world wakes up tomorrow and no one eats beef or diary. What happens to all the cows? The farmers certainly aren't going to feed and care for them out of the kindness of their hearts, are they? Suspicious extensive outbreak of foot and mouth disease resulting in huge funeral pyres of cows. Wasn't there some suspicion that farmers were claiming infections of foot & mouth disease and killing their herds so they could get the payouts? eg https://www.theguardian.com/uk/2001/apr/11/footandmouth.paulbrown
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May 4, 2021 17:36
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