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Mill Village posted:I’m not having a problem finding them. Cotton just flat out refuses to learn anything but Needle and Impale. I spent a half hour grinding each spot and came up empty handed. Like all I need is StoneGas and Cotton can be a Crystal Tree. Yeah stuff like Stone Gas and Life Rain are usually the hardest stuff to pull. All you can do is sacrifice some dice to the RNG gods and keep trying
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May 7, 2021 16:38
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Mill Village posted:I’m not having a problem finding them. Cotton just flat out refuses to learn anything but Needle and Impale. I spent a half hour grinding each spot and came up empty handed. Like all I need is StoneGas and Cotton can be a Crystal Tree. The downside is that the better skills have minimum hp requirements so if he's not absorning anything at all and his HP isn't going up then you will never learn those skills if your HP is lacking. Learning the 4th skill from an enemy is extremely tedious no matter what. Getting Magnetic Storm is annoying for exactly that reason.
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May 7, 2021 16:51
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Harrow posted:Riki's point of no return is very clear, so don't worry about hitting it without warning. You'll be given an explicit "if you go through this door, there's no turning back" message. All the endgames I entered had a clear Red LAST CHANCE TO SAVE window. I think only Blue's quest had a very mild warning of "you go to Hell, you're not coming back" warning by saying "we're taking your magic map"
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May 7, 2021 19:27
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Lute down, two more to go. Should I do Asellus or Red next?
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May 7, 2021 19:38
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I have made new plans for dealing with superbosses.
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May 7, 2021 19:41
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Ace Transmuter posted:Lute down, two more to go. Should I do Asellus or Red next? I'd do Red, just since Asellus getting the bulk of the restored content would be the best capstone
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May 7, 2021 21:30
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I have read that Wonder Bangles can be very helpful for a number of the super bosses, as some of the really nasty attacks (e.g., Diva's Gale) can be blocked since they're coded as piercing damage. I still haven't managed to farm up any Dullahan Shields yet, so it may be a thought if you're unable to provide that more general coverage to everyone.
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May 7, 2021 21:36
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Evil Fluffy posted:The downside is that the better skills have minimum hp requirements so if he's not absorning anything at all and his HP isn't going up then you will never learn those skills if your HP is lacking. What? Nothing I've read online has mentioned there being minimum HP requirements for skills. The only things for monsters that have minimum HP requirements are some monster forms. Unless something was changed for the remaster, which I doubt would be the case.
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May 7, 2021 21:50
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Cleared all 7 stories and I wasn't about to get Rei even after the scene about her at the start of Asellus's scenario and meeting her at times prior to when you're supposed to be able to recruit her. Not that I would've used her at that point but it would've been nice to get them for the hell of it. If anyone has a burning desire to make super powered mystics for the boss rushes or whatever with Fuse, just farm Mariche in the dev room you get sent to after clearing the story on a file with everyone's story cleared. It's not super fast, but you can also farm Kylin there if you want any of their moves for mystics too and it'll be fast than rushing through character stories or whatever. Has anyone done a NG+ run of Asellus and had a tough enough Asellus/White Rose/Ildon to kill the giant that gates your access to the griffin fight to rescue Gina and if so does it sequence break the game? Alard posted:What? Nothing I've read online has mentioned there being minimum HP requirements for skills. The only things for monsters that have minimum HP requirements are some monster forms. Unless something was changed for the remaster, which I doubt would be the case. It was some old GameFAQS post, iirc, with someone outlining how you just couldn't get some skills (like stone gas, magnetic storm, and a few others) right off the bat because of HP or something else. They could've been wrong. I've never seen a monster get those 'best' skills early on either but that could just be the god awful 4th skill RNG doing its thing. 
Evil Fluffy fucked around with this message at 23:40 on May 7, 2021 |
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May 7, 2021 23:35
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Evil Fluffy posted:If anyone has a burning desire to make super powered mystics for the boss rushes or whatever with Fuse, just farm Mariche in the dev room you get sent to after clearing the story on a file with everyone's story cleared. It's not fast by any means, but you can also farm Kylin there if you want any of their moves for mystics too. Does that work? I never tested it, but I thought that any changes during those fights were undone as soon as the battle ended. Although you should still be able to get the triple Mariche if you run Riki’s scenario and/or casefile enough times.
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May 7, 2021 23:43
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Evil Fluffy posted:Cleared all 7 stories and I wasn't about to get Rei even after the scene about her at the start of Asellus's scenario and meeting her at times prior to when you're supposed to be able to recruit her. Not that I would've used her at that point but it would've been nice to get them for the hell of it. You can fight Kylin there? Huh, I thought getting Time Lord to absorb Kylin would be impossible. Neat. Also, I haven't tried, but can you do the fights there multiple times, or do you have to run through a story again to get to the dev room and reset the fights? I wouldn't mind getting Time Lord and Mesarthim triple Mariches before trying a superboss again. Harrow fucked around with this message at 00:34 on May 8, 2021 |
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May 8, 2021 00:18
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Evil Fluffy posted:It was some old GameFAQS post, iirc, with someone outlining how you just couldn't get some skills (like stone gas, magnetic storm, and a few others) right off the bat because of HP or something else. They could've been wrong. I've never seen a monster get those 'best' skills early on either but that could just be the god awful 4th skill RNG doing its thing. You can't get most of those skills off the bat because they're limited to only one or two monster forms that only show up in late game monsters. I believe Crystal Trees are the only monster to teach Magnetic Storm so they are limited until your encounter rank is pretty high. A lot of the skills are only found in the 4th slot which makes it extra painful since I think that's like a 1% chance to pick it up.
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May 8, 2021 00:32
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dude789 posted:You can't get most of those skills off the bat because they're limited to only one or two monster forms that only show up in late game monsters. I believe Crystal Trees are the only monster to teach Magnetic Storm so they are limited until your encounter rank is pretty high. A lot of the skills are only found in the 4th slot which makes it extra painful since I think that's like a 1% chance to pick it up. There's an extremely useful GFaqs post all about monsters and it says the slot percentages are: GameFaqs posted:Slot 4: 1/32 (3.1%)
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May 8, 2021 00:37
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Ardryn posted:There's an extremely useful GFaqs post all about monsters and it says the slot percentages are: Some additional context: *When you absorb a monster, the game checks each slot in reverse order, stopping on a successful absorb of a skill the monster doesn't already have. *So it will always check slot 4 first, then slot 3, etc. If all these fail, you'll get the Slot 1 tech automatically (100%), if you already have that tech equipped, you don't absorb anything. *Not all monsters have four abilities to absorb
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May 8, 2021 02:14
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Ace Transmuter posted:Some additional context: Wait it's reverse order? I read that it looked at the absorbed skill and then went from 1-7 and the info on the Essence blog seems to confirm this? https://essenceofsaga.wordpress.com/home/book-index/monster-system/ The checkpoint section a little ways down this page specifically.
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May 8, 2021 02:42
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Ardryn posted:Wait it's reverse order? I read that it looked at the absorbed skill and then went from 1-7 and the info on the Essence blog seems to confirm this? https://essenceofsaga.wordpress.com/home/book-index/monster-system/ The checkpoint section a little ways down this page specifically. What you're talking about, I believe, is the monster form that gets chosen. What Ace was referring to is the skill that's absorbed when you absorb a monster- essentially, it checks to see if you absorb the rarest skill, failing that moves to the next, etc. until you get to the last skill which has a 100% of being absorbed. For the monster transformation you get, the skill in the last slot gets highest priority due to the old system always overwriting that skill (which is now gone in remastered). Edit: to use an example, I have Riki absorb a Crystal Tree in my futile attempt to get Magnetic Storm. First, it checks do I absorb it Magnetic Storm (1/32). Failing that, do I absorb Stone Gas (1/16)? Failing that, do I absorb Windfall (1/4)? If I failed each of these checks, I absorb Needles. This is also explains situations where you absorb nothing (e.g., You already have Needles on Riki and failed to get any of the rarer skills) and why you may notice you shift back and forth between say Needles and occasionally Windfall when overwriting the same slot. Magnetic Storm is a lie, do not chase it. Kagon fucked around with this message at 02:57 on May 8, 2021 |
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May 8, 2021 02:52
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Kagon posted:What you're talking about, I believe, is the monster form that gets chosen. What Ace was referring to is the skill that's absorbed when you absorb a monster- essentially, it checks to see if you absorb the rarest skill, failing that moves to the next, etc. until you get to the last skill which has a 100% of being absorbed. For the monster transformation you get, the skill in the last slot gets highest priority due to the old system always overwriting that skill (which is now gone in remastered). Ah, right. Also, thanks for answering something that had been bugging me since I started playing the Remaster, which is the removal of the overwrite slot for monsters. I kept thinking something was off whenever I'd look at Riki's techs but I could never put my finger on it!
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May 8, 2021 03:10
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Kagon posted:For the monster transformation you get, the skill in the last slot gets highest priority due to the old system always overwriting that skill (which is now gone in remastered). In the remaster it's the new skill you absorbed that gets priority, not necessarily the last slot. The actual behavior of monster transformations is the same (ie: it looks at the new skill first, then the rest of them are looked at from top to bottom)
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May 8, 2021 03:16
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I wish it was possible to lock in your monster form and just absorb random poo poo to get your HP up. As I understand it, having gotten the skills for Black Dragon, I'd have to replace and regain one of them to alternate between something garbage and something good?
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May 8, 2021 03:16
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No, leave the black dragon skills alone and absorb over some random crap you don't care about. You'll switch back and forth between black dragon and other random forms (because the game only looks at the first skill for each icon, and the newest skill gets the highest priority, so it'll sometime 'hide' one of the black dragon skills), but your hp goes up over time as you keep absorbing new skills. You only get the max hp for your first time absorbing a given skill, so if you're doing a bunch of NG+ eventually you'll have absorbed nearly everything and can stop absorbing stuff unless you need a WP refill.
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May 8, 2021 03:26
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Snake Maze posted:In the remaster it's the new skill you absorbed that gets priority, not necessarily the last slot. The actual behavior of monster transformations is the same (ie: it looks at the new skill first, then the rest of them are looked at from top to bottom) This is good to know and makes a lot of sense. Also helps explains some monster shifts I got that were not expected.
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May 8, 2021 03:51
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Mosperiburg & Riki’s final dungeon are both indoors, right? So I can dump photosynthesis? I also have water cannon on him for the Vergil fight. Is that his end boss? Or is it right before the final dungeon?
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May 8, 2021 04:12
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Blackbelt Bobman posted:Mosperiburg & Riki’s final dungeon are both indoors, right? So I can dump photosynthesis? I can’t speak for whether they’re both flagged to not allow photosynthesis to work, but you’re likely safe to dump it regardless unless you’re planning on using Kylin to Light Shift to force it to work. Virgil isn’t the last boss, but his fight is after the point of no return. The final boss comes shortly after. You can reconfigure your party and equipment, but you won’t have an opportunity to fix Riki’s skills, so go into that fight with what you would want for the final boss + water cannon if you want to trivialize Virgil. If you would rather extend the fight for a better skill, any combination of water cannon + sonic cannon can chain with themselves/each other to create a number of level 4 combos.
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May 8, 2021 04:41
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Kagon posted:I can’t speak for whether they’re both flagged to not allow photosynthesis to work, but you’re likely safe to dump it regardless unless you’re planning on using Kylin to Light Shift to force it to work. Another easy level 5 combo is tentacle+four thunderbolts and if you're willing to waste a slot on water cannon too then that's the steam cheevo, assuming everyone is faster than Virgil.
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May 8, 2021 04:54
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Snake Maze posted:Does that work? I never tested it, but I thought that any changes during those fights were undone as soon as the battle ended. Anything you absorb in those fights stays absorbed. You just can't gain stats from those fights (you can get stats from some other regular fights in there though). I guess this won't work on Asellus though since her absorbs seem to get reset even if you keep mystic stuff in NG+. Harrow posted:You can fight Kylin there? Huh, I thought getting Time Lord to absorb Kylin would be impossible. Neat. They are one of the enemies in the extra fight up to the right of the regular bosses. It's a Ring Lord fight with a different minion setup including Kylin and Suzaku (and Mariche like regular ring lord). I haven't setup triple Mariche on anyone but Zozma and some others have 1-2 copies and Nusakan is something like 99 in every stat except concentration is 98.
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May 8, 2021 05:05
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Can you get Zozma in any of the Fuse case files? I'm working my way through Asellus's story as the last one I have to do but completed Emilia's case file and didn't see him anywhere in that one.
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May 8, 2021 16:23
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You get him automatically in Asellus’s case file
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May 8, 2021 16:35
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Ok excellent, that answers that- thanks!
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May 8, 2021 17:12
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Someone on Reddit made a Fuse recruitment spreadsheet that's a pretty helpful reference: https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1bYcFYKDfzgteFbuU0dIcqGt4NSgIUMUqfvAz2i6Xmus/edit#gid=0
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May 8, 2021 17:30
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Last night Cotton finally learned StoneGas but he won't turn into a Crystal Tree, despite having all the other moves needed. 697 HP isn't enough? I had an easier time getting Thunder to turn into a Black Dragon on my Asellus file.
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May 8, 2021 20:09
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I stopped in Vergil's Funhouse, I'll get back to this game one day but I got other things to play too.
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May 8, 2021 20:14
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Mill Village posted:Last night Cotton finally learned StoneGas but he won't turn into a Crystal Tree, despite having all the other moves needed. 697 HP isn't enough? I had an easier time getting Thunder to turn into a Black Dragon on my Asellus file. What form is he in instead? If you can show that and the skills, it may help diagnose what's going on there. It may be that you either don't have enough prime hp (essentially the hp the monster has before you factor in what the form gives you), or you're meeting qualifications for other forms that are taking priority over Crystal Tree, or both.
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May 8, 2021 20:17
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Kagon posted:What form is he in instead? If you can show that and the skills, it may help diagnose what's going on there. It may be that you either don't have enough prime hp (essentially the hp the monster has before you factor in what the form gives you), or you're meeting qualifications for other forms that are taking priority over Crystal Tree, or both. 
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May 8, 2021 23:44
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Riki wasn’t dead when I killed Earth Dragon so he was able to absorb Scalding Gas  now he can be 2% evil 98% hot gasI got Spray of Life on Gen and DSC on Fei, not sure if I should keep grinding or go to Mosperiburg. Edit: I’m trying to see if I can teach Gen Solar Blade… lol I am gonna mess around with that before I go to the final area. Oh poo poo he just learned it, nice!!! Blackbelt Bobman fucked around with this message at 23:53 on May 8, 2021 |
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May 8, 2021 23:45
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I re-ran Blue's story so I could also finish it as Rouge and I guess SP/WP cap at 250 still. I figured that'd be the case but I was hoping it was higher. I'll just have to settle for doing 80-85k damage with a shadow servant boosted Tower spell before swapping over to weapon moves.  Also realize that once you finish everyone's stories you can get a NG+ file with Red's final move if you feel the desire to do so (it's more damage than lifesprinkler and seems to combo better too).
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May 9, 2021 00:16
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So Butch just requires Poison Needle for one of it's forms- that could be responsible. The other thing is that your prime hp is 268 which may be a bit low for Crystal Tree. I haven't found anywhere that actually lists what minimum Hp you need to shift into it. My guess is you may need 300+ hp which would be 8 new skill absorbs. So if replacing poison needle doesn't do it, I would just keep absorbing new skills while keeping Siren (since that's pretty nice for AoE). Another thing you could do to check if it's something due to prioritization would be to absorb Blade from the mantis enemies- they show up in Biolab pretty often. If there's still no shift, you likely need more prime hp. Kagon fucked around with this message at 00:26 on May 9, 2021 |
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May 9, 2021 00:22
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Evil Fluffy posted:I re-ran Blue's story so I could also finish it as Rouge and I guess SP/WP cap at 250 still. I figured that'd be the case but I was hoping it was higher. I'll just have to settle for doing 80-85k damage with a shadow servant boosted Tower spell before swapping over to weapon moves. I like how running Blue’s scenario a second time or Fuse’s Blue case file with NG+ lets you double the JP again (well, it hits the cap, but still). I do love those 80k Shadow Servant Towers without even having to grind to level JP.
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May 9, 2021 00:47
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Yep. And in my case when Rouge won I got a bunch of WP and skills because I'd picked up most sword and gun techs in other characters' playthroughs. Though IIRC those stats never get doubled regardless of who wins and it was just a case of NG+ stuff helping me out.
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May 9, 2021 00:50
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Evil Fluffy posted:Yep. And in my case when Rouge won I got a bunch of WP and skills because I'd picked up most sword and gun techs in other characters' playthroughs. Though IIRC those stats never get doubled regardless of who wins and it was just a case of NG+ stuff helping me out. Yeah, physical stats stay the same. After the duel, the game updates both Blue and Rouge’s data regardless of who won the duel. It gives Rouge Blue’s Intelligence, Concentration, Psychic, HP, and JP, then doubles both characters’ casting stats. It leaves the rest of their physical stats and skills alone, so if Blue learned physical skills Rouge won’t have them and vice-versa. I’ve been really enjoying the turbo-Blue I’ve trained up. He managed to learn Spray of Life before Roufas did and got DSC just a few battles after Liza. A blessed Blue I guess. Less insane outside of his own scenario since he doesn’t have Overdrive but still a huge asset to the boss rush dream team.
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May 9, 2021 00:56
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Why the gently caress doesn’t dodge touch or Blood Chalices work against the Magma Slimes, gently caress you game Edit: I thought blood chalices prevented damage to LP, what am I thinking of? Blackbelt Bobman fucked around with this message at 01:10 on May 9, 2021 |
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May 9, 2021 01:07
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