ntan1 posted:

I got my second shot at around 8:30AM on Friday. By 4PM, I was really sleepy but with no fever. After I woke up the next day, the entire day I had chills + a fever + tiredness + body ache + a headache, even when I went to sleep at 11:59PM on Saturday.

Then I woke up at 9AM on Sunday and magically felt perfectly fine.

QuarkJets posted:

This estimate suggests closer to one in one thousand, and that's verified by the huge Israeli study posted earlier on this page. That's all that really matters: that we understand that your likelihood of experiencing serious or deadly covid-19 does not reduce to 0 once vaccinated, and that big reductions in this likelihood are still further reduced with social distancing, mask wearing, etc. It's one more reason why vaccine passports are probably a stupid idea

quote:

A Minnesota man posted a video of himself that appeared to show him stealing a vial of the Johnson & Johnson COVID-19 vaccine in order to “test it at a lab.”

The man, who has been identified by his social media accounts as Thomas Humphrey, filmed himself at what appeared to be the beginning of a COVID-19 vaccine appointment at a CVS pharmacy on Thursday.

He can be heard saying, “I just want to read it. I just—you know, I’m taking the vaccine, I just want to read it,” he then reached across a counter and grabbed a white box.” A woman who appeared to be a CVS employee tried to take the box back, saying, “Sir! Sir!”

It wasn’t the first time Humphrey pulled this stunt. The day before he did the same thing at a clinic, warning people the vaccine was toxic and they should roll their sleeves back down.  Humphrey is wearing a “National Action Task Force” shirt, an org that proclaims “enough is enough!”

Thomas was arrested Thursday, but for some reason not for stealing the vaccine. He was booked for unrelated charges of obstructing legal process, operating a motor vehicle without plates and registration and driving on a suspended license. He’s already been released.

QuarkJets posted:

No one is assuming anything like that

Drunk Driver Dad posted:

I'm about 1.5 weeks post 2nd Moderna dose. I got a bit of a fever and the usual tiredness after it. I've been trying to get back into my lifting routine and my knee has been hurting and giving me a lot of poo poo, and my back is as well to a lesser degree. I normally don't get this kind of thing, and haven't even been trying to lift hard/heavy. Do you guys think it's possible I just have some extra inflammation from the immune response to the vaccine that's causing this that will resolve itself eventually?

Drunk Driver Dad posted:

I also work a lot of hours and stuff, so I'm also probably a bit more predisposed to that sort of thing as well. I'll try not to worry about it too much, but lifting is like my only healthy outlet and it's pissing me off.

MarcusSA posted:

How long did you take off?

Like I wouldn’t worry about it too much.

Drunk Driver Dad posted:

That's dumb and not what it is. Bodies don't actually fall apart in your 30s so bad you can't do any physical activity, it's usually from inactivity and other lifestyle factors that people like to blame on age. I was just trying to figure out if it was vaccine related or not.

Saros posted:

It's not though, look at the PHE SIREN study I linked before.

https://publichealthmatters.blog.gov.uk/2021/02/23/covid-19-analysing-first-vaccine-effectiveness-in-the-uk/

Healthcare workers with about the highest possible level of exposure to covid you can get were after 1st dose 72% less likely to become infected at all (tested with regular PCR screening) and 86% after the second dose.

Of the 40,000 healthcare workers in the study there were of course breakthrough infections but importantly there were zero deaths and only a small handful of serious cases two weeks after first vaccine dose.

Unless you're very elderly or otherwise vulnerable your chance of dying from covid after vaccinations is much closer to 1 in a million than one in a thousand.

QuarkJets posted:

You're talking about likelihood of getting infected at all, but that's basically impossible to predict because it's largely behavior based. I think the odds being discussed were "odds of dying of covid-19 after catching it while vaccinated", which is nowhere near one in ten million or whatever

Saros posted:

Of the 40,000 healthcare workers in the study there were of course breakthrough infections but importantly there were zero deaths and only a small handful of serious cases two weeks after first vaccine dose.

ShadowHawk posted:

QuarkJets posted:

That study actually supports what I said earlier: this study cites a 56% reduction in CFR in the best-case, which coupled with the reduced likelihood of infection still does not come anywhere near "one in ten million" odds

learnincurve posted:

U.K. had two deaths yesterday, hospital admissions and covid deaths are going down on average 24% and 38% a week respectively from 1200 deaths a day since the vaccination program started, but positive tests have been hovering around the 2000-2100 per day for a month.

Is the information you should share with the vaccine hesitant people you know.

Helith posted:

I just wish you would take that extra step and drive it down to no community spread the way Australia and NZ have done.

Lolie posted:

We don't have no community spread. Right now we're under restrictions because of a community case.

Genomic testing shows that this guy must have got it via transmission from hotel quarantine to the community but the missing link remains unidentified despite exhaustive contact tracing.

Lolie posted:

We don't have no community spread. Right now we're under restrictions because of a community case.

Genomic testing shows that this guy must have got it via transmission from hotel quarantine to the community but the missing link remains unidentified despite exhaustive contact tracing.

CaptainSarcastic posted:

What is your basic thesis here? That the vaccines don't provide very good protection after all, or are you trying to push back against people who treat it is a magic complete immunity to covid?

QuarkJets posted:

This estimate suggests closer to one in one thousand, and that's verified by the huge Israeli study posted earlier on this page. That's all that really matters: that we understand that your likelihood of experiencing serious or deadly covid-19 does not reduce to 0 once vaccinated, and that big reductions in this likelihood are still further reduced with social distancing, mask wearing, etc. It's one more reason why vaccine passports are probably a stupid idea

Helith posted:

It’s not sustained community spread luckily and our contact tracing does a good job of containing what little community spread we occasionally get. If the UK were down to the occasional quarantine outbreak the way we are I would feel a lot happier for my family there.

QuarkJets posted:

The latter; basically someone came in to report having to plan a funeral for a dead vaccine-haver and someone else was like "wow their body should be donated to medical science, that's like one in ten million odds!" Meanwhile, some vaccinated people are acting like the pandemic is already over, but that's far from the case. Basically this:

Bape Culture posted:

It is weird that the doom posting goons have anecdotes that contradict entire countries and actual studies.

quote:

Michael Barbaro

So Apoorva, what does it look like to live in a country in which there is not herd immunity, and especially a country like the United States that has started to reopen, and yet is not really on its way to herd immunity?

Apoorva Mandavilli
What it probably means is that we are going to hear about outbreaks of the virus in different parts of the country throughout the year. We’ll hear about outbreaks in any place that doesn’t have a very high level of vaccine acceptance. Hopefully, they will not be anywhere near what we saw in the months of winter when the numbers were just really horrifically high. But we will probably still hear about lots of very sick people and some people dying for many years to come.

Michael Barbaro
Many years to come.

Apoorva Mandavilli
That’s right. The best estimate so far seems to be that we might sort of bumble along this path for the next generation or two.

Michael Barbaro
Wow.

Apoorva Mandavilli
But at some point, all the adults will have either been vaccinated, or they will have had the virus once. But that might take 20 to 40 years.

Michael Barbaro
Mm-hmm. So during the intervening 20 to 40 years, when we wait for that point, I wonder if you can describe the kinds of outbreaks that we’re going to be experiencing, what that’s going to feel like. Is there an analogy that comes to mind?

Apoorva Mandavilli
Well, think about the Orthodox Jewish population in New York and just north of the city. They’ve had some really bad measles outbreaks because they’re not vaccinated for measles. Same with Los Angeles, where, for many reasons, the vaccine acceptance symptoms is very low. And those places have seen measles outbreaks that really have flared very quickly out of control because there’s very little herd immunity in those particular pockets. But those do spill out into the broader community sometimes and infect, say, babies that haven’t yet been vaccinated, or some older adults who’ve lost immunity over time to the measles virus. That does happen sometimes. So we’re talking about seeing these pockets of virus popping up all through the country and sometimes spilling over even into the neighboring communities where people did get vaccinated for the most part.

Michael Barbaro
And how risky will those outbreaks be for the average person who is vaccinated?

Apoorva Mandavilli
Well, for the vast majority of people who are vaccinated, it probably won’t be. And even if they do get infected, they may not get very sick. But there are cases that we’ve seen already where even people who’ve been vaccinated can get infected. There was just a case in Kentucky at a nursing home, where there was an unvaccinated staff member who infected 26 residents of the nursing home. And 18 of them, of that 26, had been vaccinated with both doses of the vaccine two weeks past the second dose, which is what we’re supposed to have. And still, they were infected. Some of them had symptoms, and two of them died.

Michael Barbaro
Wow.

Apoorva Mandavilli
So there’s a likelihood that you will not get as sick if you’ve been vaccinated before, but it’s not a full guarantee.

Michael Barbaro
So in a world where we have not achieved herd immunity, the world we’re living in now — and it looks like we will be living in for, as you say, up to a generation — things like this will happen, where an unvaccinated person, the kind of person who’s keeping us from achieving herd immunity, will infect vaccinated people. And some small percentage of them will get really sick. And an even smaller percentage of them will die.

Apoorva Mandavilli
That’s right, and I think this is very important to emphasize also because I’ve seen a lot of this sentiment of, if people don’t want to get vaccinated, that’s on them. Why should I care? But there are a lot of people, like the elderly, for example, who may not put up a very strong response, even when they get vaccinated. There are so many immunocompromised people, either because they had cancer or who take some kind of medication that don’t really produce antibodies when they get the vaccine. And so, we do have to think about all of those people as being susceptible when there’s an outbreak. And there’s something else we need to think about, which is that every person that the virus infects is another opportunity for it to mutate. So when you have the virus circulating in big numbers of people again, we are giving the virus so many chances to mutate into something that is more contagious or that our vaccines are not quite as effective against. So we have to be very careful to also contain the virus and its ability to mutate.

quote:

I’ve seen a lot of this sentiment of, if people don’t want to get vaccinated, that’s on them. Why should I care? But