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Young Freud posted:People with strong core strength look overweight. Look at any strongman competitor, like Hafþór "The Mountain" Björnsson, Eddie Hall, or Magnus Ver Magnusson, and they have "beer bellies" because their abdominal muscles are so huge they look protrude outward and look like fat unless they cut their water. These are guys who can deadlift small cars or pull airliners, these guys are literally mostly muscle. These people actually are extremely overweight when you see them in competition. Top strongman competition has no weight classes, so there's no reason to stay lean. Hafthor retired from breaking the deadlift record again because of how uncomfortable he is while training. Eddie is training to box Hafthor right now and he doesn't have the beer belly anymore. Because you need to be lean to box well. No matter how strong your abs are, they won't protrude like a belly. The protrusion is just fat.
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May 12, 2021 04:09
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Epic High Five posted:Uh how do you think the Bolsheviks and Maoists operated lol. Like even right now you've got the Naxalites and Kurds to point to, how many leftist revolutions succeeded while disarmed? Are we feeling great about the state of the revolution in Russia, China, and Turkey?
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May 12, 2021 04:09
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Bishyaler posted:Neat study from 24 years ago. Maybe you should read the next 8 words after that sentence quote:A landmark 1997 study actually tried to answer this question. Its findings — which scholars say still hold up — are that America doesn't really have a significantly higher rate of crime compared to similar countries More "gun rights" means more deaths. Regardless of who owns the guns. Now can you please stop parroting NRA talking points?
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May 12, 2021 04:09
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I'm not going to blame leftists for wanting guns as long as there are well-armed right wing militias running around, but the idea that having tons of guns around doesn't lead to more gun violence is just patently ridiculous
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May 12, 2021 04:11
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Bishyaler posted:I hate to break it to you, but even if they stockpile a mountain of firearms, you can only effectively use one at a time. Good thing militias aren't a thing.
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May 12, 2021 04:11
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Spiritus Nox posted:Are we feeling great about the state of the revolution in Russia, China, and Turkey? Hey! The Maoists succeeded in creating a worker state that *checks notes* became a hyper capitalist oligarchy that exploits their people and workers 10 times more than the US somehow (which is a loving achievement in itself) and abolishes freedom of information. Like I can see defending Rajava, but the end results of the Soviet Union and the CCP, really?
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May 12, 2021 04:13
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Mr. Fall Down Terror posted:if you think japan and the UK aren't capitalist and exploitative as gently caress then you're absolutely grasping in the dark for reasons to explain why "more guns" is not linked directly to "more gun deaths" and "more gun violence" I'm acknowledging they are both, but they also have much better welfare systems than the US. Desperation and poverty breed crime, crime breeds violence. For all this talk of disarming the whole nation I still haven't heard exactly one compelling argument to how you anti-gun folks intend to accomplish that. It's political suicide. And if you manage to pass it, you'll need to rely on law enforcement to enforce it. They won't.
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May 12, 2021 04:14
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Spiritus Nox posted:Are we feeling great about the state of the revolution in Russia, China, and Turkey? We still seem pretty terrified of them if you turn on the news, what's the argument here anyway, its gotta work out perfect and stay perfect and 80+ years of continuous existence in the face of the entire western world opposing them in every way while lifting backwards economies of parasites and monarchs into modernized industrial states doesnt cut it? Can you point to a disarmed and pacifist leftist revolution that managed that much or, ideally, managed whatever you're on about here as the failed ideal? I'd hate for this to be goalposts moving after it being pointed out that an armed working class has indeed worked out before
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May 12, 2021 04:14
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Flopsy posted:Good thing militias aren't a thing. They're buying their own firearms, they aren't relying on bob-down-the-road for a rental program.
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May 12, 2021 04:15
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Bishyaler posted:Gun violence is more related to late stage capitalism and the abject poverty and desperation it creates than it is to available weapons. Also the toxic masculine culture in America. Snap your fingers and remove all guns, and you'll see people building improvised explosives or renting u-hauls and driving on crowded sidewalks instead. The liberal plan to eliminate guns but leave the environments which create violence is a bad one. Cool joke but The Onion did that in 2015
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May 12, 2021 04:16
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Bishyaler posted:I'm acknowledging they are both, but they also have much better welfare systems than the US. Desperation and poverty breed crime, crime breeds violence. For all this talk of disarming the whole nation I still haven't heard exactly one compelling argument to how you anti-gun folks intend to accomplish that. It's political suicide. And if you manage to pass it, you'll need to rely on law enforcement to enforce it. They won't. Combination of taxing guns more and having generous buyback programs, eg you either buy a $100/gun tax stamp every 2 years or you turn it in at a fed gun buyback site and get $750 back.
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May 12, 2021 04:16
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Bishyaler posted:I'm acknowledging they are both, but they also have much better welfare systems than the US. Desperation and poverty breed crime, crime breeds violence. For all this talk of disarming the whole nation I still haven't heard exactly one compelling argument to how you anti-gun folks intend to accomplish that. It's political suicide. And if you manage to pass it, you'll need to rely on law enforcement to enforce it. They won't. Australia did it in the 90s. They had loons complain. It worked. It's very possible to do. Epic High Five posted:We still seem pretty terrified of them if you turn on the news, what's the argument here anyway, its gotta work out perfect and stay perfect and 80+ years of continuous existence in the face of the entire western world opposing them in every way while lifting backwards economies of parasites and monarchs into modernized industrial states doesnt cut it?  Holy poo poo "All those millions of Ukranians and Chinese died, but nothing is perfect people! Jeez!" You are actually spewing propaganda friend TulliusCicero fucked around with this message at 04:21 on May 12, 2021 |
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May 12, 2021 04:17
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The idea that shooters and right-wing militias would make bombs if they couldn’t get a dozen bushmasters is a little silly, as the whole point of guns is you can be dumb and lazy and still kill 20 people in three minutes. Half of all mass shooters would probably give up if they had to learn anything before doing it.
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May 12, 2021 04:19
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Herstory Begins Now posted:Combination of taxing guns more and having generous buyback programs, eg you either buy a $100/gun tax stamp every 2 years or you turn it in at a fed gun buyback site and get $750 back. People who believe in the right to bear arms are going to pay it willingly, and it's going to be used as a political cudgel against Democrats. Also this type of enforcement is tantamount to disarming the poor and will 100% be used to terrorize poorer communities and communities of color.
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May 12, 2021 04:20
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Bishyaler posted:I'm acknowledging they are both, but they also have much better welfare systems than the US. Desperation and poverty breed crime, crime breeds violence. For all this talk of disarming the whole nation I still haven't heard exactly one compelling argument to how you anti-gun folks intend to accomplish that. It's political suicide. And if you manage to pass it, you'll need to rely on law enforcement to enforce it. They won't. it would take a long time to restrict gun ownership and destroy the existing stockpile of guns in private hands but it isn't impossible you've pivoted now to "well its just political suicide to do anything about gun rights in this country" which is true but gets away from your ludicrous argument about america being uniquely capitalist. really we just fetishize commodity ownership of lethal weapons in this country and this fetishism runs so deep that it can short circuit otherwise leftist perspectives into how supporting private industries that make tools for killing people is good, actually
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May 12, 2021 04:21
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Bishyaler posted:People who believe in the right to bear arms are going to pay it willingly, and it's going to be used as a political cudgel against Democrats. Also this type of enforcement is tantamount to disarming the poor and will 100% be used to terrorize poorer communities and communities of color. Yeah are they going to pay it for 25 guns though, the point is to get guns out of circulation
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May 12, 2021 04:21
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Epic High Five posted:We still seem pretty terrified of them if you turn on the news, what's the argument here anyway, its gotta work out perfect and stay perfect and 80+ years of continuous existence in the face of the entire western world opposing them in every way while lifting backwards economies of parasites and monarchs into modernized industrial states doesnt cut it? You're the one who asserted that these countries proved you need an armed revolution to build a successful socialist state. If you don't have a better answer to skepticism that the countries that produced the atrocities in Chechnya or Xianjing actually constitute good outcomes than "but the US is bad tho!!!" - which, to be clear, it is - that's your own problem.
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May 12, 2021 04:21
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Antifa Turkeesian posted:The idea that shooters and right-wing militias would make bombs if they couldn’t get a dozen bushmasters is a little silly, as the whole point of guns is you can be dumb and lazy and still kill 20 people in three minutes. Half of all mass shooters would probably give up if they had to learn anything before doing it. A reminder that a number of mass shooters including Columbine tried bombs and couldn't get it to work.
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May 12, 2021 04:23
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TulliusCicero posted:
So I directly refuted your original point and pointed out two revolutions wherein the working class were armed that succeeded, and pointed out two current leftist guerilla movements that have achieved degrees of autonomy and success. Additionally I asked for examples of similar successes from pacifist movements, you gonna answer my question or do this gish gallup thing You'll note that at no point did I mention china or any of that stuff, I specifically talked about the Maoist and Bolshevik revolutions. Dont backpedal into "heh leftists amirite" poo poo just because you dont have an answer
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May 12, 2021 04:23
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Bishyaler posted:People who believe in the right to bear arms are going to pay it willingly, and it's going to be used as a political cudgel against Democrats. Also this type of enforcement is tantamount to disarming the poor and will 100% be used to terrorize poorer communities and communities of color. Please pay literally any attention at all to guns and their current relationship to poor POC communities being terrorized.
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May 12, 2021 04:23
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Bishyaler posted:I'm acknowledging they are both, but they also have much better welfare systems than the US. Desperation and poverty breed crime, crime breeds violence. For all this talk of disarming the whole nation I still haven't heard exactly one compelling argument to how you anti-gun folks intend to accomplish that. It's political suicide. And if you manage to pass it, you'll need to rely on law enforcement to enforce it. They won't. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TYbY45rHj8w&t=97s For a scientific source on how to help solve our gun violence, based on a real world example: https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC6187769/ quote:We need to understand that in the United States today, law enforcement officials in 40 states have little control over who has access to firearms because they have no discretion over whether they can deny a concealed carry license and no permit is required to obtain a firearm. In 36 of those states, it is not even necessary to undergo a background check when buying a gun from a private seller. The real lesson from the international experience with firearm regulation is that if you have little control over who has access to deadly weapons, you should not be surprised if you have a firearm injury epidemic on your hands. Trying to claim we need "gun rights" is antithetical to solving our gun epidemic. Regardless what side of the political spectrum you're on. Kalit fucked around with this message at 04:29 on May 12, 2021 |
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May 12, 2021 04:25
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you anti-murder folks you anti-suicide folks you anti-domestic-violence folks you anti-terrorism folks you anti-me-feeling-like-a-real-man folks
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May 12, 2021 04:26
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Herstory Begins Now posted:Yeah are they going to pay it for 25 guns though, the point is to get guns out of circulation Contrary to popular belief, most people who own guns don't own 25 of them. Estimates have around 8 guns per household if that's to be believed, and they will also pay that willingly, while getting very, very mad at the politicians who enforced it during the process. For completely anecdotal reference, I own two. If you want to burn moderate support for Democratic votes, this is the way to do it.
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May 12, 2021 04:26
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Bishyaler posted:Estimates have around 8 guns per household if that's to be believed That's loving insane you get that that's insane right?
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May 12, 2021 04:27
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Bishyaler posted:Contrary to popular belief, most people who own guns don't own 25 of them. Estimates have around 8 guns per household if that's to be believed, and they will also pay that willingly, while getting very, very mad at the politicians who enforced it during the process. For completely anecdotal reference, I own two. If you want to burn moderate support for Democratic votes, this is the way to do it. I'm fine burning moderate support for dems if it means 40,000 people a year aren't dying in entirely preventable gun violence. and lol 8 guns is as absurd as 25 guns.
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May 12, 2021 04:28
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Huego posted:Please pay literally any attention at all to guns and their current relationship to poor POC communities being terrorized. poor POC communities theoretically convenient to my argument need guns to defend themselves from the wretched, irresponsible, racist oppressors who also should totally be allowed to have as many guns as they like, as is their constitutional right
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May 12, 2021 04:28
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Bishyaler posted:People who believe in the right to bear arms are going to pay it willingly, and it's going to be used as a political cudgel against Democrats. Also this type of enforcement is tantamount to disarming the poor and will 100% be used to terrorize poorer communities and communities of color. If it's a point against gun control that gun owners will be upset about having to pay an extra tax and hold it against Democrats, is it a point against Medicare for All that people with employer-provided health insurance will be upset about losing it and hold that against Democrats? This isn't an attempt at a dunk, I'm just trying to se where you're coming from here.
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May 12, 2021 04:28
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Spiritus Nox posted:You're the one who asserted that these countries proved you need an armed revolution to build a successful socialist state. If you don't have a better answer to skepticism that the countries that produced the atrocities in Chechnya or Xianjing actually constitute good outcomes than "but the US is bad tho!!!" - which, to be clear, it is - that's your own problem. I'm not about to get into this weird strawman stuff so I'll keep it simple - either argue that those two were not real revolutions in a manner that means others still are in direct response to what i actually said, or give me examples of a peaceful seizing of the means of production.
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May 12, 2021 04:28
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I'm just saying "oh no don't do this obviously good thing it'll make terrible people mad" has not led to good policy decisions in literally any other case. Angry, selfish, violent, stupid people only have one move, and when we make progress in this country it's because progressives accepted that our nation's babymen are just going to throw tantrums about whatever the progress is and do it anyway.
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May 12, 2021 04:29
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I think the difference between labour and dems is labour has more brokebrain cspam/dnd posters who think armed revolution is a solution to the "neoliberal hellscape" we currently live in
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May 12, 2021 04:29
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Bishyaler posted:Contrary to popular belief, most people who own guns don't own 25 of them. Estimates have around 8 guns per household if that's to be believed, and they will also pay that willingly, while getting very, very mad at the politicians who enforced it during the process. For completely anecdotal reference, I own two. If you want to burn moderate support for Democratic votes, this is the way to do it. They would take it as the signal that the boogaloo was underway, most likely, given how they talk all the time.
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May 12, 2021 04:29
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Kalit posted:https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TYbY45rHj8w&t=97s Wishing that the US was Australia in culture, gun or otherwise does not make it so.
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May 12, 2021 04:30
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"Don't ban slavery it'll make the slavers mad." And that's only an apples/oranges thing if you're offensively ignorant about the history of gun violence in america Gun addicts are all worthless little cowards. We know this because they need to strap themselves up like big tough army commandos to endure a trip to wal-mart. We've seen the boogaloo boys in action. Yeah, they did some violence, but they did a hell of a lot more dribbling piss, turning on each other, and hiding at their mom's house.
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May 12, 2021 04:31
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I'd personally be willing to throw support behind meaningful gun control but only after passing full Medicare For All. If you think the former's more urgent despite saving a lot fewer lives, maybe you should ask yourself why you think that
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May 12, 2021 04:31
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"i don't have 25 guns! that's ridiculous! i have eight!"
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May 12, 2021 04:31
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Herstory Begins Now posted:I'm fine burning moderate support for dems if it means 40,000 people a year aren't dying in entirely preventable gun violence. and lol 8 guns is as absurd as 25 guns. Come on though! One gun for each family member if you are a Quiver family! (why the gently caress would any house need 8 guns:  )I'm not sure which LARPer is more insane at the moment
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May 12, 2021 04:32
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Herstory Begins Now posted:Yeah are they going to pay it for 25 guns though, the point is to get guns out of circulation If you want to reduce gun violence, "a gun collector/hoarder's 2nd through 100th guns" seems to be one of the few things less important to remove from circulation than "literally any rifle." This sounds like the sort of gun control that's just the inverse of various right wing "own the libs" proposals, so why should it be taken more seriously?
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May 12, 2021 04:32
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Gun violence is a public health issue, and the public health response is clear - an absolute and total abolition of handguns without a single exception for anybody or any reason. Arguing anything else is just unserious unless it's about enforcement after the factDespera posted:I think the difference between labour and dems is labour has more brokebrain cspam/dnd posters who think armed revolution is a solution to the "neoliberal hellscape" we currently live in Labour purged all those people, and won a slate of big victories on a more moderate and less focused message just as promised. Labour is just in the same spot the Dems were in 2012 but without any power instead of 1 branch. They'll either kick out their version of Clintonites and be fine in like...15 years or not do that and collapse. Its entirely up to them, it's not some unique situation, pretty much every neoliberal movement is running into it at around the same time
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May 12, 2021 04:33
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Bishyaler posted:People who believe in the right to bear arms are going to pay it willingly, and it's going to be used as a political cudgel against Democrats. Also this type of enforcement is tantamount to disarming the poor and will 100% be used to terrorize poorer communities and communities of color. Holy poo poo. Are you insinuating that our current gun culture doesn't terrorize poorer communities and communities of color now?!?!?!?  E: Bishyaler posted:Wishing that the US was Australia in culture, gun or otherwise does not make it so.
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May 12, 2021 04:34
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TheIncredulousHulk posted:I'd personally be willing to throw support behind meaningful gun control but only after passing full Medicare For All. If you think the former's more urgent despite saving a lot fewer lives, maybe you should ask yourself why you think that "I'd personally be willing to support the thing that benefits you, but only after the thing that benefits me. I've never been in any mortal danger and cops call me 'sir' when they pull me over for having too many amiibos hanging from my rear view mirror."
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May 12, 2021 04:35
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