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Powershift posted:I'm not forgetting, but it's already 2021, Auto loans are hitting 7-8 years, and manufacturers and municipalities are pushing their timelines for full-electric/ICE bans to 2030. It’s ticking a low slower than some people think. There are still going to be a lot of new cars with ICE engines being bought in 2030.
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May 13, 2021 18:26
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KillHour posted:If you have a car there, it's because you have a dedicated parking lot this is 100% not true fyi
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May 13, 2021 20:34
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KYOON GRIFFEY JR posted:this is 100% not true fyi Yea, plenty of places where new condos and apartments are going up with limited or no dedicated parking.
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May 13, 2021 20:37
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Raluek posted:ive talked to several coworkers now who have mentioned that they saw "a new bronco" on the road and they were disappointed in how poo poo it looked, didnt live up to their expectation, etc This reminds me of the Mitsu Lancer before the US got the Evo. By the time the real thing got here they'd already made some dumb OZ package for the shitbox version and friends asked me would you care about this turd?
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May 13, 2021 21:53
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KYOON GRIFFEY JR posted:this is 100% not true fyi Who is street parking overnight in a city center? Your poo poo would get towed immediately. You need to pay monthly if you're going to own a car and live downtown in a major city.
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May 13, 2021 22:01
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Mcqueen posted:This reminds me of the Mitsu Lancer before the US got the Evo. By the time the real thing got here they'd already made some dumb OZ package for the shitbox version and friends asked me would you care about this turd? The OZ edition had cool wheels BUT REAR DRUMS! Come on. I don't mind rear drums but it was supposed to be a sporty "rally edition" and it had lightweight wheels so you could see them easily. Not like Mitsubishi didn't have a brake package they could put on there easily 
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May 13, 2021 22:32
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KillHour posted:Who is street parking overnight in a city center? Your poo poo would get towed immediately. You need to pay monthly if you're going to own a car and live downtown in a major city. People who live there? Depends on city though. 
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May 13, 2021 22:40
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Powershift posted:I'm not forgetting, but it's already 2021, Auto loans are hitting 7-8 years, and manufacturers and municipalities are pushing their timelines for full-electric/ICE bans to 2030. Not even close. We'll be in dome cities before we're 90% electric in the US.
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May 14, 2021 01:26
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I'm not even saying this as a car enthusiast, just as a general consumer. I don't see myself paying more than 10K for a car, ever, unless I hit the lottery or get a significantly better paying job, which might as well be hitting the lottery at this point. Even if new cars end up all electric in a decade, it's going to take some time for those to work their way down the used market to where I can afford one.
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May 14, 2021 01:47
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euphronius posted:Cars (almost all of them) are so much insanely better than they were in the 80s and 90s . Those were dire times. You spelled worse bitchin wrong
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May 14, 2021 02:19
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As Nero Danced posted:I'm not even saying this as a car enthusiast, just as a general consumer. I don't see myself paying more than 10K for a car, ever, unless I hit the lottery or get a significantly better paying job, which might as well be hitting the lottery at this point. Even if new cars end up all electric in a decade, it's going to take some time for those to work their way down the used market to where I can afford one. I got one for $13k. It has an EPA range of 93 miles, however. :P Leafs are cheaper though.
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May 14, 2021 02:34
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Charles posted:The OZ edition had cool wheels BUT REAR DRUMS! Come on. I don't mind rear drums but it was supposed to be a sporty "rally edition" and it had lightweight wheels so you could see them easily. Not like Mitsubishi didn't have a brake package they could put on there easily oz edition was just a car to sell to people with poo poo credit scores and bad taste
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May 14, 2021 04:52
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BraveUlysses posted:oz edition was just a car to sell to people with poo poo credit scores and bad taste Yeah but they still could have at least put rear discs to look good.
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May 14, 2021 05:47
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As Nero Danced posted:I'm not even saying this as a car enthusiast, just as a general consumer. I don't see myself paying more than 10K for a car, ever, unless I hit the lottery or get a significantly better paying job, which might as well be hitting the lottery at this point. Even if new cars end up all electric in a decade, it's going to take some time for those to work their way down the used market to where I can afford one. I can picture used electric cars at sub $10k prices behaving like 4 year old iphones that need constant plugging in as their battery reads 90% -> 1% in the span of 5 minutes of use. Or RC cars with a spanked NiCd battery that will only do a surface charge anymore.
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May 14, 2021 10:45
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BloodBag posted:I can picture used electric cars at sub $10k prices behaving like 4 year old iphones that need constant plugging in as their battery reads 90% -> 1% in the span of 5 minutes of use. Or RC cars with a spanked NiCd battery that will only do a surface charge anymore. Aren't Nissan Leafs supposed to be surprisingly good electric cars for <10k?
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May 14, 2021 12:14
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Residency Evil posted:Aren't Nissan Leafs supposed to be surprisingly good electric cars for <10k? Yeah, but you may have to ship one to get one. There was a 3 or 4 year stretch where Georgia accidentally subsidized Leaf leases to where they cost less than $60/mo to lease, so Georgia is drowning in cheap leafs of all types.
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May 14, 2021 12:35
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Powershift posted:I'm not forgetting, but it's already 2021, Auto loans are hitting 7-8 years, and manufacturers and municipalities are pushing their timelines for full-electric/ICE bans to 2030. You realize how hilariously unsustainable fast charging is right? Fast charging kills batteries. You are absolutely not meant to use it as your primary means of charging and even Tesla admits as much. If you overuse it, you can get locked off from using fast charging on their network specifically because they don't want you burning out your battery. I've seen some folks on reddit reporting that in as little as 4000 miles even.
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May 14, 2021 14:20
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Charging my previous iPhone at 15w every night killed the battery in a year. I put my new one on a 5w charger and in 6 months it has less than a quarter of the battery wear. Fast charging is not good unless you need quick juice.
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May 14, 2021 14:31
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Laserface posted:Charging my previous iPhone at 15w every night killed the battery in a year. Then you had a defective phone. 15w isn't even "fast" by phone charging standards and hasn't been for a few years. I used a phone that I changed daily at 30w and it had no measurable battery degradation within a year.
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May 14, 2021 14:35
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I don't see electric cars being anything more than a novelty in our lifetimes. Gas is still too plentiful and cheap. The insane amount of gas stations and the speedy filling up is going to deter most people from wanting an EV and I just don't see that changing. This might be a stupid question but wasn't somebody working on a kind of synthetic fuel?
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May 14, 2021 14:35
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Not to make too much of a bong rip hot take but surely there needs to be a standard form factor battery and some procedure for swapping them out at a changing station rather then recharging them while you wait? No? How else is it ever going to be as fast as gas?
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May 14, 2021 14:48
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You slow charge your EV overnight while you are sleeping that's the point. If you're driving long distances which requires a fillup/recharge an EV is probably not for you.
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May 14, 2021 14:53
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Jack B Nimble posted:Not to make too much of a bong rip hot take but surely there needs to be a standard form factor battery and some procedure for swapping them out at a changing station rather then recharging them while you wait? No? How else is it ever going to be as fast as gas? Tesla experimented with swapping batteries out and decided it just wasn't feasible. My first thought is that it seems like you'd need some really sophisticated machinery to account for poo poo drivers. But I suppose if people can manage to get into the rails for an automated car wash then I don't know why swappable batteries can't be achieved. Maybe the limitation is designing the car to be safe for driving conditions while also being swappable? 
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May 14, 2021 14:57
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CornHolio posted:This might be a stupid question but wasn't somebody working on a kind of synthetic fuel? There are several already, Germany infamously had several plants in WW2 since they have a lot of coal and little oil. The economics and overall emissions currently make them a poor choice but that will certainly change over time.
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May 14, 2021 15:02
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Applebees Appetizer posted:You slow charge your EV overnight while you are sleeping that's the point. Not everyone lives in a place where this is feasible.
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May 14, 2021 15:04
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KillHour posted:Not everyone lives in a place where this is feasible. Then an EV is not for them
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May 14, 2021 15:05
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Applebees Appetizer posted:Then an EV is not for them So how exactly are they going to enforce the "all new cars must be electric" laws then? That's what started the conversation.
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May 14, 2021 15:06
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There are a lot of other issues than the physical act of swapping. How are you accounting for battery degradation? Do you allow someone with a 10 year old ev on it's original pack come in and swap for one that has more capacity? But it's more of a logistical issue. How many packs can you keep on hand? How can you CHARGE that many packs at once without needing a whole substation to yourself? You cannot approach "refueling" with the same mindset as gas. You need to have as much range as you would normally drive in a day and then have the ability to reclaim that range at home overnight (or at work, or at your various destinations throughout the day.) Longer trips require more planning but unless you are swapping out drivers, you shouldn't be driving more than 4-5 hours at a time anyways without taking an hour or two break so that problem mostly solves itself.
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May 14, 2021 15:07
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KillHour posted:So how exactly are they going to enforce the "all new cars must be electric" laws then? That's what started the conversation. Oh, well I guess they'll have to start putting charging stations everywhere then, on the side of the streets like parking meters. I mean I don't see how they are going to be able to put in that kind of law without the infrastructure to support it.
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May 14, 2021 15:11
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Applebees Appetizer posted:Oh, well I guess they'll have to start putting charging stations everywhere then, on the side of the streets like parking meters. I mean I don't see how they are going to be able to put in that kind of law without the infrastructure to support it. This is America, where passing a federal budget doesn't automatically imply authorizing the government to pay for said budget. You know exactly what will happen. KillHour posted:Municipalities are going to play dumb about infrastructure until the very last second and then everyone is going to cry that it's impossible and there's no money.
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May 14, 2021 15:14
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Sab669 posted:Tesla experimented with swapping batteries out and decided it just wasn't feasible. The automated battery swap was a stunt that earned them more ZEV credits. Tesla sells ZEV credits to other manufacturers that those manufacturers use to offset sales of gas vehicles. Zero emission cars that could be refueled very quickly, like fuel cells, earned a LOT more credits than electric vehicles that needed slow charging. Those qualifications changed, so the credits went away, and Tesla decided to focus on other things. quote:ZEV credits are earned in a complicated way. The California Air Resources Board categorizes vehicles based on their range and the time it takes to refuel them. Full article: https://www.latimes.com/business/autos/la-fi-hy-tesla-battery-swap-harris-ranch-20150310-story.html The side effect of raising awareness of the brand and more juicy VC money didn’t hurt either. Doesn’t mean it’s not viable, just means Tesla had other intentions when they prototyped it.
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May 14, 2021 15:20
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KillHour posted:This is America, where passing a federal budget doesn't automatically imply authorizing the government to pay for said budget. You know exactly what will happen. Not really, I can't see into the future but my guess is "all new cars must be electric" isn't going to happen until after I'm dead
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May 14, 2021 15:28
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Applebees Appetizer posted:If you're driving long distances which requires a fillup/recharge an EV is probably not for you. So America, then. My commute is about 30 miles each way, so I could do it day-to-day. But I sometimes go to Chicago (100 miles one way) for a day trip, or Indy (150 miles) or further for a day trip. I know I'm not alone. Nobody is going to want to buy a car that prohibits them from doing something like that easily.
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May 14, 2021 16:09
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Yea I rarely do more than 60 miles per day... But then 4-6x a year I do 450 miles from Buffalo to Boston. I guess you could say, "well just rent a gas car then" but it's lovely to add a couple hundred bucks for a week trip to visit my parents. They seem like a great second car for your typical 2-car household, but mandating them for everyone has some big limitations as of right now.
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May 14, 2021 16:15
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Day trips like that shouldn't be an issue. The first one is attainable with zero charging from a wide range of EVs out there now. The 2nd one would just require a partial destination charge so unless you are driving around Indy the entire time you are there, you could easily do that. And that's now, not 10 years from now and not 20 years from now when the gasoline powered used market is starting to show its age. (Also, insert semi-serious joke about this all being academic because in 20 years time the chances that a day trip to Indy will be high on your list of priorities will be remote. I mean, for fucks sake, that's like 5 election cycles away. I'm not convinced we'll even survive the next one.)
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May 14, 2021 16:22
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Model 3 Long Range goes about 340-350, how long does it take to add that extra 100 miles of charging if you're trying to avoid fast charging? I guess "Deal with the extra 30 minutes", but man when you're spending 6+ hours on lovely rear end I-90... You just wanna gently caress get there. Especially with 2 dogs in the back seat. Only like 240 miles in the Bolt / Leaf. I don't even know what else is out there. e; similar range in the Kona too. Sab669 fucked around with this message at 16:35 on May 14, 2021 |
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May 14, 2021 16:31
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Part of that is a whole other argument because you aren't going to find much resistance from me for forcing a driver who has been on the road for 6 hours off of it for a little extra rest. Maybe instead of asking how to do these 600 mile drives in one go, we should be asking IF we should be doing them all in one go.
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May 14, 2021 16:39
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ishikabibble posted:You realize how hilariously unsustainable fast charging is right? Please don't spread misinformation. Tesla will happily let you supercharge all day, if you're paying for it. They just didn't want people with the original unlimited plans using it all the time. I'm addition, any water cooled battery and it's not a huge deal. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=m9VxDzr7prc Please stop repeating what your "Uncle From Nintendo" said. What is this, a bunch of loving boomers?
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May 14, 2021 16:41
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CornHolio posted:So America, then. Maybe, but you're painting with a broad brush, there are plenty of people in America that don't even come close to driving that much. If you take lots of day trips and don't want to stop to charge up then don't buy an EV. If EVs happen go into law in your area then I guess you don't have much of a choice
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May 14, 2021 16:41
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Applebees Appetizer posted:If EVs happen go into law in your area then I guess you don't have much of a choice EVs going into law in America?  I would put a large, large amount of money into this not happening in our lifetime. Maybe nudges and manufacturer incentives like CAFE, but nothing like a mandate.
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May 14, 2021 16:46
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