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AMD patented a super-resolution technique which might (or might not) be the basis of FSR Looks to be on similar lines to DLSS 1.0, using ML to fill in extra details via guesswork, as opposed to the DLSS 2.0 route of filling in extra details based on previous frames https://twitter.com/ayxerious/status/1395337445621723136
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May 20, 2021 13:26
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EconOutlines posted:I don't think that's going to work either unless you seriously want to dive deep down the rabbit hole... In-line:  Really wish there were some way the stores could honeypot these fuckers.
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May 20, 2021 13:36
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EconOutlines posted:I don't think that's going to work either unless you seriously want to dive deep down the rabbit hole... Some people are just enormous assholes. I'm talking about the same kind of people as: quote:Your scientists were so preoccupied with whether or not they could, they didn’t stop to think if they should.
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May 20, 2021 13:42
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So I was looking into possibly going to Microcenter in Tustin to wait in line for a GPU but there's this one really notorious scalper there named 'Jay' who was officially banned from buying GPUs at the store, but hires people to hold places in line, harasses & threatens people who move up on empty seats that his proxies leave behind, hogs all the front-line spots, and keeps getting away with the shady poo poo he's doing in claiming vouchers. The store manager 'Greg' has apparently been worse than useless in this. Microcenter claims they're gonna do something about it, but they've been claiming something like this for a while now. https://twitter.com/microcenter/status/1394675205461716995 Here's footage of him threatening people who moved up on the empty seats that his hired proxies were taking up space in the line with. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PSeR8ir3rK0 Also I can't confirm for sure this is him or not (people in the discord think it is him) but this is allegedly him being 'classy.'   I hope the crypto and scalping market tanks already so we don't have to deal with lovely people like these. Spacedad fucked around with this message at 15:32 on May 20, 2021 |
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May 20, 2021 15:25
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How is the microcenter in cambridge? I work near there now and like eh I'm in pretty early maybe I'll go mosey down there
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May 20, 2021 15:27
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 line up for your GPU along the side of a 4 lane road, thanks surprised the cops haven't forced them to stop camping out on a public sidewalk, but then again it's scalpers making a buck, not homeless people looking for somewhere to sleep
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May 20, 2021 15:45
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Edit: ^That's not the Cambridge MC. No road in Boston is that wide.bus hustler posted:How is the microcenter in cambridge? I work near there now and like eh I'm in pretty early maybe I'll go mosey down there I've been lurking the Cambridge MC discord for a while and there's no creepers hiring proxies to buy cards or anything. No line incidents I'm appear of either. The line is still long and cards still short in supply. 2 3090s, 5 3070s, and 16 3060s today. Edit2: Looks like 40ish people in line today at open. OhFunny fucked around with this message at 15:59 on May 20, 2021 |
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May 20, 2021 15:56
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Finally got my 6800XT from the VAG program. First impressions: the blacks look more crushed on my monitor compared to the 970, is that an AMD thing or something? I definitely would have preferred an RTX card so that I could play around with raytracing/DLSS (hope the AMD DLSS thing is good, but not holding out much hope). I can max out the settings on all my games now, but graphics in the last few years have progressed to the point that at 1080p I can't tell the difference between medium/high/ultra unless I have them side by side. I guess it's time for a monitor upgrade soon. Definitely not a card I would have bought or recommended under any other circumstances, but I still think I'm going to hold onto it.
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May 20, 2021 16:04
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Nice Van My Man posted:Finally got my 6800XT from the VAG program. First impressions: the blacks look more crushed on my monitor compared to the 970, is that an AMD thing or something? Try changing "Pixel Format" in the Radeon software settings, under the display tab.
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May 20, 2021 16:09
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Sagebrush posted:Maybe I'm confused but I thought that there were specific hardware advantages to using the RTX cards for raytracing work. Like that a 3070 and a 6800 would have basically identical raster performance, but the 3070 would be much faster at raytracing jobs, and not just because of DLSS. The engine you're using would therefore have to implement those hardware optimizations. DXRT is hardware-agnostic, so again my understanding was that it doesn't necessarily take advantage of the RTX hardware. NVidia's RTX cards have dedicated ray-tracing hardware. AMD's RX 6000 cards also have dedicated ray-tracing hardware... but NVidia is on its second [?] generation of RT cores, and so pound-for-pound, NVidia is better/faster at RT workloads than the closest equivalent AMD card, even without DLSS. NVidia's RTX cards also have Tensor cores, which are a big part of what they use to run/enable DLSS. AMD doesn't have those. On the one hand, that might mean that whatever AMD's DLSS-competitor will be won't be nearly as good as DLSS, whether in image quality or in relative frame-rate increase, because it's going to have to run off of regular rasterization hardware. On the other hand, that might mean that AMD's DLSS-competitor can be used on/with more than just the RX 6000 cards, since every card generally has regular rasterization hardware.
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May 20, 2021 16:13
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Spacedad posted:So I was looking into possibly going to Microcenter in Tustin Same, when I found out you had to join their discord to get in line, and still wait all night the day before, I quickly got rid of that idea. I signed up for the shopblt cards last night, guessing I'll be a day late, but it's better than playing the Newegg shuffle disappointment game
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May 20, 2021 16:38
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Shifty Pony posted:In-line: Yeah, people calling a premature end to the shortage/demand issue yesterday are wrong lol. Huge scalping nets and cook groups like this don't dissolve in the short time frame of 2-3 months. Even if GPU's don't pull in 2x-3x MSRP in 6 months, they likely will still pull in enough scalping profit to make it worthwhile for them to continue slanging GPUs next to Jordans and Supreme shirts.
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May 20, 2021 17:50
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If crypto falls and manufacturing improves, things will change. Botters are just trying to grab a sucker while they can.
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May 20, 2021 17:56
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w/r/t manufacturing improving, everyone is saying that the chip shortage will last well into next year and possibly even into 2023.
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May 20, 2021 17:58
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Craptacular! posted:If crypto falls and manufacturing improves, things will change. Botters are just trying to grab a sucker while they can. it's also possible that miners represent a kind of inelastic demand - if a miner wants 20 gpus for his rig and thinks they print money and that he'll be able to recoup them if they don't he'll pay a shitload more than someone who wants to game on it. it's not clear how much this will make an impact tho.
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May 20, 2021 18:00
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Scalping isn't magic. They can only get high prices if there's demand at those prices. GPUs are not limited shoes. Shoes prices can be sustained at stupid high levels because people are morons and crave exclusivity, so small numbers are produced and the real value is easily manipulated. GPUs are not limited production items. If crypto does indeed do the thing it occasionally does where it completely implodes, it may be enough of a shock to the market to make the market collapse and make scalping no longer profitable. That said, I don't think that's too likely, because this may not be that big of a crypto crash, supply is still limited, demand is still high, and there's always inertia in the market as people take time to adjust. Don't get your hopes up, but also don't abandon all hope just yet.
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May 20, 2021 18:02
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Craptacular! posted:If crypto falls and manufacturing improves, things will change. Botters are just trying to grab a sucker while they can. I don't think so. Even your scenario has 2 very big caveats that are far from certain. For example Bitcoin has already climbed back to just under 40k and we've seen the dozens of articles about chip manufacturing problems in Taiwan.
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May 20, 2021 18:03
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K8.0 posted:Scalping isn't magic. They can only get high prices if there's demand at those prices. GPUs are not limited shoes. Shoes prices can be sustained at stupid high levels because people are morons and crave exclusivity, so small numbers are produced and the real value is easily manipulated. GPUs are not limited production items. If crypto does indeed do the thing it occasionally does where it completely implodes, it may be enough of a shock to the market to make the market collapse and make scalping no longer profitable. That said, I don't think that's too likely, because this may not be that big of a crypto crash, supply is still limited, demand is still high, and there's always inertia in the market as people take time to adjust. Don't get your hopes up, but also don't abandon all hope just yet. Yeah, and outside the US there's already signs that the prices have gotten higher than people are willing to pay. Stores in the UK that've been jacking up prices are hitting the point now where those prices are high enough that cards will sit in stock, like Box.co.uk has cards in stock today, and overpriced as they are (£730 for a 3060 anyone?) they're there and purchasable.
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May 20, 2021 18:24
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mA posted:I don't think so. Even your scenario has 2 very big caveats that are far from certain. For example Bitcoin has already climbed back to just under 40k and we've seen the dozens of articles about chip manufacturing problems in Taiwan. There is no magic number that BTC needs to be above because people don't directly mine it. It stabilized and through 2019 had numbers similar to early 2018 when there was a run on cards, but the 20x0 cards didn't disappear during that time because "it will pay for itself" and the GPU/gaming world looked pretty normal. ETH is being slashed in half by Nvidia supposedly, but obviously if it grows at obscene percentages so even a halved 3070 is still doing $25 a day then you're going to see demand even for LHR cards. That leaves manufacturing, and obviously the mobile market doesn't seem to be feeling too many problems getting stuff from TSMC. A company that is confident it will sell whatever it makes will spend more to make more, unless Nvidia is trying to manipulate the used cards market into evaporating like Paul has speculated, though I think the mining booms have proved that the used card market will evaporate itself time and again and so isn't really a problem. The big problem here is companies trying to save themselves a small amount of skin by adopting JIT manufacturing, with Tesla being the one weirdo on the planet who buys stuff they don't need right away to stabilize production for a rainy day. But even Apple relies on JIT, and they don't seem to have too many problems meeting demand. You just actually have to throw money at problems instead of expect the economy to revive if you sit back and do nothing.
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May 20, 2021 18:31
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mA posted:Yeah, people calling a premature end to the shortage/demand issue yesterday are wrong lol. Huge scalping nets and cook groups like this don't dissolve in the short time frame of 2-3 months. Even if GPU's don't pull in 2x-3x MSRP in 6 months, they likely will still pull in enough scalping profit to make it worthwhile for them to continue slanging GPUs next to Jordans and Supreme shirts. People are quick to call an end to the GPU shortage. I remember in November and December that everyone said the stock would be back to normal in 2-3 months. Same thing in February. I'm pretty sure we're stuck in this for a long while. Scalpers make hundreds on each card sold so there is a HUGE incentive for them to keep doing it. If you have a decent GPU hold on to it for a while and wait for things to settle out. If you don't then look at buying a prebuild.
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May 20, 2021 18:33
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mysteryberto posted:People are quick to call an end to the GPU shortage. I remember in November and December that everyone said the stock would be back to normal in 2-3 months. Same thing in February. I don't remember that being the case.
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May 20, 2021 18:36
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Scalpers make some money on each card, but they don't make enough money to continue to dam the river and own Literally All The Cards. We have seen this come and go with memory and in memory's case it's actually even a bigger problem because it's like the scalpers actually own the means of production.
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May 20, 2021 18:36
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This week's cryptocurrency crash has so far just brought the dollar value of ethereum down to where it was less than a month ago. I don't have any idea what the miners' profitability calculations look like but I don't see them really dumping GPUs they don't want anymore or demand drying up from just that level of declineCraptacular! posted:
Apple still has enough chips because they were apparently one of the only big buyers that didn't cut their orders due to the pandemic. Same with Toyota, the literal inventors of just in time, who the business press have been reporting were the only big auto company that decided to stockpile chips when they forecasted a possible future shortage. Shear Modulus fucked around with this message at 18:47 on May 20, 2021 |
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May 20, 2021 18:38
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Rinkles posted:I don't remember that being the case. yeah, here i am in February explicitly saying: our belief in the previous year that things would have gotten better by April proved to be very poorly supported. CoolCab posted:yeah demand radically outpaces supply so some places have set up a lottery. i feel like people were expecting it to get better by april and now that feels extremely unlikely. in my observation it's been 6 months to a year before things get better for god almost a year now.
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May 20, 2021 18:39
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repiv posted:AMD patented a super-resolution technique which might (or might not) be the basis of FSR Yeah this looks like a standard single-frame superresolution neural network model, which in addition to what others have said about this being more primitive than the Nvidia offering that uses time-domain info and less performant (unless AMD has somehow made up their deficit in AI-specific hardware and drivers), I don't see how all the patent claims would hold up in court.
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May 20, 2021 18:46
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Shear Modulus posted:This week's cryptocurrency crash has so far just brought the dollar value of ethereum down to where it was less than a month ago. I don't have any idea what the miners' profitability calculations look like but I don't see them really dumping GPUs they don't want anymore or demand drying up from just that level of decline While it's true that for some people they're going to have to lose a lot more than 30% of their investment because Musk tweeted something before they go "oh hey maybe gambling with Elon isn't smart", the 50% ETH nerf (assuming it's effective which I know is a reach) would need to be outpaced with growth to not reduce demand in some capacity.
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May 20, 2021 18:46
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The crypto prices when he 3080 released were like 1/4 of the prices now, even after the recent crash, and it wasn't like you could just buy one then. I suppose it will make it easier for supplies to catch up, and maybe some people will dump their cards on to ebay, but I agree that some people may be jumping the gun on this.
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May 20, 2021 18:48
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Shear Modulus posted:Yeah this looks like a standard single-frame superresolution neural network model, which in addition to what others have said about this being more primitive than the Nvidia offering that uses time-domain info and less performant (unless AMD has somehow made up their deficit in AI-specific hardware and drivers), I don't see how all the patent claims would hold up in court. It’s just an application right now, not a patent; the claims will almost certainly change before it issues.
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May 20, 2021 18:49
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Shear Modulus posted:Apple still has enough chips because they were apparently one of the only big buyers that didn't cut their orders due to the pandemic. Same with Toyota, the literal inventors of just in time, who the business press have been reporting were the only big auto company and decided to stockpile chips when they forecasted a possible future shortage. Apple is also I think the only major TSMC customer on their 5nm stuff, so they basically have an entire process to themselves, at least for the current Macs and iPad Pro. Really this whole thing is way more scalpers than supply, there's a small but fairly consistent flow of cards into the market, they just get bought up by bots or nerds living out their mob fantasies outside Micro Centers. So it's not like the cards aren't out there, even Nvidia and AMD themselves both say they're producing more cards than at any time in their history.
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May 20, 2021 18:51
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Shear Modulus posted:Yeah this looks like a standard single-frame superresolution neural network model, which in addition to what others have said about this being more primitive than the Nvidia offering that uses time-domain info and less performant (unless AMD has somehow made up their deficit in AI-specific hardware and drivers), I don't see how all the patent claims would hold up in court. That's a Pre-Grant Publication, not a patent. It is basically just a copy of their initial filing and none of the claims in it have been examined yet.
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May 20, 2021 18:54
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Shifty Pony posted:That's a Pre-Grant Publication, not a patent. It is basically just a copy of their initial filing and none of the claims in it have been examined yet. Ah ok. I've never personally been part of a patent process myself so I don't have experience there but I've seen a lot of granted patents to tech companies that claim stuff that's either prior patented or already in the scientific literature.
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May 20, 2021 19:02
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Rusty posted:The crypto prices when he 3080 released were like 1/4 of the prices now, even after the recent crash, and it wasn't like you could just buy one then. If they were only as difficult to get as the consoles are, I'd have one already, and I'm a lazy sob who is always late to links. I was able to get a PS5 amidst everything, but no way to a graphics card. Part of that is due to the more mainstream retail options you have with a console, though.
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May 20, 2021 21:03
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Craptacular! posted:If they were only as difficult to get as the consoles are, I'd have one already, and I'm a lazy sob who is always late to links. At this point I believe the entirety of the disparity is miners buying GPUs. Consoles are a great comparison point to show a gaming device that is production constrained but can't mine, so you see what the demand without mining is. I realize there's not perfect overlap, but the difference is huge in terms of availability and price.
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May 20, 2021 21:10
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3080s launched in the same time period as the PS5 and at the time there was no mining craze, but the 3080 was significantly harder to get even back then. Not saying there isn't going to be more slack if BTC keeps crashing, but I still think we're a long way to get to PS5 type supplies (where you can actually get one occasionally without bots). Edit: I looked and during the 3080 launch, BTC was 10k, right now after the recent crash, BTC is over 40k Rusty fucked around with this message at 21:24 on May 20, 2021 |
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May 20, 2021 21:16
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Rusty posted:3080s launched in the same time period as the PS5 and at the time there was no mining craze, but the 3080 was significantly harder to get even back then. Not saying there isn't going to be more slack if BTC keeps crashing, but I still think we're a long way to get to PS5 type supplies (where you can actually get one occasionally without bots). yeah but it's not BTC that's getting mined, the price of eth will most likely decide it.
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May 20, 2021 21:25
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Eth was $370 when the 3080 launched, it is now $2800. I don't follow crypto, I just thought BTC was kind of the benchmark of how crypto in general was performing. Sorry for the crypto post, but mainly this is about how there was no mining when these video cards were released and they were not something you could buy any easier then than now.
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May 20, 2021 21:28
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Inept posted:At this point I believe the entirety of the disparity is miners buying GPUs. Consoles are a great comparison point to show a gaming device that is production constrained but can't mine, so you see what the demand without mining is. I realize there's not perfect overlap, but the difference is huge in terms of availability and price. Well again I will make a concession to the different sorts of retail. You can buy PlayStations at Walmart and Target (also these are the only two stores where I’ve had a chance) but they want nothing to do with computer parts. Best Buy pivoted from the 30 foot aisle of CGI frog GPUs and sound cards long long ago into being an iPad showroom, CompUSA collapsed, and recently Fry’s went out of business and there’s very little overlap between Fry’s and Micro Center because they did so much of the same thing (although one with a much lower customer satisfaction index.) As a west coast guy I’m not even awake when Best Buy puts cards on sale, and they seem to do it as this far more bot-friendly cattle call instead of the ten minute waves that Walmart does with consoles. The death of PC builder brick and mortar to the point where only small regionals are left standing is part of the problem here. A buddy out east met a guy who was scalping and clearly friends with an employee at a regional B&M store out there because he was getting inventory before it reached the line, and I always suspected Fauxtool’s GPUs off the back of the truck were related to the SoCal Micro Center. We're in the "need to know a guy at the store" phase now, and a significant amount of the country has zero physical stores that sell these. Craptacular! fucked around with this message at 21:41 on May 20, 2021 |
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May 20, 2021 21:36
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I won the newegg shuffle, now to sell my 2060 as soon as possible.
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May 20, 2021 23:00
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Shout out to SourKraut for hooking me up with that 3060ti at an extremely fair price and sparing me anymore next-gen GPU misery.
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May 20, 2021 23:17
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mutata posted:Yeah. 3060 line seems like it's months long, 3070 line is fulfilling for people who signed up in February, 3080 line is fulfilling for people who signed up in, like, October, and the 3090 is fulfilling for people who signed up a week to a day ago. Got my 3090 today. It's a huge bitch, but I'm gonna keep it and sell the 6800 xt I got from LTT. What a lovely time to buy computer hardware, heh.
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