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gently caress republics give me playable Pope.
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May 19, 2021 16:12
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| # ? May 29, 2024 07:29 |
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I pretty much always get warmonger Popes. I've gone to war with the ones in my current file three times. Two of those were me declaring on him to take two different duchies in Africa. He has two more.
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May 19, 2021 18:35
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Maybe I should try a Sicily game, I'm so used to the Pope just being completely idle except when Crusades fire and then he hires every merc in existence to go single handedly carve chunks out of the holy land. Like when I've vassalized him as the HRE he becomes just like any other Theocratic vassal: 100% docile PittTheElder fucked around with this message at 23:35 on May 19, 2021 |
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May 19, 2021 22:33
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Yes, it's like a lava lamp.
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Edgar Allen Ho posted:gently caress republics give me playable Pope. If the last 2 games are any indicator, that’s never, ever going to happen.
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May 19, 2021 23:14
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I converted in game to Priscialianism and took over Roma. So...you know I feel accomplished.
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May 19, 2021 23:41
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Broken Cog posted:Anyone tried vassalizing the pope, give him like the entirety of the Italian peninsula, release him and let him run amock? I don't think anyone has De Jure rule over the Papacy, that plus the kingdom-level malus for vassalization means I don't know how you'd ever get him to agree to it, nor can you ever force it on him as the Papacy title is essentially invulnerable.
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May 20, 2021 02:04
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Serephina posted:I don't think anyone has De Jure rule over the Papacy, that plus the kingdom-level malus for vassalization means I don't know how you'd ever get him to agree to it, nor can you ever force it on him as the Papacy title is essentially invulnerable. You can vassalize the pope. Need to be an emperor and take all their land using a dejure duchy casus belli. It's becoming the pope that's the real mystery -- I've heard reports of people doing it, but they usually involve debug mode or previous patches. Despite putting a large amount of research into it I have no idea if it's possible now scaterry fucked around with this message at 02:46 on May 20, 2021 |
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May 20, 2021 02:43
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scaterry posted:It's becoming the pope that's the real mystery -- I've heard reports of people doing it, but they usually involve debug mode or previous patches. Surely the only way to become the pope is to enable god mode
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May 20, 2021 10:39
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Orthogonalus posted:Surely the only way to become the pope is to enable god mode Well, I can list the ways I know of to become pope. None work in a current patch ironman game. 1. debug mode, use a debug war or take title 2. use a kingdom level cb like mongol invasion. stopped working bc most cbs can't target the title due to restrictions 3. claim throne -> press claimant faction. stopped working bc papacy can no longer have claims There is a way to become a custom theocratic hof: 1. Have a theocratic vassal and reform into a faith with theocratic hof. The vassal will become the hof, but also become feudal. You can then inherit the theocratic title normally.
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May 20, 2021 15:56
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ZombieLenin posted:If the last 2 games are any indicator, that’s never, ever going to happen. In CK2, theocracies were just hardcoded unplayable, so they used the Pope to glue a bunch of events together - the Papacy always existed, so the Pope was used whenever they needed a body to fire an event like the Mongol invasion. IIRC they cleaned that up sort of thing up later, but I haven't looked at CK2 events in a while. (I have no idea what CK1 was like, but it was probably worse, if anything.) The other reason that doesn't have to do with ramshackle code is that the primary focus of CK is on dynasty, which is obviously an element theocracies lack (minus the legions of bastards). I don't think it's an insurmountable problem or anything, but it's an element that needs some sort of replacement so you're not just playing a string of disconnected randos. I'm guessing CK3 can probably handle playable theocracies a lot better than 2 could, but I'm not sure if the non-dynastic focus is something Paradox is interested in tackling.
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May 20, 2021 17:29
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The main reason you couldn't play as the Pope according to Paradox is because the Pope gets a zillion decision to make per day because of all the rulers constantly making requests.
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May 20, 2021 17:48
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pope achievement: reform catholicism to get everyone to SHUT THE gently caress UP
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May 20, 2021 17:55
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jpmeyer posted:The main reason you couldn't play as the Pope according to Paradox is because the Pope gets a zillion decision to make per day because of all the rulers constantly making requests. I believe you can get a view of what this is like if you're the temporal head of faith of a large religion with the communion tenet. So many indulgence notifications.
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May 20, 2021 20:45
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Have there been any leaks about tomorrow’s expansion announcement? What does everyone want/expect?
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May 20, 2021 23:44
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is there a reason the ck games avoid having anything other than far western China be on the map
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May 20, 2021 23:47
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cuz its for the eu games
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May 20, 2021 23:48
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Raskolnikov38 posted:is there a reason the ck games avoid having anything other than far western China be on the map China is loving massive and i assume that's still just too many characters
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May 20, 2021 23:48
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verbal enema posted:China is loving massive and i assume that's still just too many characters fair point I guess since my rurikid game is rapidly approaching a game breaking amount of rurikids
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May 20, 2021 23:50
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Raskolnikov38 posted:fair point I guess since my rurikid game is rapidly approaching a game breaking amount of rurikids also if ur giving me China give me japan Korea all of it gimmie 867 Australia
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May 20, 2021 23:52
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I'm honestly glad East Asia isn't in, the geography really separates it out from the Mediterranean world. I'm of a mixed opinion on the inclusion of the Indian subcontinent too but I guess it would be weird to play in Central Asia without it. There's so many systems that need adding around the Mediterranean, I would much rather they focus on making the core areas feel real rather than add more of the world.
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May 21, 2021 00:00
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The map has a hard border on the west, and a ripped map on the East. It is coming. I do not think it is the first expansion.
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May 21, 2021 00:00
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verbal enema posted:also if ur giving me China give me japan Korea all of it It's entirely plausible that there's gonna be an expansion of the map all the way to Japan and Malaysia based on the in-game map files. There's a significant chunk of unused space that's blank in the map_data/provinces.png, rivers.png, and heightmap.png files that's in an area not pan-able to in the game but is 100% pre-allocated in the internal map data for allow for easier expansion of the map eastwards later.
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May 21, 2021 00:02
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Raskolnikov38 posted:fair point I guess since my rurikid game is rapidly approaching a game breaking amount of rurikids Mine has like 40 cadet branches and more keep popping up. I'm not even at the 13th century yet.
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May 21, 2021 00:17
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FreudianSlippers posted:Mine has like 40 cadet branches and more keep popping up. it is 1062. there are 2064 living rurikids across 102 houses. opening the family tree from helgi to rurik took 20+ minutes why yes I did make sure as many people as possible had the maximum amount of wives/concubines why do you ask?
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May 21, 2021 00:35
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It would be fully sick if they did huge old-school style expansions with China/Japan/Korea. But i know it would never be done justice so please just keep adding flavor and enhanced mechanics to the base game. Cheers.
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May 21, 2021 05:24
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Raskolnikov38 posted:is there a reason the ck games avoid having anything other than far western China be on the map You can reasonably isolate China as a separate entitiy that hasn't affected the rest of Eurasia that much in pre-modern era. But if you add China you have to add everything else to. Japan, Indochina, maybe Indonesia. Besides, a lot of countries already stretch the definition of Feudalism. Like as I understand devs had to take a lot of liberties with Byzantines as they didn't have local ruling dynasties (or did they?) and in China it would look even stranger. Did they have a practice of governor children inheriting titles at all?
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May 21, 2021 07:01
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there were powerful landed families that contended for the throne in both china and the byzantine empire. but the bureaucracy in both these countries was also powerful enough to exert its own historical force: enough to keep key state functions from being feudally devolved. in the three kingdoms period in china there was a weird balance in which the wife of the emperor was always from a certain landed family but the emperor himself was routinely sidelined by the eunuchs. there needs basically to be a robust system for modelling the outsized importance of centralized bureaucracies in these countries. with the byzantines the urban populations of the capital could also be anomalously important because of the survival of still robust urban centers into the middle ages. at least one emperor was deposed by an enormous mass riot touched off by the big chariot races in constantinople. Zane fucked around with this message at 08:18 on May 21, 2021 |
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May 21, 2021 07:28
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867 South America when? Give me Wari and Tiwanaku, you cowards.
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May 21, 2021 07:32
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Zane posted:there were powerful landed families that contended for the throne in both china and the byzantine empire. but the bureaucracy in both these countries was also powerful enough to exert its own historical force: enough to keep key state functions from being feudally devolved. in the three kingdoms period in china there was a weird balance in which the wife of the emperor was always from a certain landed family but the emperor himself was routinely sidelined by the eunuchs. there needs basically to be a robust system for modelling the outsized importance of centralized bureaucracies in these countries. Yeah, this touches off what I want to see more of. More succession types for empire or kingdom-level titles, and implemented in such a way it doesn't gently caress the player out of their county/duchy holdings. Something akin to how Republics worked in CK2. ALTERNATELY: Republics.
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May 21, 2021 08:20
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This all comes back to the game being all about land-owning. For me CK2 always felt like a mod over a grand strategy game, character stuff was always pushed in the corner by the map. Monks and Mystics expansion has really made the issues clear when it showed that in every side of medieval life - including scientific societies and satanist cults - there were only land-owning people or their advisors. Imperator Rome might be better at modeling a universal approach with its prominence and political power of characters. CK3 is slightly better at all this but I still don't see a lot of power outside of land-owning vertical hierarchy. Right now it's extremely weird to me that religion can be only reformed by a secular ruler. Priests are at least represented as owners of temples, but the whole economy outside of feudal subsistence economy is not represented, and thus you don't have merchants or artisans or scholars at all. And in the case of big established empires, it also means no bureaucrats. So adding proper imperial administration kinda means you have to represent whole new classes of society.
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May 21, 2021 10:09
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I also want new forms of government implemented but how do you make a bureaucracy different from just having more councilors? And then you need to make unlanded characters a credible threat as well.
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May 21, 2021 10:56
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I would love an entire playable world tbh. Also not including China probably has a lot to do with being able to sell video games in China while not being forced to pander to them so much that you lose sales in the West.
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May 21, 2021 14:11
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Brandfarlig posted:I also want new forms of government implemented but how do you make a bureaucracy different from just having more councilors? And then you need to make unlanded characters a credible threat as well. I mean at least for the Romans the biggest threat to the ruler at any given moment is a revolt by leading army officers. To do it any justice you'd have to create an office-holding structure where you can distribute positions (and the salaries that come with them) to people (domestic and foreign) and revoke them at will as well, with the risk that revoking a command from a general without reason is a great way to trigger a wider revolt. The real Roman title system was hugely fluid and adhoc which is a challenge to bring into a game, but you'd have to do it. But the insurmountable problem as I see it now is that CK3 is just not built to handle the sort of continuous and low level warfare that standing armies got up to. Maybe you could approach it with the raiding system?
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May 21, 2021 15:59
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I've been reading a history of the Sassanid Empire lately (obviously a bit out of time-scope but...) and one thing that has struck me is how endemic that sort of raiding was for so long - really the restrictions on raiding in CK3 make very little sense when they could just, say, let everyone do it but give characters of religions that don't embrace it piety hits or something when they do?
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May 21, 2021 16:20
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Yeah that would be a very good change. And let the Pope try and crack down on it with some Peace of God action for Catholics, but even then it should never go away. Low level violence was absolutely endemic throughout the period. Also something like the Varangian adventures for the Islamic world, who's goal is to fight a religious enemy, pillage some poo poo, and then probably go home again but maybe settle. It was a consistent problem for Rome's Eastern flank as military adventurers would show up, and either become manpower for the local emirs, or just be sent on to raid the Empire themselves. PittTheElder fucked around with this message at 17:24 on May 21, 2021 |
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May 21, 2021 17:21
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ilitarist posted:Right now it's extremely weird to me that religion can be only reformed by a secular ruler. Priests are at least represented as owners of temples, but the whole economy outside of feudal subsistence economy is not represented, and thus you don't have merchants or artisans or scholars at all. And in the case of big established empires, it also means no bureaucrats. So adding proper imperial administration kinda means you have to represent whole new classes of society. Well what do you know, they're adding "courts" which include artisans, hunters, scholars and other characters.
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May 21, 2021 19:09
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https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cvid3edWqcg https://www.pcgamesn.com/crusader-kings-3/dlc-royal-court this royal court thing sounds like some VR thing? the culture merger/splitting/hybridization sounds cool tho
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May 21, 2021 19:09
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That cultural hybridization thing sounds like dynamic melting pots which is amazing.
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May 21, 2021 19:10
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It certainly does sound very interesting, though it sounds like we'll be waiting quite a while to hear details on most of this.
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May 21, 2021 19:12
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Yeah this culture stuff sounds badly needed.quote:The patch also seeks to overhaul the culture mechanics and make them more dynamic, bringing them in line with other features such as religion and dynasties. A new interface will give cultures distinct elements, called ‘traditions’, ‘ethos’, and ‘pillars’, which will define that culture. Previously hidden or obfuscated culture-specific mechanics and game content will also be brought under the new system, making them more legible. Seems like they'll be turning culture into something very similar to the religion system. Hopefully it'll allow for blending of Innovations, Turkish and Russian are badly underserved by the current setup (though for Turkish I guess it matters less since they never wind up in Anatolia anyway).
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May 21, 2021 19:23
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