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Didn't he once eat a cannoli filled with dog poo poo on the Real World? I'd go with that.
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May 26, 2021 13:22
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CopywrightMMXI posted:Inspired by the Dumb wrestling opinions thread - what are the best Miz matches? Not including MitB or other clusterfuck matches I can really only recall his one match with Daniel Bryan from 2010 or 2011 being really great. I think there was a match with Ziggler at one point too that people raved about. Anything else stand out? The Ziggler match was No Mercy 2016 and iirc was very good. Other than that he had a really hot intercontinental title match against Seth Rollins at Backlash 2018
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May 26, 2021 13:38
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Wasn't the match where he pinned Roman good?
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May 26, 2021 13:54
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NikkolasKing posted:is Wrestling With Shadows good and worth a watch? Also, Paul Jay has it up for free on YouTube! https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=L3wZhA5s3kI
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May 26, 2021 18:23
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CopywrightMMXI posted:Inspired by the Dumb wrestling opinions thread - what are the best Miz matches? Not including MitB or other clusterfuck matches I can really only recall his one match with Daniel Bryan from 2010 or 2011 being really great. I think there was a match with Ziggler at one point too that people raved about. Anything else stand out? There is a match he had with wade barret from a random raw that was actually pretty drat good
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May 26, 2021 18:49
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Ringo Roadagain posted:There is a match he had with wade barret from a random raw that was actually pretty drat good Wasn't it Miz's fault that Barrett had to save a dive to nowhere and ended up getting injured
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May 26, 2021 18:53
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El Gallinero Gros posted:Wasn't it Miz's fault that Barrett had to save a dive to nowhere and ended up getting injured Wasn’t in this match. There is a hosed up neckbreaker spot though. Still a much better match than I expect from the miz
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May 26, 2021 19:12
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davidbix posted:Yes, as long as you understand that, for some reason, Paul Jay made the decision to frame it as if Montreal was being PLANNED as Bret's last night in the WWF even though it wasn't the case. I've long wondered how people feel about Montreal: 1. Did it essentially destroy Bret's career? 2. How did it change the industry? 3. Does Vince become the biggest villain in history as a result of this event, or would that have happened anyway? 4. Did any of the (planned) repeats mean anything?
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May 26, 2021 19:48
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El Gallinero Gros posted:Wasn't it Miz's fault that Barrett had to save a dive to nowhere and ended up getting injured Wasn’t that injury part of a hastily put together battle royal that ended up with half the participants hurt in some way?
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May 26, 2021 19:50
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El Gallinero Gros posted:Wasn't it Miz's fault that Barrett had to save a dive to nowhere and ended up getting injured If it's the one I'm thinking of, then I guess he was the guy that got hiffed out the ring by the Big Show. I'm not sure you can really blame Miz for that.
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May 26, 2021 20:10
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Kurt Angle Shield versus Assorted Bad Guys was pretty great, and Miz was basically the heels' ringleader throughout and took the endgame finisher spam
D.N. Nation fucked around with this message at 20:15 on May 26, 2021 |
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May 26, 2021 20:13
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Red posted:I've long wondered how people feel about Montreal: 1) As far as I understand it, the screwjob itself didn't hurt Bret's career too much, other than it making sure he'd stay in WCW. The only thing that really destroyed his career was WCW being a mess and tragedies happening in his life every time he got closer to the top of the card, and that's mostly unrelated. (WCW squandering Bret right after Montreal was bad, but that's just a symptom of WCW being bad at this.) For the rest of those questions, other people are in a better place to answer them.
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May 26, 2021 20:43
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Pope Corky the IX posted:Wasn’t that injury part of a hastily put together battle royal that ended up with half the participants hurt in some way? Don't remember whether it was hastly put together, but it was a 10-men battle royal on Raw in February 2012. Big Show gorilla-pressed Ziggler to the outside, but used too much force and Ziggler overshot Truth, crashed down on Barretts arm and still hit his head on the announce table. As bad as the injury was for Barrett, if he wasn't in the way it looked like Ziggler would have hit the edge of announcer table chin- or throat-first, which could have been an even worse injury. And then of course, a minute or so late Cody (of Stardust fame) had to throw out Santino and for whatever reason threw him over the same side towards the announcer table and Santino landed right on Barrett's arm, further worsening the injury. Don't remember what the other injuries were on that show (I think Dolph actually got a concussion in a dark match after that show rather than during this match), but it was massively hosed up for Wade.
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May 26, 2021 20:45
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Red posted:I've long wondered how people feel about Montreal: IMO 1. No. Bret SHOULD have been able to capitalize on this in WCW, but WCW was WCW. WCW hurt his career more than Montreal did, because he should have been coming off of it hot. 2. I think it propelled Vince into the spotlight more than he already was, probably at a faster rate, but I don't think much else changed. They were already doing worked-shooty kind of stuff with Bret and Shawn leading up to this, plus the rise of Austin. 3. Yes. He was already starting to lean into the "I'm the boss, and Steve Austin needs to listen to me and calm down" stuff if I'm remembering correctly. Austin was well on his way to beating up authority figures and all that, so Vince would have been the natural progression. 4. All of the Montreal callbacks have sucked.
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May 26, 2021 21:38
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Ganso Bomb posted:IMO With the benefit of hindsight, I don't hate the Rock/Mick one. But the rest are pointless navel gazing.
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May 26, 2021 21:53
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I don't mind the Punk one, but that's because they explicitly subverted it by having Cena stop Vince from ringing the bell.
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May 26, 2021 21:55
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Gaz-L posted:I don't mind the Punk one, but that's because they explicitly subverted it by having Cena stop Vince from ringing the bell. One of the few times Cena has looked like a moron, too.
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May 26, 2021 22:01
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My favorite is the version of Montreal where Raven put Captain Nice in the Sharpshooter and the betrayal caused Jesse Ventura to quit wrestling and go into politics.
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May 26, 2021 22:02
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This isn't a recreation of it, but that time Shawn said he invited Bret to come back and bury the hatchet, played his music, waited a few minutes, and then was like "lol pranked" was a nuclear heel move.
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May 27, 2021 01:32
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sticklefifer posted:This isn't a recreation of it, but that time Shawn said he invited Bret to come back and bury the hatchet, played his music, waited a few minutes, and then was like "lol pranked" was a nuclear heel move. This reminds me of a time when we went to see RAW in Montreal in college. There was a commercial break so everyone went to the bathroom and concessions and then out of nowhere, Bret's music started to play and everyone ran back toward the arena like crazy people, myself included. It was an ad for a CD or DVD or some bullshit.
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May 27, 2021 01:59
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Red posted:I've long wondered how people feel about Montreal: For as much as Bret's WCW stint is maligned, he was still a two-time world champ, four-time US champ, and one-time tag champ. Aside from WCW being a clusterfuck, his career was going fine. The actual literal career-ending injury was what ended his career. If that doesn't happen, there's a realistic scenario where he becomes a top guy in TNA or even returns to WWE and has a match with Michaels which brings in a fuckton of money.
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May 27, 2021 04:32
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rujasu posted:For as much as Bret's WCW stint is maligned, he was still a two-time world champ, four-time US champ, and one-time tag champ. Aside from WCW being a clusterfuck, his career was going fine. The actual literal career-ending injury was what ended his career. If that doesn't happen, there's a realistic scenario where he becomes a top guy in TNA or even returns to WWE and has a match with Michaels which brings in a fuckton of money. It really wasn't going fine. They completely wrecked his momentum after the Flair feud. But he was huge coming into WCW, his match with Flair was big business. But the turns and getting shoved into the midcard really, really hurt him. He went from a difference maker to a guy very quickly and listing off his title runs, especially "being a two time champ" really completely misses the point. Look at the two reigns! Would he have still had some residual value? Sure, but Bret was probably on his last contract and was getting incredibly disillusioned with wrestling. Montreal made him a bigger star than ever before and WCW wasted it. He was very entertaining during his severe groin injury phase, but the guy was completely wasted.
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May 27, 2021 04:36
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Lily Catts posted:Roppongi 3K from NJPW too. Okada reading the roppongi 3k photo book is one of my favourite pictures  But yes roppongi 3k is the answer
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May 27, 2021 04:50
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Gavok posted:My favorite is the version of Montreal where Raven put Captain Nice in the Sharpshooter and the betrayal caused Jesse Ventura to quit wrestling and go into politics. lol this is good.
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May 27, 2021 05:03
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It's always worth reiterating that Bret went from the hottest commodity in wrestling, with several pre-made storylines and feuds at any decent booker's disposal, to feuding with the guys from MadTV in the span of less than two years.
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May 27, 2021 06:27
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sticklefifer posted:This isn't a recreation of it, but that time Shawn said he invited Bret to come back and bury the hatchet, played his music, waited a few minutes, and then was like "lol pranked" was a nuclear heel move. Shawn was actually cutting an anti-Hogan promo in Montreal, referenced Bret, and said he'd screw him again given the chance. Perfect timing for the music to hit.
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May 27, 2021 06:31
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Hedgehog Pie posted:It's always worth reiterating that Bret went from the hottest commodity in wrestling, with several pre-made storylines and feuds at any decent booker's disposal, to feuding with the guys from MadTV in the span of less than two years.
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May 27, 2021 06:45
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Yes Bret could show up to our company as the hottest face in the world off the sympathy from getting screwed or, and this is gonna blow your mind... Bret could sort of kind of join the nWo after a few months!
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May 27, 2021 06:54
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anakha posted:Shawn was actually cutting an anti-Hogan promo in Montreal, referenced Bret, and said he'd screw him again given the chance. Perfect timing for the music to hit. Did Bret ever mention what he thought of this, or other instances of it? I end up re-watching this particular one every few years and it's always just crazy how loud...everything about it was.
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May 27, 2021 07:45
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Nick Jr. Face posted:WCW was literally gifted a layup and completely bricked it. A lot of people (including my teenaged self) thought the screwjob was the beginning of the end of the WWF. I thought the same, on both counts. Nowadays, though, looking back, I wonder if the screwjob ruined Bret's reputation as a top guy. Bret debuted on a Nitro as the announced special referee for a stupid Bischoff/Larry match, and the crowd cheered, but it wasn't huge. Bret had some creative control at WCW, so he could've vetoed or changed some of the stuff he was handed, but then, he was limited by his no-compete clause. Bret never seemed like a big deal, even when involved with Goldberg or another top name.
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May 27, 2021 14:28
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TheKingslayer posted:Yes Bret could show up to our company as the hottest face in the world off the sympathy from getting screwed or, and this is gonna blow your mind... Bret could sort of kind of join the nWo after a few months! If it weren't such a terrible idea over all, suddenly one starts to see the argument for creative control in a wrestler's contract. I'm not sure that would occur to Bret, though, I admittedly haven't read his book so maybe he talks about thinking it and deciding not to, I don't know.
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May 27, 2021 14:38
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Red posted:Nowadays, though, looking back, I wonder if the screwjob ruined Bret's reputation as a top guy. Bret debuted on a Nitro as the announced special referee for a stupid Bischoff/Larry match, and the crowd cheered, but it wasn't huge. Bret had some creative control at WCW, so he could've vetoed or changed some of the stuff he was handed, but then, he was limited by his no-compete clause. Bret never seemed like a big deal, even when involved with Goldberg or another top name.
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May 27, 2021 15:07
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Was DDT Digest the leading unoffical WCW website when it was all happening or just the biggest that survives to this day?
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May 27, 2021 15:12
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Am I right in thinking that Bret also broke or at least fractured his wrist when he punched Vince in Montreal? If so, that coupled with the no-compete clause certainly didn't help things, but the all-too-brief "dream feud" with Flair was still fun enough when it finally happened. It was definitely all down to WCW after that.
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May 27, 2021 15:21
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Halloween Jack posted:I remember when he did the program with Goldberg and he said he'd been "handfed" opponents, and they had that match where they spent part of it in the corner with Bret trying to wrench Goldberg's knee. I remember thinking it all seemed very real at the time. But I was a weird kid who never liked Hogan or Goldberg and was a mark for the vanilla midgets. Bret's best WCW moment was tricking Goldberg with the steel plate. Aside from the silliness of the El Dandy thing Hedgehog Pie posted:Am I right in thinking that Bret also broke or at least fractured his wrist when he punched Vince in Montreal? If so, that coupled with the no-compete clause certainly didn't help things, but the all-too-brief "dream feud" with Flair was still fun enough when it finally happened. It was definitely all down to WCW after that. I think it was cut short because they didn't especially like each other El Gallinero Gros fucked around with this message at 15:25 on May 27, 2021 |
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May 27, 2021 15:22
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CM Punk just RT'd this: https://twitter.com/Super70sSports/status/1397718041732038658 Unselfish? I think back to 1996, and I know Undertaker/Diesel were angry with Bret about the finish to the cage match, which ended up convincing Nash it was time to leave. Bret's match with Undertaker at the Royal Rumble was, well, boring; he'd probably gotten the news he was dropping the belt to Shawn soon, and, apparently, just stopped giving a poo poo. Bret could pull great matches out of everyone, and then he had the whatever-fest with UT at RR96, then the bad cage match with Diesel a month later (his previous matches with Diesel were all at least good, and the Survivor Series one was amazing). After dropping the belt to Shawn, he up and disappeared for 6-7 months. Was it a break, a chance to renegotiate with Vince, or was he really considering retirement?
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May 27, 2021 17:20
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Red posted:CM Punk just RT'd this: According to his book, he wasn't chuffed about needing Diesel's help to beat Taker and Taker's help to beat Diesel later, plus he had been going pretty non-stop since he'd started with the company. And yes, his contract was up. He was fully expecting to come back to a rematch with Shawn at WM 13. If you want a fun example of him being dismissive, read his summary of the Patriot feud.
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May 27, 2021 17:39
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Everything I've ever read about Bret makes me believe that he would've dropped the belt after Survivor Series, that he was being truthful about not wanting to drop it in Montreal. I have to wonder, if he had stayed, what his career in the Attitude Era would've been like.
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May 27, 2021 18:22
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Admiral Joeslop posted:Everything I've ever read about Bret makes me believe that he would've dropped the belt after Survivor Series, that he was being truthful about not wanting to drop it in Montreal. “Commissioner Bret” Or he’d quit/jump to WCW upon Owen’s death (assuming the rest of the timeline is unchanged).
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May 27, 2021 18:26
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My favourite Montreal reference was HBK putting Benoit in the Sharpshooter in Edmonton while the first ref has been KO'd. Earl Hebner runs out as a replacement and teases calling for the bell and the crowd go absolutely crazy thinking he's going to screw another beloved Canadian world champion out of the title. Hebner calls it straight, Benoit escapes the hold and wins by submitting Michaels in the Sharpshooter. WWE was in full apology mode to Canada that night.
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May 27, 2021 19:30
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