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I don't really know what people are trying to point out. Of course cases are going to go up in the UK, people have been freely gathering pretty much for weeks even though the true rubberstamped "Open 'er up" isn't until the 21st. It shouldn't even slightly be a surprise to anyone. Deaths will rise as well, in due course. The only question of merit is whether the amount of deaths will fall within acceptable bounds and be more or less controlled, or whether letting things go hogwild could actually cause a meaningful spike in serious hospitalisations and deaths or potentially foment some kind of variant that undermines the protection that vaccination currently affords. I know the idea of an 'acceptable' level of deaths is probably one that will rankle with some, but them's the breaks in public health. e:  continuing the meltdown for a new page
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Jun 8, 2021 23:24
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Jeza posted:The only question of merit is whether the amount of deaths will fall within acceptable bounds and be more or less controlled, or whether letting things go hogwild could actually cause a meaningful spike in serious hospitalisations and deaths or potentially foment some kind of variant that undermines the protection that vaccination currently affords. To most of the world I think it seems incredibly foolish to squander the reduction in active cases, or undercut the usefulness of your vaccinations - the US/UK have such lead of fully vaxx'd people. Literally the envy of the world. Letting a variant that significantly reduces efficacy of your most common vaccine rip through a mixed population of partially, fully, and unvaccinated people is practically begging for a new variant with improved evasion. The rest of the world may never get to catch up if that happens, and to run that risk for the sake of learnincurves doorknob licking desires seems .. incredibly short sighted. Perhaps that's just me, in a country where relatively few people have had their second shot, and where case counts are very slow to drop, despite good adherence to NPI and climbing vaccination numbers.
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Jun 8, 2021 23:46
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Jeza posted:I know the idea of an 'acceptable' level of deaths is probably one that will rankle with some, but them's the breaks in public health. I'm going to be burying people from this fuckin' thing forever.
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Jun 8, 2021 23:52
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Something that folks like our recently-probated friend are either overlooking or willfully ignoring is that this is a disease with widespread consequences for the people it infects that don't require hospitalizations, and can occur even for asymptomatic infections. Exponential case growth even without it being a leading indicator of hospitalizations down the line is still a bad thing and a sign that the situation is worsening and needs to be taken seriously, not doomposting, unless you don't believe in long COVID and the other ills we've seen in the aftermath of a "mild" or asymptomatic infection.
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Jun 9, 2021 00:12
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Fluffy Bunnies posted:I'm going to be burying people from this fuckin' thing forever. I mean, yeah. It’s been obvious this was going to hang around forever since like April 2020.
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Jun 9, 2021 00:29
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Kestral posted:Something that folks like our recently-probated friend are either overlooking or willfully ignoring is that this is a disease with widespread consequences for the people it infects that don't require hospitalizations, and can occur even for asymptomatic infections. Exponential case growth even without it being a leading indicator of hospitalizations down the line is still a bad thing and a sign that the situation is worsening and needs to be taken seriously, not doomposting, unless you don't believe in long COVID and the other ills we've seen in the aftermath of a "mild" or asymptomatic infection. This.
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Jun 9, 2021 01:20
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I'd be interested in seeing examinations on cases where the person was vaccinated, never hospitalized and asymptomatic yet has long covid symptoms anyway. Is that a thing yet?
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Jun 9, 2021 02:00
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I’d be more worried about all the unvaccinated children and those who have only been able to have 1 jab yet as they are the ones more likely to catch Covid in the UK right now.
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Jun 9, 2021 02:31
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KakerMix posted:I'd be interested in seeing examinations on cases where the person was vaccinated, never hospitalized and asymptomatic yet has long covid symptoms anyway. Is that a thing yet? If there's been a case of asymptomatic COVID causing long term health consequences I haven't seen it. How would you even capture that data without blanket testing.
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Jun 9, 2021 02:32
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Helith posted:I’d be more worried about all the unvaccinated children and those who have only been able to have 1 jab yet as they are the ones more likely to catch Covid in the UK right now. The official UK dashboard shows that 40,573,517 people have received one or more doses (roughly 60.8% of the total population) so there's still something like 26 million people in the UK who are currently unvaccinated. That's more than the entire population of Australia!
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Jun 9, 2021 02:50
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Something the glass-half-empty crew misses too is the fact that pretty much everyone said this isn't going anywhere quickly, and you might just have to accept this is a danger of leaving your home. There's a lot of dangers that can leave lasting damage from leaving your home. Lyme disease from ticks, the plague, cancer from exposure to chemicals and other things. At some point you'll just have to accept a level of risk needed to exist. It's not like you're likely to be eaten by a lion. And if you are, I would bet covid is not high on the list of everyday worries. And other diseases and stuff. They didn't go anywhere.
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Jun 9, 2021 02:53
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Another Bill posted:If there's been a case of asymptomatic COVID causing long term health consequences I haven't seen it. How would you even capture that data without blanket testing. I bring this up because of comments like these: Kestral posted:Something that folks like our recently-probated friend are either overlooking or willfully ignoring is that this is a disease with widespread consequences for the people it infects that don't require hospitalizations, and can occur even for asymptomatic infections. Exponential case growth even without it being a leading indicator of hospitalizations down the line is still a bad thing and a sign that the situation is worsening and needs to be taken seriously, not doomposting, unless you don't believe in long COVID and the other ills we've seen in the aftermath of a "mild" or asymptomatic infection. Specifically calling out how even asymptomatic COVID infections cause long term health "consequences". I have not heard of asymptomatic yet long covid effects ever, so if there is something to be seen there I'd love to see it. This reads, to my ignorant eyes, as doom posting in its most insidious form. Good intentions mixed with probably sounding things that don't make much sense when thought about. IS there such a thing as no-symptom covid yet now I have bad balls?
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Jun 9, 2021 03:04
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KakerMix posted:IS there such a thing as no-symptom covid yet now I have bad balls? I personally know at least half a dozen people who were asymptomatic positive. Their balls are uniformly awful. Just terrible. The worst balls.
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Jun 9, 2021 03:19
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KakerMix posted:I bring this up because of comments like these: "Post-COVID syndrome severely damages children's hearts: 'Immense inflammation' causing cardiac blood vessel dilation -- ScienceDaily" https://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2020/09/200904125111.htm
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Jun 9, 2021 03:23
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Submarine Sandpaper posted:"Post-COVID syndrome severely damages children's hearts: 'Immense inflammation' causing cardiac blood vessel dilation -- ScienceDaily" https://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2020/09/200904125111.htm Yeah, this is definitely bad news. Does anyone have access to the actual study? All of the summaries I've found mention that this can happen with asymptomatic Covid infection, but I can't find the actual numbers on what percentage of MIS-C cases were linked to asymptomatic Covid, or how/when the Covid diagnosis was made.
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Jun 9, 2021 03:32
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learnincurve posted:This thread, in general, was 100% telling people not to get AZ, and gleefully telling people how it’s rollout in their country was paused and how it wasn’t as effective while actual virologists were screaming about how the trials were done at the peak and you needed to adjust to reflect that. You're entitled to your opinion about other people's posts but straight up lying about them to give yourself an excuse for yet another meltdown is incredibly lovely. I've been urging people to get AZ instead of waiting for months and months Snowglobe of Doom posted:The best vaccine is the one that's in your arm right now. Snowglobe of Doom posted:If I was offered AZ today I'd definitely take it. Snowglobe of Doom posted:Here in Australia we're saving Pfizer for the under 50s and giving everyone 50+ AZ because of the clotting issue but the current outbreak in Melbourne is 100% India variant so I'm seeing a lot of older people showing vaxx hesitancy on social media because they'd really really prefer Pfizer and not AZ, which I guess is understandable. Again, some real lovely luck on how it's all unfolded. But 60% protection is still WAY better than 0% protection, the government really needs to start leaning on that messaging Snowglobe of Doom posted:Get vaxxed as soon as you can, make sure your family gets vaxxed as soon as they can Etc etc etc
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Jun 9, 2021 03:53
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satanic splash-back posted:Something the glass-half-empty crew misses too is the fact that pretty much everyone said this isn't going anywhere quickly, and you might just have to accept this is a danger of leaving your home. There's a lot of dangers that can leave lasting damage from leaving your home. Lyme disease from ticks, the plague, cancer from exposure to chemicals and other things. we have eliminated a shitload of diseases with attitudes that are the opposite of this and we could do the same with covid.
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Jun 9, 2021 03:58
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Fluffy Bunnies posted:we have eliminated a shitload of diseases with attitudes that are the opposite of this and we could do the same with covid. Satanic splash-back could stand to read the audience better, but I think there’s the kernel of a point there. We, as a society, should not accept the threat of coronavirus hanging over our heads. We, as individuals, are forced to. I wear a good mask, but I am under no illusion that I can dodge the virus forever. Society is allowing it to go endemic, and chances are high that sooner or later my immune system will be tested against it. I’m not rushing down to Denny’s to get it over with, but I have accepted that some day an encounter will happen. There’s a ninety‐five percent chance I won’t notice when it does.
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Jun 9, 2021 04:30
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satanic splash-back posted:Something the glass-half-empty crew misses too is the fact that pretty much everyone said this isn't going anywhere quickly, and you might just have to accept this is a danger of leaving your home. There's a lot of dangers that can leave lasting damage from leaving your home. Lyme disease from ticks, the plague, cancer from exposure to chemicals and other things. Exactly. I'm trying to be a beacon of hope here. Driving your car is more dangerous if you are fully vaxed in the US and under what 70? 75?
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Jun 9, 2021 04:41
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Spinz posted:Driving your car is more dangerous if you are fully vaxed in the US and under what 70? 75? Car crashes aren't contagious, if you get into a minor fender bender and scratch your bumper that won't set off a chain of events that might directly cause your grandma to flip her car 20 times and explode into flames
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Jun 9, 2021 04:47
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Snowglobe of Doom posted:Car crashes aren't contagious, if you get into a minor fender bender and scratch your bumper that won't set off a chain of events that might directly cause your grandma to flip her car 20 times and explode into flames I hope that I'm more likely to kill a grandma with my car than pass covid on. I'm not sure what the odds are rn. Funny thing is is I wear my half mask respirator inside stores because eh why not I own it. And I'm more optimistic than many of you in here
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Jun 9, 2021 04:52
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satanic splash-back posted:And other diseases and stuff. They didn't go anywhere.  two strains of the common flu may have died because *gasp* people wore masks during flu season.https://gizmodo.com/the-pandemic-might-have-killed-off-some-flu-strains-for-1847033924
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Jun 9, 2021 05:09
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Hey remember that pharmacist in Wisconsin who deliberately left 500 doses of vaccine out of the freezer overnight so they'd spoil last December? https://twitter.com/CBS58/status/1402295177117589506
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Jun 9, 2021 05:09
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Should have gotten three life sentences, IMO.
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Jun 9, 2021 05:15
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Snowglobe of Doom posted:Hey remember that pharmacist in Wisconsin who deliberately left 500 doses of vaccine out of the freezer overnight so they'd spoil last December? Direct article link: https://cbs58.com/news/former-wisconsin-pharmacist-who-tampered-with-covid-vaccines-sentenced-to-3-years-in-federal-prison
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Jun 9, 2021 05:33
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Spinz posted:I hope that I'm more likely to kill a grandma with my car than pass covid on. I'm not sure what the odds are rn. The odds of you personally passing it on? Probably extremely small, not zero but still fairly close to zero. The odds of tens of thousands of people in the same situation as you across the nation passing it on, if they all had the same attitude as you? Pretty high. This "At some point you'll just have to accept a level of risk" bullshit is the Tragedy Of The Commons where everyone comes up with personal excuses to perform actions which have very small chances of bad outcomes for themselves, but when you spread out those actions across the entire population it directly leads to large numbers of avoidable death and suffering. Currently 13.6% of the US 65+ cohort have not received a coronavirus vaccine, which is 7.4 million people. Current CFR for that age range is between 3% to 27% so we could potentially see another couple hundred thousand additional deaths from that cohort if the pandemic goes endemic and keeps chugging along in the background, and that's not even taking into account breakthrough cases or variants pushing the CFRs higher. Oh well, people wanna go to Applebees, gonna have to write those off as an acceptable level of deaths. Couldn't be helped. Gotta stay optimistic! 
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Jun 9, 2021 06:14
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Smh This is so nuts. I give up. Grand total of what I do that could add to variant creation: be unmasked outdoors if not in crowds But ok, I'm a bad guy lol
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Jun 9, 2021 06:53
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Spinz posted:Smh LOL You came into the thread to brag about how disassociated you were from the ongoing pandemic and scold the "glass-half-empty crew" who still held a level of ongoing concern, gently caress off with that proselytizing.
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Jun 9, 2021 07:16
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I for one am extremely impressed at posters who constantly talk about how not scared of covid they are and just make up poo poo that didn't happen to act like they're the only rational ones
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Jun 9, 2021 07:19
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This thread is very bad.
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Jun 9, 2021 08:11
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We clearly need 2 Covid threads: 1 for optimists and 1 for pessimists.
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Jun 9, 2021 08:13
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Melbourne has been in lockdown since May 27 with restrictions on movement out of the city and all that but that didn't stop a couple from leaving the city on June 1 and spending 4 days traveling through several states until they reached Queensland. You can guess how the rest of this story goes already. https://twitter.com/abcnews/status/1402522501104603138 https://twitter.com/abcnews/status/1402522503180738560 https://www.abc.net.au/news/2021-06-09/queensland-coronavirus-case-sunshine-coast-woman/100201816
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Jun 9, 2021 08:19
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yes not a lot of healthy talk going on at the moment. i think putting anything on individual behavior is fruitless and serves only as a way to make yourself mad and separate yourself from others in your mind. if you will only accept total elimination of the virus - I think it could be possible - you need to focus on government decision making. there will always be hoaxers, people who don't understand that air comes out of their nose as well as their mouth, anti mask convenience martyrs, and just people who cannot mentally live in a state of constant alarm for years on end. If you disagree with those views you waste your energy confronting them because those people do not determine whether covid becomes endemic. this is a political issue. anti maskers will exist whether or not mask mandates exist - but mask mandates will get more people wearing them. anti vax people likewise. the use of political power to guide society through this safely is what is letting you down. we love to individualize problems and treat them like playstation vs xbox because individual argument is easy, but it's clear from this thread that it isn't mentally healthy for a lot of people
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Jun 9, 2021 08:35
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Snowglobe of Doom posted:Melbourne has been in lockdown since May 27 with restrictions on movement out of the city and all that but that didn't stop a couple from leaving the city on June 1 and spending 4 days traveling through several states until they reached Queensland. You can guess how the rest of this story goes already. Oh, it's even better than that. She started having symptoms on 3 June and continued travelling instead of staying put and getting tested where she was.
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Jun 9, 2021 08:37
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Snowglobe of Doom posted:Melbourne has been in lockdown since May 27 with restrictions on movement out of the city and all that but that didn't stop a couple from leaving the city on June 1 and spending 4 days traveling through several states until they reached Queensland. You can guess how the rest of this story goes already. Lolie posted:Oh, it's even better than that. She started having symptoms on 3 June and continued travelling instead of staying put and getting tested where she was. I know that it’s not true that the virus causes behavioral changes, compelling victims to spread it far and wide, but you gotta admit that it makes a good story.
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Jun 9, 2021 08:41
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Lolie posted:Oh, it's even better than that. She started having symptoms on 3 June and continued travelling instead of staying put and getting tested where she was. I swear one of the main symptoms of covid is the urge to travel long distances. Back when we were in full lockdown one of our mps tested positive in London so the first thing she did was catch a train back to Scotland. https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-scotland-politics-55924053
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Jun 9, 2021 09:02
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Snowglobe of Doom posted:Coronavirus bonds to ACE2 receptors and the testicles contain one of the highest ACE2 concentrations in the body so it can really gently caress up yer nuts If covid somehow managed to sterilize all the antivaxxers and chuds this will have probably all been worthwhile.
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Jun 9, 2021 09:54
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Here's some happier UK news:quote:
https://www.theguardian.com/world/2021/jun/09/link-between-covid-cases-and-deaths-has-been-broken-says-senior-nhs-boss This bears out what people were expecting/ hoping to see from the roll-out of the vaccination programme: with all older or medically vulnerable people now double-vaccinated, Covid hospitalisations and deaths among these groups have collapsed, with the remaining hospitalisations being overwhelmingly of younger people, who are much less likely to get sick enough to need ventilators.
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Jun 9, 2021 10:22
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Platystemon posted:I know that it’s not true that the virus causes behavioral changes, compelling victims to spread it far and wide, but you gotta admit that it makes a good story. Holy poo poo a second story just emerged - some people snuck out of Melbourne and flew to New Zealand and tried to evade quarantine so they could go to a funeral. So far they've tested negative. quote:Three Melbourne residents have been caught trying to get into New Zealand during Victoria's coronavirus lockdown. 
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Jun 9, 2021 10:53
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Snowglobe of Doom posted:Holy poo poo a second story just emerged - some people snuck out of Melbourne and flew to New Zealand and tried to evade quarantine so they could go to a funeral. So far they've tested negative. See, this is the control group. People do incredibly reckless poo poo like all the time. It doesn’t take a special disease to make them do it.
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Jun 9, 2021 11:01
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