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I was late jumping into FM21 but the match engine has turned out to be... really impressive actually, by FM standards. It even vaguely resembles actual football once in a while. Or put it this way: FM21 is the first version ever that you can't just download a cheat tactic and pancake everything without even trying.
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Jun 12, 2021 20:23
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20 was hot garbage, 21 is actually good. The only one where they didn't patch out the fun during the beta. The messy, congested first seasons are a nice novelty as well, although they do make it pretty easy because lol at the ai managing player fitness.
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Jun 12, 2021 21:01
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I've been starting unemployed and simming through the first year before looking for a job for years. Does anyone have any idea what if anything the new PPMs do? I migrated straight from 2018. A quick googling suggests they probably don't do anything, like most PPMs. The only PPM I ever really tried to train my guys on was Plays One-Twos, almost everything else is just tactical instructions, and Places Shots makes a player unable to ever convert a penalty. The AI loves to put Runs With Ball Down [whatever] and Likes To Switch Ball To Other Flank on every player it can, I assume that was a janky duct taping of something in the match engine.
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Jun 12, 2021 22:02
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I now have Newmarket Town in Tier 7, just one more promotion and we can jam in the Bananarama divisions!  The monster striker I swiped off a rival seems to have plateaued skillwise but that hasn't stopped him from scoring 20+ every season. Sadly the Faro kid didn't develop at all so I let him walk. Also we got sold, but the new guy hasn't been any different other than taking out a loan with repayments we can easily manage once we actually start getting revenues in.
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Jun 12, 2021 23:04
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Eric the Mauve posted:I've been starting unemployed and simming through the first year before looking for a job for years. The AI uses PPMs to paper over its own tactical inadequacies - it jams players into systems without really being able to analyse what they're good at and give individual player (or opposition) instruction, so the PPM training just adds another layer to basic role instructions they're assigned. Player good at running with ball = run with ball PPM, so now whenever he's in the team he'll try to run with the ball more, even if he's in a role without that instruction locked in. They're also obviously used by researchers to (in theory) make real players play in a recognisable way. I don't see much value in teaching players to limit their game at the cost of other training time. There's only a few that I feel create observable positive effects in the match engine. Brings Ball Out Of Defence has been great for low vision centre halves who would otherwise panic and clear the ball for no reason. They don't have to go far, just by moving 5 yards or so options will open up in a good system. Tries One-Twos has a weirdly high Passing threshold to learn, when the action is about playing a simple ball and then making an ambitious run. If a player is really bad or good at something instructions are fine. If the option isn't available for their position then the PPM rarely has much impact on the match engine performance.
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Jun 12, 2021 23:50
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I received '20 on an Epic 'free transfer', but I've heard nothing but bad things about it, here and elsewhere, and nothing but much better things about '21. I'm hoping that is also an Epic free game sometime, but then '22 will probably be even better while handing out cherry tarts and cuddling orphans.NutShellBill posted:Taking my smuggled Canadians to Disneyland! Or whatever Weston-super-Mare has. Try Alton Towers
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Jun 13, 2021 00:04
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Yeah if anything you'd think Off the Ball would be the important attribute for Plays One-Twos. Knocks Ball Past Opponent on a player with 15+ Pace/Accel/Agil used to be a cheat code, but anecdotally it feels like that was nerfed in 2021 and I'm not sure whether it does anything anymore. Likes to Round/Likes to Lob Keeper I'm 99% sure are just placebos that don't do anything. I personally enjoy the two times a year a guy with Shoots With Power scores a ridiculous long rage howitzer goal, but mostly they just launch the ball into outer space over and over until you want to strangle them. Places Shots is pretty good but you don't ever want it on a penalty taker--it makes them utterly unable to score penalties (Shoots With Power does, too). I don't believe Dictates Tempo actually does anything. If a player has anything like Stays Back At All Times, Hugs Line, Likes To Switch Ball, Dwells on Ball, Plays Short Simple Passes, etc., and especially Shoots From Distance--gently caress that PPM forever--don't buy them. Not worth the trouble. Pretty much everything else is just stuff that will make them ignore your tactical instructions.
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Jun 13, 2021 00:22
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Won our first Southern League Premier (Central) match, beat Hednesford away 2-1!
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Jun 13, 2021 00:31
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Eric the Mauve posted:Yeah if anything you'd think Off the Ball would be the important attribute for Plays One-Twos. The effectiveness of Places Shots in previous games you can get with a good Decisions attribute this year. You don't need a PPM to tell strikers to put care into placement of simple finishes, but it probably comes in handy if your striker is an idiot. Similar with the other finish types (curls, power), the PPM will influence what might be a good decision towards a worse one more often than it will help if your player knows what they're doing. Dictates Tempo is supposed to encourage a player to move into space to receive the ball, and carry a playmaker effect where others are more willing to give it to him. But if you play with an actual playmaker, or that player is the playmaker, you likely won't see anything happen. Some PPMs are supposed to be additive to their instruction but ymmv. A lot of players in the database have PPMs that aren't necessary as they only do things their roles will already instruct, and so look like they don't do anything. So many fullbacks have "gets further forward" when they're going to be told to do that in game and in real life, it's not really a tendency of the player or something special you will notice in the match engine. PPMs are supposed to be used for odd quirks that won't be covered in standard instructions - the winger who dribbles rarely, or the all-action fullback who doesn't dive into tackles (both of these are Connor Roberts).
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Jun 13, 2021 13:37
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Dives Into Tackles is definitely one PPM that works as advertised, any player with that one will be a red card machine.
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Jun 13, 2021 13:46
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sassassin posted:20 was hot garbage, 21 is actually good. The only one where they didn't patch out the fun during the beta. Cheers, I ended up getting a nice save going in 2020 going from Vanarama to European Cup with an incredible team of regens. The match engine always feels a bit more reasonable at higher level than in the dregs of the lower leagues. I think the thing that put me off this version was that the "new features" were incredibly lacklustre. A layer of ambiguity over the existing options for Calm/Passionate/Aggressive and some fairly useless additional match stats. The match engine being fun is probably the big selling point, thanks.
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Jun 13, 2021 20:35
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Realised there is a limited length demo version on Steam and decided to give it a go. I'm not entirely convinced... https://i.imgur.com/Krh2IFp.gifv
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Jun 14, 2021 18:16
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So, thread, are there any actually good Football Manager video LPs on Youtube to be found? Like, that do interesting things with the game and explain what they're doing and why? All I've ever turned up is fanbros and, ah, uneven attempts at humor.
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Jun 16, 2021 16:48
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SecondYellowCard and JDFM are the only two I watch regularly
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Jun 16, 2021 16:55
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Lollujo is pretty good I reckon
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Jun 16, 2021 17:12
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Eric the Mauve posted:So, thread, are there any actually good Football Manager video LPs on Youtube to be found? Like, that do interesting things with the game and explain what they're doing and why? All I've ever turned up is fanbros and, ah, uneven attempts at humor. I remember secondyellowcard doing a Huecsa LP where he played the whole season game by game. I think it was FM20 or FM19. Anyway he actually would go through his whole prematch tactical set up, what he was doing and why he set it up the way he did. I remember it because it is so rare to actually see that. He's just trying not to get relegated from La Liga. Here it is: https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLoDys3MrOSf1oh8CFaW3lgLhniyC4pVkI
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Jun 16, 2021 19:16
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AlbertFlasher posted:I remember secondyellowcard doing a Huecsa LP where he played the whole season game by game. I think it was FM20 or FM19. Anyway he actually would go through his whole prematch tactical set up, what he was doing and why he set it up the way he did. I remember it because it is so rare to actually see that. He's just trying not to get relegated from La Liga. I have in the back of my head an idea to do a real-time LP of Football Manager, one day per day. A very niche set of weirdos might be into it.
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Jun 16, 2021 22:58
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I've had SecondYellowCard on in the background a good bit while working, building a nation is something I find interesting but I couldn't even be bothered to do it when I was a student, let alone now. He's much less in-depth now due to the nature of the challenge but usually thinks aloud when making changes also helps that he's chipper even when losing big games. Used to watch LooneyHoon but he was too aggy when he lost, last time I watched he pulled off an amazing comeback but didn't celebrate because he was still sulking about going 2-0 down. If I wanted to watch someone sulking about every setback I'd just stream myself.
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Jun 16, 2021 23:01
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SYC also streams on twitch a few days a week and is doing building a nation there with Norway. The streams are posted to YouTube on the StraightRedCard channel. By it's nature you'll see everything going on in a live stream Currently 80 4 hour vods up if you want to see the rise of Tromsø Idrettslag and have 15 days to kill
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Jun 16, 2021 23:18
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sebzilla posted:I have in the back of my head an idea to do a real-time LP of Football Manager, one day per day. A very niche set of weirdos might be into it. This weirdo would be. Edit: Previous post reminded me, though, that I don't really like video LPs. I can read screenshot LPs for hours and hours, but video ones just don't hold my attention. No idea why.
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Jun 17, 2021 01:13
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sebzilla posted:I have in the back of my head an idea to do a real-time LP of Football Manager, one day per day. A very niche set of weirdos might be into it. Well Grey Hunter LP'd a WW2 Pacific theatre simulator day by day and people got into it. The problem with FM is that there's just so many days with little or nothing going on, maybe 2 per week might work?
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Jun 17, 2021 07:31
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Day 323, still haven't heard back from the scout I sent to observe the third tier of Mongolian football
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Jun 17, 2021 09:07
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Azhais posted:Day 323, still haven't heard back from the scout I sent to observe the third tier of Mongolian football I had a scout in South America for about 5 seasons who never recommended me anyone. After a couple of seasons I left him to it because I respected his hustle just texting the club 'nah no footballers yet, send more money for uhh scouting materials' while sat in a cafe in Buenos Aires
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Jun 17, 2021 09:16
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sebzilla posted:I have in the back of my head an idea to do a real-time LP of Football Manager, one day per day. A very niche set of weirdos might be into it. I seem to remember someone on the official FM forums was doing a real time Man Utd LP so there probably is a market for it.
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Jun 17, 2021 14:51
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Lemon posted:Lollujo is pretty good I reckon Lollujo, DoctorBenjyFM and Zealand are the 3 FM content creators I like.
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Jun 17, 2021 18:41
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Random question from watching the euros - does the weather have a noticeable effect on your players' performance? If I'm trying to play bielsaball and press all over the pitch in 35 degree heat is it less effective or result in increased fatigue or risk of injury? Ditto trying to do short passes in torrential rain on a soggy pitch
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Jun 19, 2021 15:36
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There's been an ingame tip for years that says possession football doesn't work in the rain and you should try direct football instead, so I assume either there is no effect or it's the opposite and you should play tiki-taka in bad weather. My personal experience suggests probably no effect.
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Jun 19, 2021 15:42
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Here's one thing I really appreciate about the FM team's attention to detail: for many years the game's tracking of just about every promise you could make was bugged all to hell and would force you to auto-fail and piss off your players. You'd have to work around that by never promising anyone anything. But now that exploit has been closed: your players will now get pissed off for refusing to make any promises. You now have the freedom to choose if you'd rather your player get pissed off now by not making promises, or later by making promises and auto-failing them because of the buggy code. Either way, the difficulty-enhancing auto morale hit is now being delivered as intended. Well done, SI!
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Jun 19, 2021 16:56
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the sex ghost posted:Random question from watching the euros - does the weather have a noticeable effect on your players' performance? If I'm trying to play bielsaball and press all over the pitch in 35 degree heat is it less effective or result in increased fatigue or risk of injury? Ditto trying to do short passes in torrential rain on a soggy pitch Not a noticeable difference. Accumulation of fatigue is a bigger and more visible factor now with the move from condition % to values like minutes played and distances covered, but it's not something that needs managing within a specific game, just over a run of games.
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Jun 19, 2021 18:37
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Eric the Mauve posted:Here's one thing I really appreciate about the FM team's attention to detail: for many years the game's tracking of just about every promise you could make was bugged all to hell and would force you to auto-fail and piss off your players. You'd have to work around that by never promising anyone anything. But now that exploit has been closed: your players will now get pissed off for refusing to make any promises. You now have the freedom to choose if you'd rather your player get pissed off now by not making promises, or later by making promises and auto-failing them because of the buggy code. Either way, the difficulty-enhancing auto morale hit is now being delivered as intended. Well done, SI! Have you tried fulfilling your promises? That's what I do. Pissing off players is part of the job, they're children and will generally get over issues in time.
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Jun 19, 2021 18:40
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Of course. Promise to strengthen the squad -> buy several much better players -> "YOU BROKE YOUR PROMISE gently caress YOU SELL ME NOW" because what the game thinks constitutes improvement is opaque and nonsensical. Honestly it's all good because I turn basically the entire squad over every two years as they demand more money and thus can be sold and replaced with cheaper but equally good players. It's the circle of life. In breaking news, my League One team just concluded a six match winning run to clinch the title on the penultimate game by not giving a poo poo and blowing a 2 goal 70th minute lead to lose the last meaningless game. I tore them all a new rear end in a top hat in the team talk and the presser and now they're all pissed and will probably all be sold. I will likely be sacked in 24th place in December and I don't even care. update: the whole team wants ridiculous new contracts--and then when I transfer list them they refuse to leave. 
Eric the Mauve fucked around with this message at 14:40 on Jun 20, 2021 |
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Jun 19, 2021 23:14
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sassassin posted:Have you tried fulfilling your promises? That's what I do. Also the right response when they get pissy can get them to back down. Good luck guessing which one that is, but at least there's a chance! (Seriously if they're going this route they should at least have it look at recent events, like "waaa why haven't you loaned me out?" "Bitch I offered you out 3 times and nobody wants your punk rear end, sit down."
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Jun 21, 2021 04:08
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Eric the Mauve posted:Of course. Promise to strengthen the squad -> buy several much better players -> "YOU BROKE YOUR PROMISE gently caress YOU SELL ME NOW" because what the game thinks constitutes improvement is opaque and nonsensical. Also buy new player with promise to strengthen (position) -> 1 week passes -> WHY HAVEN'T YOU BOUGHT ANYONE YET
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Jun 21, 2021 04:11
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The strengthen a position promises are tricky to fulfil because it's unclear what the player/game thinks strengthening is, and certainly won't map exactly to what a decent manager will have in mind to develop their squad. Others like "I will use young players" are incredibly forgiving and should be used in every preseason meeting for free brownie points. If you make any promises it's important to keep an eye on the promises tab to see how you're getting on and when deadline day will be. The dialogue isn't always clear but the progress bars are. It can be fun to annoy players and see how many of their teammates back them up. If you've built relationships well it'll often be a couple of fringe players you're not fussed about moaning that you're being unfair, and most will back down when challenged.
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Jun 21, 2021 17:34
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Summer update, of the 20 players in the League One title winning squad, 7 of them are still on the team going into Championship opening day. 13 were sold or released, and almost universally replaced with cheaper and better players. (Many of them demanded £7K/week from me and then ended up signing elsewhere for £2K/week or less, well done by those agents.) Still going to struggle to stay up with by far the lowest wage budget in the league.
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Jun 21, 2021 22:07
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I love it when an AI team spends $70m on a player at the start of the transfer window only to have the player unhappy and transfer listed by request when the window closes because they failed to strengthen the team.
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Jun 22, 2021 09:10
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This is my favourite AI transfer I've seen in my save: Simultaneously the most expensive transfer to date (in the save, anyway) and also - arguably - one of the worst in terms of output.
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Jun 22, 2021 17:31
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I sold my good-for-League-One but greedy right back to Swansea and they transfer listed him the very next day 
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Jun 22, 2021 18:34
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Very accurate that Liverpool are still able to get £31m for a garbageman.
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Jun 22, 2021 18:37
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anyone ever have issues with "club spending levels on staff are already high" not letting you hire anyone good? i'm playing a paok game and in 2025 i can't hire any coach over 4* . won four titles and got at least to the group stage of the CL every time, but with this staff thing i'm spending 100 million euros on wonderkids and can't renew my HOYD's contract lol
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Jun 24, 2021 14:39
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