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Vasukhani posted:Well without development there is really no reason to run ovals imo. They should at least reduce the power by another 200 hp. It's a fine series then, like F2 or Super Formula Nah. More power means harder to drive/more difficult to control. The last thing we need is corner speed battles, because 200hp less would be no challenge for the current downforce levels. From memory, the next engine package is expected to have more power.
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Jun 22, 2021 06:41
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Vasukhani posted:Well without development there is really no reason to run ovals imo. They should at least reduce the power by another 200 hp. It's a fine series then, like F2 or Super Formula Da gently caress
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Jun 22, 2021 06:42
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Knock off the wings then, there is no reason to be going 230 if everyone having the same car is the goal.
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Jun 22, 2021 06:46
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The speed (and the risk) is part of the point of watching top level racing for lots of people. That’s what makes it cool. I like slow racing too, and I’ve made peace with never hearing “it’s a new track record” at Indy ever again, but indycar should absolutely not abandon the things that make it cool to be like feeder series it is already (imo) much more entertaining than.
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Jun 22, 2021 06:57
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Vasukhani posted:Knock off the wings then, there is no reason to be going 230 if everyone having the same car is the goal. get thee to the Formula Ford Festival there's still a point to having these cars have wings and ground effect even if everyone has it, that allows for higher speeds which are exciting and a challenge for drivers.
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Jun 22, 2021 10:57
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Cygni posted:The speed (and the risk) is part of the point of watching top level racing for lots of people. That’s what makes it cool. They're talking about another 150-200hp with the 2.4L engine, right? I think we'll hear that again, once, with the new engine on a day where the conditions are absolutely perfect for speed.
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Jun 22, 2021 14:49
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IOwnCalculus posted:They're talking about another 150-200hp with the 2.4L engine, right? They're shooting for 900-950 combined with the hybrid, near the end of the rules cycle. They're increasing displacement as well as boost, and I think adding intercoolers as well to the spec (could be wrong on the IC) I think it's pretty attainable.
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Jun 22, 2021 15:00
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With E85 intercoolers (or a lack thereof) aren't worth a huge amount of power, though it's not as awesome in that regard as methanol was. Hybrid power is also going to be a big question mark at Indy given the total lack of anywhere to recharge it. I could maybe see there being enough energy storage on the car to make one lap a bit quicker but even a full qualifying run might be asking too much.
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Jun 22, 2021 16:23
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anyone else remember the Richmond race in the IR-05 where first and second ran side by side for like a dozen laps because there was literally no development left and they were just running flat out lap after lap an no, we're never going to see another track record at Indy
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Jun 22, 2021 18:21
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That happened because the series used to mandate rear wing angles though, not really anything to do with development. They have roughly the same amount of development now as then (shocks and thats about it really).
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Jun 22, 2021 18:30
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I was at Danica’s first race at Richmond. 
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Jun 22, 2021 18:48
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Proud Christian Mom posted:anyone else remember the Richmond race in the IR-05 where first and second ran side by side for like a dozen laps because there was literally no development left and they were just running flat out lap after lap is this a good race or a bad race?
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Jun 22, 2021 19:08
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Cygni posted:That happened because the series used to mandate rear wing angles though, not really anything to do with development. They have roughly the same amount of development now as then (shocks and thats about it really). That combined with the fact that "fast" was also "easy". So driver skill / comfort couldn't spread the field out either. On the current aerokit and the allowable aero parts / settings, fast is also evil.
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Jun 22, 2021 19:36
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Vasukhani posted:is this a good race or a bad race? Extremely bad though the IRL fans liked to call this the best racing on earth because hey it's side by side
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Jun 22, 2021 20:34
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You could tell an IRL race was gonna be bad in the mandatory AoA era when the fastest way around the track was just running the bottom full throttle 100% of the time even down the straights. I don't mind momentum/drafting racing as much as some of yall, but the true 2x2 pack races were tough to watch sometimes.
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Jun 22, 2021 20:39
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Cygni posted:mo-mo-mentum
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Jun 22, 2021 21:16
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Feels Villeneuve posted:Extremely bad though the IRL fans liked to call this the best racing on earth because hey it's side by side
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Jun 23, 2021 04:29
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Cygni posted:That happened because the series used to mandate rear wing angles though, not really anything to do with development. They have roughly the same amount of development now as then (shocks and thats about it really). They still do mandate rear wing angles at the superspeedways, but I don't think they do at short ovals, they just limit it by not allowing the upper wing flaps. IOwnCalculus posted:
From what I understand, (based on what Marshall Pruett has said in his podcast) on the superspeedways (as well as maybe the short ovals I guess), there is going to be a different hybrid generation system, he's hinted at it being a MGU-H style system on the turbo, to allow charging at full throttle and max boost, basically taking the energy wasted with the wastegates open and converting that to electricity.
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Jun 23, 2021 05:51
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MazeOfTzeentch posted:From what I understand, (based on what Marshall Pruett has said in his podcast) on the superspeedways (as well as maybe the short ovals I guess), there is going to be a different hybrid generation system, he's hinted at it being a MGU-H style system on the turbo, to allow charging at full throttle and max boost, basically taking the energy wasted with the wastegates open and converting that to electricity. considering they need a hybrid system that can work on ovals, this is a smart idea. I would imagine the next IndyCar only has that MGU-H style system instead of also adding an MGU-K as well, due to weight and packaging. Beyond F1, Porsche's 919 LMP1 car used an MGU-H system on the exhaust. it would also make sense to have the hybrid be captive to the powertrain because I think there's still a chance that there will be a staggered introduction of the new engine and new chassis.
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Jun 23, 2021 08:23
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MazeOfTzeentch posted:They still do mandate rear wing angles at the superspeedways, but I don't think they do at short ovals, they just limit it by not allowing the upper wing flaps. They limit what aero parts you can and can’t run to put the teams in a downforce range, but there is no minimum AoA at the two speedway tracks left. In fact, there is a set maximum. On top of the max AoA, both Texas and Indy have the max downforce parts not allowed. It’s the inverse of the old days. The AoA era was different for a lot of other reasons too that probably are worth leaving in the past. Cygni fucked around with this message at 09:24 on Jun 23, 2021 |
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Jun 23, 2021 09:22
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Cygni posted:They limit what aero parts you can and can’t run to put the teams in a downforce range, but there is no minimum AoA at the two speedway tracks left. In fact, there is a set maximum. On top of the max AoA, both Texas and Indy have the max downforce parts not allowed. It’s the inverse of the old days. Ah okay yeah, I didn't realize you meant they mandated a minimum angle, that's nuts
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Jun 23, 2021 14:54
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Speaking of Superspeedways, why was Texas World Speedway (Not TMS - it's a MIS knockoff) never considered for use for either CART or Indycar prior to it's shutdown? I think it would have been ideal.
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Jun 23, 2021 15:33
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Didn't USAC Indycars run that one? At some point the track owners stopped having money and the track surface became too lovely to race anything fast on, IIRC.
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Jun 23, 2021 15:48
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Jeff Andretti set a speed record testing in the early 90s there, so unless the deterioration was extremely severe in the late 90s/2000s I'm not sure why it was not used. It would be ideal for open wheel cars
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Jun 23, 2021 16:00
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Frond posted:Speaking of Superspeedways, why was Texas World Speedway (Not TMS - it's a MIS knockoff) never considered for use for either CART or Indycar prior to it's shutdown? I think it would have been ideal. it was in an awful location, there was absolutely nothing developed around it and by the time it was repaved in the 1990s the track facilities were pretty obsolete.
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Jun 23, 2021 20:23
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it's really wild that twice as many people tune in for the F1 race on cable at 8 in the morning than the Indycar race on network at noon maybe it is something to do with the exceptionally awful coverage it has
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Jul 4, 2021 19:29
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Indycar coverage needs more drone and boom cameras that convey how awesome the road courses are with elevation changes and whatnot. It blew me away the first time I went to Mid-Ohio, because that poo poo looks absolutely flat on TV. The onboards are great for this too, but I feel like there's room to improve for sure. I also hate the lack of prompt podium celebrations being shown. F1 blows Indycar away in this regard, you could watch Indycar for years and never even know they give 2nd and 3rd place finishers a trophy. The points system isn't highlighted as well as it could be either.
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Jul 5, 2021 21:08
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It also could be the fact that F1 on ESPN has 0 ads during the race. That is pretty much the #1 reason I rarely watch Indycar or Nascar, they are just ad break after ad break. And lets be real F1 just has the biggest following of any race series, even in the US. Also if you have missed it, SRX has been uploading their full race broadcasts to Youtube (Although still with the adbreaks, that are mostly under cautions though), pretty good racing with some of the old indycar drivers. SLICK GOKU BABY fucked around with this message at 22:00 on Jul 5, 2021 |
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Jul 5, 2021 21:56
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Indycar coverage is literally the biggest problem it has now, but no one will address it as it needs NBC to exist.
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Jul 5, 2021 22:01
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Reynold posted:Indycar coverage needs more drone and boom cameras that convey how awesome the road courses are with elevation changes and whatnot. It blew me away the first time I went to Mid-Ohio, because that poo poo looks absolutely flat on TV. The onboards are great for this too, but I feel like there's room to improve for sure. I also hate the lack of prompt podium celebrations being shown. F1 blows Indycar away in this regard, you could watch Indycar for years and never even know they give 2nd and 3rd place finishers a trophy. The points system isn't highlighted as well as it could be either. Grosjean's own personal YouTube has an absolutely amazing helmet cam video that must have been filmed at a test before this past weekend. It's amazing how blind so many of those corners are at the height of an Indycar driver.
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Jul 5, 2021 22:56
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Reynold posted:I also hate the lack of prompt podium celebrations being shown. F1 blows Indycar away in this regard, you could watch Indycar for years and never even know they give 2nd and 3rd place finishers a trophy. The points system isn't highlighted as well as it could be either. - We went to the championship final at Laguna Seca in 2019 and it was pretty surprising how much access we had to that podium! Probably 20 feet away. And I didn’t think about it until you said it, but Indy 500 is the only podium I can remember seeing during televised IndyCar races. - I’ve been watching F1 and Indy since 2019; the former’s point system makes a lot more sense to me, where I couldn’t tell you how many points IndyCar gives out. The live championship updates help with this for F1. - no ads would definitely help, but I also agree that NBC picks the oddest broadcast angles. The MX-5 Cup race at Mid-Ohio gave me a better idea of the track than the IndyCar angles. edit i looked up the points system and … that’s too many points. I feel like NASCAR is to blame for this. Nybble fucked around with this message at 02:31 on Jul 6, 2021 |
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Jul 6, 2021 02:26
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Nybble posted:edit i looked up the points system and … that’s too many points. I feel like NASCAR is to blame for this. You probably shouldn't look up how many points Indycar paid before NASCAR even existed then. It varied based on race distance. First place scaled from 200 points for winning a 100 mile race to 1000 points for winning a 500 mile race. That is not a typo. Picking a random pre-NASCAR season (1948), the champion was Ted Horn with 1880 points to second place Myron Fohr's 1159. Third place was Mauri Rose with 1000 from winning Indy in his only start of the season. It wasn't until CART that the point system was within the same order of magnitude that they are now. Theris fucked around with this message at 04:07 on Jul 6, 2021 |
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Jul 6, 2021 04:00
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oops
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Jul 6, 2021 04:01
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Theris posted:
Now that’s working smarter, not harder.
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Jul 6, 2021 04:22
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Points based on race distance makes some sense if you extrapolate it all the way back to glorified local dirt track racing. If a championship includes a 500 mile superspeedway race and a 50 mile A-main at a dirt track, you'd expect the former to pay out more points than the latter.
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Jul 6, 2021 06:15
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it sounds like Robin Miller is in very rough shape right now, which has been suspected given he hasn't even been doing the Mailbag columns recently.
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Jul 8, 2021 02:11
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Thanks to the Netflix show that I shouldn’t mention in this thread, I’ve really gotten back into racing the last few weeks. Went to the Indy 500 for 10 straight years or so, but tailed off as I got older. Anyone been to the Long Beach Grand Prix? Looking to get tickets for the race in September and wondering where the best vantage points are.
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Jul 10, 2021 23:51
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I've gone twice, I like the seats on the inside of Tecate because if you're up high enough you can see the cars coming down two straights and heading towards the fountain. Also good view of a jumbotron so you can see what else is happening.
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Jul 11, 2021 00:35
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Been to Long Beach more times than i can count, it is one of the best weekend racing experiences you can get anywhere. For race day, I think stands 36 and 40 are the best. I wouldn't buy a stand seat for Saturday. Just spend all day walkin around the track and watching from various angles, checking out the convention center, etc. Also crucially, don't skip Saturday, it is absolutely worth making it a 2 day thing and doing both days.
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Jul 11, 2021 22:33
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ScooterMcTiny posted:Anyone been to the Long Beach Grand Prix? Looking to get tickets for the race in September and wondering where the best vantage points are. A GA ticket is all you really need to see everything and see it well. You're going to be on foot most of the time anyway. But having a reserved ticket is nice because you know you will have a seat for the races and don't have to sweat it. Saturday has literally everything going on, so much so that some years I don't bother coming back on Sunday for the race because I've had my fill at that point. But if it's your first time, you'll want all three days to see everything properly. The best grandstands for Sunday IMO are 40 (turn 1) and 6 (turn 6), since you can see them coming down Shoreline at top speed and two passing zones on opposite sides of each other. There are also two video boards in the area. I always sit in stand 6 for the IMSA race, it's free for GA on Saturday but you'll need to scope out a spot at least an hour in advance. Alternatively, you can have 27-31 for a finish line/pit view, 29 being the best as it's right in front of the video board. I'm not a fan of stands 24-26 after the hairpin exit since you don't get much except a very close view of slow cars. Stand 16-18 at the Turn 10/11 hairpin complex is nice, too. There won't be a lot of passing here but you'll see the cars work going around the left hander into the hairpin. The drift competitions take place at these corners, and you don't need a reserved ticket to go up into the grandstands. IMO this is also the best spot to see Super Stadium trucks because they have a ramp under the crossover bridge between turns 9 and 10 and the trucks will get airborne at an angle! Be sure to visit under the bridge at pit exit at the start of one of the races. It's a natural echo chamber, which is the perfect place to experience the sounds of dozens of shouty race cars going at full song. The underside of the convention center in the middle of the backstretch also has this effect but it's not as pronounced since the cars will be more spread out and not going at top speed. Turn 8 is THE BEST place to check out Indycar practice or qualifying. The plaza for the convention center is elevated. When you're up there you can get a fantastic top-down view of the cockpits and the drivers fighting and twitch-reacting on the steering wheel. It's recommended you get there a little before a session starts to get a spot on the rail, but even if you have to wait you'll still be able to get a good view eventually. The hairpin is best seen on-foot, right up against the outside fence. It's always crowded here, so if you want a nice view you need to get there early before a session begins. I like being here for IMSA practice. You can really appreciate the cars from up close, and also see how well they turn and accelerate. Good photo ops through the fencing, too.
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Jul 12, 2021 01:29
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