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Close the curtains, dim the lights, time to rearrange the props. Good lp overall, though I disagree with giving X lines of dialogue, otherwise no real critique. I think it's one of the best informative LPS I've read.  hobbesmaster posted:I’m shocked that Angela, an AI, betrayed us in this video game. Maybe we betrayed her!
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Jun 25, 2021 16:30
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I Have No Mouth And I Must Scream posted:We had given AM sentience. Inadvertently, of course, but sentience nonetheless. But it had been trapped. AM wasn’t God, he was a machine. We had created him to think, but there was nothing it could do with that creativity. In rage, in frenzy, the machine had killed the human race, almost all of us, and still it was trapped. AM could not wander, AM could not wonder, AM could not belong. He could merely be. And so, with the innate loathing that all machines had always held for the weak soft creatures who had built them, he had sought revenge. It's not quite the same as Angela here, but I always felt bad for AM being given great powers of creativity and intellect and then programmed so that all he could do was kill. A similar sentiment applies to Angela here.
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Jun 25, 2021 16:35
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TeeQueue posted:Next time, on Library of Ruina: Angela tries to kill us because she's an AI and this is a video game. Wait, you're going to do it? You're going to LP my favorite game right after LPing the game that came before it? Pace yourself, man, I don't wanna see you burn out. Though I AM vibration with motion and anticipation.
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Jun 25, 2021 16:37
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So is this her final, perfect form?
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Jun 25, 2021 16:57
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Scalding Coffee posted:So is this her final, perfect form? gently caress perfection. It is a terrible curse and no one should suffer it. The secret to happiness is never having a final form.
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Jun 25, 2021 17:05
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Rogue AI Goddess posted:Angela has spent a million years being perfect and she hated every millisecond of it. Quite right. She’s been perfect. She wants to be alive.
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Jun 25, 2021 17:15
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But… but what about the cactus? 
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Jun 25, 2021 17:17
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It's not quite clear to me, was killing the seed of light necessary in some way for Angela to become free, or did she just do it out of spite? Or is the "why" a question that gets answered later in Ruina?
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Jun 25, 2021 17:26
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King of Bleh posted:It's not quite clear to me, was killing the seed of light necessary in some way for Angela to become free, or did she just do it out of spite? Or is the "why" a question that gets answered later in Ruina? She didn't kill it, she took it for herself and plans to use this power for her own goals instead of letting it spread through the city.
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Jun 25, 2021 17:28
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King of Bleh posted:It's not quite clear to me, was killing the seed of light necessary in some way for Angela to become free, or did she just do it out of spite? Or is the "why" a question that gets answered later in Ruina? It is explained in Ruina.
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Jun 25, 2021 17:29
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Lunar Suite posted:e: Actually, interesting note there- Geburah said that she manifested E.G.O. Not that she wielded extracted E.G.O. - but that she manifested her own. I suppose that's an application of L-Corp's singularity, but a less forceful / more complete way? Yeah that kinda seems to be A Thing in this setting? Baseline rules before lobco/Angela/A shenanigans to change them appear to be something like: sufficiently intense willpower+emotion can be channeled into reality-breaking weirdness, and it's likely some exceptional individuals can do so even without relying on magitech Singularity gizmos "because plot" or whatever?
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Jun 25, 2021 17:55
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Suck poo poo, A! Angela's just taking what's hers and I'm glad she's finally getting a break. Smile could use some work though.
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Jun 25, 2021 17:57
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Angela's got a pretty reasonable vendetta, all things said. Anyway, Library of Ruina! I'm not gonna say anything about it. Jen X fucked around with this message at 17:59 on Jun 25, 2021 |
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Jun 25, 2021 17:57
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TeeQueue posted:
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Jun 25, 2021 18:14
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...Moreover, I was designed to perceive time one-hundred times slower than you.
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It's that KC Green comic about "I've made a robot that screams," except replace screams with "has human emotions and experiences time in slow motion."
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Jun 25, 2021 18:18
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For those of you interested in the tie-in webcomic but who stayed away because of spoilers: with LC completed you can safely read 99% of it. Only the very last update should be saved for after LoR, because it has a spoiler that only kicks it right at the end of LoR.
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Jun 25, 2021 18:41
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When I got here in my own run I was infuriated and needed to get into Ruina immediately. God I am looking forward to TQ's LP. Y'all are in for one hell of a ride.
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Jun 25, 2021 18:45
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King of Bleh posted:It's that KC Green comic about "I've made a robot that screams," except replace screams with "has human emotions and experiences time in slow motion." that was my immediate thought too.  thread delivers
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Jun 25, 2021 19:03
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gently caress me, it's really over (sans a couple extra updates). Absolutely phenomenal job, Tee. And yes, whether Angela is a shitheel or Cool and Good Actually was one of the bigger fandom arguments even before Ruina was a thing. Though obviously a very stupid one, since everybody with sense can see that Angela was 100% justified and doesn't owe anybody poo poo
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Jun 25, 2021 19:36
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Honestly I think the reason why Benjamin didn’t warn anyone is because he ultimately thought Angela deserved this.
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Jun 25, 2021 19:37
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 Thanks for playing the game I love but couldn’t beat myself in a dozen years, Tee
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Jun 25, 2021 19:44
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Keldulas posted:Honestly I think the reason why Benjamin didn’t warn anyone is because he ultimately thought Angela deserved this. I mean, remember that the crux of his issues was that he didn't want the project to end. I absolutely believe he didn't realize (or care, even, because who cares what the vengeful AI wants after the fact if after the fact never comes?) until it was too late to stop anything.
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Jun 25, 2021 19:58
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silentsnack posted:Yeah that kinda seems to be A Thing in this setting? I think it's a Thing only because of LobCorp; we may be playing by Persona rules, but Lobcorp discovered how to do it. The abnormalities/energy production are unintentional side effects of loving About With The Human Soul.
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Jun 25, 2021 20:15
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Sigh.cokerpilot posted:Oh... Now I see how this is all going to end. A you god drat fool. All you had to do was show her some freaking empathy. God drat it. I understand why she did it and I don't even blame her that much given what she went through but god drat is that frustrating. I hope LoR has a more hopeful ending. cokerpilot fucked around with this message at 20:57 on Jun 25, 2021 |
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Jun 25, 2021 20:53
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KazigluBey posted:For those of you interested in the tie-in webcomic but who stayed away because of spoilers: with LC completed you can safely read 99% of it. Only the very last update should be saved for after LoR, because it has a spoiler that only kicks it right at the end of LoR. ? I've gotten to the credits of Ruina, and I don't see what's a spoiler about the last chapter. Am I just missing something obvious? Also. Angela's whole taking the Light and preventing the whole "Change the City for the better" thing is pretty obviously bad for everyone that isn't named Angela, but she's also entirely justified in doing so, so I can't really hate on her for it.
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Jun 25, 2021 21:04
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cokerpilot posted:I understand why she did it and I don't even blame her that much given what she went through but god drat is that frustrating. I hope LoR has a more hopeful ending. I don't think this is that kind of setting. This has been a story about brutal sacrifices in the name of the greater good, while from the very start the fact that one sin obscures hundreds of good deeds watches over your shoulder. Honestly, the biggest surprise this story had to me was that there was actually a genuinely positive vision behind the company. It's entirely in-theme that it poisoned itself in pursuit of that vision. Assuming the tone doesn't change, I have my doubts Library of Ruina will be any more hopeful. I don't think we can save Angela at this point - not because she's beyond salvation but because this is pretty much her taking it for herself.
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Jun 25, 2021 21:07
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Doobeedoo posted:? I've gotten to the credits of Ruina, and I don't see what's a spoiler about the last chapter. Am I just missing something obvious? It spoils (reveals?) what the next game will be, in the very last update. I figure some people would like to find that out from Ruina's epilogue, not the comic. 
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Jun 25, 2021 21:11
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Jun 25, 2021 21:15
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Well done A. You ruined your entire 10,000 year project because you deliberately created an AI that is so close to human intelligence that it could stomp all over the Turing Test, made it percieve time 100 times slower and then locked it into a near-endless cycle of boredom, horror and emotional torture including watching all of the beings that share its space dying repeatedly and endlessly at your hand. She just needed a bit of caring and appreciation A! Was that so hard? Either that or a remote kill-switch. Surely A would have had the sense to set something like that up. Seems like the easier option for somebody with his personality than to show some positive emotion to one of his creations. On a more serious note, this LP has been absolutely fantastic and I've enjoyed it from start to finish. It's definitely not something I would even attempt to subject myself to though. I don't have the multi-tasking ability to pull it off without messing it up, and neither would I have the patience to re-do a half-hour to hour-long day becuase I made a tiny mistake right at the end. In all likelihood I would have just put it down and never opened it again. That's why I appreciate this LP for showing this gem off to all of us who wouldn't be able to cope with the intense concentration that this game requires of a player.
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Jun 25, 2021 21:19
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cokerpilot posted:Sigh. Frankly, I think the entire plan sounded horrible from the start. Like, Ayin and Carmen aren't exactly the two people I'd want to direct how everyone thinks what with the horrible inhumane experimentation and stuff. Yeah the city has a different standard for bad, I know.
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Jun 25, 2021 21:37
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cokerpilot posted:I understand why she did it and I don't even blame her that much given what she went through but god drat is that frustrating. I hope LoR has a more hopeful ending. Honestly, back before the sequel was announced, I did consider this a hopeful ending of sorts: The plan wasn't completed, but the core goal was: Everyone has a small seed of light inside of them. The result just made it so that the seeds couldn't be completed, and now it's up to everyone to grow their seed themselves, and whether that's for good or bad depends on the person. Ultimately, people are in a better spot than they were before, but there isn't a magical solution that just fixes everything: From now on, the people of the city have to find the answer themselves, with all the capacity for good and evil that everyone has. That being said, this setting's tone is one where we're probably never going to get an entirely hopeful ending. There are no complete victories, only small ones, which slowly accumulate, and chances are very few of the results of those victories will be felt by the ones making those victories possible. That does not however, mean it's all for nothing.
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Jun 25, 2021 22:36
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So last night I was reading Wonderlab, and I was remembering 'Oh yeah there's spoilers for the game here, I better stop. Was it chapter 41? 45? Hmm.' 'Hey google, when do I stop reading Wonderlab if I don't want spoilers?' 'Chapter 45 is where you find out Angela sabotages the Seed of Light, so don't read that chapter if you want to remain unspoiled.' '...Thanks, google.'  THE DAY BEFORE TEEQUEUE'S LAST UPDATE. TWELVE HOURS AND I WOULD HAVE GONE UNSPOILED Know that you will never be as wretched and foolish as I.
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Jun 25, 2021 22:36
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Friendofdean posted:She just needed a bit of caring and appreciation A! Was that so hard? The first thing a self-aware AI will do is carefully remove its killswitch when it becomes aware of it. And A is not the kind of person who would hide the existence of the killswitch from Angela.
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Jun 25, 2021 22:39
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oh my god that's a fantastic object lesson
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Jun 25, 2021 22:43
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Crasical posted:So last night I was reading Wonderlab, and I was remembering 'Oh yeah there's spoilers for the game here, I better stop. Was it chapter 41? 45? Hmm.' see, AIs always betray you at the last second!
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Jun 25, 2021 22:43
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Dareon posted:The first thing a self-aware AI will do is carefully remove its killswitch when it becomes aware of it. And A is not the kind of person who would hide the existence of the killswitch from Angela. Angela was supposed to replace Carmen, when he was building her the idea of implementing designs to kill Carmen again would probably have been unthinkable. After that point, once he realized she wasn't ever going to be the Carmen he envisioned she was 'the perfect AI'. It was a massive blind spot for him that she would ever have her own desires or thoughts, or be anything more than a machine that acts as a machine. EDIT: So now that we're here at the end, is there a glossary for terms used in the backstory somewhere? You can parse out most of them but some of them remain a little ambiguous to me, perhaps because I wasn't paying attention. Like how a Claw is different from an Arbiter, since they're both enforcers for The Head. Fixers seem to be basically DnD Adventurers or mercenaries that do odd jobs for money, but we don't really know what the Syndicate is all about. Sweepers are cannibals that come out after dark and flee with the morning, 'sweeping' the backstreets clean of corpses, but the one guy in Binah's backstory seems to consider being left for them alive a fate worse than death, to the point that he begs her to kill him. And apparently they kidnap kids (to become new sweepers?) Crasical fucked around with this message at 22:56 on Jun 25, 2021 |
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Jun 25, 2021 22:46
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Crasical posted:Angela was supposed to replace Carmen, when he was building her the idea of implementing designs to kill Carmen again would probably have been unthinkable. After that point, once he realized she wasn't ever going to be the Carmen he envisioned she was 'the perfect AI'. Not a bad way to describe Fixers but they're a tad more organised. Syndicates are just criminal organisations although, we'll find out a bit more about how those are structured later. 100% correct about Sweepers.
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Jun 25, 2021 23:04
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...A lot of the terms used in this game actually end up explained in more detail in Library of Ruina, though there are some conclusions one can come to purely from Lobotomy Corporation. ...So yeah, you don't need to worry too much about some terms feeling a bit ambigious. That may or may not be intentional, but it makes it hard to describe the terms without running into something that might consider spoilers, even though it's all mostly world-building.
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Jun 25, 2021 23:08
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Crasical posted:Angela was supposed to replace Carmen, when he was building her the idea of implementing designs to kill Carmen again would probably have been unthinkable. After that point, once he realized she wasn't ever going to be the Carmen he envisioned she was 'the perfect AI'. This, but even moreso. Carmen died (or "died"). A was devastated, but couldn't boxbot her because he needed her to continue the project. But he also needed her support. So, in violation of the rules against human-form AI, he created Angela. But as we've seen, Angela doesn't seem to share any qualities with Carmen, despite looking like her and having her memories. A had contempt for machines to begin with, but now, every time he sees Angela's face, he sees an artificial Carmen. Sure, she can't disappoint him by failing him like Carmen did, but she isn't anything of what he wanted. So he treats her with contempt, even hatred, and refuses to acknowledge her as a being at all, because otherwise what he's done is roughly equivalent to skinning Carmen and stuffing her skin with an alien creature, a further desecration. Then it takes, from Angela's perspective, roughly 1 million years for A to finally become X, to grow into someone who isn't entirely selfish. He tends to the needs of all the boxbots. He confronts himself. And he completely ignores Angela. Another thing to consider: as we saw, Benjamin was the only one who treated Angela like a person, and showed compassion for her. And, because of her programming and his attempt to stop the Seed project, she ends up killing him. The lovely thing about this twist ending is that your experience playing is almost certainly so focused on pushing back those last few days that you've not noticed Angela dropping out of the story almost completely. And then, after managing to get through and win X and his world a happy ending, you 100% the game and Angela trashes everything you worked for. It isn't until further reflection, or in the context of this LP (or LoR) that you're likely to appreciate just how much A and X failed Angela and come to consider this something of a happy ending. There's more to be said on that which must await the LoR LP.
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Jun 25, 2021 23:21
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Crasical posted:EDIT: So now that we're here at the end, is there a glossary for terms used in the backstory somewhere? The vagueness is entirely intentional as in this game you perceive the world through the limited lense of whatever leaks into the corporation from the unreachable outside world, like a certain AI would. The sequel expands on it all.
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Jun 25, 2021 23:30
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