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Providing an entry point to override and modify even just Explorer and Start are relatively uncomplicated asks and have existed in the past. Explorer is probably still pretty handleable, but Start looks like it might be scuffed. I do not think it's at all an unreasonable ask to provide block UI options (Desktop Mode, Tablet Mode, etc.). Failing block-level options, provide individual options to get some customization out of it. Failing that, provide an API to customize in code. Failing that, at least provide some way for an enterprising dev to just override completely. Like, I'm not even asking for half way. I'm willing to come to nearly the finish line and Microsoft won't even take a few steps out. Canine Blues Arooo fucked around with this message at 08:48 on Jun 26, 2021 |
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Jun 26, 2021 07:58
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doctorfrog posted:
Pretty sure they just blocked moving the taskbar because if you docked it to the left then it would conflict with the new widget overlay that also comes in from the left, and covering all the corner cases was too much  But I also fully expect there’ll be enough backlash over this that they’ll figure out a way to make it work eventually, if not for the initial release. I really hope they do because I’ve docked my taskbar to the right for over a decade.
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Jun 26, 2021 08:01
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beuges posted:Pretty sure they just blocked moving the taskbar because if you docked it to the left then it would conflict with the new widget overlay that also comes in from the left, and covering all the corner cases was too much Hoping so. I've used a taskbar on top for about 20 years, and I like it slim and small. I use a mouse, not
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Jun 26, 2021 08:22
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Truga posted:and yet, desktop environments with a tiny fraction of resources microsoft has don't have issues shipping some simple user accessible variables. KDE ships in a mostly-windows-like state and works fine like that, but it also lets you change font size and hotkeys and those two cover most of what people wanting to change stuff want and somehow microsoft with their billions can't provide it? lmao get outta here Boutique desktop environments that have a support policy of "well it works on my PC" have really good support for boutique customizations? Is this true?
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Jun 28, 2021 07:32
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nice passive aggressive reply, buddy. you clearly have no loving idea what you're talking about but maybe this will be more in your line of expertise: nearly every video game has support for rebinding keys and many even let you customize the font size! microsoft has no excuse Truga fucked around with this message at 09:25 on Jun 28, 2021 |
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Jun 28, 2021 09:06
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You can do that on Windows as well.
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Jun 28, 2021 10:25
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i'm going to die on this stupid hill today but no, you can't change hotkeys "on windows" you can technically do it with a 3rd party tool. it's a shitton of work if you want it to work well, and it has to run with admin privileges if you want it to work consistently under all situations, and is a loving nightmare to maintain if you ever install new apps where hotkeys overlap with windows hotkeys same with font sizes. i can't change the font size in my taskbar and window titlebars to be smaller unless i also want every other thing in windows to be tiny. it's dumb af. i now run a 4k monitor at no scaling so the bars aren't loving huge taking up half the screen, and then have every app that supports it zoomed to 200%. this could easily be fixed if i could just set the font size on those things to be smaller instead but nope, can't have that! option removed since windows 8 ironically, the only app that doesn't have its own zoom feature on my windows box is windows explorer lmfao Truga fucked around with this message at 11:13 on Jun 28, 2021 |
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Jun 28, 2021 11:05
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Sorry, I meant the font thing instead of the hotkeys, that's my bad. But I think with this:Truga posted:i'm going to die on this stupid hill today but no, you can't change hotkeys "on windows" that you have identified with pinpoint precision why you don't get to change the approximate two billion Windows hotkeys in existence.
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Jun 28, 2021 11:23
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the irony is that as long as i could tell windows so alt+f4 does something other than close window, any app that overrides that hotkey would keep working just fine with alt+f4 instead i have to hack alt+f4 to do something completely different like alt+f13, and then any app that has alt+f4 as a hotkey doesn't work with alt+f4 until i make an exception for that app or remap it within the app on other desktop environments, i can just remap alt+f4 to something else and everything keeps working normally
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Jun 28, 2021 11:29
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biznatchio posted:Boutique desktop environments that have a support policy of "well it works on my PC" have really good support for boutique customizations? Is this true? mmmmm yes, as opposed to the comprehensive toll-free technical support helpdesk that microsoft supplies, gratis, with every copy of windows? I sure do take comfort in knowing that if some part of windows doesn't work on my PC, MS support will be there to correctly identify and promptly solve the problem. Klyith posted:Oh noes, how will we live without MS Answers amazing support of replying "run sfc /scannow and dism /online /RestoreHealth" to every single thread regardless of the symptoms?!?!!1!
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Jun 28, 2021 14:47
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The greatest trick the devil ever pulled was selling us keyboards with a built-in windows key. Linux is a joke since nobody even has a non-windows keyboard besides nerds.doctorfrog posted:I dunno, I have some hope here. 8.1 walked back some of the dumber ideas, and 10 rolled somewhat back to sanity. Cortana was unavoidable once, and now you can just remove it completely. Like maybe we'll get to move the taskbar to the top of the screen and have taskbar labels, but you can't move it to the sides and the labels look extra dumb b/c you can't use small taskbar buttons. It'll be just worse enough, like every new Windows version has been. I still remember the jump from windows 3.1 to windows 95. They tricked me, 3.1 to 3.1 NT was nice, my stepdad installed it and I barely noticed, it was just a lil better in some ways. Then we got a computer than had Wnidows 95 and it was like... bruh, what the hell happened, what is this baby poo poo? Why is there this dumb horseshit at the bottom, where's my fuckin folders with the programs, oh we just skipping DOS now?! what the gently caress. Eventually I'm running Windows 7 still trying to force a classic shell theme before finally giving in to modernity. I tell you what, my taskbar poo poo is going back to left justified where it belongs. edit: Catching up on thread, booted into BIOS to turn on TPM, but also turned on re-sizeable BAR. Kind of odd those weren't on already! edit 2: windows used that bio reboot as a chance to sneak in an update, which broke my fuckin pen monitor again. Time to re-uninstall update, jfc. Khanstant fucked around with this message at 17:04 on Jun 28, 2021 |
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Jun 28, 2021 17:01
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drat, I'm a sucker for visual refreshes and glass effects and was looking forward to this, but until they let me put my taskbar on the side and turn off grouping I'm sticking with 10. Let me use the space on a widescreen sensibly, damnit!
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Jun 28, 2021 17:16
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MikeJF posted:but until they let me put my taskbar on the side and turn off grouping I'm sticking with 10. --edit: They also must be futzing around a lot with RDP, because it acts like crap in my VM. Combat Pretzel fucked around with this message at 20:30 on Jun 28, 2021 |
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Jun 28, 2021 19:51
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Combat Pretzel posted:Well, it doesn't even show on secondary displays currently, so you're asking for a bit much, my dude. what... jesus gently caress Microsoft...
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Jun 28, 2021 21:21
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Combat Pretzel posted:Well, it doesn't even show on secondary displays currently, so you're asking for a bit much, my dude. It'd be extremely loving funny and on brand for Microsoft to regress on previously added, much-needed multimonitor functionality in the release where they're finally solving the issue of window positions not being remembered properly in most configurations with multiple monitors.
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Jun 28, 2021 21:32
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MikeJF posted:drat, I'm a sucker for visual refreshes and glass effects and was looking forward to this, but until they let me put my taskbar on the side and turn off grouping I'm sticking with 10. Let me use the space on a widescreen sensibly, damnit! 
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Jun 28, 2021 21:36
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Josh Lyman posted:For many years I’ve put the taskbar at the top bc research shows that most of your mousing is in the top half of the screen, but given 16x9 monitors, I wonder if I shouldn’t be putting it on the left. I was able to get the taskbar to move to the top in the W11 preview by messing with the registry. The only problem is that the calendar and notifications still pop up at the bottom. Forcing the taskbar to the left or right side just causes Explorer to enter a loop of crashing and restarting.
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Jun 28, 2021 21:42
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Ruflux posted:It'd be extremely loving funny and on brand for Microsoft to regress on previously added, much-needed multimonitor functionality in the release where they're finally solving the issue of window positions not being remembered properly in most configurations with multiple monitors. With basic things like these missing, I'm surprised Microsoft threw it into the insider rings already. It's supposed to release before end of 2021 apparently.
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Jun 28, 2021 22:50
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Combat Pretzel posted:The (newest) settings app has a checkbox to enable it, but it's greyed out. I guess it's coming eventually. The small taskbar setting is still not implemented, you have to again fudge it via the registry. Presumably with the leak out already, they'd rather have people trying an 'official' version.
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Jun 29, 2021 07:16
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Falcon2001 posted:Presumably with the leak out already, they'd rather have people trying an 'official' version. That was my thought as well. "Welp, cat's out of the bag, let's go!"
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Jun 29, 2021 08:43
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Some people were commenting about how you have to use 3rd party tools to do button remapping. Does PowerToys have limitations that make it's remapping insufficient? I don't use it for that and I don't think it has any enterprise capabilities, but if that's what you're needing for just one machine it seems like it's a pretty capable MS provided solution? (I also don't know if PowerToys is working with the Windows 11 build.)
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Jun 30, 2021 06:15
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Saw someone claiming MS is pushing for TPM because it makes it easier to spy on users, enforce software licenses, and manage and enforce DRM by any application. any basis to that?
Khanstant fucked around with this message at 19:25 on Jun 30, 2021 |
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Jun 30, 2021 16:09
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Khanstant posted:Saw someone claiming MS is pushing for TPM because it makes it easier to spy on users, enforce software licenses, and manage and enforce DRM by any application. any basis to that? Uh, no
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Jun 30, 2021 23:26
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I'm flashing back to 2007 here
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Jul 1, 2021 00:23
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Khanstant posted:Saw someone claiming MS is pushing for TPM because it makes it easier to spy on users, enforce software licenses, and manage and enforce DRM by any application. any basis to that? Starting with Windows Vista you can't play DRM free videos, at least according to articles that were published before Vista release.
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Jul 1, 2021 00:48
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Khanstant posted:Saw someone claiming MS is pushing for TPM because it makes it easier to spy on users, enforce software licenses, and manage and enforce DRM by any application. any basis to that? Uhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh no I mean, MS likes to spy but TPM shouldn't further that agenda
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Jul 1, 2021 01:03
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I vaguely recall a bunch of people freaking out that secure boot was a huge ploy to kill Linux, and force you to Windows which has DRM and Microsoft tracking?
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Jul 1, 2021 01:55
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i think the worst part about tpm is how it vaccinates you against coronavirus.
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Jul 1, 2021 02:04
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the worst part about TPM is the module for my motherboard went from $24 to $200 overnight
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Jul 1, 2021 03:55
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FuturePastNow posted:the worst part about TPM is the module for my motherboard went from $24 to $200 overnight if your motherboard is less than 8 years old you don't need a dedicated module a setting called "Intel PTT" (on intel platforms) or "fTPM" (on AMD) in your BIOS needs to be turned on, and then you will have TPM
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Jul 1, 2021 03:59
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FuturePastNow posted:the worst part about TPM is the module for my motherboard went from $24 to $200 overnight 
Josh Lyman fucked around with this message at 04:30 on Jul 1, 2021 |
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Jul 1, 2021 04:02
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Khanstant posted:Saw someone claiming MS is pushing for TPM because it makes it easier to spy on users, enforce software licenses, and manage and enforce DRM by any application. any basis to that? jokes posted:Uhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh no The concern is that it may be a prelude to a reintroduction of something along the lines of the Next Generation Secure Computing Base architecture, which was dropped out of Windows Vista when the entire computing community had a shitfit over the idea. Nowadays with all the walled gardens we're used to it'd probably pass in without notice, especially if elements get phased in slowly. And then there'll inevitably be drift over time where new desirable APIs are only available in NGSCB as part of the usual gradual pressure, etc etc... A lot of that springs from the fact that there doesn't seem to be a super-pressing need to introduce mandatory TPM with Windows 11; it runs fine without it at the moment, and it doesn't seem like there's any core systems that depend on it that would be needed by the average home user, and it won't be the thing that'll protect them against most 2021 attacks, so people are wondering what the motivation would be to mandate it in such a forceful way that'll cost them a fair few upgrades. MikeJF fucked around with this message at 04:42 on Jul 1, 2021 |
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Jul 1, 2021 04:37
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So my buddy made me aware of this. Apparently, the IPTT on the i5 8xxx series or better (so i7 too?) counts as a TPM 2.0 module, at least as far as the current windows 11 check counts, it its a-okay if you turn that on in the BIOS. No scrambling for a TPM module. Just make sure your HDDs are formatted for GUID or you're going to have a bad time (your computer won't boot).
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Jul 1, 2021 04:44
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Unless anyone has any objections I am going to make the subtitle of the thread something about not needing hardware TPM and edit in the Ars article about TPM.
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Jul 1, 2021 04:46
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Truga posted:same with font sizes. i can't change the font size in my taskbar and window titlebars to be smaller unless i also want every other thing in windows to be tiny. it's dumb af. i now run a 4k monitor at no scaling so the bars aren't loving huge taking up half the screen, and then have every app that supports it zoomed to 200%. this could easily be fixed if i could just set the font size on those things to be smaller instead but nope, can't have that! option removed since windows 8 Words cannot express how much I miss this: 
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Jul 1, 2021 05:47
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Sudden Loud Noise posted:I vaguely recall a bunch of people freaking out that secure boot was a huge ploy to kill Linux, and force you to Windows which has DRM and Microsoft tracking? in early designs, uefi secure boot on was only supposed to get certificates pre-installed into the firmware and be always on until the community raised a stink about that and you could set up secure boot on your own, tbf. there's not many actors in PC OS space who can afford to work with all the global vendors like that Megillah Gorilla posted:Words cannot express how much I miss this: 
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Jul 1, 2021 09:04
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yeah me too. I am also somewhat trepidatious that they'll drop a bunch of sound events I like, since 99% of people probably either leave them at the truly awful defaults, or turn them off. (I use quiet little blippy sounds for application start/stop to make my computer sound like it's the future, and to passively monitor things launching expectedly or unexpectedly. When something slows down and it's accompanied by a bunch of blips, it's either some update being applied, or something unwanted that needs to be hunted down and turned off. I'll admit this is a very oddball use case. I won't exactly be mad when support for those kinds of things disappear, but I'll be kinda sad.)
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Jul 1, 2021 09:19
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11 has a bunch of new sounds that I'm not entirely used to yet, but they sound more subtle than 10 I guess.
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Jul 1, 2021 09:24
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doctorfrog posted:yeah me too. Those might survive because of accessibility use?
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Jul 1, 2021 09:34
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Klyith posted:I'm already looking forward to windows 11.1 when they realize all these simplifications & tablet-style changes still haven't pushed the Surface to even a fraction of the ipad's market share. I stopped selling Surfaces like 4-5 years ago. They are buggy pieces of poo poo. I'd take an Ipad pro 10/10 over MS underpowered surfaces.
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