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Clawtopsy posted:1 million hours in photoshop Oh please, that bitch ain't got half the baby killing skills that the French do. Edit: (I typed all of this up it deserve to be on the top of the new page DAMNIT!) Fate/Grand Order? Ha, you nerd  Anyway, I'm going to put a spoiler tag on this because it's some hosed up poo poo. Real life is darker than fiction, you have been warned: While most of the French Revolution was more of a slaughter fest rather than a torture fest focused on killing as many people as possible as quickly as possible rather than making them suffer; down in Nantes they were doing things a bit differently during the Reign of Terror, and by that I mean they were drowning people. A lot of people. About 4,000 people, although no one was really keeping track so it could have been a little less or a little more. And just in case you were about to start in with any "drowning isn't torture" bullshit, yes drowning absolutely is torture. If you don't believe me go fill a bathtub with water then stick your head in and inhale deeply, except don't actually do that because it'll hurt like Hell and you'll probably throw up. Thousands upon thousands of men, women, children, and infants died screaming. Yeah, that's right, infants. Multiple infants were among the thousands drowned. Oh, and they sometimes did this hosed up thing called a "Republican Marriage" were they would pick a random man and woman, strip them naked, tie them together with ropes, and then drown them as a pair. Why? For fun, that was just the kind of hosed up poo poo people did to entertain themselves before video games were invented. The past was a nightmare, be glad you don't live there. And as for whether or not this was viewed as heroic, well, that depends on who you asked. The English and Americans were horrified and disgusted by the revolution, but the French themselves? They were proud of all of their killing! And still are! They were sick of having a king so they decided to murder him and they did! Then they just sort kept murdering people until they were all murdered out. Fun fact: Some of the last people murdered were the people who had inspired the revolution in the first place, it was a nice way to wrap everything up. The country of France consider their revolution to have been a rousing success (and I mean yeah, they did kill that king) and 14 July, the anniversary of the day it began, is still celebrated every year. That was the day that a mob arrived to storm the Bastille. When they arrived they captured the commander of fortress a 49 year old man named Bernard-René de Launay. At first they were just going to throw him out of the building, but then they decided "Nah, let's go ahead and kill him" and the mob began to viciously beat Launay and stab him with knives. His death was slow and excruciating. When he finally expired they sawed off his head and stuck it on a pike that they paraded through the streets, and I'm just going to count that as another example of someone being tortured to death during the French Revolution that is looked back on as a heroic moment worthy of celebration. And that concludes todays history lesson! For more information on the terrifyingly brutal gore fest that was The French Revolution I recommend using Wikipedia and Google. Space Cadet Omoly fucked around with this message at 02:59 on Jun 30, 2021 |
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Jun 30, 2021 02:52
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Well this is a first. Usually the French Revolution and all the talk about the terror being used to justify Edelgard but here we are with it being used to excuse Dimitri.
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Jun 30, 2021 02:53
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Capes are dumb unless you're vampiring it up. 
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Jun 30, 2021 02:54
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The only good lord is Claude because all of the other lords committed all the war crimes before he could get to them.
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Jun 30, 2021 02:56
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Hunt11 posted:Well this is a first. Usually the French Revolution and all the talk about the terror being used to justify Edelgard but here we are with it being used to excuse Dimitri. What? I ain't excusing poo poo! Clawtopsy asked for an example of heroic torture during the French Revolution and I provided two! Two examples! If someone wants to use my post to defend their preferred mass murdering waifu or husbando I'll allow it, but that wasn't what I was going for. That post was about the history man, the history.
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Jun 30, 2021 02:57
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Oh, is it time to quote Mark Twain?
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Jun 30, 2021 03:05
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Space Cadet Omoly posted:What? I ain't excusing poo poo! Clawtopsy asked for an example of heroic torture during the French Revolution and I provided two! Two examples! I guess that is all I need to know about your beliefs.
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Jun 30, 2021 03:08
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my belief is that Edelgard is right so I will forgive her war crimes but Dimitri is hot as hell so I will too also forgive his war crimes.
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Jun 30, 2021 03:10
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Tired Moritz posted:my belief is that Edelgard is right so I will forgive her war crimes but Dimitri is hot as hell so I will too also forgive his war crimes. Tired Moritz speaks the truth.
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Jun 30, 2021 03:12
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Space Cadet Omoly posted:Oh please, that bitch ain't got half the baby killing skills that the French do. i'm very familiar with the french revolution actually, but thank you lmao
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Jun 30, 2021 03:14
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Space Cadet Omoly posted:What? I ain't excusing poo poo! Clawtopsy asked for an example of heroic torture during the French Revolution and I provided two! Two examples! hmmmmmmmmm
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Jun 30, 2021 03:15
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Tired Moritz posted:I don't think people thought Dimitri was killing toddlers because we're all sensible enough to know that they're not gonna give us a lord that's a baby murderer. I've seen some people argue that Rhea is at fault for crests because she DID NOT chop up all the Elite babies (and I guess the families of her own allies???) so you know err on the side of caution I guess
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Jun 30, 2021 03:15
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Hellioning posted:The only good lord is Claude because all of the other lords committed all the war crimes before he could get to them. Unfortunately, using the uniforms of your opposition is a war crime. There's also the (planned) execution of captives on VW.
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Jun 30, 2021 03:18
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Ah, good to know that Cluade found the few war crimes not already committed so he could commit them. Truly a real go-getter, that Claude.
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Jun 30, 2021 03:40
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Rand Brittain posted:Oh, is it time to quote Mark Twain? Unfortunately, if you try to quote Twain to defend anybody but Edelgard, you're cursed to die within seven weeks. It's a rule. Anyway, I was mostly thinking of anti-Nazi and anti-colonial resistance movements in the 20th century, but wanted to avoid sounding like I thought Edelgard was Hitler or Leopold II. (She isn't, obviously.) Even the most morally spotless of these partisan fighters certainly assassinated officers and even civilians seen as being collaborators. And lots of them killed captives*, too, and even engaged in torture. Even the 18th century's American Revolution famously subjected civilians to public torture by "tarring and feathering" them, and those folks are certainly lionized by modern Americans today. Obviously, it was bad if Dimitri tortured people, and it would have been better if he didn't, although it's not clear how often it actually happened. But it isn't really very different in kind from deciding to launch a war like Edelgard does, or for that matter, the results of ensuring the continuity of cruel regimes like Rhea does. * WTF is with the part where Byleth just executes a POW and nobody bats an eye, anyway? Why is this the de-escalation strategy your player avatar chooses? I get why Dimitri doesn't care, but aren't the other Faerghus characters supposed to be part of a milieu where that sort of thing is frowned upon? I suppose it's just another casualty of the baffling writing decision that the other students can't say or do anything important during the second half of the game.
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Jun 30, 2021 03:59
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Also to bring up something previously when someone once again used the least charitable wording, when it came to "civilians" Dimitri says to Annette that he killed "generals and officials," which is a bit of a butchering of shouhei and kanri, or officer leaders and the soldier mans under their command vs civil government dudes in sweet robes and their bureaucratic subordinates. Some of which can be armed and militarily trained but most likely since Dimitri makes a distinction between the two one would have to infer that he's drawing a difference between armed combatants and unarmed noncombatants. Still bad of course, obviously since he himself feels bad about it, but more in the killing the harmless senators in that one camp map in Radiant Dawn kind of way, less in the gutting random uninvolved villagers sort of way
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Jun 30, 2021 04:04
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nrook posted:* WTF is with the part where Byleth just executes a POW and nobody bats an eye, anyway? Why is this the de-escalation strategy your player avatar chooses? I get why Dimitri doesn't care, but aren't the other Faerghus characters supposed to be part of a milieu where that sort of thing is frowned upon? I suppose it's just another casualty of the baffling writing decision that the other students can't say or do anything important during the second half of the game. BTF, it does seem the policy of most of Fodlan is "prisoners get executed if captured"- see VW and SS where Bergliez has to give himself over to be executed for his captive subordinates to be spared. quote:Dorothea: So, the moment we defeat Edie, the nobles cozy up to the Alliance and church... That lot really does think only of themselves, and no one else. But then there's Count Bergliez. He used to be Minister of Military Affairs... He sacrificed his own life so that all the soldiers and officers who fought could be given quarter... When I heard that... I don't know... that simple act of humanity... I couldn't help it. I burst into tears. You know Count Bergliez is Casper's father, right? I can't even imagine how Caspar must feel about it. So Byleth's actions are just normal for the Church and so none of the BL people think about it, especially compared to the non-standard "torture to death" Dimitri was planning. Shinji117 fucked around with this message at 04:14 on Jun 30, 2021 |
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Jun 30, 2021 04:04
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There's lots of moments in Azure Moon where everyone sorta does the whole monkey looking off to the side meme when Dimitri stands in the foreground shouting about how he wants to literally pulverize limbs to dust and gutfuck his foes. Only Felix ever goes "yep, saw it coming". Everyone else sorta goes "Dimitri isn't really like that... Is he?" as Dimitri goes to be exactly like that.
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Jun 30, 2021 04:27
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Clawtopsy posted:There's lots of moments in Azure Moon where everyone sorta does the whole monkey looking off to the side meme when Dimitri stands in the foreground shouting about how he wants to literally pulverize limbs to dust and gutfuck his foes. Only Felix ever goes "yep, saw it coming". Everyone else sorta goes "Dimitri isn't really like that... Is he?" as Dimitri goes to be exactly like that. I hate so much that all they let Felix do is go "told ya", they should have kept in the cut content where he and Annette can defect, or just let him do anything. So frustrating.
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Jun 30, 2021 05:04
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Honestly for as horrific as a lot of the things Dimitri does in his route he doesn't come out of it all that poorly when everything's said and done. He owns his mistakes and clearly has a lot of regret/atonement he's striving for etc. The people who come off terribly are the other Blue Lions who enable him even in the worst grasps of his delusions to a frankly insane level. Like I think the route needed to be fundamentally rethought and planned out because holy poo poo does it make all of them monsters as they just whistle and try to ignore that Dimitri is clearly not fit to lead over and over again. Felix getting some 'Ha, I knew this would happen!' rings so loving hollow when he's still just pitching in doing whatever Dimitri wants anyways. And then you have Dimitri telling Edelgard that the war was unnecessary because the people would rise against a bad king. Says the dude who up until two months prior was leading a murder-suicide cult based on hallucinations that no one challenged him on. Its such a bizarre disconnect it feels like it came from welding two versions of Azure Moon together. I also think Dimitri's arc and story would be more coherent if he abdicated and dedicated his life to trying to rebuild Duscar or something. It would be a really nice capstone to his arc and make a lot more sense than 'and after all that he got to still become king'. It would also make his conversation with Edelgard a lot more impactful since he'd be showing how they were different in a much more meaningful way by ultimately recognizing he couldn't wield the power he had while she can't etc. Zore fucked around with this message at 05:22 on Jun 30, 2021 |
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Jun 30, 2021 05:11
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Zore posted:The people who come off terribly are the other Blue Lions who enable him even in the worst grasps of his delusions to a frankly insane level. Like I think the route needed to be fundamentally rethought and planned out because holy poo poo does it make all of them monsters as they just whistle and try to ignore that Dimitri is clearly not fit to lead over and over again. Felix getting some 'Ha, I knew this would happen!' rings so loving hollow when he's still just pitching in doing whatever Dimitri wants anyways. It’s character death that did it! I think the reason for that disconnect is that the show must go on even if another student dies, so they can’t do anything important. This is a baffling limitation on the writers (why not just come up with a permanent injury excuse?) but it’s one they chose to have, for whatever reason.
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Jun 30, 2021 05:59
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nrook posted:It’s character death that did it! I think the reason for that disconnect is that the show must go on even if another student dies, so they can’t do anything important. This is a baffling limitation on the writers (why not just come up with a permanent injury excuse?) but it’s one they chose to have, for whatever reason. Oh I'm aware of it but they absolutely could have structured the route differently so it wasn't so incredibly blatant. Or even just given folks some incidental dialogue about exploring other options or trying or anything but just sort of being in a state of vague concern for like 5 chapters. I dunno, the whole game is written around that limitation but it only really falls apart there because on every other route and situation the other characters are generally on board with what's happening. Their other option was to just have them lean in and go full blood-gargling psychopath with everyone until Dimitri snaps out of it which would be at least more consistent. And there are hooks in several Act 2s that temporarily have you lose access to some students, they easily could have done that with at least Felix and Annette etc where they're gone for a few chapters like how you lose access to Dedue, Ashe or Lorenz on various routes. Zore fucked around with this message at 06:05 on Jun 30, 2021 |
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Jun 30, 2021 06:01
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i am ferdinand von aegir
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Jun 30, 2021 08:37
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Hellioning posted:The only good lord is Claude because all of the other lords committed all the war crimes before he could get to them. Claude is kind of weird because he introduces himself with "I'm the schemer of the bunch don't trust me  " but all that ever amounts to is him suggesting you sneak laxatives into the enemy rations or wear disguises sometimes.Sudden Javelin posted:i am ferdinand von aegir Ah yes we almost forgot who the undisputed actual best lord is.
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Jun 30, 2021 09:09
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Zulily Zoetrope posted:Claude is kind of weird because he introduces himself with "I'm the schemer of the bunch don't trust me From what I've read they had originally planned to make him more of a morally dubious schemer, but then decided "nah". I think a lot of the ideas they had for a more ethically flexible Claude were later reused when they were designing Yuri who really is a straight up trickster assassin, but I don't have enough hard evidence to be able to prove that in a court of law. Clawtopsy posted:i'm very familiar with the french revolution actually, but thank you lmao Yeah I bet you're familiar with historical time periods, NERD! Edit: ....wait a minute, then why did you ask for an example of heroic torture?! You already knew about this stuff!  You tricked me into typing things for no reason!
Space Cadet Omoly fucked around with this message at 09:46 on Jun 30, 2021 |
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Jun 30, 2021 09:30
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Because you still failed to list an example lol
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Jun 30, 2021 16:50
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Clawtopsy posted:Because you still failed to list an example lol Expand on that. Because, personally, I think I proved whatever point I was trying to make. The French Revolution is widely regarded as something heroic by the people of France, and it was also filled with a lot of torture. Acts of torture perceived as heroic, there you go. Was that not what we were talking about? Or have I lost the plot on this one? I might not have ever known what the plot was here, honestly.
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Jun 30, 2021 17:03
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you cannot "well, from a certain point of view..." torture
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Jun 30, 2021 17:14
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Clawtopsy posted:you cannot "well, from a certain point of view..." torture That's basically all of human history though, it's just a long series of people doing horrible things to each other and the winners of fights get to pretend that the horrible things they did were less horrible than the horrible things the loser did and thus the winners are the good guys. I know that's a vast oversimplification, but it's still something every country does in regards to their national identity.
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Jun 30, 2021 17:25
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Got a mechanics question: I understand from Rea's LP that some supports have one partner boosting the Mt of the other when assigned as an adjutant. Is there a way to see these in-game or just a list of what all they are?
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Jul 8, 2021 20:50
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https://twitter.com/Akinomakinomin1/status/1413226372835659778?s=20 I finally got through my Verdant Wind Maddening playthrough! Hilda and Lysithea took almost all of the MVP slots, with a respectable showing from Petra, Leonie and Claude. I love this game so much, I'm almost ready to jump back in and try another route on maddening, but I think I'm going to take a break and try out FE4 since it's on the Japanese Super Famicon app now.
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Jul 8, 2021 21:08
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Cythereal posted:Got a mechanics question: I understand from Rea's LP that some supports have one partner boosting the Mt of the other when assigned as an adjutant. Is there a way to see these in-game or just a list of what all they are? I don't think it's ever brought up in-game, but serenes forest has the list. It's not just for adjutants, it's anywhere support bonuses normally apply. It's mostly Byleth with lords, lords with their lieutenants, and pairs of characters who are family or childhood friends.
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Jul 8, 2021 21:43
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Zulily Zoetrope posted:I don't think it's ever brought up in-game, but serenes forest has the list. It's not just for adjutants, it's anywhere support bonuses normally apply. It's mostly Byleth with lords, lords with their lieutenants, and pairs of characters who are family or childhood friends. Good to know. I had the thought of pairing Byleth with Flayn in my next run, and given that Flayn herself is an iffy unit, may as well make her an adjutant to get that permanent damage backpack. And since in my experience the most mechanically valuable adjutant is the defender, and the only defender adjutant classes women can become are the armor knight line... Hello, armor knight Flayn. Amusing and a legitimate mechanical choice.
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Jul 8, 2021 21:49
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Flayn has an excellent spell list she isn't bad. Rescue and Fortify are insanely powerful and useful on Maddening and are enough alone to justify her a slot plus Excalibur will still allow her to delete some enemies. Her starting stats and level suck but they're mostly irrelevant compared to her utility.
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Jul 8, 2021 21:56
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Zulily Zoetrope posted:I don't think it's ever brought up in-game, but serenes forest has the list. It's not just for adjutants, it's anywhere support bonuses normally apply. It's mostly Byleth with lords, lords with their lieutenants, and pairs of characters who are family or childhood friends. Okay almost all of the certain pairs make sense, but why Hilda x Dorothea? Also, why Bernadetta x Marianne? Is it because they both have over whelming social anxiety? I've never done a social link with either Hilda/Dorothea or Bernadetta/Marianne, what's their relationship like?
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Jul 8, 2021 22:21
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Space Cadet Omoly posted:Okay almost all of the certain pairs make sense, but why Hilda x Dorothea? Huh. Neither of those pairs have a support chain, which is a drat shame, because Bernadetta and Marianne would be adorable together. \/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/ Hilda/Dorothea would have incredible "I am so gay but you are so irritating" vibes. Well Manicured Man fucked around with this message at 22:34 on Jul 8, 2021 |
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Jul 8, 2021 22:25
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Well Manicured Man posted:Huh. Neither of those pairs have a support chain, which is a drat shame, because Bernadetta and Marianne would be adorable together. Yeah, maybe it was something that was planned earlier in development and got cut for time? Which is a bummer because now that I think about it Hilda/Dorothea and Bernadetta/Marianne would both be fun pairings.
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Jul 8, 2021 22:30
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RevolverDivider posted:Flayn has an excellent spell list she isn't bad. Rescue and Fortify are insanely powerful and useful on Maddening and are enough alone to justify her a slot plus Excalibur will still allow her to delete some enemies. Her starting stats and level suck but they're mostly irrelevant compared to her utility. The theory goes like this: Flayn herself is a kind of iffy unit, both for white and black magic there's other people who do what she can but better, and she has a conspicuous Physic-shaped hole in a character who's supposed to be a healer by default. However, she also has linked attacks with Byleth. All of Byleth's other linked attack pairings are with characters you will want out in the field in their own right (except maybe Yuri, as this run has proven). Flayn, however, is probably not ever going to be necessary to your plans. Now, looking at adjutants, in my experience far and away the most valuable adjutant type is the guardian adjutant. This, however, is restricted to just a handful of classes: the armor knight line, the brawler line, and Edelgard's unique classes. As a woman, Flayn does not have brawler. Thus, Flayn the armor knight. Starting at +3 Hit and Avoid for Byleth, she goes up to becoming a +3 Might, +10 Hit and Avoid backpack who provides anywhere from 10% to 40% damage reduction on enemy follow-up attacks.
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Jul 8, 2021 22:44
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ah, but you still aren't thinking optimal enough. you should instead first speedrun through a playthrough with male byleth marrying flayn, and then buy that s support in NG+ to get +5 might and +15 avoid/hit
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Jul 8, 2021 23:14
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And then speedrun again to get Yuri and the Lord of Choice to get a sweet sweet +15 might and 60 hit/avoid. Take that other dodgetanks.
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Jul 9, 2021 00:10
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