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This isn't funny or a panel but it's slightly amusing and I don't know where else to post it; Finnish Phantom versus Swedish Phantom: https://i.imgur.com/m6qZkSX.png
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Jul 5, 2021 14:27
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Sweden's got tits.
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Jul 5, 2021 15:00
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 Fantastic Four #59 (1967)  Speedball #3 (1988)
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Jul 5, 2021 15:56
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Alhazred posted:Why does people even bother with science in an universe where people can change reality by snapping their fingers. Because unless you know the reality-changers personally your world's no different. TwoPair fucked around with this message at 16:00 on Jul 5, 2021 |
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Jul 5, 2021 15:56
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The Question IRL posted:Isn't that issue of Spawn almost exactly like the short film that Mr. Burns had Seniór Speilbergo make for him? No, it's an extended rant about creator's rights. I'm pretty sure Sim had high hopes for Image Comics, because there's a whole chunk of Cerebus that follows a similar theme. I read it recently to see if I could see when Sim starts to go off the rails, and there's several issues with very specific references to late 90's comics that hasn't aged very well. Not that Cerebus aged well in the first place.
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Jul 5, 2021 16:54
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Darthemed posted:
What the heck Wyatt? "Listen Johnny, you're better off single, just leave that girl and all her family imprisoned."
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Jul 5, 2021 16:54
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3D Megadoodoo posted:This isn't funny or a panel but it's slightly amusing and I don't know where else to post it; Finnish Phantom versus Swedish Phantom: Huh. Jerome K. Bloche seems to be a much bigger draw in Finland.
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Jul 5, 2021 18:16
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The Question IRL posted:Isn't that issue of Spawn almost exactly like the short film that Mr. Burns had Seniór Speilbergo make for him? Ugh, I couldn't get this thought out of my head: 
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Jul 5, 2021 18:25
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So what's the deal with Cerebus? I only ever see it brought up in passing.
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Jul 5, 2021 18:43
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Alacron posted:So what's the deal with Cerebus? I only ever see it brought up in passing. Basically it starts as a Conan pastiche for like 20 issues, then delves into this incredibly long, winding epic of a story which Sims said would go for 300 issues. It has some issues, but a lot of fairly interesting thoughts, and then he gets divorced and suddenly an entire issue is just this longform story about how men are the light and women are the void and it just turns into this remarkably bleak story of what if a violent, hedonistic rapist got extremely divorced. All in all, I would recommend, if at all, reading High Society and Church & State and Jaka's Story, then pretending he never got even close to his goal of 300 issues. Short version of the story is after the single issue stuff, Cerberus is invited to a city, manipulated by High Society factions and ends up as prime minister. Fucks around through situations, ends up as Pope, ascends to the Moon, has a 4th wall breaking conversation with a being who tells him, among other things, that he'll die alone, unmourned and unloved. At which point, the country is conquered by a matriarchal society starting the Mothers and Daughters Arc. Cerberus takes a back seat for awhile, as Oscar Wilde shows up to narrate the story of Jaka, which is about a dancer in a tavern, and explores gender roles and suppression of art, and involves an abortion and Rick, the most divorced man of all time. <This is probably where you want to stop> After 2-3 volumes, including the infamous women are voids story, Cerberus comes back, slaughters a bunch of matriarchal soldiers, culminating in a meeting of the minds of all the principal characters and then Cerberus talks directly to Dave Sim, who shows that due to his nature, Cerberus will never be happily married, and is sent to a prison-like bar where he hangs with other bros including Rick. You get two volumes of that and Rick's man-centric version of Christianity, then two volumes of Jaka and Cerberus together again on a journey to prove Dave wrong, and completely loving failing, then two final volumes I didn't read. Here's why I didn't bother finishing (plot synopsis of the last volume). The second and concluding part of "Latter Days", and the conclusion of the series as a whole. In the first 40 pages Cerebus has a dream or vision in which cosmology is seen as a reflection of theology, complete with explanatory footnotes by Sim. Upon waking Cerebus—now incredibly aged, decrepit, pain-wracked, and mildly senile—makes the laborious trek to his writing desk to write down his new revelation. He then hides the manuscript, and it is implied that nobody will find it for two thousand years. Cerebus spends most of the rest of the book trying to persuade his chief of security to admit his son, Shep-Shep, with whom he remembers sharing an idyllic father–son relationship. However, the Sanctuary is under lockdown due to opposition from a new and even more rabidly "feminist-homosexualist" group led by Shep-Shep's mother, whom Cerebus refers to as "New Joanne", which favors such "rights" as pedophilia, zoophilia, juvenile recreational drug use and lesbian motherhood. As a result, social values have undergone a complete breakdown. Cerebus finally goes to bed despairing of seeing his son again, but Shep-Shep manages to sneak into Cerebus's room late that night. Their subsequent conversation shatters Cerebus's last illusions about his son. Shep-Shep has aligned himself with his mother, who has been conducting genetic engineering experiments, partly with knowledge gained from Cirin's earlier experimentation. Cerebus is disgusted and horrified when Shep-Shep shows him the results of one of the experiments, a lion cub with a human baby's head, and explains his mother's plans. As Shep-Shep leaves, Cerebus grabs a knife, intending to kill him, but falls out of bed and breaks his neck, alone, unmourned, and unloved, just as the Judge had predicted. His life flashes before his eyes in a series of flashback panels and his ghost sees many of his old friends and enemies waiting for him in "the Light." Jaka, Bear, and Ham beckon to him, and he eagerly rushes to join them, thinking they are in Heaven, but then he notices the absence of Rick and realizes that the Light may in fact be Hell. He calls out to God for help, but is dragged into the Light nonetheless. But hey, at least early on you get a lot of Groucho as-leader of a nation, which is fun. 
Kalli fucked around with this message at 19:20 on Jul 5, 2021 |
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Jul 5, 2021 19:17
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PoptartsNinja posted:I think "the Hangman" has to be the worst possible idea for a superhero. What about the one in Astro City?
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Jul 5, 2021 19:30
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3D Megadoodoo posted:This isn't funny or a panel but it's slightly amusing and I don't know where else to post it; Finnish Phantom versus Swedish Phantom: fixed
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Jul 5, 2021 19:31
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Lol
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Jul 5, 2021 19:34
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Kalli posted:Words about Cerebus  Well I'm not sure what I expected but I don't think it was that.
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Jul 5, 2021 19:39
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Sims eventually brought on another artist to help him and working on it gave the artist some genuine trauma because he was contractually obliged to keep drawing an increasingly hateful and insane comic
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Jul 5, 2021 19:51
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Push El Burrito posted:Sweden's got tits. It's actually a swedish translation of a norwegian story. Fun fact: It's the first Phantom story written by a woman.
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Jul 5, 2021 19:56
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thetoughestbean posted:Sims eventually brought on another artist to help him and working on it gave the artist some genuine trauma because he was contractually obliged to keep drawing an increasingly hateful and insane comic No? Gerhard did backgrounds for most of the run (235 issues). He's never really said anything I can find about being traumatized, though Sim said he stopped reading the issues by the end. He only drew backgrounds, no characters or props. After the series ended, Gerhard sold his 49% share to Sim, but he still does comic conventions, does Cerebus sketches, signs books, etc. He used to sell Cerebus prints, but I don't see them on his site right now.
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Jul 5, 2021 20:04
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Uthor posted:No? Gerhard did backgrounds for most of the run (235 issues). He's never really said anything I can find about being traumatized, though Sim said he stopped reading the issues by the end. He only drew backgrounds, no characters or props. After the series ended, Gerhard sold his 49% share to Sim, but he still does comic conventions, does Cerebus sketches, signs books, etc. He used to sell Cerebus prints, but I don't see them on his site right now. I remember reading something about him having to get a therapist and not being able to draw for a couple years after the series ended. I’ll try to find it, I guess I could have just fallen for a juicy rumor
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Jul 5, 2021 20:09
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Kalli posted:Cerebus stuff I actually read though the entire series last year to see if you could see the crazy coming on. Dave's divorce from Deni Loubert was at the end of High Society/start of Church and State, and you start seeing the mysogyny popping up in the his editorials and responses to letters during Church and State, but nothing notable in the comic itself. I'd say reading to the end of Melmoth is pretty safe, because that's mostly the death of Oscar Wilde and some comic interludes from the fallout of Church and State. Issue 186 is where it falls apart with the female Voids and male Lights. The whole of Mothers and Daughters seems to be about Sim destroying all the fun stuff he'd created and trying to start again. Cerebus kinda devolves from a cunning and knowledgeable, if rear end in a top hat-ish, character, to just an out-and-out almost ignorant dick. Guys is kinda funny on the surface, but is feels ultimately about men's friendships being destroyed by females being females. There's a whole bunch of cameos from late 90's comics - who remembers Tug and Buster? Rick's Story is kinda interesting though a bit confused - Rick is clearly hosed up and ends up with his weird Man religion. I have no idea if Sim wanted us to agree with Rick or Cerebus, but neither are particularly likeable here. Going Home is Sim hate-reading American literature - I'd read bits of the Hemingway part at the time and it seemed interesting, but Sim explicitly stated he hates Hemingway and it kinda makes the whole story a bit unplesant. Latter days is really when it starts going really off the rails - a weird, probably racist, bit about Cerebus' later life sports career; Cerebus as Spawn for a bunch of issues; not-Todd McFarlane; the Cirinists (matriachal goverment) is overthrown because men can obviously shoot guns better than females; and a weird screed about the nature of God (more male vs female bollocks) with a Jewish character based on Woody Allen to give it some AUTHORITY (I skipped this bit because it is mostly text and boring, lovely analysis of gender (biotruths) in relation to religion). This is probably when Sim came up with his mash-up of Christianity, Islam and Judaism. The Last Day is those spoilers up there. I'll add that the Chief-of-Security is based on Radar from M*A*S*H. Its annoying, because visually, Cerebus is really interesting and there's great bits in Guys where Cerebus has extended conversations with himself and the use of expressive lettering is amazing. Sim has the ability to tell good stories, its just a shame that the brainworms won.
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Jul 5, 2021 20:23
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Lobok posted:So you don't get left out. Science in comics is basically magic and the barrier to entry isn't high. If you were an A student in school you can scrabble together tech that defies whatever pesky law of physics is annoying you. Canonically in the 616 the smartest person on Earth is a 9 year old girl.
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Jul 5, 2021 20:33
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Elissimpark posted:No, it's an extended rant about creator's rights. I'm pretty sure Sim had high hopes for Image Comics, because there's a whole chunk of Cerebus that follows a similar theme. I read it recently to see if I could see when Sim starts to go off the rails, and there's several issues with very specific references to late 90's comics that hasn't aged very well.  FOREVER
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Jul 5, 2021 20:35
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thetoughestbean posted:I remember reading something about him having to get a therapist and not being able to draw for a couple years after the series ended. I’ll try to find it, I guess I could have just fallen for a juicy rumor You know, maybe he had, I shouldn't have gotten so defensive; I hadn't heard of him having issues post Cerebus, but that doesn't mean he didn't. Probably all my knowledge from around that time was coming from Sim's writing and while he seems truthful to a fault, it doesn't make him neutral. I don't see anything, but trying to search "Cerebus" and "therapy" is getting all kinds of things about Sim and his busted hands.
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Jul 5, 2021 20:58
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Have a funny panel to make up for the Sim chat. New Mutants 19 Full context: 
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Jul 5, 2021 21:06
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Uthor posted:You know, maybe he had, I shouldn't have gotten so defensive; I hadn't heard of him having issues post Cerebus, but that doesn't mean he didn't. Probably all my knowledge from around that time was coming from Sim's writing and while he seems truthful to a fault, it doesn't make him neutral. I don't see anything, but trying to search "Cerebus" and "therapy" is getting all kinds of things about Sim and his busted hands. I read an interview with him and don't remember anything like that. Gerhard was just a chill dude who liked to draw. Cerebus is pretty amazing for the first half and absolutely worth the read, but it goes off the rails in a very binary way.
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Jul 5, 2021 22:12
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Well I can't imagine Sim doing anything nonbinary.
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Jul 6, 2021 00:25
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Endless Mike posted:Well I can't imagine Sim doing anything nonbinary.  Weirdly he had some quite feminist stuff in earlier issues, the theory is he just went a little cray
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Jul 6, 2021 12:25
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 Not Brand Echh #13 (1969)  Flaming Carrot Comics #14 (1986)
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Jul 6, 2021 13:32
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Socialised sorcery ensures everyone has access to a qualified wizard when they need it without going broke. 
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Jul 6, 2021 13:35
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sebmojo posted:
I think he had undiagnosed (later diagnosed) mental illness that he exacerbated with LSD use, or at least that’s how the story goes
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Jul 6, 2021 13:42
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sebmojo posted:I read an interview with him and don't remember anything like that. Gerhard was just a chill dude who liked to draw. While I never read it, I always got the impression that most of the love for Cerebrus came from the fact it came from the 80's and was ground breaking for it's time. Based on the description of the series, if I read it I'd expect this to be a summary of the series. (The first half of Cerebrus.) David Sims: What if I was to tell you, Religion and Society are really bad.  Readers: Oh My God! Since this is the 1980's this is ground breaking stuff. My mind is blown by this idea.  (The second half of Cerebrus. ) David Sims: What if I was to tell you, Women are really bad. Readers: Oh My God! Even in this 1990's, this poo poo is awful. Please stop. 
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Jul 6, 2021 14:36
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The Question IRL posted:(The first half of Cerebrus.) I mean, people in the 80s weren't Flintstones. Granted comics are a medium that generally does keep at least one eye on adolescent readers whose minds are easily blown, but like, in general the people reading Cerebus were probably not sputtering going "p....pope... pope bad???" and flinching away at movies of trains coming at the screen. From everything I've read the trajectory of Cerebus-appreciation went sort of like this over the course of many years: 1) oh it's funny, it's a funny satire of Conan and Wolverine and Michael Moorcock and stuff 2) oh the funny animal barbarian comic is really well drawn now 3) holy cow the aardvark guy is really experimenting formally and doing stuff with the basic visual grammar of comics that I haven't seen before 4) ha this is pretty sophisticated satire now, I really like this 5) mm but it's getting a little wordy, isn't it 6) hold on, what's this about the light and the void? 7) gently caress, what? IMO Sim was a pretty ok writer early on who grew into being a pretty good one, but was always bogged down by wordiness and by his ideas not being quite as clever as he thought. Which was recognized early on by fans, but still, it was certainly cranking along at a higher standard than many other things on the shelf at the time. His big reputation as an innovator should be attributed to his art and in particular to his approach to the page and the word bubble, giving more attention and showing more ambition about the basic building blocks of the comic book.
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Jul 6, 2021 15:16
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I mean, even up until issue 300 you see him/them doing interesting and beautiful things with the medium. It hit a high level of art early on and kept it up for 25 years. A lot of the humor is parody and especially subject to being dated. I bet a lot of the interest came from Sim writing 25-50 issue story lines with relatively intricate plots and lots of moving characters. Uthor fucked around with this message at 15:27 on Jul 6, 2021 |
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Jul 6, 2021 15:23
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sebmojo posted:Cerebus is pretty amazing for the first half and absolutely worth the read, but it goes off the rails in a very binary way. I've said in this forum before that Cerebus is one of the most important comics of the 1980s. It pushed storytelling and structure hard and Sim nurtured a lot of the major indie talent of the 80s and 90s. Cerebus matters. And it's impossible to talk about that stuff because it will always be overshadowed by Dave Sim being actually mentally ill, self-destructive, and hate-spewing. I've threatened to do a Cerebus read-through and commentary before, but backed off because it would be too depressing when I hit the back half.
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Jul 6, 2021 15:27
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I've considered the same thing and ditched it for the same reason.
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Jul 6, 2021 15:31
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Dave deserves credit for helping independent comics gain credibility, but Kevin Eastman and Peter Laird (amongst others) managed to do that in a different way without being HOF level misogynists
El Gallinero Gros fucked around with this message at 15:43 on Jul 6, 2021 |
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Jul 6, 2021 15:38
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Don't know where this came from.
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Jul 7, 2021 01:58
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Historically accurate that Franklin was thirsty.
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Jul 7, 2021 02:00
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Supersonic Shine posted:Don't know where this came from. It is well documented that ol' Ben was very thirsty.
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Jul 7, 2021 02:01
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It's easy being thirsty if you're hot. The chad Benjamin Franklin vs. the virgin Kool-Aid Man (see the chin? yeah me neither!)
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Jul 7, 2021 02:01
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Supersonic Shine posted:Don't know where this came from. Adventures of Kool-Aid Man #2, published by Marvel 1984. ManiacClown fucked around with this message at 02:09 on Jul 7, 2021 |
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Jul 7, 2021 02:06
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